Chelsea thoughts

[El Pistolero]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1429992#msg1429992 date=1321893700]
[quote author=El Pistolero link=topic=47592.msg1429985#msg1429985 date=1321892426]
Apart from the goal Johnson was shite.
[/quote]

Disagree, in the first half he was great, he was superb going forward and constantly a menace for Ashley Cole, held his own at the back too. When we were under the cosh in the second half he wasn't as solid as Kelly would have been, but to brandish him as shite apart from the goal is quite frankly ridiculous.

I don't get what it is on this site, but I've noticed, especially in the match thread yesterday, there seems to be some form of hate campaign going around over Johnson, would I dare say it's because he's playing the same position and limiting the chances of a young promising scouser?
[/quote]

Its got nothing to do with him keeping kelly out of the team, its more to do with his complete lack of defensive skills.

I'm sorry but johnson was continually beaten on his side, his primary job is to defend and unfortunatly he just simply is a shit defender. His distribution was poor. I had to laugh in the pub everyone was slating him all match about how poor he'd been. When he scored it was hilarious.

 

[Mystic]

His defending is weak comparatively but it's completely overblown, people act like he's another Degen, when he's much better. I think the fact that Enrique is on the other side to him makes it worse for him as Enrique has been out of this world, also that and the fact it's been gone on about with England so much. The reason he appears weaker at the back is because he gets forward so much and I'm inclined to believe that's what he's been told to do by Kenny. I hope we stick with him.

 

[spider-Neil]

first half we were pressing chelsea high up the pitch and johnson was a part of that but when we dropped off (for whatever reason) johnson was given a torrid time.
truth is defensively I think johnson can get better, last season at left back he was rock solid so the defensive talent is there.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1430004#msg1430004 date=1321895087]
think the fact that Enrique is on the other side to him makes it worse for him as Enrique has been out of this world, [/quote]

defensively he has but I expect more from him going forwards

 

[themn]

Glen Johnson: The New Lucas.

 

[Mystic]

[quote author=themn link=topic=47592.msg1430008#msg1430008 date=1321895386]
Glen Johnson: The New Lucas.
[/quote]

This.

 

[FoxForceFive]

Johnson makes us *slightly* more vulnerable at the back than when Kelly plays.

However he makes us a lot better in attack.

As our problems don't stem from conceding too many, but not scoring enough, it makes sense to play him rather than Kelly.

 

[Halmeister]

We should really give him a go at right mid. I think he could potentially be class there.

Another thought, if you're going to dance after you score - make sure you're Brazilian. And even then you will look like a fucking twat.

 

[vantage]

Mata was at his most effective when he played more centrally, meaning he is not an upgrade on Downing as Downing plays as a winger. A distinctly average winger.

 

[Mystic]

[quote author=vantage link=topic=47592.msg1430016#msg1430016 date=1321896527]
Mata was at his most effective when he played more centrally, meaning he is not an upgrade on Downing as Downing plays as a winger. A distinctly average winger.
[/quote]

My point was, we need someone like him a lot more than Drowning.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Halmeister link=topic=47592.msg1430012#msg1430012 date=1321895688]
We should really give him a go at right mid. I think he could potentially be class there.

Another thought, if you're going to dance after you score - make sure you're Brazilian. And even then you will look like a fucking twat.
[/quote]

I'd say if you are going to dance make sure its the winning goal. adebayor knows.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1429992#msg1429992 date=1321893700]

Disagree, in the first half he was great, he was superb going forward and constantly a menace for Ashley Cole, held his own at the back too. When we were under the cosh in the second half he wasn't as solid as Kelly would have been, but to brandish him as shite apart from the goal is quite frankly ridiculous.

I don't get what it is on this site, but I've noticed, especially in the match thread yesterday, there seems to be some form of hate campaign going around over Johnson, would I dare say it's because he's playing the same position and limiting the chances of a young promising scouser?
[/quote]
There is no hate campaign. People are rightly pointing out that he's not that good a defender.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Shrek is spot on.

Great goal and good going forward yesterday , but the weak link in the defence.
He is adequate as a right back but no more. When he is on-form going forward, we can forgive his defensive frailties , when he is no good offensively he is a problem.
As I said in an earlier post, I really would have pulled Dirk off (and then substituted him), put Kelly on and played Glen on the right mid.
I just saw a thread about that and I don't think it is too outlandish.
It puts Kelly in who is a better defender than Glen, but can still bomb forward, and we have someone that looks comfortable on the right for a change.

Bellamy has to start every game he can, where does he get his pace from for an old git....love him

regards

 

[Squiggles]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1429992#msg1429992 date=1321893700]
[quote author=El Pistolero link=topic=47592.msg1429985#msg1429985 date=1321892426]
Apart from the goal Johnson was shite.
[/quote]

Disagree, in the first half he was great, he was superb going forward and constantly a menace for Ashley Cole, held his own at the back too. When we were under the cosh in the second half he wasn't as solid as Kelly would have been, but to brandish him as shite apart from the goal is quite frankly ridiculous.

I don't get what it is on this site, but I've noticed, especially in the match thread yesterday, there seems to be some form of hate campaign going around over Johnson, would I dare say it's because he's playing the same position and limiting the chances of a young promising scouser?
[/quote]

That's bollocks mate. Most of their attacks came down that side. They targeted Johnson to good effect. They even scored because Johnson backed away from Malouda too much. Defensively, he was pretty poor, as was Enrique on a few occasions.

And BTW, this is coming from someone who wanted Johnson long before we signed him and certainly has no agenda against him.

 

[Squiggles]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=47592.msg1430221#msg1430221 date=1321921856]
Shrek is spot on.

Great goal and good going forward yesterday , but the weak link in the defence.
He is adequate as a right back but no more. When he is on-form going forward, we can forgive his defensive frailties , when he is no good offensively he is a problem.
As I said in an earlier post, I really would have pulled Dirk off (and then substituted him), put Kelly on and played Glen on the right mid.
I just saw a thread about that and I don't think it is too outlandish.
It puts Kelly in who is a better defender than Glen, but can still bomb forward, and we have someone that looks comfortable on the right for a change.

Bellamy has to start every game he can, where does he get his pace from for an old git....love him

regards
[/quote]

Yeah, agreed.

I'm not sure Bellemy's knees are strong enough to play as regularly as we would like though. I hope they hold up, because I think he's great.

 

[cobrastatus]

[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=47592.msg1430011#msg1430011 date=1321895584]
Johnson makes us *slightly* more vulnerable at the back than when Kelly plays.

However he makes us a lot better in attack.

As our problems don't stem from conceding too many, but not scoring enough, it makes sense to play him rather than Kelly.
[/quote]

I can get behind this.

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=cobrastatus link=topic=47592.msg1430259#msg1430259 date=1321942862]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=47592.msg1430011#msg1430011 date=1321895584]
Johnson makes us *slightly* more vulnerable at the back than when Kelly plays.

However he makes us a lot better in attack.

As our problems don't stem from conceding too many, but not scoring enough, it makes sense to play him rather than Kelly.
[/quote]

I can get behind this.
[/quote]


Yeah he's got a good point

 

[Woland]

Adam's pass for Johnson was Alonso stylee. He did a few against Swansea too, straight to feet from miles away but the passee ballsed it up. He's ace.

 

[spider-Neil]

I think too much is made of johnson's defensive weakness, for instance he was rock solid for us on the left and and was rock solid for england against spain and was even rock solid for us first half when the entire team pressed chelsea. johnson looked vulnerable when the entire team backed off when under the cosh and as for the chelsea goal look at the space around malauda when he picks up the ball, that goal is collective team fuck up, not just johnson.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=Woland link=topic=47592.msg1430268#msg1430268 date=1321949766]
Adam's pass for Johnson was Alonso stylee. He did a few against Swansea too, straight to feet from miles away but the passee ballsed it up. He's ace.
[/quote]

He pings it straight into touch just as often. And anyway, the long cross-field ball is as overrated as tackling. How often do you see Xavi whack it 50 yards across the field?

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47592.msg1430274#msg1430274 date=1321950534]
[quote author=Woland link=topic=47592.msg1430268#msg1430268 date=1321949766]
Adam's pass for Johnson was Alonso stylee. He did a few against Swansea too, straight to feet from miles away but the passee ballsed it up. He's ace.
[/quote]

He pings it straight into touch just as often. And anyway, the long cross-field ball is as overrated as tackling. How often do you see Xavi whack it 50 yards across the field?
[/quote]

i love xavis mobility as much as his passing ability. He casually just drifts into acres of space. Hes amizzin

 

[Woland]

This nostalgic view of Alonso is always a laugh to see. His shit really doesn't stink to some of you. A lot of the time he was fucking awful, pinging it 50 yards into touch was expected.

 

[keniget]

I've always defended Johnson on here so I was glad to see him get back to his attacking best. In the first half watching him waltz past Cole and his team-mates like they weren't there on numerous occasions was fantastic. And the goal was of course magic.

Defensively however he was very poor, particularly in the second half. I can't remember whether he was getting left on his own too much but so many attacks and crosses came from that side. It's a good thing Chelsea's attack was stuttering.

It was interesting to note that the problem wasn't so much him being caught out of position as is often said here but one on ones. The commentators seemed impressed with Mata's bit of skill to get past Johnson but in truth he just bungled it into a different direction and Johnson was gone. Malouda and others waltzed past him without having to really work for it either. For someone with Johnson's natural athletic qualities this really shouldn't be the issue it is. Learn from Enrique who uses his strength and pace to his advantage all the time.

Still, I want to see a lot more of the Johnson we saw in the first half giving the opposition defence a real problem.

 

[Mystic]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47592.msg1430274#msg1430274 date=1321950534]
[quote author=Woland link=topic=47592.msg1430268#msg1430268 date=1321949766]
Adam's pass for Johnson was Alonso stylee. He did a few against Swansea too, straight to feet from miles away but the passee ballsed it up. He's ace.
[/quote]

He pings it straight into touch just as often. And anyway, the long cross-field ball is as overrated as tackling. How often do you see Xavi whack it 50 yards across the field?
[/quote]

That's because Xavi hasn't got the same level of vision and passing technique as Adam.

 

[keniget]

As for the game itself it was good to see a bit of fight in the team after some of the toothless displays we've had to endure recently. They put loads of effort in the first half and you could tell they wanted it. That in itself is a little annoying though because year after year they notably raise their game for the big sides and then slump back down for the more average ones. You don't gain success from 'wanting it' 25% of the season.

In the second half I guess we tired a little after the exertions of the previous 45mins and their goal prompted us to go a little more defensive. I hate watching us play like that - two banks of four deep in our own half and standing off the opposition - because in recent times we've not looked too hot defending that way.

 

[vantage]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1430017#msg1430017 date=1321896694]
[quote author=vantage link=topic=47592.msg1430016#msg1430016 date=1321896527]
Mata was at his most effective when he played more centrally, meaning he is not an upgrade on Downing as Downing plays as a winger. A distinctly average winger.
[/quote]

My point was, we need someone like him a lot more than Drowning.
[/quote]
I see where you're coming from and kinda agree. But we had Carroll and no service to him. It was like buying a new toy for your kids at Christmas and not giving them any batteries.

So we bought the batteries. But instead of the kids being delighted with their new toy which works like a dream, they soon discovered it was not what they had expected but a rip off that doesn't work properly. It looks just like the real thing, but doesn't perform anywhere near it's physical potential.

But it wasn't until you put the batteries in that it became apparent. Or it could be the batteries. But we've thrown the receipts away, so the best we can hope for is to get 25% of our money back on ebay. I think. Daddy is pissed off cos he really wanted it to work and Mummy is even more pissed off with Daddy for wasting the money.

 

[Fabio]

If johnson plays attacking like that every week then i'm happy with his inclusion, because we are shit attacking sometimes

When our defence becomes our problem, then i'll advocate kelly

Even though i do like kelly more

 

[Mystic]

[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47592.msg1430285#msg1430285 date=1321952301]
If johnson plays attacking like that every week then i'm happy with his inclusion, because we are shit attacking sometimes

When our defence becomes our problem, then i'll advocate kelly

Even though i do like kelly more
[/quote]

Just like Vantage was saying ie drowning, I think Johnson playing like that will benefit Carroll as well, a couple of times he got to the byline and could have cut it back for Andy. I like Carroll but I dont think he should start on Sunday, he should get longer than he did though, give him 30mins I say!

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=Mystic link=topic=47592.msg1430289#msg1430289 date=1321952699]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=47592.msg1430285#msg1430285 date=1321952301]
If johnson plays attacking like that every week then i'm happy with his inclusion, because we are shit attacking sometimes

When our defence becomes our problem, then i'll advocate kelly

Even though i do like kelly more
[/quote]

Just like Vantage was saying ie drowning, I think Johnson playing like that will benefit Carroll as well, a couple of times he got to the byline and could have cut it back for Andy. I like Carroll but I dont think he should start on Sunday, he should get longer than he did though, give him 30mins I say!
[/quote]

carroll shouldn't play at all on sunday, as upsetting as it is for me to say. City play with power and mobility. We don't have both so we need to play with movement and quick passing. Only change i would make from sunday would be to bring on hendo/downing for dirk. Most likely downing as he helps the fullback a lot

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=47592.msg1430274#msg1430274 date=1321950534]
[quote author=Woland link=topic=47592.msg1430268#msg1430268 date=1321949766]
Adam's pass for Johnson was Alonso stylee. He did a few against Swansea too, straight to feet from miles away but the passee ballsed it up. He's ace.
[/quote]

He pings it straight into touch just as often. And anyway, the long cross-field ball is as overrated as tackling. How often do you see Xavi whack it 50 yards across the field?
[/quote]

He does, and we had a similar issue with Murphy and Alonso at times, but isn't that the point? If you're gonna have an adventurous passer then they're there to try the pass most people wouldn't, because occasionally it will come off and lead to a chance or a goal, so you have to take the misplaced passes with the top quality ones like the one for GlenJo's goal, because no one else in the team could do it.

Our pet fav Garcia used to be infuriating at times, but I used to always let it go because I knew for every few he fucked up, he'd eventually try something and pull it off.

I think Adam's played some great passes at times, he's been unfortunate a few times that the people on the end of them have fucked it up.