You're an ignorant bastard; I wasnt even in the match thread & yet you have a go at me personally like this 😉
Aston Villa v Liverpool - Match Thread - FA Cup
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Not a lot that’s unreasonable here mate, or in what @Judge Jules has written.
The issue i think stems from frustration from not having replaced Lovren given Matips injury record, which is not Rhys’ fault at all. However, what are fans clinging to about him other than he’s local? Young CBs in this league can probably get away with failings whilst they learn on the job by having standout attributes (super fast, hyper aggressive and physical) or by their teams being set up to not expose them. I don’t see either of these things being in Williams’ favour. Our formation and tactics call for things he doesn’t have.
I’m all for allowing players time to develop, but what are the elements of his game people are looking at and saying make him a premier league player in waiting? You can’t train pace in any meaningful way, and let’s put the spin to one side for a minute, he didn’t go and spend time in non-league football last year because there were 20 Championship and League One clubs keen on taking him...
It was a win. Would be pissed if we had not do so. But overall I am not at all happy with this...
We were play there youth team for the most part, and some would say that we won 4-1, but It should have been 4 in the fisrt half, and no I am not on about the saves, but our lack of peneration and finishing. 4 goals should have been the start.
We are not the same team as last season. In part the VVD injury, plus Gomez and Matip
mean we have sacrificed Fabinho on the alter of CB and lose what he brings in the middle of the park sitting in front of the back four, and in turn, Henderson has dropped back to take up that role thus losing the trush he give in attack from that more advanced role.
Jones while a capable does not offer in attack what Naby Keita (injured) does going forward
And even against tiring youth players, and besides coming on late in the game both the Ox and Origi did nothing. Klopp and LFC need to move AOC, Origi and need I say Shaqiri, who did nothing wrong in my books, on in this window and use the money to by a quality CB that can replace both our injury prone cb's Gomez and Matip
The other thing that I thought was what does it say about our youth, and our team at the moment vs Villia..? There fisrt team puts five on anwsered goal pass our youth, we stuggle to beat theirs 4-1. Villia starting 11 put 7 pass our starting 11. Something is seriously wrong here. The fact that if it is not our chosen starting 11 (When everyone is fit) the dorp off in players coming in (D.Jota excluded) Is massive, compere it to the other top six/seven clubs. The fall off is negligible...
We were play there youth team for the most part, and some would say that we won 4-1, but It should have been 4 in the fisrt half, and no I am not on about the saves, but our lack of peneration and finishing. 4 goals should have been the start.
We are not the same team as last season. In part the VVD injury, plus Gomez and Matip
mean we have sacrificed Fabinho on the alter of CB and lose what he brings in the middle of the park sitting in front of the back four, and in turn, Henderson has dropped back to take up that role thus losing the trush he give in attack from that more advanced role.
Jones while a capable does not offer in attack what Naby Keita (injured) does going forward
And even against tiring youth players, and besides coming on late in the game both the Ox and Origi did nothing. Klopp and LFC need to move AOC, Origi and need I say Shaqiri, who did nothing wrong in my books, on in this window and use the money to by a quality CB that can replace both our injury prone cb's Gomez and Matip
The other thing that I thought was what does it say about our youth, and our team at the moment vs Villia..? There fisrt team puts five on anwsered goal pass our youth, we stuggle to beat theirs 4-1. Villia starting 11 put 7 pass our starting 11. Something is seriously wrong here. The fact that if it is not our chosen starting 11 (When everyone is fit) the dorp off in players coming in (D.Jota excluded) Is massive, compere it to the other top six/seven clubs. The fall off is negligible...
You see this is why I think I was watching a different game. Williams wasn’t even the worst out there. Yet that’s seems to be the major takeaway from the match. For me, in this match, we failed for long spells of the first half to break down and score against an U18 side. Even the Villa goal for which Williams is coping the most blame, seasoned players were easily sliced open from around our attacking third.
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To be fair..
VVD doesn't necessarily have pace to burn as his initial acceleration at times can be poor and often can get beaten out of the blocks..
Much like Usain Bolt.. He just has longer legs than everyone else and wonderful; strength.. so when an attacker goes on the attack VVD longer strides and strength will catch them out in no time even if he has been beaten out of the blocks.. His wonderful ability to read the game adds to this to make him the all round complete defender he is..
Essentially Rhys Williams problems will potentially be the same as VVD, before it just clicked.... something he has to work on..
The kid is what 19.. give him time.. Just needs to learn to read the game better and build up his physical upper body strength
VVD doesn't necessarily have pace to burn as his initial acceleration at times can be poor and often can get beaten out of the blocks..
Much like Usain Bolt.. He just has longer legs than everyone else and wonderful; strength.. so when an attacker goes on the attack VVD longer strides and strength will catch them out in no time even if he has been beaten out of the blocks.. His wonderful ability to read the game adds to this to make him the all round complete defender he is..
Essentially Rhys Williams problems will potentially be the same as VVD, before it just clicked.... something he has to work on..
The kid is what 19.. give him time.. Just needs to learn to read the game better and build up his physical upper body strength
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I can remember Trent getting burned similarly a couple of years ago.
Lol
I didn't watch the game ...
How did our front 3 interchange? Good passing among them? or what we've come to expect?
I saw highlights, so Rhys Williams looks poor on the goal - but overall?
How did Neco do?
Any other players?
How did our front 3 interchange? Good passing among them? or what we've come to expect?
I saw highlights, so Rhys Williams looks poor on the goal - but overall?
How did Neco do?
Any other players?
Front 3 weren't good. Taki was industrious but wasteful. Mane and Salah just didn't look like they were in any form at all. Defence was mostly fine, apart from were Rhys was isolated. Neco did well, milner did well but he really shouldn't be at left back any more.
We were very very bereft of creativity until thiago and shaq came on. Our midfield just doesn't do enough to take the attacking burden off the full backs
I don't understand what happened with Mane/Salah ... hopefully this break helps them - we need them hungry and on form.
It seems our lack of creativity in the middle is a big problem when the front 3 aren't working...
I don’t think Williams was necessarily the worst out there. I’m guess I’m just saying I understand the concern about him being picked and we have a major cause for concern at CB, and I don’t understand what people think his redeeming qualities are
Minamino simply can’t hold a position. He skews everything either playing wide forward or in the midfield, is hopelessly lightweight and offers no threat. The guy is twenty fucking six years old, and you’d think we were talking about a youth prospect the way he’s defended on here. He is miles off and got pushed around by 17yr olds last night. There are some pluses to him, of course, but we’re talking Lazarus levels of turnaround required at this point
He was probably looking like 2-3 years in the u23s, before having a shot at the 1st team, and then all of a sudden he's thrown straight in. He's done remarkably well. His control, distribution is excellent for a young CB. He rarely gets beaten in the air, hasn't made any howlers. His decision making has been great.
Yes he's not the quickest and we play the highest line I've ever seen. He's playing without a recognised CB partner.
Our goals against average is better with him and Fabs than it was with VVD and JoGo.
Why are we complaining about him?
Do we need another CB? Yes of course. Is he perfect? Of course not. Has he done remarkably well? Yes. We are top of the league in part because of him. The fact we may be overtaken is down to Klopp, FSG, the midfield and the forwards. Not Rhys. He's done his job.
I imagine because whilst every sane person agrees youngsters need time, this wasn’t one of the youngsters in the plan to be getting it; we’re talking about nearly one goal conceding mistake per game, and the side is massively misfiring at least in part because of the CB injury crisis.
Everyone gets put under the microscope after 4 draws in December and losing to Southampton last week, and I don’t believe there is another defensive “prospect” in the Top 6 who shows less potential.
This is probably harsh on him, and it’s not his fault he has been accelerated into the first team, but pretending he is up to it right now seems at best naive
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We don't see the other defensive prospects because they are not playing.
Against Southampton, Trent fucked up. Hendo pulled I think Gini back to help him, but unnecessarily as he didn't need it, and gini could have bailed Trent out if he wasn't pulled back. So the goal was on 2 of our most celebrated players. Everyone makes mistakes.
Rhys got done by Barry yes, what else has he done that directly led to a goal?
People wanted to keep Lovren who’d be making even more mistakes. Thank fuck he’s gone.
So you're saying that Rhys is better than Lovren?
Really?
No. I think people are forgetting how utterly terrible he was. This is the guy who was taken off in the first half of a match because he lost his head. He was absolutely useless. Add to that he didn’t manage to play 10 consecutive games for us means he’d probably be out too.
I’d rather we invest game time in a youngster learning his trade making those mistakes than fucking Lovren.
I’d rather we invest game time in a youngster learning his trade making those mistakes than fucking Lovren.
It makes sense, but the thing with Rhys is that it's come too early for him.
I mean he basically went from playing non-league football to playing in the premier league in less than a year. Yes he's getting more and more experience every game he plays but I think some of us are too focused on the fact that he's young and local. He just isn't built for premier league football yet. If it was Gomez at 19 I'd be right there with you.
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We are conceding some goals but not at a rate makes me overly concerned right now. As we have 70+% of the ball we should be doing more with it. It’s not like we are under pressure for periods of games. We aren’t winning games because of a mixture of Trent being massively out of form, lack of midfield spark and a flat front 3.
You're exactly right, our front three should be doing more and are a part of the problem.
Overreaction. During games fans always moan and whinge.It happens with every club.It's not disrespectful in any way, it's born out of anxiety for the result. Vast majority are far more subjetive and considered after the game. Most of us have been on the Kop and heard the moans when it becomes difficult. Moaning and whinging are part of the fabric of the game.Yeah sometimes it get a bit abusive and one or two let themselfes down but we know why they're doing it.
Rhys Williams is doing far better than he should be considering the level of football he was used to. His problem and the teams problem is that with Fabinho in central defence it means we're missing Fabinho from defensive midfield as Henderson and the rest of the midfielders just don't play the position as well as he does.
They are all good players but Fabinho is just better at anticipating danger rather than reacting to it when it's too late. Our defence looks more vulnerable when the opposition has the chance to play dangerous passes to their forward players and Fabinho normally stops that at source. I think we'll get better when Fabinho is back at defensive midfield even though he's been phenomenal in defence. That's the knock on effect of Van Dijk being injured and Matip and Gomez being injury prone.
They are all good players but Fabinho is just better at anticipating danger rather than reacting to it when it's too late. Our defence looks more vulnerable when the opposition has the chance to play dangerous passes to their forward players and Fabinho normally stops that at source. I think we'll get better when Fabinho is back at defensive midfield even though he's been phenomenal in defence. That's the knock on effect of Van Dijk being injured and Matip and Gomez being injury prone.
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