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What happened next...

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[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36872.msg976540#msg976540 date=1257091707]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976526#msg976526 date=1257091249]
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36872.msg976525#msg976525 date=1257091187]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976519#msg976519 date=1257090947]
[quote author=amber cabs link=topic=36872.msg976516#msg976516 date=1257090898]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976502#msg976502 date=1257090374]
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36872.msg976495#msg976495 date=1257090063]
I dont think so Sheik. I think his rehabilitation took longer than anticipated.
[/quote]

6 weeks longer than anticipated is a hell of a lot of time mate. Surely he went through a stringent medical which would have assessed such like. Either Rafa knew how long he'd be out or the doctor needs some refresher training.
[/quote]

Maybe there was noone else available to replace xabi that rafa wanted. Surely better to sign someone and have them for half this season and four more than to have signed noone this summer.
[/quote]

Even easier, tell Alonso he ain't goin' nowhere.
[/quote]

We only paid 5m up front for Aquilani with the next installments coming in Jan and next Summer. Maybe that's the reason we went for him as we needed the rest of the Xabi money to pay off some of our debts.
[/quote]

So it was the owners who sold Alonso?
[/quote]

No, it was Rafa but perhaps he thought would have got to spend the money he generated.

Another scenario is that perhaps Rafa knew that debts needed to be paid and agreed with the owners that he would sell if Real's offer was too good to be true.
[/quote]

have you considered the scenario that rafa is a shit manager?
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36872.msg976551#msg976551 date=1257092423]
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36872.msg976540#msg976540 date=1257091707]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976526#msg976526 date=1257091249]
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=36872.msg976525#msg976525 date=1257091187]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976519#msg976519 date=1257090947]
[quote author=amber cabs link=topic=36872.msg976516#msg976516 date=1257090898]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976502#msg976502 date=1257090374]
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36872.msg976495#msg976495 date=1257090063]
I dont think so Sheik. I think his rehabilitation took longer than anticipated.
[/quote]

6 weeks longer than anticipated is a hell of a lot of time mate. Surely he went through a stringent medical which would have assessed such like. Either Rafa knew how long he'd be out or the doctor needs some refresher training.
[/quote]

Maybe there was noone else available to replace xabi that rafa wanted. Surely better to sign someone and have them for half this season and four more than to have signed noone this summer.
[/quote]

Even easier, tell Alonso he ain't goin' nowhere.
[/quote]

We only paid 5m up front for Aquilani with the next installments coming in Jan and next Summer. Maybe that's the reason we went for him as we needed the rest of the Xabi money to pay off some of our debts.
[/quote]

So it was the owners who sold Alonso?
[/quote]

No, it was Rafa but perhaps he thought would have got to spend the money he generated.

Another scenario is that perhaps Rafa knew that debts needed to be paid and agreed with the owners that he would sell if Real's offer was too good to be true.
[/quote]

have you considered the scenario that rafa is a shit manager?
[/quote]

No, because I know for a fact that isn't true.
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976472#msg976472 date=1257088661]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976455#msg976455 date=1257087620]
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36872.msg976453#msg976453 date=1257087477]
He signed Aquilani on the 7th August under the illusion he would be out for 6 weeks, how can you blame him that 12 weeks later he hasnt played?
[/quote]

Did he suffer another injury while recovering Andy?
[/quote]

Anyone?
[/quote]

Somebody was telling me that the club decided to hold Aquilani back from training to ensure his injury was completely sorted. They also mentioned that the Liverpool medical staff felt that Roma had neglected his injuries for many season. Not sure where they got that info from, but it would explain the extension to his time on the sidelines.
 
oh facts now is it regrding your belief in rafa but everything else maybe someone elses fault.

give it up tinto - he'll be gone soon, at best he's average and no way is he good enough for a team like ours that measures success by trophies.
 
Shit managers don't win the number of trophy's Rafa has over the years.

Shit managers hold half-time team talks on the pitch.
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976544#msg976544 date=1257091967]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976542#msg976542 date=1257091797]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976535#msg976535 date=1257091537]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976534#msg976534 date=1257091501]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976529#msg976529 date=1257091337]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976527#msg976527 date=1257091267]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976519#msg976519 date=1257090947]
[quote author=amber cabs link=topic=36872.msg976516#msg976516 date=1257090898]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976502#msg976502 date=1257090374]
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36872.msg976495#msg976495 date=1257090063]
I dont think so Sheik. I think his rehabilitation took longer than anticipated.
[/quote]

6 weeks longer than anticipated is a hell of a lot of time mate. Surely he went through a stringent medical which would have assessed such like. Either Rafa knew how long he'd be out or the doctor needs some refresher training.
[/quote]


Maybe there was noone else available to replace xabi that rafa wanted. Surely better to sign someone and have them for half this season and four more than to have signed noone this summer.
[/quote]

Even easier, tell Alonso he ain't goin' nowhere.
[/quote]

If only it was that simple, but you already know that really.
[/quote]

Why couldn't it have been that simple?
[/quote]

You don't need me to explain that.

[/quote]

I really want you to.
[/quote]

Why do any clubs sell players who are on long contracts, that they want to keep?

If a player wants out they have the power to force through a move in todays game.


[/quote]

So what would have happened if Rafa turned down his request?
[/quote]

Well if you're right we could simply force any player on a long contract to stay with us. No need to ever worry about Torres leaving then i guess.
 
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=36872.msg976557#msg976557 date=1257092775]
Out of interest, how much would it cost if he were sacked this season?
[/quote]

16Million I think
 
[quote author=Bradleme link=topic=36872.msg976556#msg976556 date=1257092756]
Shit managers don't win the number of trophy's Rafa has over the years.

Shit managers hold half-time team talks on the pitch.
[/quote]

i'd like to think our level of shit is far higher than hull's. it's all relative really.

remind me what rafa's won recently - oh never mind of course we don't measure success by winning its measured by progress.
 
[quote author=Bradleme link=topic=36872.msg976556#msg976556 date=1257092756]
Shit managers don't win the number of trophy's Rafa has over the years.

Shit managers hold half-time team talks on the pitch.
[/quote]

Ha yeah. Rafa isn't a shit manager, he's far from it. I just don't think he's the person to win us the league. He had his chance last season. Going on this one so far, we're going backwards. Failure to improve on last season's standing or failure to win a trophy means his position needs to be seriouslt looked at.
 
[quote author=refugee link=topic=36872.msg976563#msg976563 date=1257092916]
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=36872.msg976557#msg976557 date=1257092775]
Out of interest, how much would it cost if he were sacked this season?
[/quote]

16Million I think
[/quote]

fucking hell
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976559#msg976559 date=1257092794]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976544#msg976544 date=1257091967]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976542#msg976542 date=1257091797]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976535#msg976535 date=1257091537]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976534#msg976534 date=1257091501]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976529#msg976529 date=1257091337]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976527#msg976527 date=1257091267]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976519#msg976519 date=1257090947]
[quote author=amber cabs link=topic=36872.msg976516#msg976516 date=1257090898]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976502#msg976502 date=1257090374]
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36872.msg976495#msg976495 date=1257090063]
I dont think so Sheik. I think his rehabilitation took longer than anticipated.
[/quote]

6 weeks longer than anticipated is a hell of a lot of time mate. Surely he went through a stringent medical which would have assessed such like. Either Rafa knew how long he'd be out or the doctor needs some refresher training.
[/quote]


Maybe there was noone else available to replace xabi that rafa wanted. Surely better to sign someone and have them for half this season and four more than to have signed noone this summer.
[/quote]

Even easier, tell Alonso he ain't goin' nowhere.
[/quote]

If only it was that simple, but you already know that really.
[/quote]

Why couldn't it have been that simple?
[/quote]

You don't need me to explain that.

[/quote]

I really want you to.
[/quote]

Why do any clubs sell players who are on long contracts, that they want to keep?

If a player wants out they have the power to force through a move in todays game.


[/quote]

So what would have happened if Rafa turned down his request?
[/quote]

Well if you're right we could simply force any player on a long contract to stay with us. No need to ever worry about Torres leaving then i guess.
[/quote]

It's not the same for every player of course but I'll tell you what I reckon would have happened..
Alonso would have been disappointed but gone away and played to the best of his ability..
 
I would agree that his position is under threat and I don't see how anybody could standby him with out scrutinising some of his decisions. That said he's not going any place before the end of the season no matter how far we fall Rafa will still be the manager unless we get new owners or Real Madrid come in and take him off our hands.
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976573#msg976573 date=1257093138]

It's not the same for every player of course but I'll tell you what I reckon would have happened..
Alonso would have been disappointed but gone away and played to the best of his ability..

[/quote]

Maybe, but he would have been annoyed and may not have been as professional off the pitch.
 
[quote author=refugee link=topic=36872.msg976576#msg976576 date=1257093239]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976573#msg976573 date=1257093138]

It's not the same for every player of course but I'll tell you what I reckon would have happened..
Alonso would have been disappointed but gone away and played to the best of his ability..

[/quote]

Maybe, but he would have been annoyed and may not have been as professional off the pitch.
[/quote]

Do you really think he's that type of player/person? He doesn't come across that way to me.
 
[quote author=rage link=topic=36872.msg976555#msg976555 date=1257092706]
oh facts now is it regrding your belief in rafa but everything else maybe someone elses fault.

give it up tinto - he'll be gone soon, at best he's average and no way is he good enough for a team like ours that measures success by trophies.


[/quote]

I never once stated that's it's never Rafa's fault as clearly he bears some, if not a lot, of the responsibility, but I don't think our club as a whole has worked with as much coherence and togetherness in the transfer market as clubs such as Arsenal and United.

A manager that has 2 La Ligas, 1 UEFA Cup, 1 Champions League and an FA Cup isn't average.
 
Think Houillier's was about 10 million, but Im not sure if that included his bak-room staff as well.
 
No fuck it sheiky, Torres (or any player on a long contract for that matter) is on a 5 year contract so we can just say "no" if he ever wants out over the next 4 years.

It's that simple.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976584#msg976584 date=1257093405]
No fuck it sheiky, Torres (or any player on a long contract for that matter) is on a 5 year contract so we can just say "no" if he ever wants out over the next 4 years.

It's that simple.


[/quote]

Sound.

Sorted.

Next?
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976581#msg976581 date=1257093384]
[quote author=refugee link=topic=36872.msg976576#msg976576 date=1257093239]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976573#msg976573 date=1257093138]

It's not the same for every player of course but I'll tell you what I reckon would have happened..
Alonso would have been disappointed but gone away and played to the best of his ability..

[/quote]

Maybe, but he would have been annoyed and may not have been as professional off the pitch.
[/quote]

Do you really think he's that type of player/person? He doesn't come across that way to me.
[/quote]

He didn't come across as being the type of person that would go back on his word and play for Real Madrid.
 
[quote author=refugee link=topic=36872.msg976591#msg976591 date=1257093548]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976581#msg976581 date=1257093384]
[quote author=refugee link=topic=36872.msg976576#msg976576 date=1257093239]
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976573#msg976573 date=1257093138]

It's not the same for every player of course but I'll tell you what I reckon would have happened..
Alonso would have been disappointed but gone away and played to the best of his ability..

[/quote]

Maybe, but he would have been annoyed and may not have been as professional off the pitch.
[/quote]

Do you really think he's that type of player/person? He doesn't come across that way to me.
[/quote]

He didn't come across as being the type of person that would go back on his word and play for Real Madrid.
[/quote]

That's hardly being unprofessional though. He changed his mind tis all.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976597#msg976597 date=1257093813]
I can't believe we didn't just say "no" when Xabi put in his transfer request!


[/quote]

You still haven't give us your ideas on what would have happened if we had said no Raf.
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976593#msg976593 date=1257093619]
That's hardly being unprofessional though. He changed his mind tis all.
[/quote]

Its a bit more than changing his mind considering the love of Real Madrid amongst the Basque people. Anyway I'm just pointing out that your are trying to make a point based on your outsiders perception that Xabi is a professional, it may be true, but you are not in the best position to make that call. Why risk having an unhappy payer disrupting morale when you can have an alternative player (who is very highly rated) and extra money to spend on strengthening other areas of the team, which Rafa was led to believe that he had.
 
[quote author=Sheik Yerbouti link=topic=36872.msg976601#msg976601 date=1257093947]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=36872.msg976597#msg976597 date=1257093813]
I can't believe we didn't just say "no" when Xabi put in his transfer request!


[/quote]

You still haven't give us your ideas on what would have happened if we had said no Raf.
[/quote]

Like you i have no idea what the outcome would have been.

My point is though that when a player makes up his mind that he wants out, then he's more than likely going to get his own way. If you can't accept that then you're as bad as the posters that irritate you so much with their stubbornness sheiky
 
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