The RAFAEL OUT thread

[keniget]

Until we have some stability at the top and finances in place, we have to be a little bit careful about how much we start demanding. Rafa, for all his flaws, is still obviously competent and if he can keep us chugging along whilst we sort out the fucking mess we're in, that'll have to do.

 

[Richey]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

I think you're probably right.

However if we win the FA Cup say and also finish top 4 then I would be surprised if he got the sack. The pressure would still be on for next season though

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=36631.msg968612#msg968612 date=1256203049]
Until we have some stability at the top and finances in place, we have to be a little bit careful about how much we start demanding. Rafa, for all his flaws, is still obviously competent and if he can keep us chugging along whilst we sort out the fucking mess we're in, that'll have to do.
[/quote]

that's the exact position I hold. add to that the cost to replace the manager and then the cost to buy out the new manager (unless he walks of his own free will). let's not forget rafa walked from valencia or we'd have had to buy rafa out of his contract and if we did that at least one of alonso and garcia wouldn't have happened.
when people talk about getting rid they need to think things through.

 

[Richey]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I don't think anyone was suggesting that it is likely to happen. Certainly not on current form.

 

[Fabio]

Can't win against the Rafa out crowd. They'd much rather the club flounder with no manager than let him see the season out. I can't decide on whether I want him gone or not, but getting rid now or after the mancs is fucking stupidity to the nth degree

We
Have
No
MONEY

How will that entice these managers who have clubs? The promise of blow jobs off benayoun the smackhead?

Let's get southgate so glock can stop crying that the invites for dinner no longer come

Providing they ever did

 

[Oncy]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968615#msg968615 date=1256203288]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=36631.msg968612#msg968612 date=1256203049]
Until we have some stability at the top and finances in place, we have to be a little bit careful about how much we start demanding. Rafa, for all his flaws, is still obviously competent and if he can keep us chugging along whilst we sort out the fucking mess we're in, that'll have to do.
[/quote]

that's the exact position I hold. add to that the cost to replace the manager and then the cost to buy out the new manager (unless he walks of his own free will). let's not forget rafa walked from valencia or we'd have had to buy rafa out of his contract and if we did that at least one of alonso and garcia wouldn't have happened.
when people talk about getting rid they need to think things through.
[/quote]I nominate garcia.

 

[Richey]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968615#msg968615 date=1256203288]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=36631.msg968612#msg968612 date=1256203049]
Until we have some stability at the top and finances in place, we have to be a little bit careful about how much we start demanding. Rafa, for all his flaws, is still obviously competent and if he can keep us chugging along whilst we sort out the fucking mess we're in, that'll have to do.
[/quote]

that's the exact position I hold. add to that the cost to replace the manager and then the cost to buy out the new manager (unless he walks of his own free will). let's not forget rafa walked from valencia or we'd have had to buy rafa out of his contract and if we did that at least one of alonso and garcia wouldn't have happened.
when people talk about getting rid they need to think things through.
[/quote]

Depends on the terms of Benitez's contract and the terms of any new manager's current contact really doesn't it?

 

[Fabio]

[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=36631.msg968618#msg968618 date=1256203438]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968615#msg968615 date=1256203288]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=36631.msg968612#msg968612 date=1256203049]
Until we have some stability at the top and finances in place, we have to be a little bit careful about how much we start demanding. Rafa, for all his flaws, is still obviously competent and if he can keep us chugging along whilst we sort out the fucking mess we're in, that'll have to do.
[/quote]

that's the exact position I hold. add to that the cost to replace the manager and then the cost to buy out the new manager (unless he walks of his own free will). let's not forget rafa walked from valencia or we'd have had to buy rafa out of his contract and if we did that at least one of alonso and garcia wouldn't have happened.
when people talk about getting rid they need to think things through.
[/quote]I nominate garcia.
[/quote]
Either would've meant Istanbul wouldn't have happened
Theoretically

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Fabio Alrighty-o link=topic=36631.msg968617#msg968617 date=1256203416]


We
Have
No
MONEY

[/quote]

say it again and again until it finally sinks in.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968624#msg968624 date=1256203860]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.


[/quote]

my minimum requirement for the season was a league challenge. I can't say I'm perticually asked what happens in the CL although I conceed escaping the group is critical for financial reasons.

 

[Delinquent]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=36631.msg968492#msg968492 date=1256191668]
Glock has a point lads.
[/quote]

What tripe you just posted.

In all seriousness, there probably is a point to be made, but it got lost in the sea of shite that was Glock's opening post.

 

[gkmacca]

Quite. It epitomises what goes wrong on the forum these days. A thread begins by saying something like 'if you don't share the following views then you're an idiot'. That doesn't lead to a serious discussion, it just leads to endless pointless rants. The problem with someone like Glock is that he doesn't know how to debate. I couldn't care less about his views, but the way he states them leads to nowhere but this waste of time.

 

[The Slugmonster]

If we win sunday you'll all back off for a while tho wont you! Gerrard, Torres, Aquilani, Johnson (only recent..i know!), Agger, Aurelio....all either injured, just back from injury or not quite match fit yet!!

I dont care who says Rafa has had five years to build a better squad, well he built THIS squad in his five years and its a good squad but those six are all starters and any team in Europe would struggle with 6 of their best out or not on form (even wengers pups)..along with Cara not having the best of starts to a season, you cant really ask for Rafas head.

Although it will ultimately probably have an effect on us challenging for major honours this season...its just a series of unfortunate events that you cant really plan for 2 months into the new season. The only thing I blame Rafa for is the failure to do anything about the zonal marking at set pieces..which is obviously a problem..but I definitely dont want him out for it....just try something new maybe!!

Lets look to Sunday...C'mon you Reds!!!!!

 

[Vanbasten84]

[quote author=The Slugmonster link=topic=36631.msg968696#msg968696 date=1256210150]
If we win sunday you'll all back off for a while tho wont you! Gerrard, Torres, Aquilani, Johnson (only recent..i know!), Agger, Aurelio....all either injured, just back from injury or not quite match fit yet!!

I dont care who says Rafa has had five years to build a better squad, well he built THIS squad in his five years and its a good squad but those six are all starters and any team in Europe would struggle with 6 of their best out or not on form (even wengers pups)..along with Cara not having the best of starts to a season, you cant really ask for Rafas head.

Although it will ultimately probably have an effect on us challenging for major honours this season...its just a series of unfortunate events that you cant really plan for 2 months into the new season. The only thing I blame Rafa for is the failure to do anything about the zonal marking at set pieces..which is obviously a problem..but I definitely dont want him out for it....just try something new maybe!!

Lets look to Sunday...C'mon you Reds!!!!!
[/quote]

A serious of unfortunate events starring Jim Carrey is it Slugsy..The scum shall feel the backlash on sunday

 

[refugee]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=36631.msg968492#msg968492 date=1256191668]
Glock has a point lads.
[/quote]

Vault

 

[The Slugmonster]

Haha yeah.....on a different topic completely....did you see how purple Fergusons nose was in moscow last night?! Full bottle of scotch couldnt even warm it up!! Hope the cunt got frostbite!!

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968627#msg968627 date=1256204240]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968624#msg968624 date=1256203860]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.


[/quote]

my minimum requirement for the season was a league challenge. I can't say I'm perticually asked what happens in the CL although I conceed escaping the group is critical for financial reasons.
[/quote]


I know it's English and yet....

 

[gene hughes]

Glack does have a point though.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=36631.msg968726#msg968726 date=1256213072]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968627#msg968627 date=1256204240]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968624#msg968624 date=1256203860]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.


[/quote]

my minimum requirement for the season was a league challenge. I can't say I'm perticually asked what happens in the CL although I conceed escaping the group is critical for financial reasons.
[/quote]


I know it's English and yet....
[/quote]

what was wrong with what I said?

 

[Judge Jules]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968627#msg968627 date=1256204240]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968624#msg968624 date=1256203860]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.


[/quote]

my minimum requirement for the season was a league challenge. I can't say I'm perticually particularly asked arsed what happens in the CL although I conceed concede escaping the group is critical for financial reasons.
[/quote]

Neil, does your spellcheck include a Random function or something?

As far as the football point you're making goes, like you I put the title as top priority, but unlike you I think the CL matters a great deal as well, both financially (which applies well beyond the group stage incidentally) and in terms of momentum and confidence. Sidelining the CL is a big mistake IMHO.

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=36631.msg968749#msg968749 date=1256215714]
Glack does have a point though.
[/quote]

Yes. On top of his head.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=36631.msg968763#msg968763 date=1256217595]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968627#msg968627 date=1256204240]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968624#msg968624 date=1256203860]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=36631.msg968614#msg968614 date=1256203134]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=36631.msg968604#msg968604 date=1256202106]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=36631.msg968598#msg968598 date=1256201682]
Whilst I don't agree totally with Glock on here he does raise some points worth considering and is able to back them up.

I still don't agree that we should be getting rid of Benitez now as I can't see how that will help matters in the short term. He will turn things around to a degree definately and I think he deserves the chance to do so. The question is what exactly does he have to achieve this season to keep his job in the summer?
[/quote]

You'd have to say even a domestic cup wouldn't appease most, if we fall short of second and a reasonable challenge.

The Champions League might do it, but you'd have to say in our current state that going all the way in the CL could be too much for this squad and would have a knock on effect on our league status.
[/quote]

all the way in the CL? if someone offered me escaping the group right now I'd snatch their arm off.
[/quote]

I want the best but I'm not sure what's reasonable from this sorry mess Neil, and Rafa is partly culpable aswell, let's be fair.

I was stating it from a general fans perspective and from what's perceived as reasonable taking into consideration factors like, how long he's been here, how much money we've spent prior to recent issues (and why our squad is so thin), etc.

He's done an enormous amount of good though and it'll prove both costly to get rid of him and a tall task to find someone better who's willing to come in under current conditions.

If you asked me the minimum expectations for this season though, given we've improved on right back and brought in a 'alleged' quality replacement for Xabi, then given what we achieved last season, the above would be about right really.


[/quote]

my minimum requirement for the season was a league challenge. I can't say I'm perticually particularly asked arsed what happens in the CL although I conceed concede escaping the group is critical for financial reasons.
[/quote]

Neil, does your spellcheck include a Random function or something?

As far as the football point you're making goes, like you I put the title as top priority, but unlike you I think the CL matters a great deal as well, both financially (which applies well beyond the group stage incidentally) and in terms of momentum and confidence. Sidelining the CL is a big mistake IMHO.


[/quote]

I'm not bothered about spelling or grammar on a football forum, seriously, who the fuck cares?

 

[Judge Jules]

Normally I'd say the same, but it's a question of degree. Some of the spelling in that last post of yours was so wildly out that it was honestly not easy to work out what you meant to begin with. When things get to THAT stage, it does matter.

 

[Mamma Mia]

It always matters.

 

[Le Chacal]

He does have a very good point

 

[acejmk]

Fucking hell it's getting abit heated around here good job we are not all sat in a room together there would he bloody spilt LOL
Anyway keep it up it's great ;D

 

[Niall K]

 

[Judge Jules]

[quote author=acejmk link=topic=36631.msg968785#msg968785 date=1256219610]
Fucking hell it's getting abit heated around here good job we are not all sat in a room together there would he bloody spilt LOL
Anyway keep it up it's great ;D
[/quote]

If you think this is heated, especially for 6CM, you can't have been around very long.