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Suárez vs Terry.

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kingjulian said:
Lol at in "in your uneducated opinion" stuff....... Excellent trolling...
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It's not even trolling. I'm fed up at people with no understanding of the law talking shite as if they know something. I wouldn't even venture to say Suarez definitely wouldn't get convicted in court - Ched Evans had a similar quality of evidence against him. He got convicted of rape. You never know what's going to happen on the day, you can't account for witnesses.

The reality is nobody who stuck up for Suarez knows anything about law, they expressed shock at the most normal of things, and gave the impression they were actually interested in justice and the principles involved. They also got taken in by lies the club told (see those who still think Negrito was the word used). When similar things happened in John Terry's criminal trial like when he didn't get to view the video before he was interviewed by police - there wasn't any uproar about how big an injustice it was. There was no uproar when they found out the Court has a 98% conviction rate much like the FA's kangaroo court.

So lets be honest - you lot don't have a clue or give a fuck about the law. You don't give a fuck about justice or a lack of it. You're just interested in supporting a Liverpool player no matter how much of a cunt he is, and continuing a horrible victim mentality.

FoxForceFive said:
Tbf as far as I know Ross is the only one who is educated within the law.
Though of course his exact phraseology was more blunt than that.
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Irushie is more qualified than me, and it's no coincidence his thoughts were pretty similar to mine all the way through.

vantage said:
You know how far standards have slipped when it's the mods trolling.
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Sorry Mr. Insider.
 
1. On the subject of education in/knowledge of the law: as I've said more than once before (not that I'd have expected you to notice, so convinced are you of being the "only legal ITK in the village") I'm not a lawyer but I am a qualified company secretary. To obtain my practising certificate I had to pass degree-level law (in a variety of subjects, not just company law) and accountancy exams, among others. Moreover, having practised for 17 years, I probably have a sod of a lot more experience at using what I learned than you do.

2. I for one didn't know similar things happened to Terry. If I had, and if the subject had come up on here, my view would have been that two wrongs don't make a right and it wasn't appropriate in his case either.

Get the f'ck over yourself.
 
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Rosco said:
It's not even trolling. I'm fed up at people with no understanding of the law talking shite as if they know something.
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Speaking for myself, the law is that far beneath my capacity of understanding it's actually on a par with Sesame Street.
 
I cant take another round of all this, but whats your comment to Suarez being questioned once without seeing the video of events, while Evra was questioned 3 times while using video to help him with his story.

Had his case gone down the same road as Terry there at least wouldnt be any questions to why the FA have handled this as they've done.

Even you can agree that the FAs system is like the Spanish Inquisition trials from midevil days and do as they please.
They shouldnt have the power or right to act as a governing body in cases like this.
 
Comparing Suarez to Evra is wrong. One is a witness the other is the accused.

Suarez v Terry - both accused, both questioned without seeing the video, so neither were able to make up a bullshit story that fits.

It's far from unusual for a legal team to talk to witnesses before a trial.
 
For someone with legal training, how come he comment so much on accounting and numbers as if he is the expert? Just makes one wonders does it not? It is therefore not right to say those without a full law degree is unable to comment or have an opinion on the legal systems and justice.
 
Y1 said:
For someone with legal training, how come he comment so much on accounting and numbers as if he is the expert? Just makes one wonders does it not? It is therefore not right to say those without a full law degree is unable to comment or have an opinion on the legal systems and justice.
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Should I produce a CV ?
 
From what I understand in an article today in one if the rags, its not the intent or the inflection, or the manner that Suarez said what he is alleged to have said , but the fact that he said it. Which from an uneducated perspective would seem the opposite if the law. In the Terry case, he said it but allegedly did it mean anything by it, ergo he will be found guilty by the FA. As he only said it once he may get half the ban, however there are other issues surrounding other foul language that could top that up. There is also the thought that fucking black cunt could be worse than Negro, in a different generation Negri was not seen as unacceptable and was in fact seen as a polite term, as far as I know fucking black cunt never has been.
Regards

regards
 
Judge Jules said:
1. On the subject of education in/knowledge of the law: as I've said more than once before (not that I'd have expected you to notice, so convinced are you of being the "only legal ITK in the village") I'm not a lawyer but I am a qualified company secretary. To obtain my practising certificate I had to pass degree-level law (in a variety of subjects, not just company law) and accountancy exams, among others. Moreover, having practised for 17 years, I probably have a sod of a lot more experience at using what I learned than you do.

2. I for one didn't know similar things happened to Terry. If I had, and if the subject had come up on here, my view would have been that two wrongs don't make a right and it wasn't appropriate in his case either.

Get the f'ck over yourself.
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If Company Secretary's knew anything about criminal law they'd be hired by criminals to defend them. For someone claiming a legal background to produce such ignorance of legal procedures in your comments about Suarez and everything that went on is amazing.

You said nothing about Terry because you don't give a shit about him, that's fair enough. Just don't go on some pretend moral crusade when in reality all you're doing is trying to stick up for Suarez.
 
Vlads Quiff said:
From what I understand in an article today in one if the rags, its not the intent or the inflection, or the manner that Suarez said what he is alleged to have said , but the fact that he said it. Which from an uneducated perspective would seem the opposite if the law. In the Terry case, he said it but allegedly did it mean anything by it, ergo he will be found guilty by the FA. As he only said it once he may get half the ban, however there are other issues surrounding other foul language that could top that up. There is also the thought that fucking black cunt could be worse than Negro, in a different generation Negri was not seen as unacceptable and was in fact seen as a polite term, as far as I know fucking black cunt never has been.
Regards

regards
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I agree.

Strict liability offences do appear in criminal law too Vlad. For example - it's no defence to a speeding charge that you didn't mean to speed. You did it, you get punished regardless. It's a matter of convenience really,meant for minor not truly criminal offences.
 
Terry saw the video at his FA hearing. The new evidence from the training cameras he hadnt seen.


During an FA interview five days after the match, Terry agreed: "If you watch the video and me, watching the video, you can quite easily say that, that doesn't look good." But, he said, it had to be viewed "in the context of what I thought Anton accused me of".
 
Rosco said:
So lets be honest - you lot don't have a clue or give a fuck about the law. You don't give a fuck about justice or a lack of it. You're just interested in supporting a Liverpool player no matter how much of a cunt he is, and continuing a horrible victim mentality.

.
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I would take exception to that comment if I was being included in " you lot "
 
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Lol @ Rosco getting all Judge Dredd. I AM THE LAWW !!!

Why the fuck anyone is partaking in this thread which is bound to become a clusterfuck sooner or later Is beyond me.


Because of that, I'm out.
 
The likeliest charge the FA will consider is a breach of its rule E3, which prohibits improper conduct including "indecent or insulting words or behaviour". A reference to a person's ethnic origin, colour or race is an aggravating factor. Given the nature of the confrontation and swearing, it is likely Anton Ferdinand could be charged, as well as Terry. The FA must consider, on the balance of probabilities, its view of how Terry said "fucking black cunt" in a Premier League football match, following a court's decision that it was not proven, beyond reasonable doubt, the words were said as an insult.

If Ferdinand is charged, it rasises a few questions to why Evra wasnt charged.....
 
Vlads Quiff said:
From what I understand in an article today in one if the rags, its not the intent or the inflection, or the manner that Suarez said what he is alleged to have said , but the fact that he said it. Which from an uneducated perspective would seem the opposite if the law. In the Terry case, he said it but allegedly did it mean anything by it, ergo he will be found guilty by the FA. As he only said it once he may get half the ban, however there are other issues surrounding other foul language that could top that up. There is also the thought that fucking black cunt could be worse than Negro, in a different generation Negri was not seen as unacceptable and was in fact seen as a polite term, as far as I know fucking black cunt never has been.
Regards

regards
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That rag is wrong then isn't it, because it is absolutely not "ergo he will be charged by the FA", and the fact Rosco agrees shows how little he actually understands. It's all good having your taught definitions of strict liability, but you have failed to apply it properly here. And you are also failing to see the difference between Terry and Suarez. That attention to detail is what will eventually separate you from the top barristers.

Anton: Did you call me a fucking black cunt?
Terry: Did I say 'you fucking black cunt'? No I never.
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Those are not abusive or insulting words spoken by Terry. So he will not and cannot be charged under the FA's rule E3 or the Public Order Act. He will have to be charged for something else if they want to save face. Or else it is up to the FA to prove on the balance of probabilities that the above is not the true context of those words. Which without an admission from Terry is basically impossible to do. They can't even question Terry's character without looking like idiots seeing as though they fucking chose him as their captain for 6 odd years.
 
The 25-year-old Uruguay forward was handed the suspension and a £40,000 fine in December after being found guilty of racially abusing United defender Patrice Evra in a Barclays Premier League match.

Speaking on Uruguayan television show 'RR.Gol', Suarez said: "They were very tough days to me. I am not used to showing what I really feel, but the trial week was very difficult. I also cried alongside my wife.

"People at Liverpool are sure that it was a way that Manchester United used to put me out of the team and stop Liverpool. In England, Manchester United's political power is strong and you must respect that and shut your mouth."

The controversy was re-ignited in February, when Suarez seemingly refused Evra's handshake as the teams conducted their traditional pre-match greeting.

Suarez claims his actions were misunderstood.

He said: "In England, it was shown the moment when I passed in front of him, but they didn't see that he had his hand low before.

"Only the media in Uruguay and Spain showed that I wanted to shake his hand.

"Previously, I had promised my wife, the manager and the directors that I was going to shake hands with Evra. There was a chance for the teams not to shake hands like in a game between QPR and Chelsea [following the Anton Ferdinand-John Terry racism row], but I told them I was to shake hands with him.

"'Why not?', I thought, because I had no problems with him. I had been punished because of him, but I had no problems with shaking hands."

Speaking at length about the subject for the first time, Suarez reflected on a difficult period in his career.

"The trial [disciplinary hearing] was so complicated for me," he said. "I had to go to Manchester in a taxi for the trial. I got up at seven in the morning and I came home at nine at night.

"I was exhausted, I was so tired. I wanted to cry, and kick all the things around me.

"I came home and I wanted to do all that, but I couldn't because my daughter was at home. There were really complicated days, and then things became harder after the punishment."
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You can't really argue with that.
 
Racism is not going away regardless of what campaigns are endorsed.

Lets see what the FA does not that I have faith in theri ability to be impartial.
 
The thing is, he did an hour long interview were he praises everyone from Gerrard to Drogba. The Evra bit was a couple of minutes tops, but the media makes it as if this is all he talked about.

Still, should have kept his trap shut. We need to move on regardless.
 
Regardless of whatever political power United have, they couldn't have gotten him banned if he had said nothing at the time and/or kept his mouth shut and denied everything straight afterwards
 
Every time I see this thread title I think there's gonna be a celebrity death match video in here.

Disappointed every time.
 
As someone who was and is in the Suarez camp in the whole Evra thing, I would like to tell him to stop talking about it to the media. He is doing himself and the club more harm than good. Its over. He lost. It isnt going to change.

His best bet now is to concentrate on his football, hopefully have a great season, and in the process tear Evra two new arseholes.
 
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