Six Nations

[bryndaloo]

Deepest condolences to Bradley Davies whose Mam passed away today after a short and sudden illness.
He's been told by Gatland that he will play against France if he feels up to it.

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1056825#msg1056825 date=1266612825]
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=38718.msg1056747#msg1056747 date=1266596835]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1054847#msg1054847 date=1266264308]
Not even the people in the Southern Hemisphere want to see Southern Hemisphere rugby Rouge. Attendances at the Super 14 are falling year on year, and it's not surprising really. It's become almost like tag rugby.
[/quote]

What, you mean there's actually some Rugby played? The S14 attendances have fallen significantly in Aus as RU is nowhere near as prevalent nor revered as RL. It's still king in SA & NZ.
In terms of a spectacle, I watched Eng v Italy this week and would have preferred to saw my foot off. Next time you get a chance, watch a RL or S14 game, people pass and run and stuff.

[/quote]

Rugby League is rugby for simpletons (that's why Andy Powell should switch codes). And the problem with Super14 is that it's become almost like league.

Rugby isn't a spectacle, it's a battle. That's the way I like it.
[/quote]

Well said.

 

[Judge Jules]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1056825#msg1056825 date=1266612825]
[quote author=LarryHagman link=topic=38718.msg1056747#msg1056747 date=1266596835]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1054847#msg1054847 date=1266264308]
Not even the people in the Southern Hemisphere want to see Southern Hemisphere rugby Rouge. Attendances at the Super 14 are falling year on year, and it's not surprising really. It's become almost like tag rugby.
[/quote]

What, you mean there's actually some Rugby played? The S14 attendances have fallen significantly in Aus as RU is nowhere near as prevalent nor revered as RL. It's still king in SA & NZ.
In terms of a spectacle, I watched Eng v Italy this week and would have preferred to saw my foot off. Next time you get a chance, watch a RL or S14 game, people pass and run and stuff.

[/quote]

Rugby League is rugby for simpletons (that's why Andy Powell should switch codes). And the problem with Super14 is that it's become almost like league.

Rugby isn't a spectacle, it's a battle. That's the way I like it.
[/quote]

Hear hear.

 

[bryndaloo]

Tîm Cymru for Friday (or so I've heard):

Byrne
Halfpenny
Hook
Roberts
Williams
S. Jones
Rees

James
Bennett
A. Jones
Davies
D. Jones
Thomas
R. Jones (Capt.)
Williams

Bench:
Owens
Gill
Charteris
Warburton
Bishop
Phillips
Shanklin

 

[Pesam]

Bryn me ol' mucker, what do think about laying Scotland beating the Iti's on Sunday? Should Scotland even be favourites? Thy're about 1.68 on Betfair and I'm toying with the idea of laying it.

 

[Stulikesdrums]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1056825#msg1056825 date=1266612825]
Rugby isn't a spectacle, it's a battle. That's the way I like it.
[/quote]

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Pesam link=topic=38718.msg1058092#msg1058092 date=1266856187]
Bryn me ol' mucker, what do think about laying Scotland beating the Iti's on Sunday? Should Scotland even be favourites? Thy're about 1.68 on Betfair and I'm toying with the idea of laying it.
[/quote]

Given the injuries they've picked up that might be a decent shout.

 

[Judge Jules]

Agreed. That's a fair bet.

 

[Pesam]

Cheers Ross/JJ, bet placed, I have layed Scotland at 1.69.

 

[Bologna]

O'Gara out and Sexton in for Ireland.

England are unchanged.

 

[Judge Jules]

I was afraid they might do that, x 2.

 

[doctor_mac]

Huzzah! But O'Leary lingers. Just like he will behind the breakdown.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058630#msg1058630 date=1266937810]
Huzzah! But O'Leary lingers. Just like he will behind the breakdown.
[/quote]

Is it only us that sees this problem ?

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1058798#msg1058798 date=1266954745]
[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058630#msg1058630 date=1266937810]
Huzzah! But O'Leary lingers. Just like he will behind the breakdown.
[/quote]

Is it only us that sees this problem ?
[/quote]

I don't understand it. It suggests a fundamental lack of judgement on Kidney's part. Have the press down south not been picking up on O'Leary's torpidity behind the pack?

 

[Judge Jules]

There's been no comment on it over here.

In any case, having Sexton on the end of whatever passes O'Leary DOES manage to get away will help you. The only reason I can see for England keeping Jonny at no.10 is for him to act as an extra flanker and lead the charge at Sexton, otherwise Flood should have been picked instead of him. Not that that was ever going to happen with Johnno in charge.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058809#msg1058809 date=1266956237]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1058798#msg1058798 date=1266954745]
[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058630#msg1058630 date=1266937810]
Huzzah! But O'Leary lingers. Just like he will behind the breakdown.
[/quote]

Is it only us that sees this problem ?
[/quote]

I don't understand it. It suggests a fundamental lack of judgement on Kidney's part. Have the press down south not been picking up on O'Leary's torpidity behind the pack?
[/quote]

Not much has been made of O'Leary. There was so much nonsense written about the defeat by France, "end of an era", "time to rebuild" etc. they completely failed to acknowledge that the form side in World rugby is the French team. I didn't see any real analysis of the failings of the team, it was more shock at the defeat and the nature of the defeat.

I saw one article that suggested there's no place in the game for players like Cullen and O'Connell and that Heaslip and Ferris should play second row. It showed such a fundamental misunderstanding of the game I could only help but think it was written by either a) someone who only ever watches rugby league or b) Jamie Kanwar.

I like "torpidity", that's a new one on me.

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1058820#msg1058820 date=1266957385]
[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058809#msg1058809 date=1266956237]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1058798#msg1058798 date=1266954745]
[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1058630#msg1058630 date=1266937810]
Huzzah! But O'Leary lingers. Just like he will behind the breakdown.
[/quote]

Is it only us that sees this problem ?
[/quote]

I don't understand it. It suggests a fundamental lack of judgement on Kidney's part. Have the press down south not been picking up on O'Leary's torpidity behind the pack?
[/quote]

Not much has been made of O'Leary. There was so much nonsense written about the defeat by France, "end of an era", "time to rebuild" etc. they completely failed to acknowledge that the form side in World rugby is the French team. I didn't see any real analysis of the failings of the team, it was more shock at the defeat and the nature of the defeat.

I saw one article that suggested there's no place in the game for players like Cullen and O'Connell and that Heaslip and Ferris should play second row. It showed such a fundamental misunderstanding of the game I could only help but think it was written by either a) someone who only ever watches rugby league or b) Jamie Kanwar.

I like "torpidity", that's a new one on me.
[/quote]

Christ on a bike, that's extraordinary. The thing is, that theoretically, if we didn't commit so many diabolical errors, Kidney had a game plan that was basically very good. We targeted their lineout brilliantly (O'Connell was immense in there), and O'Gara's kicking could have thus set us up with a platform to win the game. But with that platform you also need some quick hands behind the forwards to let the backs do their part, and to set up breaks around the ruck for Heaslip, Wallace and Ferris to carry the ball before the defense has reorganised. It isn't rocket science.

What do you think about Murphy coming back in at FB?

 

[Rosco]

I agree with you on that, the only thing we were missing from the gameplan was quick distribution. We'll struggle as long as that's the case.

I haven't seen Murphy play this year, so I'm not sure. I've read he hasn't played much this season though which is a little bit of a worry.

On the face of it though, given the options it still looks like a decent choice. Earls isn't great under a high ball so he shouldn't be playing there. Fitzgerald obviously isn't available either. Bowe would have been an interesting one, I'd like to see him coming into the line from 15 - he could really do damage - but his kicking game seems a bit limited for fullback. Trimble isn't suitable for 15.

Murphy ticks most of the boxes - good kicking game, solid under a high ball, excellent at coming into the line in attack. His weakness is often his tackling.

 

[doctor_mac]

I've a huge soft spot for Geordan- he's another one who suffered under O'Sullivan, which usually means you're in my good books. He's never really translated his scintillating club form into the international arena, but he's very nice to have as back up.

I've a feeling he'll have a good game despite only coming back from injury.

 

[Judge Jules]

Pardon my ignorance (yes yes, I know you always do) but has Kearney been injured or dropped? He was possibly the Lions' player of the tour in SA but the reviews I've read haven't been that kind to him so far this season.

 

[Stulikesdrums]

Was it ever likely Leo Cullen would have regained his place in the side?
I think he is very unlucky to drop to the bench considering his performances.

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=38718.msg1059154#msg1059154 date=1267009722]
Pardon my ignorance (yes yes, I know you always do) but has Kearney been injured or dropped? He was possibly the Lions' player of the tour in SA but the reviews I've read haven't been that kind to him so far this season.
[/quote]

Injured. He was far from his best up until his injury against France, but he's too good to drop with the first blip in years.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Stu link=topic=38718.msg1059155#msg1059155 date=1267009735]
Was it ever likely Leo Cullen would have regained his place in the side?
I think he is very unlucky to drop to the bench considering his performances.
[/quote]

Kidney's comments were good in respect of Cullen. He pretty much said it's a horses for courses thing. He reckoned Cullen had been playing very well, but him and O'Callaghan are different types of second row. Kidney felt O'Callaghan's workrate and ability at the breakdown was needed more for this game than Cullen's superior lineout skills.

Doc - is O'Leary being kept in because of his defence ? Danny Care's fondness of popping to forwards close to a ruck and his own danger as a runner could be in Kidney's mind.

 

[doctor_mac]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1059321#msg1059321 date=1267037037]
[quote author=Stu link=topic=38718.msg1059155#msg1059155 date=1267009735]
Was it ever likely Leo Cullen would have regained his place in the side?
I think he is very unlucky to drop to the bench considering his performances.
[/quote]

Kidney's comments were good in respect of Cullen. He pretty much said it's a horses for courses thing. He reckoned Cullen had been playing very well, but him and O'Callaghan are different types of second row. Kidney felt O'Callaghan's workrate and ability at the breakdown was needed more for this game than Cullen's superior lineout skills.

Doc - is O'Leary being kept in because of his defence ? Danny Care's fondness of popping to forwards close to a ruck and his own danger as a runner could be in Kidney's mind.
[/quote]

I think defense was in his mind against France too. It's crazy though. Blunting a massive part of your ability to attack in order to have an extra tackler....

 

[TheBunnyman]

[quote author=doctor_mac link=topic=38718.msg1059323#msg1059323 date=1267037462]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=38718.msg1059321#msg1059321 date=1267037037]
[quote author=Stu link=topic=38718.msg1059155#msg1059155 date=1267009735]
Was it ever likely Leo Cullen would have regained his place in the side?
I think he is very unlucky to drop to the bench considering his performances.
[/quote]

Kidney's comments were good in respect of Cullen. He pretty much said it's a horses for courses thing. He reckoned Cullen had been playing very well, but him and O'Callaghan are different types of second row. Kidney felt O'Callaghan's workrate and ability at the breakdown was needed more for this game than Cullen's superior lineout skills.

Doc - is O'Leary being kept in because of his defence ? Danny Care's fondness of popping to forwards close to a ruck and his own danger as a runner could be in Kidney's mind.
[/quote]

I think defense was in his mind against France too. It's crazy though. Blunting a massive part of your ability to attack in order to have an extra tackler....
[/quote]

Sounds familiar...

 

[TheBunnyman]

Are y'all as confident as Keith Wood?

I do not think Hayes and the rest of the Ireland pack will have a whole lot of trouble against England at Twickenham on Saturday. Ireland did very well in the scrum against Italy, poorly against France, but then France were truly extraordinary.

Ireland were totally outplayed in Paris and I think they will be a tiny bit jaded, but that does not mean the buzz has gone. The big issue is confidence - has it taken a knock?

Even though they were being outplayed, there was a five-minute spell in the first half where, if things had gone Ireland's way, they could have still been in the game.

If Gordon D'Arcy had been able to collect that ball that bounced the wrong way off the post, that would have made a big difference, because if you are in the game after 20 minutes in Paris, you are in with a chance of winning. And if you score at that stage, you might have seen the energy seep out of the French.

Sexton's a bigger physical presence than O'Gara, a better defender and he has what you might call youthful ignorance

Instead, Cian Healy gave away a penalty at the other end and got a yellow card, Jerry Flannery performed his magician's trick and tried to cut someone in half and Ireland fell into a huge hole.

Wales coach Warren Gatland said he didn't think France were that good and inisted Ireland were very bad, but that is not entirely true.

Ireland did not play at their best, but France, when they are playing with that kind of confidence, are peerless. England simply aren't as good as France so a lot of the problems that existed in Paris will not exist at Twickenham.

Ireland will have learned an awful lot about contact in Paris, because France were fantastic at the contact area. Ireland need to win the collisions in the forwards against England and need to be running on to the ball.

That was the difference between the France game and any other game Ireland have played recently, and as a result Ireland's ball was poor. Against England, if Ireland get any ball of note, I think they can do damage.

Leinster's Johnny Sexton may not have Ronan O'Gara's experience at fly-half, but I think it is time for him to play. Sexton is a bigger physical presence, a better defender and he has what you might call youthful ignorance.

O'Gara plays the percentages very well, and although I would not say he is predictable, teams are forcing him to play in a certain style. He takes the kicking option a lot of the time, while opponents rush up outside him so he has to go himself, and he has not really got the turn of pace to make a half-gap into a whole gap.

Offensively against France, Ireland did not look high on confidence, and that is where Sexton comes in, because he is also quicker than O'Gara and he will mix the game up a bit more, mainly because he does not know any better.

I do not think Rob Kearney's absence will make a huge difference to the team. England will not profit from kicking the ball to Geordan Murphy because, as a former Gaelic footballer like Kearney, he can field the high ball in his sleep.

Which begs the question, will we see a more adventurous England from the team that played Italy? Well, I'm sure there are those that would say if they string two passes together, that would be a more adventurous England.

England are in a very funny situation, at a crossroads. They could go back down the pan very quickly or they could actually start achieving and setting higher standards for themselves. But they need a cutting edge.

Ireland's discipline, with the exception of Healy and Flannery against France, has been fantastic (Healy's yellow card was Ireland's first in 12 months) so England cannot rely on kicking goals, they need to score tries.

England at home are very, very difficult. But the truth is the idea of fortress Twickenham does not really exist any more and I think Ireland will win. There is too much in the team and they do not want that negative feeling again.

 

[doctor_mac]

No. Ireland made about a million errors against France, but I thought the pack fronted up well enough, and the scrum did much better than I expected against France. In terms of set pieces, we're fine. It was the litany of errors, defensive and offensive, in open play that made us shit.

England aren't as good as France, but if we make that many mistakes again we'll lose. And Gatland is right- we flattered France.

 

[Squiggles]

Predicting anything to do with the English Rugby team is extremely difficult. Ireland have got the talent to win this by 15-20 points but I still think England will fancy their chances and will prove a tough team to overcome.

I'm going for an England win.

 

[Judge Jules]

Ireland could well win by that kind of margin if England play like they did against Italy, but if England get a grip and play at the top of their game I wouldn't have said there were that many points between the two sides. IMO Ireland have more game-breaking potential behind the scrum overall though, so - with some hesitation, and I'd be glad to be wrong - I'm going to tip Ireland by a single-figure margin.

 

[TheBunnyman]

I have absolutely no fucking idea who'll win. But I'm hoping for England to beat Ireland, and Wales to beat France.

Scotland-Italy? Who gives a toss.