One last signing?

[mark1975]

[quote author=FPI Project link=topic=35518.msg933952#msg933952 date=1251457213]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg933928#msg933928 date=1251452923]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=35518.msg933925#msg933925 date=1251452322]
Riera not getting a look in is the only thing that makes me vaguely wonder if there is still some transfer activity pending. Its just possible that the reason he is not playing is because he is part of another deal and Benitez doesn't want him injured.

Although I wouldn't want to lose Riera either if we want an attacking player brought in and need to sacrifice one of our existing ones there probably isn't anyone else.

We can't lose Gerrard, Torres, Kuyt and Benayoun, and I doubt there would be much interest in Babel, Voronin or N'gog. In terms of attacking players Riera would be the only saleable asset who teams might actually want.

That's the scenario anyway. Personally I can't see it though. There are probably other reasons why Riera is not playing.
[/quote]

We don't know what's gone on but this all seems to have stemmed from when he was unavailable for our pre season game and then he played and scored for Spain a few days later.

Whatever the case, he's being shut out and if a replacement isn't on the cards, then Rafa is in a tricky situation and I wouldn't be surprised to see him cut his nose off to spite his face.
[/quote]But why would rafa have riera on the bench v villa when he could of had another sub at his disposal?
[/quote]

He's done it loads of times. It's easier to make a point to a player by putting them on the bench, especially when you then proceed to bring on lesser quality players ahead of them. We've seen it with Babel, Keane and others before.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933954#msg933954 date=1251457528]
The only other motive is that they still don't trust Rafa with the purse strings, that being the case they should not have handed them over in the first place.

regards

[/quote]

That doesn't really wash, though I suspect they do have their concerns, because we've still spent big(ish) on Johnson and Aquilani.

I know the net spend is non-existent, I think and hope this is just a case of getting the bulk of the debt paid off this Summer in the hope that the financial climate will change over the next year.

The only problem is it's a massive gamble on what is a paper thin squad. Which in itself is a massive gamble on our future.

Markmc - I agree re him being reluctant to sell, because he won't see the money, which is why it's imperative that if he's got to stick with what he's got, he gets Riera back in the side as soon as.

 

[Buddha]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=35518.msg933955#msg933955 date=1251457531]
Mark's posts have left me seriously fucking depressed about the state of our club and this coming season.
[/quote]

Me too Keni. It's a sickening state of affairs.

 

[Squiggles]

It looks like their content to see us qualify for the Champions League year in, year out and leave it at that.

The problem is City have improved enormously this summer and Arsenal are far better than last seasons showing, even Spurs are on the up, so it's a risky strategy to take and someone's going to be left very disappointed.  

I think blame for this is split between Rafa and the owners. Last summer was a fucking catastrophe and had even one of the signings worked out, we wouldn't be in such a mess now. But the owners have made false promises to Rafa over this seasons transfer budget and haven't backed up when we really needed it, which shows their lack of commitment to this club, IMO. At least Rafa's mistakes were honest ones.

 

[singlerider]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933918#msg933918 date=1251450852]
Is Riera this seasons Crouchy and Keane ?

regards
[/quote]

Ha! It's not just 6CM that has its whipping boys

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=singlerider link=topic=35518.msg933981#msg933981 date=1251460581]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933918#msg933918 date=1251450852]
Is Riera this seasons Crouchy and Keane ?

regards
[/quote]

Ha! It's not just 6CM that has its whipping boys
[/quote]

If Riera goes, then that's really hammered the nail in the coffin of last Summers spending.

Keane
Dossena
Riera
Dodgy reserve keeper.

 

[HC]

Thanks MC, saves me getting my hopes up over the coming few days for them only to be dashed later on.

 

[singlerider]

If the reason he isn't playing is genuinely because he's had a bust up with Rafa, then the big man needs to fucking grow up and do what's right for the team.

No player is bigger than the club, but neither is the manager

 

[LadyRed]

Sssooo...we're not buying Carrick then?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=Buddha link=topic=35518.msg933963#msg933963 date=1251458582]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35518.msg933955#msg933955 date=1251457531]
Mark's posts have left me seriously fucking depressed about the state of our club and this coming season.
[/quote]

Me too Keni. It's a sickening state of affairs.
[/quote]

me too ... but i'm serious hoping his accuracy here isn't Keane'esque, but more Bentley'esque ... Here's hoping.

 

[NOTH]

[quote author=Stu link=topic=35518.msg933953#msg933953 date=1251457216]
[quote author=mark mc link=topic=35518.msg933943#msg933943 date=1251456085]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg933941#msg933941 date=1251455746]
[quote author=Mors link=topic=35518.msg933940#msg933940 date=1251455661]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933891#msg933891 date=1251446877]
I think there is one last deal to be done.
If we don't get a forward we will very likely live to regret it.

regards
[/quote]

It is worrying. I can't think of any of the other say top 6 teams that are taking a gamble on having only one decent striker. Rafa's nuts.
[/quote]

Rafa's nuts or Rafa's hands are tied?

I hope we at least go for a loan signing like Baptista, we need 'someone'.
[/quote]Rafa has had chances to sell certain players which I wont mention on here but has refused because even though we and rafa would like to see the back of these players rafa knows he wont see a fuckin penny as the Yanks are virtually asset stripping everything.Rafa wanted certain players in the Alonso deal but these two wankers wanted straight cash,I think you can work the rest out yourselves lads.
[/quote]

This post makes me very sad.

[/quote]

fucking hell me too. puts a bit of a dent in my optimism.

explains why all the players look so thoroughly pissed off i suppose. what a nightmare, we were so close and only needed another player or two

wonder if all this had anything to do with alonso's desire to leave?

Mind you, if rafas hands are tied up like this, he really shouldn't be falling out with, and not playing, players like riera (if that's what's going on)

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933954#msg933954 date=1251457528]
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=35518.msg933948#msg933948 date=1251456926]
[quote author=mark mc link=topic=35518.msg933943#msg933943 date=1251456085]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg933941#msg933941 date=1251455746]
[quote author=Mors link=topic=35518.msg933940#msg933940 date=1251455661]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933891#msg933891 date=1251446877]
I think there is one last deal to be done.
If we don't get a forward we will very likely live to regret it.

regards
[/quote]

It is worrying. I can't think of any of the other say top 6 teams that are taking a gamble on having only one decent striker. Rafa's nuts.
[/quote]

Rafa's nuts or Rafa's hands are tied?

I hope we at least go for a loan signing like Baptista, we need 'someone'.
[/quote]Rafa has had chances to sell certain players which I wont mention on here but has refused because even though we and rafa would like to see the back of these players rafa knows he wont see a fuckin penny as the Yanks are virtually asset stripping everything.Rafa wanted certain players in the Alonso deal but these two wankers wanted straight cash,I think you can work the rest out yourselves lads.
[/quote]

The only thing is, if that was the whole story, wouldn't Rafa walk?
[/quote]

I can't see what their motivation would be though. If they want to protect their investment they have to keep it in tip top condition to compete, yes they need to make some attempt for the books to balance, but they know as well as anyone they have to speculate to accumulate.
The only other motive is that they still don't trust Rafa with the purse strings, that being the case they should not have handed them over in the first place.

regards

[/quote]

Impending sale?

I don't think they'll be in charge come the end of the season.

 

[LadyRed]

If only, 4PM, if only.

 

[Tinto]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg933958#msg933958 date=1251458114]

That doesn't really wash, though I suspect they do have their concerns, because we've still spent big(ish) on Johnson and Aquilani.

I know the net spend is non-existent, I think and hope this is just a case of getting the bulk of the debt paid off this Summer in the hope that the financial climate will change over the next year.

The only problem is it's a massive gamble on what is a paper thin squad. Which in itself is a massive gamble on our future.

Markmc - I agree re him being reluctant to sell, because he won't see the money, which is why it's imperative that if he's got to stick with what he's got, he gets Riera back in the side as soon as.
[/quote]

Have we actually spent big(ish) this Summer? Yes, we have if you just look at the fees agreed but what is the club's actual cash outlay this Summer? Something round £15m/£17m, perhaps? £5m on Aqualini, £8m on Johnson and the rest on kids?

I know and fully accept that we have paid £17m for Johnson but I do wonder if Portsmouth hadn't owed us the money from the Crouch deal, would the money have been there for him otherwise? My feeling is now that the particular circumstances surrounding what Portsmouth owed us allowed us to agree a £17m fee.

Also, it's looking more likely that the rest of Aqualini money will probably be mostly paid off by future earnings if there are to be no January transfers.

I do hope too that this isn't pattern being set here but it's just the one Summer when the owners need to reduce their debt.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934005#msg934005 date=1251462698]
If only, 4PM, if only.
[/quote]

Well lets hope it's the case anyways...

I wonder how many games they'll attend this season?

 

[LadyRed]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934009#msg934009 date=1251463091]
[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934005#msg934005 date=1251462698]
If only, 4PM, if only.
[/quote]

Well lets hope it's the case anyways...

I wonder how many games they'll attend this season?
[/quote]

I'm inclined to think it's quite likely. As others have mentioned given how the money Rafa was promised wasn't delivered, I would have expected him to walk, the fact that he's stayed suggests maybe he thinks he can outlast them. As I can't imagine he thinks he can re-build a relationship of trust with them after this summer.

 

[Mors]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg933941#msg933941 date=1251455746]
[quote author=Mors link=topic=35518.msg933940#msg933940 date=1251455661]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35518.msg933891#msg933891 date=1251446877]
I think there is one last deal to be done.
If we don't get a forward we will very likely live to regret it.

regards
[/quote]

It is worrying. I can't think of any of the other say top 6 teams that are taking a gamble on having only one decent striker. Rafa's nuts.
[/quote]

Rafa's nuts or Rafa's hands are tied?

I hope we at least go for a loan signing like Baptista, we need 'someone'.
[/quote]

I'm not so sure though mate, he's has potentially spent 30mill this summer. If he thought a forward was a priority, he could have gone for cheaper replacements for Xabi/Arb and then gone for a forward.
Also, I don't think he 'had' to sell Alonso and Arbeloa, he could have dug his heels in and said to Madrid he wanted 50mill or something. So their positions wouldn't need replacing.

Like you said, he also has the options of loans, or loan-to-buy's.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934010#msg934010 date=1251463257]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934009#msg934009 date=1251463091]
[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934005#msg934005 date=1251462698]
If only, 4PM, if only.
[/quote]

Well lets hope it's the case anyways...

I wonder how many games they'll attend this season?
[/quote]

I'm inclined to think it's quite likely. As others have mentioned given how the money Rafa was promised wasn't delivered, I would have expected him to walk, the fact that he's stayed suggests maybe he thinks he can outlast them. As I can't imagine he thinks he can re-build a relationship of trust with them after this summer.
[/quote]


I agree with that, but please don't forget the fact that Rafa loving us greatly would have played it's part in his decision too.

 

[Molbystwin]

Financially it makes fuck all difference to the Yanks finishing second or third or first, the key is top 4 and the CL. The yanks never had any fucking real unborrowed money or they would have kept their promises re the purchase of the club shares. As long as we finish top 4 they and keep paying off the loans they do not give a fuck, certainly they will not be bringing in any new stars this summer. We were a selling club this summer in many ways and unless more real investment arrives or those two arsholes sell up we will continue to be so.

I think that we will always be found wanting with them at the helm, they are a perfect disaster, highly expensive highly leveraged buyout by two unconcerned near penniless parasites who fucked up got confused as to their own abilities and never sold when they had the chance.

I am angry about it ( sorry) but not so much for the fans, we've had it in our power to get rid of the cunts for three years and carry on meekly accepting but more for the sheer waste of talent, Gerrard deserves to finish his career with a league medal.

 

[LadyRed]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934013#msg934013 date=1251463661]
[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934010#msg934010 date=1251463257]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934009#msg934009 date=1251463091]
[quote author=Anita link=topic=35518.msg934005#msg934005 date=1251462698]
If only, 4PM, if only.
[/quote]

Well lets hope it's the case anyways...

I wonder how many games they'll attend this season?
[/quote]

I'm inclined to think it's quite likely. As others have mentioned given how the money Rafa was promised wasn't delivered, I would have expected him to walk, the fact that he's stayed suggests maybe he thinks he can outlast them. As I can't imagine he thinks he can re-build a relationship of trust with them after this summer.
[/quote]


I agree with that, but please don't forget the fact that Rafa loving us greatly would have played it's part in his decision too.
[/quote]

Haha, well of course.

 

[Wilko7]

[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=35518.msg934015#msg934015 date=1251464073]
Financially it makes fuck all difference to the Yanks finishing second or third or first, the key is top 4 and the CL. The yanks never had any fucking real unborrowed money or they would have kept their promises re the purchase of the club shares. As long as we finish top 4 they and keep paying off the loans they do not give a fuck, certainly they will not be bringing in any new stars this summer. We were a selling club this summer in many ways and unless more real investment arrives or those two arsholes sell up we will continue to be so.

I think that we will always be found wanting with them at the helm, they are a perfect disaster, highly expensive highly leveraged buyout by two unconcerned near penniless parasites who fucked up got confused as to their own abilities and never sold when they had the chance.

I am angry about it ( sorry) but not so much for the fans, we've had it in our power to get rid of the cunts for three years and carry on meekly accepting but more for the sheer waste of talent, Gerrard deserves to finish his career with a league medal.
[/quote]

Horse shit. The yank shite haven't even been here for 3 years and how have the fans had it in their power to get rid of them?

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=Wilko7 link=topic=35518.msg934020#msg934020 date=1251464609]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=35518.msg934015#msg934015 date=1251464073]
Financially it makes fuck all difference to the Yanks finishing second or third or first, the key is top 4 and the CL. The yanks never had any fucking real unborrowed money or they would have kept their promises re the purchase of the club shares. As long as we finish top 4 they and keep paying off the loans they do not give a fuck, certainly they will not be bringing in any new stars this summer. We were a selling club this summer in many ways and unless more real investment arrives or those two arsholes sell up we will continue to be so.

I think that we will always be found wanting with them at the helm, they are a perfect disaster, highly expensive highly leveraged buyout by two unconcerned near penniless parasites who fucked up got confused as to their own abilities and never sold when they had the chance.

I am angry about it ( sorry) but not so much for the fans, we've had it in our power to get rid of the cunts for three years and carry on meekly accepting but more for the sheer waste of talent, Gerrard deserves to finish his career with a league medal.
[/quote]

Horse shit. The yank shite haven't even been here for 3 years and how have the fans had it in their power to get rid of them?
[/quote]

Horse shit? They took over half way through the 2006-07 season we are now in the 2009-10 season.... Er?

Time wise what's that .... 2 and a half years?

As for the fans not having any power I think we did but we blew it we should of and could of kicked up a far bigger stink and hit them in their pockets when they were looking to sell up. Just because its not a nice thing to say and impractical doesn't mean it isn't true... we could have got rid of them i'm sure of it but we were divided and allowed it to happen now we are lying in the bed we made for ourselves.

 

[mark1975]

That's a touch extreme Molby but I do take a few of your points.

I think the problem was they initially fucked up, then tried to level with us and we gave them the benefit of the doubt and prompted them to get up to speed with the ethics of the club. Signings like Mascherano and Torres also sweetened things, despite how it's turned out they were financed.

We could also have drove them out, not knowing how things would have turned out, and ultimately regretted that too. And then the Worldwide recession wasn't foreseen either.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing and all that.

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg934035#msg934035 date=1251465763]
That's a touch extreme Molby but I do take a few of your points.

I think the problem was they initially fucked up, then tried to level with us and we gave them the benefit of the doubt and prompted them to get up to speed with the ethics of the club. Signings like Mascherano and Torres also sweetened things, despite how it's turned out they were financed.

We could also have drove them out, not knowing how things would have turned out, and ultimately regretted that too. And then the Worldwide recession wasn't foreseen either.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing and all that.
[/quote]

It is indeed extreme, I accept that mark, it is far from horse shit however, at least it is from my own viewpoint. They have given us plenty of grounds for disgruntlement which we have ineffectually acted upon previously but I suspect our chance has passed now. I take your point about hindsight also as fair comment, but you cannot say that the signs were not there because they were loud and very clear. We will be lumbered with the shit that they bring for a good few years yet unless we make it politically unbearable for them to remain and for the banks to back them as a going concern.

In the same way as bad luck in the league is not a defence for failing to win bad luck in the financial market is no defence either. Neither of those two has given me any reason to place my trust in them, personally i think they would sell their own grandmothers if the price was right.

Then use the money to take out another massive loan on the next fucking suckers.

 

[mark1975]

Rafa's silence over all of this is deafening, and very strange.

I wonder if he'll react differently once the transfer window closes?

 

[Wilko7]

[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=35518.msg934031#msg934031 date=1251465431]
[quote author=Wilko7 link=topic=35518.msg934020#msg934020 date=1251464609]
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=35518.msg934015#msg934015 date=1251464073]
Financially it makes fuck all difference to the Yanks finishing second or third or first, the key is top 4 and the CL. The yanks never had any fucking real unborrowed money or they would have kept their promises re the purchase of the club shares. As long as we finish top 4 they and keep paying off the loans they do not give a fuck, certainly they will not be bringing in any new stars this summer. We were a selling club this summer in many ways and unless more real investment arrives or those two arsholes sell up we will continue to be so.

I think that we will always be found wanting with them at the helm, they are a perfect disaster, highly expensive highly leveraged buyout by two unconcerned near penniless parasites who fucked up got confused as to their own abilities and never sold when they had the chance.

I am angry about it ( sorry) but not so much for the fans, we've had it in our power to get rid of the cunts for three years and carry on meekly accepting but more for the sheer waste of talent, Gerrard deserves to finish his career with a league medal.
[/quote]

Horse shit. The yank shite haven't even been here for 3 years and how have the fans had it in their power to get rid of them?
[/quote]

Horse shit? They took over half way through the 2006-07 season we are now in the 2009-10 season.... Er?

Time wise what's that .... 2 and a half years?

As for the fans not having any power I think we did but we blew it we should of and could of kicked up a far bigger stink and hit them in their pockets when they were looking to sell up. Just because its not a nice thing to say and impractical doesn't mean it isn't true... we could have got rid of them i'm sure of it but we were divided and allowed it to happen now we are lying in the bed we made for ourselves.
[/quote]

Indeed, horseshit. So you've reduced your 3 years to 2.5. Two and a half years ago during that month of February did you want them out immediately or did you wait until the summer before demanding their exit after they had the gall to finance Torres?

Should our season ticket holders have given up their tickets to hit the shite in their pockets? Do you think those season tickets would sit there waiting for them whilst they were making their point or perhaps might lads who had been on the waiting list for years have snatched them up?

 

[Jürgen4PM]

Am i right in thinking that we we have to pay another huge amount off of our debt next year as well?

If so then it's either Mascher, Torres or SG gone, or they'll have sold off by then.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934055#msg934055 date=1251466942]
Am i right in thinking that we we have to pay another huge amount off of our debt next year as well?

If so then it's either Mascher, Torres or SG gone, or they'll have sold off by then.


[/quote]

Thanks Dreambeliever

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg934053#msg934053 date=1251466803]
Rafa's silence over all of this is deafening, and very strange.

I wonder if he'll react differently once the transfer window closes?
[/quote]

I don't think he feels the need to speak out about it TBH Mark, after this money making transfer window is shut, it's crystal clear to everyone what the yanks are up to.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=35518.msg934060#msg934060 date=1251467206]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35518.msg934053#msg934053 date=1251466803]
Rafa's silence over all of this is deafening, and very strange.

I wonder if he'll react differently once the transfer window closes?
[/quote]

I don't think he feels the need to speak out about it TBH Mark, after this money making transfer window is shut, it's crystal clear to everyone what the yanks are up to.
[/quote]

Yeah true, but he's pretty much the self appointed voice of the club now so you'd think he'd be inclined to make some point in the media, otherwise it'll just pass by and the American's can think they've practically got away with it.