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Kenny Dalglish

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[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=40476.msg1116401#msg1116401 date=1276094630]


Leaving all romance at the door - why should we hire him?

Because as one of the younger members on these boards - which might have something to do with it - I'm really struggling to embrace this idea.


[/quote]

Worry not, as one of the older members, I am too....and so by the looks of it is the oldest member 😉
Like Portly, I idolised him as a player and still do, which is one of the reasons why I think it would be folly .
I have had fisticuffs with people on these boards over the years, including Jules, as I think he is the greatest player I have ever seen, I still maintain he was all round a better player than Best, others disagree...I digress, but need people to know how much I think of him.
He had some great years as Liverpool Manager and maintained the status quo when he took over. He did well to win the league with Blackburn, it's not really not that easy buying success, but since that point in time his managerial success has been pretty tarnished, culminating with the Celtic debacle.
Trust me on this...everyone, it's fraught with disaster on several different levels.


regards
 
Portly, IMO giving a caretaker money to spend makes a lot more sense than giving it to a permanent appointment who could turn out to be anything but. Neither the latter nor the players he tried to sign would know where they stood pending a change of ownership. At least with a caretaker manager everyone knows the position up front and can make their decisions accordingly.

Squiggs, the case for Kenny has actually been made at some length both on here and in the media. To recap:

1. He's willing to do the job (indeed, would insist on doing it) on a short-term basis only, so wouldn't want the costly contract guarantees which anyone in the job market proper would look for;

2. He'd stand a better chance than anyone (bar perhaps Mourinho) of persuading our big names to stay, because they know him a good bit better than they do the other candidates being discussed;

3. Because the issue of a change of ownership is very much a live one still, a caretaker appointment makes sound sense at this stage;

4. It isn't as though any of the alternatives are mouthwatering.

The King's managerial record after leaving us wasn't spectacular, that much is true. Those were permanent appointments though, and a long time ago, whereas a caretaker job would entail less pressure for the reasons set out very well in mark's post earlier in the thread. As for the King's absence from active football roles since 2000, I suspect that has as much to do with Marina's illness as with anything else.

Vlad, there is indeed a risk involved, but I can't think of a risk-free option in any of this. No change of manager is without its risks at the best of times anyway.
 
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=40476.msg1116423#msg1116423 date=1276095702]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=40476.msg1116401#msg1116401 date=1276094630]


Leaving all romance at the door - why should we hire him?

Because as one of the younger members on these boards - which might have something to do with it - I'm really struggling to embrace this idea.


[/quote]

Worry not, as one of the older members, I am too....and so by the looks of it is the oldest member 😉
Like Portly, I idolised him as a player and still do, which is one of the reasons why I think it would be folly .
I have had fisticuffs with people on these boards over the years, including Jules, as I think he is the greatest player I have ever seen, I still maintain he was all round a better player than Best, others disagree...I digress, but need people to know how much I think of him.
He had some great years as Liverpool Manager and maintained the status quo when he took over. He did well to win the league with Blackburn, it's not really not that easy buying success, but since that point in time his managerial success has been pretty tarnished, culminating with the Celtic debacle.
Trust me on this...everyone, it's fraught with disaster on several different levels.


regards
[/quote]

While I see your points and respect your fear, you must rememeber that he took on the job the first time as a very young man. It was a brave call at the time, but he solved it with integrity and dignity in the Anfield way. Now he is even older and more experienced. He is not a stupid romantic man, he knows what he is doing if he takes on the job.

One thing he can teach the squad is that football is not as complicated as some "modern" managers likes to think. Yes there are more focus on the human and their physical attributes these days, but youdont expect Kenny to run the show alone. He is smart enough to be able to pick a good backroom staff and to lwad the team with the aim of outplaying whichever 11 we are up against.
 
[quote author=Portly link=topic=40476.msg1116403#msg1116403 date=1276094720]
Jules - Kenny was a legend as a player, but not as a manager. I think there is a reason why he has done nothing except his charity work after he was sacked by Celtic in 2000 along with John Barnes, whom he hid behind during that short period. I don't see why Kenny in charge would be an attractive option, particularly as the players would not necessarily see him as the man to deliver success on the pitch.

As for the stand-in manager operating on the transfer market - would it make sense to give him a chequebook to go round making signings, when they might not fit in with the strategy of his successor at all. I think not.
[/quote]

Portly - I have to side with Jules in disagreeing with you with regard to Kenny the manager. In 5 complete seasons he won the League 3 times and the FA Cup twice. We also lost a dodgy Cup final and lost another League title not on points, not even on goal difference but on goals scored. He also left the club at the top of the league on that awful day in February 1991.

He also constructed the finest attack in the club's history.
 
It seems to me that a big concern for people who don't want to see the "return of the King" (sorry my younger lad is watching the "lord of the rings" dvd at the moment) is that he is an absolute idol to them (rightly so) and that they fear that failure would tarnish his image in their eyes.

I would suspect that Kenny is fully aware of his standing in Liverpool and with Liverpool supporters worldwide and if he was willing to risk his reputation because he felt he could do some good for his and our beloved club then I too would be willing to take that risk.

He loves the club, of that there can be little doubt. At a time when it is important that the manager has solely got the best interest of the club at heart both on and off the field this is a great starting point. The past regime was often accused of politicking and trying to play the fans for his/their benefit but I believe that with Kenny in charge people would believe and trust what he says about the behind the scenes activities of our owners and the rest of the board, and his motives for doing so.

Vlad rightly points out that he has had a far from perfect manegerial career. His successes with Liverpool and Blackburn are conterbalanced by his disasterous times at first Newcastle, then Celtic.
But the alternative, Roy Hodgson, has hardly had a flawless career either and shares just as many question marks over his ability to stabilize the club/team and take us forward.

In brief I trust Kenny to make the right decision for the club. If he believes that Roy is the best available option for the job then I will get behind him with all my support. However, if Kenny thinks that he himself has the best chance of leading the club through the present critical period in it's history, and is willing to risk his reputation by doing so, then he gets my vote of approval.
 
[quote author=Wilko7 link=topic=40476.msg1116434#msg1116434 date=1276096672]

Portly - I have to side with Jules in disagreeing with you with regard to Kenny the manager. In 5 complete seasons he won the League 3 times and the FA Cup twice. We also lost a dodgy Cup final and lost another League title not on points, not even on goal difference but on goals scored. He also left the club at the top of the league on that awful day in February 1991.

He also constructed the finest attack in the club's history.
[/quote]

OK I have every respect for Kenny as a player and as a man, so I don't want my doubts on the subject to appear as if I am attacking him.

I am happy just to agree to disagree. And we'll see what happens. 🙂
 
Hold on, this business about a patchy Managerial career is a little harsh. Kenny was Manager at Newcastle for 20 months. They finished runners up in the Premier first time out, were beaten Cup finalists to Arsenal, next season they finished 13th with Shearer out for most of that season. Then he was sacked after the first two games of the new season and replaced by Gullit. He signed Solano, Speed and Shay Given to name a few.

He was at Celtic for just over a year, less as Manager and won the Scottish Cup. Celtic terminated his contract and paid him 600k.Don't know much else 'cos I'm not a sweaty but it was hardly Armageddon.

Could he do better than 7th, I think he could. Could he get star players to stay, I think he could. Would the board, players and fans rally to him as a caretaker, I think they would. Could he handle a gloating Press, I think he could.

He's a man who knows his own mind, his wife has made a good recovery; if he wants the job to help the transition, I think he should.
 
I'm not interested in reason, as it will never account for everything.

Kenny is our history, and our history is the only thing that can save our future from our present state of affairs. It's this or mediocrity, lads.

We need belief more than ever. We need our old guard to come back and do the work they have avoided / not been given the opportunity fully to do, not just Kenny.

Bring back the boot room. Pick up where we left off. We've got a good squad, but our style became convoluted and boring. We need pass and move football and it needs to come from the people who know how to implement it.

The other option is Hodgson, this is how bad it is. Kenny can bring us back from the brink. Imagine how much it will inspire Gerrard.

COME ON RED MEN! This is where it went wrong. It can be put right!!!

Please believe!

*has to sit down*
 
I must say that although it does little for my brain, the prospect of a Dalglish appointment has me emotionally erect.
 
Just imagine the look on the scum fans faces and the old drunk fergies if Kenny took over and we were taken over by rich arabs also! Fuck me it would be every Xmas rolled into 1 x 100
 
If it's between Hodgson, O'Neill etc and Kenny there's no fucking contest.

I still want Pellegrini though

The Snake better listen to the fans and not fuck this up which I fully expect them to do
 
Now that I'm ignoring Rebel, every time he posts I just imagine:

"Blah blah blah snake blah blah"

God, it's so refreshing
 
[quote author=rebel23 link=topic=40476.msg1116493#msg1116493 date=1276104049]
If it's between Hodgson, O'Neill etc and Kenny there's no fucking contest.

I still want Pellegrini though

The Snake better listen to the fans and not fuck this up which I fully expect them to do

[/quote]

ARE YOU GOING TO ANSWER THIS QUESTION ?

[quote author=themn link=topic=40490.msg1114348#msg1114348 date=1275831235]
So, do you believe what the Spanish press (Marca, basically) are saying ?


[quote author=rebel23 link=topic=40490.msg1114347#msg1114347 date=1275831116]
err ok
[/quote]

I take it you think my re-production of your posting style was inaccurate ?
[/quote]
 
I can't believe it's being considered. Actually, of course I can, as H&G will think that it will placate the fans in the short term, as he's a beloved figure, and they won't have to pay him much.

As a managerial appointment though, it would be an utter disaster.
 
I'd agree if we were talking about a permanent appointment, but the man himself wouldn't want that. As far as the caretaker role goes, I simply don't believe he'd put himself forward for it in the first place if he thought there was even the merest ghost of a chance that that would happen.
 
We shouldn't have a caretaker appointment. What exactly does that accomplish, other than delay a manager making the transfers they want for their own team?
 
First of all I don't believe it would have that effect - caretaker appointments don't elsewhere, so why would that happen now with us?

Secondly, it would avoid making a permanent appointment, with attendant employment rights and contingent financial obligations, which new owners might well want to bring to an end.

Thirdly, it would avoid our having to make such an appointment from what is frankly an underwhelming list of candidates.

Fourthly but by no means least significantly, the identity of this particular caretaker would give the whole club a massive shot in the arm and could well make the difference between some of our top players staying and going.
 
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=40476.msg1116511#msg1116511 date=1276106508]
'Caretaker' is such a loaded term.
[/quote]

Yeah, they are often child molesters! :🙂
 
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=40476.msg1116500#msg1116500 date=1276104784]
As a managerial appointment though, it would be an utter disaster.
[/quote]

Bollocks
 
[quote author=robinhood link=topic=40476.msg1116513#msg1116513 date=1276106784]
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=40476.msg1116500#msg1116500 date=1276104784]
As a managerial appointment though, it would be an utter disaster.
[/quote]

Bollocks
[/quote]

I think you're both right.

If it's regarded as a short-term gig pending the finalising of a permanent manager, then I think its a good thing. We're practicll in free-fal now and some calm hads would be a help. I think ( or I hope) that good targets are insight and that appointing Dalglish would be a good stop-gap measure.


If it's long term tho, I sense this would be bad.
 
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40476.msg1116509#msg1116509 date=1276106349]
First of all I don't believe it would have that effect - caretaker appointments don't elsewhere, so why would that happen now with us?

Secondly, it would avoid making a permanent appointment, with attendant employment rights and contingent financial obligations, which new owners might well want to bring to an end.

Thirdly, it would avoid our having to make such an appointment from what is frankly an underwhelming list of candidates.

Fourthly but by no means least significantly, the identity of this particular caretaker would give the whole club a massive shot in the arm and could well make the difference between some of our top players staying and going.
[/quote]


I largely agree with you on this subject. I'm not sure who it's a good thing for, but it's a rarity, so it ahuld be noted.

Caretaker or not, I really don't mind. People come out with all sorts of crap to try to justify their position, Farky being one of the biggest gobshites around for tenous crap that makes him sound knowing in the most superficial of ways.

We have to wake up to the reality of our situation - Kenny is a shining beacon of salvation beckoning us out from this massive sewer of shite we're in. ANYTHING that can remind us of the legacy; ANYONE that has those credentials and means this much to the club, and who can reflect that affection and remind the footballing world of how great this club is.

Look forward to the montages on the television, the banners at the games, the comments of assurance from Carra and SG; comments in the press from Rushy and Fowler - the spirit will be unforgettably huge.

What is there to lose? To say the game has changed that much is insane; to even say the job is that hard for someone truly from our great tradition is missing the key. It's an easy game, we have a good squad; we need faith and passion in abundance and a passing game and we're basically there; one or two players, but we're there.

Kenny can give us back our faith in football, and that's what we need - it's all Mourinho woud have really offered.
 
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=40476.msg1116526#msg1116526 date=1276108990]
The biggest change in football since 1991 is that people have forgotten how simple it is.
[/quote]

Bang on.
 
[quote author=gene hughes link=topic=40476.msg1116526#msg1116526 date=1276108990]
The biggest change in football since 1991 is that people have forgotten how simple it is.
[/quote]

* more money has come into the game meaning better players even in the rubbish teams
* better calibre of opposition managers. whinger - league winner, ancelotti - CL winner, fergie 20+ years of experience, rednapp - years of experience, etc
* richer players with massive egos - players have far more power now than they used to
* league is much faster now so large squads are required to cope
* clubs with limitless money have deeper stronger squads

its true, there is still one ball and the team that scores the most goals in the game wins, the rules are the same but shitloads has changed.
that's not to say I don't want kenny.
 
So, does anyone "in the know" have any clue as to whether this is going to happen?
 
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