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Coutihno through the middle?

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FreshRed

FreshRed

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Can someone please reference a single game when Coutinho has been effective through the middle?

Don't get me wrong, I am a huge fan, but I think all of his best work for us has been from the left cutting in. He has more time and space and seems to have a better eye for the pass. I think even when not injured that he has been a major disappointment this season. He is forcing passes that are just not there and losing the ball on a regular basis.

I realize that some of his passes will always be high-risk/high-reward, but last season he was completing 20-30 or 40% of those threaded passes and the risk was worthwhile. This season seems like 5% and the reward is just not great enough.

So, I find it puzzling that everyone assumes that now he is fit again that he should go straight back into the hole. I would rather see see Allen, Henderson or Alberto up there, with Coutinho left and Moses/Alberto on the right. Even Rodgers says that the middle is Coutinho's position, but I am just not convinced.
 
His last game ha nothin to do with space, he was simply shite with his touch when threading the ball through.
A player in 'the hole' must be capable of scoring and/or creating chances with the final ball.
How many times did Allen do this when he played many times in that position last season?

I'd rathe Coutinho than anyone else.
 
juniormember said:
His last game ha nothin to do with space, he was simply shite with his touch when threading the ball through.
A player in 'the hole' must be capable of scoring and/or creating chances with the final ball.
How many times did Allen do this when he played many times in that position last season?

I'd rathe Coutinho than anyone else.
Click to expand...

I don't think Allen has played a single league game in the hole. Several preseason games and maybe League or Europa game last season.

I like the idea of Coutinho in this role, but the reality does not seem to work out as well.
 
I want to see him in the hole for an extended period. But we won't get the best out of him there until we've got a winger who carries goal threat and hugs the touchline. We need to stretch the field to give him space and opportunity.

As for the other four, I can't believe that people are suggesting Allen or Henderson in the hole. If it's one of them then it surely must be Gerrard - nobody else is even close.

Sent from my HTC One XL
 
FreshRed said:
I don't think Allen has played a single league game in the hole. Several preseason games and maybe League or Europa game last season.

I like the idea of Coutinho in this role, but the reality does not seem to work out as well.
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Allen played several times ahead of the two central midfielders last season, once Lucas was back from injury. He did not produce. His best performances (first 5-6 games of the season) actually came when playing in Lucas's position, weirdly enough, but I still think he'd be much better playing alongside a DM, the way Xabi used to for us.
Argh. I want Xabi back.
 
Like Wiz, I wouldn't mind seeing him get an extended run. There's a big conundrum over Gerrard at the minute though so it might be more productive to have Gerrard in the hole, with Coutinho in the left sided roaming role. I don't think one game can mean "case closed" either, Newcastle were fucking awful that day.

The midfield and attack that day was:

Lucas, Gerrard, Henderson, Downing, Coutinho, Sturridge.
 
First half against Swansea this season he took the complete piss.

He got injured, had to go off, and we threw away a lead.

I harboured some doubts about him early on in his time with us, but happy to admit they were fruitless really. He's a sublimely gifted footballer. His touch, awareness, technique, and ability to find the ball are as good as I've seen.

He'd be brilliant in the 10 role. Play him there.
 
If we had a couple of decent wing backs, the current formation would be perfect with Coutinho as a 10.

I initially typed that as Courtinho, interesting.
 
Unless we know of a couple of undiscovered ones in Brazil, then I'm pretty sure the club are just hoping that Rob Jones will be able to make them.
 
Coutinho in the middle is a bit of a no brainer. I do worry that we may be putting all our eggs in one basket. Would really like to see an improvement from Allen/Alberto playing that position.
 
Bit of a no brainer really. The only players that can play there apart from coutinho are gerrard and a certain Spanish player out on loan shining in la liga. Allen and hendo will never ever have that level of talent to play that role.
 
Glen C said:
Bit of a no brainer really. The only players that can play there apart from coutinho are gerrard and a certain Spanish player out on loan shining in la liga. Allen and hendo will never ever have that level of talent to play that role.
Click to expand...
Teixeira maybe?
 
FreshRed said:
Pretty sure he played on the left. Case open?
Click to expand...

Well if we're being specific here yes he started on the left. But if I remember it correctly he had pretty much a free role in that game and drifted inwards every time he had a chance. Look at the goals we he created and his shot in the 2nd half that hit the bar.
What I'm trying to say is that he might have started out on the left but it's not like he was running on the wing like a proper winger.
 
Modo said:
Well if we're being specific here yes he started on the left. But if I remember it correctly he had pretty much a free role in that game and drifted inwards every time he had a chance. Look at the goals we he created and his shot in the 2nd half that hit the bar.
What I'm trying to say is that he might have started out on the left but it's not like he was running on the wing like a proper winger.
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Yeah but this is it Modo, his left sided position afforded him less responsibility and the ability to drift. When he's playing central, especially with our midfield that's made of jelly, he's got more defensive responsibility, more onus to press and he's playing against the back line and the deep midfielder(s), when he's picking up possession deeper or wide, getting a yard of space to run into to pick his pass. I'm not saying he can't do it, but sometimes it's easier sticking players like that wide and giving them license to roam. It worked with Gerrard because he had the industry to match.
 
mark1975 said:
Yeah but this is it Modo, his left sided position afforded him less responsibility and the ability to drift. When he's playing central, especially with our midfield that's made of jelly, he's got more defensive responsibility, more onus to press and he's playing against the back line and the deep midfielder(s), when he's picking up possession deeper or wide, getting a yard of space to run into to pick his pass. I'm not saying he can't do it, but sometimes it's easier sticking players like that wide and giving them license to roam. It worked with Gerrard because he had the industry to match.
Click to expand...

I'd actually argue that he has more of a defensive responsibility playing on the wing than in the middle considering that he has to help cover for Enrique/Cissokho if they decide to bomb forward. Playing in the middle doesn't mean that he's relieved of any defensive duties but with a working pair of midfielders he shouldn't have to worry about what's behind him. What he should do is help Sturridge/Suarez press their deep lying midfielders during their build up but that shouldn't be too hard.
Coutinho belongs in the middle but yeah we don't have stable midfield atm, still I don't think it's enough to deprive him of his natural position.
The options aren't nearly good enough.
 
I think we just have to get him in the final third along with Suarez and Sturridge, and then build the rest of the team around that and getting the ball to them. They can all interchange and create for one another.
 
Modo said:
I'd actually argue that he has more of a defensive responsibility playing on the wing than in the middle considering that he has to help cover for Enrique/Cissokho if they decide to bomb forward. Playing in the middle doesn't mean that he's relieved of any defensive duties but with a working pair of midfielders he shouldn't have to worry about what's behind him. What he should do is help Sturridge/Suarez press their deep lying midfielders during their build up but that shouldn't be too hard.
Coutinho belongs in the middle but yeah we don't have stable midfield atm, still I don't think it's enough to deprive him of his natural position.
The options aren't nearly good enough.
Click to expand...

Yup, he should be given a go at least, or we should push Gerrard back up, play Coutinho on the left for now and see what happens.
 
This kid's ridiculously good. Guy's like him don't come round very often.

He keeps fit and playing and we'll end up with one of the best footballers in the world in a year or two's time.

He's that fucking good.
 
dantes said:
If we had a couple of decent wing backs, the current formation would be perfect with Coutinho as a 10.

I initially typed that as Courtinho, interesting.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't worry about spelling his name wrong, check out the thread title. Unless we do have Coutihno.
 
FreshRed said:
Missed game due to travel today. Where did he play? Left or central?
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cout.jpg
 
Our 4-4-2 formation looked more like 4-2-2-2 with Coutinho and Henderson both spending more time in the middle than near the touchline. But against better teams our wingers will not be able to drift inside as often, because they will need to help their fullback in defense. So you can start with the same exact formation, but against a strong opponent Coutinho might get pinned to the wing in defense, which could limit his effectiveness in attack (think Suarez at Arsenal last year).

That's why, defeat to Arsenal notwithstanding, I still think 3-4-1-2 can be a good formation to play in tougher games. This way you have enough bodies behind the ball and can at least ensure that your best creative players stay centrally, where they will have more options to create an opening.
 
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