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Chinese "Devil Virus" - anyone worried?

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Things have been pretty "normal" here for a good few months, but there has been an increase in cases in the larger cities and in general among the 20-30 year olds category. When the colleges started up again and off campus parties were happening, it was mayhem. 65 new cases yesterday, but its been about 100+ each day for a little while.
The bars and restaurants are open but cant have more than so and so people at the same time and have to register everyone that visits.
Working from home 3 days a week and 2 days at the office.
Was supposed to go the Norway - Serbia game today and had hospitality tickets through work, but with only 200 people being allowed in the stadium that wont happen.. Gutted.

We have job to do in Oslo the next few weeks, or else we could see numbers like the rest of Europe are at this stage.
Shame that the 20-30 year olds give a fuck in every advice and sanctions that are given. Thankfully they can be fined now, and I hope they are given massive fines the dickheads that wont listen.
 
momoWASboss said:
Are they getting financial support?
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That’ll be THE hot topic.

Some support - not enough for most - hard to gauge.

Most will be fucked - the bigger test is how they cope with running cost and restrictions on capacity - for many, re-opening will be more costly than staying closed.
 
This will be herd immunity by default if not be design.

The whole thing about vaccines etc just won't happen, even if a vaccine is available by December there won't be a scramble to get it and there'll be priority lists anyway inc front line workers, elderly/vulnerable etc, it won't be given to the world so quickly.

A work colleagues sibling is taking part in the Oxford trials and they've asked her to come back for a year long trial, so either they chuck something out there and carry on testing or it'll take a full year plus to develop something.

Personally, I'm loving it. No 2 hours daily commute where I return too tired to get up and do anything after and end up wasting away the days. Managing to get loads of stuff done, spending more time with the kids and family and more time to myself out and about.
I'm a little worried when my contract finishes in July what I'll do workwise but hopefully I find something cos I can see a second, third, fourth, fifth wave etc
 
Rosco said:
All the countries that took early drastic action seem to have fared better.

In Ireland we're allowing a load of lawyer TD's to talk about how a level 5 lockdown would be disproportionate. But it's what actually might work.

It's clear level 3 hasn't mitigated anything in the counties that have been level 3 for a couple of weeks.

We also have the laughable situation where the police have no power to actually enforce travel restrictions, so to avoid a load of confrontation that they can't win they've set up traffic jams rather than checkpoints. The motorway near me is down to one lane on the pretence that there is a checkpoint , but nobody is actually being checked. A five minute stretch of motorway took more than 2 hours to get through because of it.
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It's fucking ludicrous isn't it? So typically fucking Irish. Holding up hospital staff and delivery trucks for hours. It's so unimaginative. Do they think border breaks are going to go at peak traffic time?
 
Halmeister said:
Oh yeah. But I reckon they'll start using it now as some kind of false flag (for want of a better term) to control us. Every time we're doing something they don't like, "the R number has gone up. Local lockdown for you." Disobey, get fines and jail time. Our government and the US must look at the way China controls its population and get a raging hard on.
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They are not really interested in lockdowns - it’s being forced upon them by rising cases.

Even though you’re only being a bit jokey this kind of chat annoys me because people actually believe this shit, continue ignoring the rules (and basic common sense) and we all have to suffer the consequences.
 
keniget said:
They are not really interested in lockdowns - it’s being forced upon them by rising cases.

Even though you’re only being a bit jokey this kind of chat annoys me because people actually believe this shit, continue ignoring the rules (and basic common sense) and we all have to suffer the consequences.
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Yeah.

I get the (very real) concern that some of these measures could be dangerous if they're used long term (if we get to a post covid world), but believing that it's in the entire government's interest to shutdown more than half of the economy is more than batshit crazy.

The 1% have made/accumulated yet more wealth than ever before during this, there's no doubt, but then they do that during every recession or crisis, but this will damage longer term wealth creation & the global economy far more significantly for relatively small reward.

To believe in this crackpot theory you'd have to believe that the 1% has ultimate control over every decision, & that they want to watch the entire economic global society crumble so that they can, what, rebuild a system they have ultimate control over?

It's utterly nonsensical even from a standard conspiracy theory standpoint.
 
Beginners conspiracy theorists are the worst.

This is a man made virus released by China to destroy economies and make them more powerful.
 
FoxForceFive said:
But in order to do this, then they must already have total control...
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Got to start somewhere at some point...

Obviously I'm being a bit tongue in cheek, but the people who usually find their way to the top and in positions of power are actual psychopaths. And psychopaths crave control. I put nothing past the people in charge of most governments, especially the cunts we have in charge.

Obviously they don't want to tank the economy and shut everything down. But if they could come up with a way of consolidating their power, keeping people scared, apathetic and compliant, then all the better for them. Everyone knows they do that to some degree already, why wouldn't they go further?

It's like the erosion of our working rights. I use where I work as an example. You live to work, not work to live. Work, make money, everything else is irrelevant.
 
It's really not as far fetched as it sounds from an economic standpoint. Economies will grow and shrink, their job is to give it a boost when it's bad, and take their foot off the gas when it gets too good. Stable growth. The tool for doing this used to be interest rates. The government amassed so much debt, they broke that tool. So then we have to go to the money printing press as a tool to control growth and maintain stability. The problem with that tool is it shifts power from governments to central banks, and there's not a god damn thing they can do about it.

So, lockdowns are a way for the government to reclaim power, their very own tool for controlling the economy, growth to high? No problem, lock it the fuck down. Growth to low? No problem, open it up again. Like a lever. The new interest rate. They even measure the lockdown in levels, level 3, level 5, level jesus fucking christ, it's obviously their new interest rate lever.
 
It'll be a matter of time before they break it. Let us pray it does not kill too many of us when they do.
 
dantes said:
It's really not as far fetched as it sounds from an economic standpoint. Economies will grow and shrink, their job is to give it a boost when it's bad, and take their foot off the gas when it gets too good. Stable growth. The tool for doing this used to be interest rates. The government amassed so much debt, they broke that tool. So then we have to go to the money printing press as a tool to control growth and maintain stability. The problem with that tool is it shifts power from governments to central banks, and there's not a god damn thing they can do about it.

So, lockdowns are a way for the government to reclaim power, their very own tool for controlling the economy, growth to high? No problem, lock it the fuck down. Growth to low? No problem, open it up again. Like a lever. The new interest rate. They even measure the lockdown in levels, level 3, level 5, level jesus fucking christ, it's obviously their new interest rate lever.
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I don't think they've done that intentionally, but rather they've stumbled across this and will continue to do it as long as it serves them.

Obviously, the pandemic is real and is serious etc, I'm not debating that. But with everything, these cunts will have looked at it and gone "how can we use this to our advantage?" They will have looked to see how they can consolidate and increase their control, and they will have seen how to make money from it. Those are the two things (probably loads of others, as well) that go through these psychopaths' heads. We see it all the time with sorting their mates out with lucrative contracts for substandard services - that track and trace app being just a recent one.

I don't think there's some Illuminati end game. But rather, it's just cunts being cunts, and they'll keep finding ways to profit and gain power. At our expense.
 
The recent kidnapping plot might give you some cause for slight optimism. These corrupt cunts still need to walk the earth like everyone else, and someone else can easily walk up behind them and make our little problem go away.
 
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3% of cases linked to hospitality. A third schools. A quarter care homes. A fifth work. Shutting the pubs is gonna fix this!

Table sourced from figures up to yesterday from Public Health England

https://assets.publishing.service.g.../Weekly_Flu_and_COVID-19_report_W41_FINAL.pdf
 
I've tried to avoid this whole topic as much as possible, mainly because it's become so depressingly partisan, but is it basically right to say that the only point in continued measures is to wait until a vaccine arrives?

And that a vaccine is far from certain to ever arrive and if it does, very likely to be 6 months to a year away?

I don't really understand how that can be a sensible policy.

Wouldn't it just be better to encourage the spread among as young people as possible, shield the older people, and suffer the relatively small number of deaths that would follow?

Is there some scientific objection to this (e.g. doubt over strength of acquired immunity) or is it just that people can't countenance the deaths? Which obviously is reasonable at first sight but not so reasonable given the huge amount of deaths that result in the name of freedom from things like smoking, drinking, and driving. Smoking and drinking don't really bring much, if any, economic benefit, unlike generally allowing people to go about their lives.

It's just seemed obvious to me for ages that with no hope of eradication it's a matter of charting the best route to herd immunity, and if a vaccine is ages off AND doubtful, shouldn't some other way be found?

It's weird, I try to think about this stuff as dispassionately as I can, and yet I still seem to find myself lined up with Farage and the Brexit Boys against the righteous 'follow the science' types.

Oh well. At least there are more scientists now openly pushing for the kind of approach I've thought was common sense for ages.
 
I think most were pretty much agreed that we should have gone balls deep on a full lockdown early march and see if that sorted it while we developed a working track and trace system - but we didn't, so now... it's really hard to see what we can do.

If it's a case of we must keep schools open, then we must also tell old and vulnerable people that they have to stay locked up alone. Where school kids are unavoidably going to come into contact with ill / old carers, then that family has to make a diffcult choice. Keep the kids off or take the risk. No one is having the discussion but it seems pretty obvious that this is the choice we're now faced with. I think it's not being broached as every govt policy is enacted to empower and enrich old people... there's loads of them and they vote.
 
There are two big problems (apart from people dying to death) one is that some people are having terrible times trying to get over it and the other is that lots of health care workers are coming down with it putting a strain on hospitals. So, I don't think it is as easy as just letting the young get it and put up with a few deaths.
 
Athens said:
There are two big problems (apart from people dying to death) one is that some people are having terrible times trying to get over it and the other is that lots of health care workers are coming down with it putting a strain on hospitals. So, I don't think it is as easy as just letting the young get it and put up with a few deaths.
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Yeah, I think the theory Peter suggests is a valid one until you look at the figures in depth around those hospitalised at younger ages who required treatment to recover. Now they're low, but when the viral load (ie how many people have it so exposed to virus for longer/more often, & remember it's exponential) is high those figures were significant.

So you still end up with a situation where you have medical staff unable to work cos they're ill themselves & not enough beds, just shielding the vulnerable is no longer an option IMO.

A proper track & trace system is the answer. Why the media constantly looks at us & refuses to point out that other countries are successfully managing economies, education, workplaces & stopping further outbreaks as thy begin is completely beyond me.
 
FoxForceFive said:
Yeah, I think the theory Peter suggests is a valid one until you look at the figures in depth around those hospitalised at younger ages who required treatment to recover. Now they're low, but when the viral load (ie how many people have it so exposed to virus for longer/more often, & remember it's exponential) is high those figures were significant.

So you still end up with a situation where you have medical staff unable to work cos they're ill themselves & not enough beds, just shielding the vulnerable is no longer an option IMO.

A proper track & trace system is the answer. Why the media constantly looks at us & refuses to point out that other countries are successfully managing economies, education, workplaces & stopping further outbreaks as thy begin is completely beyond me.
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On the possibility of hospitals being overwhelmed: have any actual forecasts been done on the likely numbers?

Survival below 50 is what 99.8% or something? Any idea what the hospitalisation percentage would be?

Obviously this is conditional on being able to shield the vulnerable, which is obviously uncertain, but it'd still be interesting to be able to quantify this stuff.
 
They were saying yesterday that the hospitals are close to being rammed again, but there are currenty 3400 people in hospital with it out of 165,000 hospital beds in the UK. I think the issue is more that we've ditched 60k hospital beds in the last twenty years so there's just fuck all wiggle room.
 
They don't list the staff on the bed capacity statistics, so what's the point really in having them? You just need beds, lots of beds, job done. Stats will look good. Fuck the staff. Sick people? Oh fuck them too.
 
I had thought herd immunity is primarily achieved with a vaccine, not sure if it can or has been without? All really depends on if you can get it twice and/or if it mutates into different forms I guess, which I assume they can't know until it's been around for at least a year.
 
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