Attitude

[Fabio]

Origi is a poor example - he was here for 8 years and wanted to move on. Fair enough, why are people still going on about him? Ditto Minimino who left because he wanted game time (under utilised here so who could blame him)
There are very few examples of those we wanted who left and many of those who did/do nothing who stayed.

People are going on about them because we didn't adequately replace them froggy. We lost 3 players (including mane) and around 20 goals (and most importantly, variety in play style), and expected no drop off or injuries from existing players, and the 2 new signings to pick up the slack from minute 1.

It was short sighted and foolish, and people said so in the summer.

 

[Fabio]

I love how klopps gone from "we don't need a midfielder", to panic loaning one, to being desperate to get one in January.

 

[Irishanfield]

I'd be staggered if we don't sign two midfielders in early January. There's just no getting over the fact that the squad needs at least a refresh if not a rebuild and that has to start at the first opportunity if we're to have any chance of getting in the top four.

So you think fsg will change their transfer policy all of a sudden?

 

[tomasjj]

I love how klopps gone from "we don't need a midfielder", to panic loaning one, to being desperate to get one in January.

I hope this escalation continues, so that before january he wants two.

 

[Frogfish]

People are going on about them because we didn't adequately replace them froggy. We lost 3 players (including mane) and around 20 goals (and most importantly, variety in play style), and expected no drop off or injuries from existing players, and the 2 new signings to pick up the slack from minute 1.

It was short sighted and foolish, and people said so in the summer.

Yeah I agree with that re. not replacing them (at least one) - however it's only with injuries to Diaz and Jota we're really noticing it. Normally with 5 for 3 slots they'd actually be starting even fewer games than last season. I'd have thought Musialowski or one of the other U21s could get some time but it seems they aren't ready / rated.

 

[StevieM]

People are going on about them because we didn't adequately replace them froggy. We lost 3 players (including mane) and around 20 goals (and most importantly, variety in play style), and expected no drop off or injuries from existing players, and the 2 new signings to pick up the slack from minute 1.

It was short sighted and foolish, and people said so in the summer.

I think we had enough forwards - I agree with @Frogfish - it’s more to do with injuries to Jota & Diaz - Bobby’s form has been good.

The mistake was not signing a midfielder - not cutting our losses on Keita (which we should have done even sooner) and Ox (although we we’d not likely get much for him, so he’s neither here nor there.

We probably could have kept Morton, rather than loaned him - but the current situation will probably work out in our favour in time.

 

[moron]

I like the idea of Morton as a future DM, if he turns out to be good overall. I hate the idea of spending loads of money on a DM type - it's so fucking boring - I mean he is a break-up artist an anti-football player if you like. I think of all positions on a football pitch it should be something that can be trained in any player so long as he has the physical attributes and if he has pace then that is a bonus. How hard can it be to recruit one of these players.

 

[Brizzle]

I love how klopps gone from "we don't need a midfielder", to panic loaning one, to being desperate to get one in January.

It's better than him continuing to say "i don't need a midfielder" i suppose, but worse than actually getting a midfielder in the summer when it was glaringly obvious that Geriatric Millie wasn't going to suddenly become a viable option in our team.

 

[StevieM]

I like the idea of Morton as a future DM, if he turns out to be good overall. I hate the idea of spending loads of money on a DM type - it's so fucking boring - I mean he is a break-up artist an anti-football player if you like. I think of all positions on a football pitch it should be something that can be trained in any player so long as he has the physical attributes and if he has pace then that is a bonus. How hard can it be to recruit one of these players.

Is he playing as a DM at Blackburn though - Badger-Tits might fill in there (or he might even revert back to CB if he develops more muscle).

The impression I get with Morton is - he can play across all of or midfield positions in a 433 - defensively sound with creativity (same as Badger-Tits).

 

[JohnnyRocket]

I like the idea of Morton as a future DM, if he turns out to be good overall. I hate the idea of spending loads of money on a DM type - it's so fucking boring - I mean he is a break-up artist an anti-football player if you like. I think of all positions on a football pitch it should be something that can be trained in any player so long as he has the physical attributes and if he has pace then that is a bonus. How hard can it be to recruit one of these players.

It's a more difficult position to play than we think. It's arguably more mental than a physical role. It's all about spacial awareness, anticipation, using the ball properly. Some players just don't have that, no matter how hard you try.

I think the last 20 years have shown that when you have the right player in that role it sets the platform for a successful team, and one of the most important pieces in it. Just look at Real Madrid with Makelele and then without, and what happened to Chelsea when he joined them. We screwed around with Lucas for years, but only started winning things when we invested in Fabinho.

 

[StevieM]

It's better than him continuing to say "i don't need a midfielder" i suppose, but worse than actually getting a midfielder in the summer when it was glaringly obvious that Geriatric Millie wasn't going to suddenly become a viable option in our team.

Milner is a viable option in the team - just not 90 mins twice a week.

 

[refugee]

Yeah I agree with that re. not replacing them (at least one) - however it's only with injuries to Diaz and Jota we're really noticing it. Normally with 5 for 3 slots they'd actually be starting even fewer games than last season. I'd have thought Musialowski or one of the other U21s could get some time but it seems they aren't ready / rated.

Wasn't there some rumours Musiałowski had upset the club and was on his way out?

 

[Frogfish]

Wasn't there some rumours Musiałowski had upset the club and was on his way out?

Ah if so that would explain it. Pity if true.

 

[Fabio]

It's better than him continuing to say "i don't need a midfielder" i suppose, but worse than actually getting a midfielder in the summer when it was glaringly obvious that Geriatric Millie wasn't going to suddenly become a viable option in our team.

You know what? Millie has probably been one of our better performers, so I'm loathed to criticise him. The issue is as others said, is we shouldn't be relying on him twice a week

 

[Fabio]

Wasn't there some rumours Musiałowski had upset the club and was on his way out?

Seriously. FFS. He was the new yesil, who was the new suso, who was the new pacheco

 

[Fabio]

Our youth system is shite

 

[Brizzle]

You know what? Millie has probably been one of our better performers, so I'm loathed to criticise him. The issue is as others said, is we shouldn't be relying on him twice a week

He absolutely has not been, unless you are basing it purely on one last minute block in the box.

 

[Fabio]

He absolutely has not been, unless you are basing it purely on one last minute block in the box.

When he's been in at right back, he's been great. When he's been in the midfield, it's usually when the whole midfields a bin fire. I can count good games this season by Millie more than I can fabinho

 

[refugee]

Seriously. FFS. He was the new yesil, who was the new suso, who was the new pacheco

Don't take my word for it. I thought I read it somewhere but it's a vague memory and I could be completely wrong.

 

[Hansern]

Our youth system is shite

Thats not correct, in all honesty.
U21s are in 4th place and the U18s are in 2nd place in their respective leagues. We've got several great prospects that could come good.

Bobby Clark, Bajcetic, Ben Doak, Keyrol Figueroa, Tommy Pilling, Kone-Doherty and Cannonier.
Some are out on loan.

In recent years we sold quite a few with a great profit as well. Brewster, Solanke, Brad Smith, Danny Ward, Stewart and Kent to name a few.

 

[Hansern]

Musialowski has played 5 games this season in the Premier league 2 for us. His start to the season explained here:

Liverpool winger Mateusz Musiałowski has had a frustrating start to the season, but his U21s manager Barry Lewtas identified what must come next for the Pole.

At times, Mateusz Musiałowski has been a name that has excited Liverpool fans the world over. When he scored an excellent goal against Newcastle United in 2021, Liverpool's official Twitter account put out the video, and Reds fans lapped it up.
This season, though, has been more of a struggle for fitness, form and minutes. In the 5-1 win for Liverpool U21s vs Wolves on Saturday, he started just his second match of the campaign. So far, he has only racked up 187 minutes in total this season for Liverpool, as well as a couple of appearances for Poland U21s"He has had a few injuries, then there was an international break and a few little bits, and he had a bit of an ankle injury in the past," Liverpool's U21s manager, Barry Lewtas, explained to Liverpool.com on Saturday following the match with Wolves.
game back for a while and sometimes you have to find a bit of rhythm — that's for us to help him with and for him to find as well. He did OK — there were a few little flashes and moments where I thought he was going to get a shot off in the first half, but for him, it's just about games and trying to get rhythm.

"It's hard if you're on the side of the pitch this season — Mel Frauendorf has done well; Harvey Blair has done well. We have other players in there as well — it's a bit like the two number nines [Layton Stewart and Oakley Cannonier] — you've got to find rhythm and get into the team.
"We're still developing players and Matty got his opportunity today and I was pleased with him. There's plenty of the season to go so let's see what happens."
There is, clearly, a talent there. His dribbling and natural ability needs honing further but there is ability to work with. In one moment against Wolves, Musiałowski nudged the ball over the top of the opposition goalkeeper, who had rushed out of his goal to close him down, only to be saved by a defender scrambling the ball off the line — inches from being a goal.



"Mateusz did not knock on the door, he just broke it. What a talent!" Pep Lijnders once enthused (via Sport). "He is constantly looking for something new in the attack. He can use the smallest gap to create a situation. Quality does not need large spaces. There are young players who are immediately appreciated in the first team. This is what happened with Mateusz."
Polish outlet Sport reported recently that Jürgen Klopp used Musiałowski in the build-up to the Champions League final, using him against Trent Alexander-Arnold to mimic the dribbling and one-versus-one ability of Real Madrid's Vinícius Jr.
But that same report in Poland a few weeks ago claimed that Musiałowski was not defensively aware enough for Liverpool's liking and that he was struggling to fulfil tactical instructions, writing that he was 'closer to the Ekstraklasa [Poland's top division] than the Premier League'.
He was not one of the young talents taken on the pre-season tour this summer, with the likes of Bobby Clark preferred (though he did come on as a substitute in the Anfield friendly against Strasbourg). But while the report in Poland was harsh about the chances of one of their top talents making it at Anfield, it is true that he has lacked consistency and, like most teenagers, still has a lot of developing to do.
As Lewtas explained, there were flashes against Wolves — something to build upon. There have been great moments within games. Now, turning 19 next weekend, Musiałowski needs to find some consistency in order to take his game to take the next step. Getting some luck with his fitness would be a good start.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

None of them are gonna make it. Except maybe Badger boy. And he’s still a longggggg way off.

 

[Hansern]

Ben Doak looks like someone who can make the step up.

 

[Fabio]

Thats not correct, in all honesty.
U21s are in 4th place and the U18s are in 2nd place in their respective leagues. We've got several great prospects that could come good.

Bobby Clark, Bajcetic, Ben Doak, Keyrol Figueroa, Tommy Pilling, Kone-Doherty and Cannonier.
Some are out on loan.

In recent years we sold quite a few with a great profit as well. Brewster, Solanke, Brad Smith, Danny Ward, Stewart and Kent to name a few.

I begrudge solanke being included there, as we effectively bought him for the first team.

Some of the ones out on loan (balagizi for example), are at such a low level, it makes you wonder what the point of the loan is.

Bradley, Musialowski, doak, bajcetic and cannonier I have hope for, but they'll fall by the wayside like the talent always does. We so rarely produce talent for the first team.

 

[peekay]

I think we've got rid of all sorts of players. Some I'd rather we had right now.

The loyalty thing could extend to some of our older mainstays, but on the fringes of the squad, not really. We got rid of origi for fucks sake.

It's the players we can't get the fuck out, that we desperately want to, that are the issue. We're not allowed to write them off and they become lampreys slowing us down and bleeding us dry.

Did we get rid of him? I thought he left on a free as his one year extension did not trigger due to low number of appearances.

 

[Farkmaster]

Did we get rid of him? I thought he left on a free as his one year extension did not trigger due to low number of appearances.

Klopp talked him up for a year and a half to get some offers. The ferraris in the garage was a classified ad.

 

[peekay]

Klopp seems to have this extended sense of loyalty, to all of his players. Whilst this is an honourable trait it's clearly not in the best interest of the team. His deep faith may be an influence in this respect.

Every now and then a squad player will develop into something far more than anticipated but once it has been established a certain player is unlikely to be one of those, and even worse is injury prone, then it should be de rigueur to move them on and replace with another having potential. You're not losing anything but buy backs clauses cover us just in case.

Our squad is littered with these players.

Partly it is his sense of loyalty. I also think our strict valuation is also an issue. Yes, we did an amazing job getting a lot of money for Brewster, Ibe, etc. I remember reading reports (unconfirmed but reliable sources) that we were asking 15 million for Nat Phillips and 12 million for Rhys and 30 million plus for Ox. Those were ridiculous valuations, especially in the COVID-impacted seasons.

If we were reasonable and compromised, we could have probably got 20-30 million for all three, gotten them off the wages, and maybe signed a youngish midfielder or a competent backup for TAA.

 

[Hansern]

I begrudge solanke being included there, as we effectively bought him for the first team.

Some of the ones out on loan (balagizi for example), are at such a low level, it makes you wonder what the point of the loan is.

Bradley, Musialowski, doak, bajcetic and cannonier I have hope for, but they'll fall by the wayside like the talent always does. We so rarely produce talent for the first team.

True, but if you look at the other top teams right now in the league there arent many talents that have been produced from their own acadamy.

City: Foden
Arsenal: Saka
Chelsea: Mount, James (Chalobah/Loftus Cheek)
Spurs: Kane
Utd: ?
Newcastle: Longstaff? In other words not one.

There arent many players in the first teams that have come through the acadamy in recent years. The English clubs have certainly something to learn compared to the other top teams in Europe.
Chelsea have been the best in the business in regards to this but they have also had an insane youth policy with up to 40 players out on loan.

 

[Hansern]

Currently watching the youth CL match against Napoli while working, and Ben Doak is another level.
I'd love it if he could be on the bench against Derby and get some minutes.

 

[Modo]

Yeah I agree Ben Doak looks really good