Zlatan
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[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35939.msg947296#msg947296 date=1253473999]
If he came here and kept up his league winning streak that £25m would look a great deal.
[/quote]
He wouldn't though...
Because he wouldn't be coming to a team that's clearly the best team in it's league and wins at a canter every year.
Here's he'd have to score important goals in big games. Hence, he'd fail. Enormously.
If he came here and kept up his league winning streak that £25m would look a great deal.
[/quote]
He wouldn't though...
Because he wouldn't be coming to a team that's clearly the best team in it's league and wins at a canter every year.
Here's he'd have to score important goals in big games. Hence, he'd fail. Enormously.
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947342#msg947342 date=1253478456]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=35939.msg947349#msg947349 date=1253480190]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947342#msg947342 date=1253478456]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[/quote]
are you being ironic?
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947342#msg947342 date=1253478456]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[/quote]
are you being ironic?
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947279#msg947279 date=1253472946]
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=35939.msg947267#msg947267 date=1253472505]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947174#msg947174 date=1253465074]
incredible goal but an incrediable player - and to think there were some who doubted.....
[/quote]
You're right.
One great goal against Spain's version of Aston Villa cancells out nearly a decade of vanishing when it matters most.
[/quote]
what are you on dude? Iba is rated by those who count (those in football) as a world class striker who has played for the biggest clubs in europe, won some of the biggest accolades you can get and has just been transferred for a fee in excess of 60m - decade of vanishing?????
[/quote]
How many goals has he scored past the group stage of the champions league? How many goals did he score last year against Juve and Milan?
he's a clue, it starts with Z and ends with O.
That being said, he's still a very good player. But just like Ronaldo went about proving it two years ago, until he scores against the 'best teams' and when Barca need a goal (ie knock out games), he'll not be on that level.
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=35939.msg947267#msg947267 date=1253472505]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947174#msg947174 date=1253465074]
incredible goal but an incrediable player - and to think there were some who doubted.....
[/quote]
You're right.
One great goal against Spain's version of Aston Villa cancells out nearly a decade of vanishing when it matters most.
[/quote]
what are you on dude? Iba is rated by those who count (those in football) as a world class striker who has played for the biggest clubs in europe, won some of the biggest accolades you can get and has just been transferred for a fee in excess of 60m - decade of vanishing?????
[/quote]
How many goals has he scored past the group stage of the champions league? How many goals did he score last year against Juve and Milan?
he's a clue, it starts with Z and ends with O.
That being said, he's still a very good player. But just like Ronaldo went about proving it two years ago, until he scores against the 'best teams' and when Barca need a goal (ie knock out games), he'll not be on that level.
The only time to judge him is at the end of the season exactly because of the way this thread is turning out. Spion and others are not alone in questioning Ibra's past achievements. He has a great record in Italy, but has often struggled on the big stage when people have looked to be convinced by him and this is an irrefutable fact.
Serie A isn't what it once was and people don't pay attention to it or give it the respect they used to. Now at Barcelona he has the perfect opportunity to prove everyone who doubted him wrong. The fact that he's in such a team, the fact that the transfer was so absurd, the fact that he's quite a divisive character in general... it'll all mean that the spotlight will be on him like it never has been before.
Everyone will have seen a lot more of him than they ever did before by the end of this season and his performances and results will prove who is right and who is wrong.
Serie A isn't what it once was and people don't pay attention to it or give it the respect they used to. Now at Barcelona he has the perfect opportunity to prove everyone who doubted him wrong. The fact that he's in such a team, the fact that the transfer was so absurd, the fact that he's quite a divisive character in general... it'll all mean that the spotlight will be on him like it never has been before.
Everyone will have seen a lot more of him than they ever did before by the end of this season and his performances and results will prove who is right and who is wrong.
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947352#msg947352 date=1253481242]
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=35939.msg947349#msg947349 date=1253480190]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947342#msg947342 date=1253478456]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[/quote]
are you being ironic?
[/quote]
No.
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=35939.msg947349#msg947349 date=1253480190]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg947342#msg947342 date=1253478456]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=35939.msg947335#msg947335 date=1253477678]
I've always said Ibrahimovic is a good player and kinda defended him along with you in these threads red_maradona, but I'm sorry... it's fucking absurd to use that goal as some sort of victory over the nay sayers.
It was a world class finish, no question, but A.Madrid have one of the worst defences in La Liga and at the end of the day, it's just one goal. The only time to judge him will be at the end of the season when we see how he and Barca have fared in the CL and in the big league deciding games.
[/quote]
wrong keni - you can judge him on what he has done already too.
[/quote]
And what has he done exactly?
Won Serie A with Juve when they were the dominant force and the same with Inter.
Remind me what he did against us in the European Cup QF's in 05? Oh yeah nothing.
How many Europena Cups has he won?
As for the transfer tag? Its widely accpeted that Inter got the best of that deal in terms of value. But carry on with your assertion that he's world class, and is the difference in the teams he plays for.
I'd look good with Iniesta and Xabi providing service for me.
[/quote]
are you being ironic?
[/quote]
No.
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg947365#msg947365 date=1253484026]
[quote author=ankreds link=topic=35939.msg947363#msg947363 date=1253483689]
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg947359#msg947359 date=1253482903]
Zlatan is shit.
[/quote]
Duh.
[/quote]
Thought I'd state the obvious.
[/quote]
He's not shit. But he's not world class either as some here seem to claim.
[quote author=ankreds link=topic=35939.msg947363#msg947363 date=1253483689]
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg947359#msg947359 date=1253482903]
Zlatan is shit.
[/quote]
Duh.
[/quote]
Thought I'd state the obvious.
[/quote]
He's not shit. But he's not world class either as some here seem to claim.
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg947374#msg947374 date=1253485070]
Don't want to waste a bunch words describing what I really think about him.
He's shit.
That's my conclusion.
[/quote]
Clearly this is a swedish thing then.
Don't want to waste a bunch words describing what I really think about him.
He's shit.
That's my conclusion.
[/quote]
Clearly this is a swedish thing then.
Some of you have really weird rules on what makes a good player, Ill stick to the watching them and making a conclusion based on my own eyes, Zlatan is class, people used to make these ridiculous arguements against Matt le Tissier too, he's good enough for Juve, Inter and Barca and won countless league titles, no manager to my mind that has ever had him wanted rid, thats a telling point.
If he was a Michael Owen type sniffer I'd get the goals arguement but theres so much more to his game, he's in definetly in the top tier of players in the world, he's no Fernando Torres but I'd take him here in an instant and most of his critics here would have there tongue so far up his arse they taste his tonsils if he did turn out in red.
If he was a Michael Owen type sniffer I'd get the goals arguement but theres so much more to his game, he's in definetly in the top tier of players in the world, he's no Fernando Torres but I'd take him here in an instant and most of his critics here would have there tongue so far up his arse they taste his tonsils if he did turn out in red.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35939.msg947413#msg947413 date=1253502186]
The white Kanu.
[/quote]
That's harsh because he actually does score ~25 goals a year, albeit against the Burnleys & West Broms of his league
The white Kanu.
[/quote]
That's harsh because he actually does score ~25 goals a year, albeit against the Burnleys & West Broms of his league
[quote author=Bob Loblaw link=topic=35939.msg947395#msg947395 date=1253489012]
Some of you have really weird rules on what makes a good player, Ill stick to the watching them and making a conclusion based on my own eyes, Zlatan is class, people used to make these ridiculous arguements against Matt le Tissier too, he's good enough for Juve, Inter and Barca and won countless league titles, no manager to my mind that has ever had him wanted rid, thats a telling point.
[/quote]
It would be all too easy to label him world class and think of him as amazing based on his exploits in another league you never watch and youtube compilations. The fact is that the doubt *does* come from watching him play... in the Champions League and internationals. A lot of Liverpool fans simply recall the two games against us in which he was pretty awful to produce an opinion about Zlatan.
As I said earlier, Barca will give him more exposure and if he can do the same for them as he did for Inter, which is score great goals like he did on Saturday, people will end up having a higher opinion of him. But still, if he wants to be thought of in the same bracket of player as Ronaldo, Torres and the like, he's simply going to have to start doing more in the big games. You can't say any fairer than that.
Some of you have really weird rules on what makes a good player, Ill stick to the watching them and making a conclusion based on my own eyes, Zlatan is class, people used to make these ridiculous arguements against Matt le Tissier too, he's good enough for Juve, Inter and Barca and won countless league titles, no manager to my mind that has ever had him wanted rid, thats a telling point.
[/quote]
It would be all too easy to label him world class and think of him as amazing based on his exploits in another league you never watch and youtube compilations. The fact is that the doubt *does* come from watching him play... in the Champions League and internationals. A lot of Liverpool fans simply recall the two games against us in which he was pretty awful to produce an opinion about Zlatan.
As I said earlier, Barca will give him more exposure and if he can do the same for them as he did for Inter, which is score great goals like he did on Saturday, people will end up having a higher opinion of him. But still, if he wants to be thought of in the same bracket of player as Ronaldo, Torres and the like, he's simply going to have to start doing more in the big games. You can't say any fairer than that.
I personally think he is rubbish but he has obvious techincal ability and may do some serious damage because of all the world class players he has around him.
T
the_khl
Guest
There were times where Ronaldo was accused of the exact same thing - that he never delivered in the big games. And rightly so. He did win United shitloads of points against the Wigans, Fulhams and Sunderlands though and this was of great influence to more than a few of United's trophies.
Zlatan has the same problem obviously, that he fails to deliver in the big games against the best, but I reckon it's only a matter of time before he steps up and starts scoring and performing against those as well.
He's a class act on his day and if he manages to stabilize his performances on a high level he's upthere with the Ronaldo's and Messi's of this world.
Zlatan has the same problem obviously, that he fails to deliver in the big games against the best, but I reckon it's only a matter of time before he steps up and starts scoring and performing against those as well.
He's a class act on his day and if he manages to stabilize his performances on a high level he's upthere with the Ronaldo's and Messi's of this world.
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg948603#msg948603 date=1253654464]
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
Haha, so what? I didn't say that it was magnificent, did I?
He's doing well so far, without even having a proper pre-season.
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
Haha, so what? I didn't say that it was magnificent, did I?
He's doing well so far, without even having a proper pre-season.
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg948603#msg948603 date=1253654464]
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
yeah I forgot he hasn't won the champs league, that makes him shit, whereas djimi traore is a living legend who is world class.
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
yeah I forgot he hasn't won the champs league, that makes him shit, whereas djimi traore is a living legend who is world class.
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35939.msg948635#msg948635 date=1253658174]
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg948603#msg948603 date=1253654464]
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
yeah I forgot he hasn't won the champs league, that makes him shit, whereas djimi traore is a living legend who is world class.
[/quote]
Fuck the CL, he's still shit.
[quote author=Modokay link=topic=35939.msg948603#msg948603 date=1253654464]
[quote author=ArtOfficialIntelligence link=topic=35939.msg948598#msg948598 date=1253654159]
He's scored tonight again. 4 in 4 league games. He's doing quite OK
[/quote]
He's still shit.
To be fair he headed the ball onto the defenders shoulder, it hit the post and the goalkeeper touched the ball into his own net. WOOOOOW!!!
[/quote]
yeah I forgot he hasn't won the champs league, that makes him shit, whereas djimi traore is a living legend who is world class.
[/quote]
Fuck the CL, he's still shit.
[quote author=the_khl link=topic=35939.msg947474#msg947474 date=1253521292]
There were times where Ronaldo was accused of the exact same thing - that he never delivered in the big games. And rightly so. He did win United shitloads of points against the Wigans, Fulhams and Sunderlands though and this was of great influence to more than a few of United's trophies.
Zlatan has the same problem obviously, that he fails to deliver in the big games against the best, but I reckon it's only a matter of time before he steps up and starts scoring and performing against those as well.
He's a class act on his day and if he manages to stabilize his performances on a high level he's upthere with the Ronaldo's and Messi's of this world.
[/quote]
I think you're getting a little carried away with your final statement but otherwise I agree.
Funnily enough, he's exactly the sort of player we need - someone who will consistently exploit the gap in class between us and many of the teams in this league. We've got a whole bunch of big game players and yet we still seem to struggle against teams we should beat comfortably (based on last season, obviously).
There were times where Ronaldo was accused of the exact same thing - that he never delivered in the big games. And rightly so. He did win United shitloads of points against the Wigans, Fulhams and Sunderlands though and this was of great influence to more than a few of United's trophies.
Zlatan has the same problem obviously, that he fails to deliver in the big games against the best, but I reckon it's only a matter of time before he steps up and starts scoring and performing against those as well.
He's a class act on his day and if he manages to stabilize his performances on a high level he's upthere with the Ronaldo's and Messi's of this world.
[/quote]
I think you're getting a little carried away with your final statement but otherwise I agree.
Funnily enough, he's exactly the sort of player we need - someone who will consistently exploit the gap in class between us and many of the teams in this league. We've got a whole bunch of big game players and yet we still seem to struggle against teams we should beat comfortably (based on last season, obviously).
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