• You may have to login or register before you can post and view our exclusive members only forums.
    To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Watford post-match

Status
Not open for further replies.
I think we're out of the CL, too.

The kids will get beat on Tuesday.

The league will get postponed/cancelled because of coronavirus.

City actually will have some dirt on us and we'll get fucked by UEFA/FIFA/CAS and will plummet down the leagues.

Lovren will stay and be named club captain and player/manager.

Lucas will return.
 
I think we're out of the CL, too.

The kids will get beat on Tuesday.

The league will get postponed/cancelled because of coronavirus.

City actually will have some dirt on us and we'll get fucked by UEFA/FIFA/CAS and will plummet down the leagues.

Lovren will stay and be named club captain and player/manager.

Lucas will return.
One loss and you fall apart like this? How did you ever survive the other seasons we have had where started to lose games before December ?
 
Watford was extremelly disciplined and packed their own box. Very useful as we can expect the same from At Madrid. We need to find a way to break it down.
Was thinking exactly the same, unfortunately again we failed to find a solution to such a defense. The only solution to such problems is to pass and move quicker. We constantly slow down in the final third and before you know it there is no space to exploit.
 
Yep, so in hindsight this one really was coming. I said during the West Ham game that I didn't think Trent played well defensively and he hasn't been playing particularly well in that respect for a while. Obviously he's a tremendous attacking threat, but he's been targeted and too many times he's looked brittle and a weak-spot in the team. I don't know how you solve that. He would get more protection from Milner or Henderson maybe, but perhaps after this season we should start looking at utilising his strengths further upfield, as has been suggested for some time.

The midfield is pedestrian (again) and needs a reshuffle, again I'm not sure who you take out as any one of them puts in a great performance one week and a dire one the next, particularly Ox and Gini, while Fabinho has always looked sluggish in getting going again after time on the sidelines.

Bobby also needs a bit more pressure on him, he's coasting into the side at times because we have no one else. He's integral to how the forward line works, but we don't seem to have any ideas beyond that, for when he's out of form or it's just not working for him. Origi has had a poor season and Minamino is obviously being eased in.

It's hard, form is temporary and all that, but there are minor cracks and players who either need a rest or a bit of a kick up the arse via pressure on their place. Unfortunately for many of them, we either don't have that competition yet, or Klopp isn't quite willing to give lads like Minamino, Jones etc a go.
 
I would like to see us play Minamino in the midfield 3 against Chelsea. Similar to how we used to utilise Coutinho when he was here and we wanted to play the "Fab four".

He looks like a playmaker and someone who likes to play forward. All the other midfielders are too boring and safe. No creativity, vision, skill nor risk. It makes us too predictable and static going forward.

Move Gini over to the right to give Trent the protection he needs and play Minamino as the LCM, at least until Hendo comes back.
 
No matter how much we love Jurgen Klopp we have to addmit that he has his fualts. At times he is too reluctant to give one of the young players a shot than the more senior player. He would say start Ogiri out on the left and keep Jones on the bench even though Origi's form is poor, and yes Origi as score some big goals in big games, but who is to say that if given the chance that Jones will not do the same or better
 
The thing with Origi is he's proven to be shit when played on the left?

Not sure why Jurgen keeps persisting with it. I've never seen Origi come on and have a great impact on the game with a goal from the left wing.

His best games have always been through the centre. Either play him there or just don't bring him on. Klopp just seems reluctant to take off Firmino/Salah when they are having a shocker.
 
Hendo


How is this even relevant to yesterday's defeat? Lallana looked sharp when he came on, Ox changed the game vs West Ham.

We missed Henderson. For all the old posts about Fabinho being crucial to us defensively, we've shipped 5 in 2 games without the captain there.

Let you in on a little secert...replacing the ox with Lallana was like replacing dog squeeze with squat, neither of them are what I call game changes.
And just because one played slightly better than the other means fuck all both are simply not good enough. Yes we missed Henderson but Henderson being one the field can not make up for the lack of quality in the Ox's play,Lallana,Lorven or anyone elses on less Henderson can play in three or four places at once
 
Let you in on a little secert...replacing the ox with Lallana was like replacing dog squeeze with squat, neither of them are what I call game changes.
And just because one played slightly better than the other means fuck all both are simply not good enough. Yes we missed Henderson but Henderson being one the field can not make up for the lack of quality in the Ox's play,Lallana,Lorven or anyone elses on less Henderson can play in three or four places at once

So we lost because of Lallana and Ox? Nothing to do with terrible defending from Trent and Lovren, or an overpowered frontline, or just not turning up on the day and being in fairly obvious sluggish form? Just Lallana and Ox.

Hmmm.. ok.
 
There's a case for getting Lallana back in that midfield, given the state of it. He's hardly the answer long-term and will no doubt leave in the Summer, but he has something to offer now, while everyone else seems to be performing inconsistently.
 
One thing that hasn't been mentioned as much was the style of play, we constantly repeated the same tricks that Watford became wise to.

1. Defender/midfielder gets the ball
2. Defender/midfielder launches long ball towards front three
3. Front three either don't get anywhere near the ball or receive it but lose it under pressure.

The only styles of play that seemed to surprise Dortmund...I mean Watford were the sporadic driving runs from the middle from ox and Lallana.

If I could say we are missing one ingredient in this team it is a kdb type player, someone disciplined enough to do the pressing but also creative enough to run through the lines providing that measure of unpredictability.
 
I was wavering until the last couple of games. But, and maybe it's a coincidence, Hendo's absence has been hugely noticeable.
I think it's an inability to break down organised, low block teams rather than the absence of one player. Napoli,Sheffield United, Norwich, Atletico and now Watford. It doesn't help when the defence gifts chances to the opposition but the forwards have been feeding off scraps since the winter break mainly because there is little alternative to creativity from the flanks
 
Last edited:
Firmino really is the glue. And i love firmino, and we can't rely on him to do everything... And I've always said, firmino with more goals would be the best player in the world. Well, firmino is going to be worse next year, and worse the next. We should be looking for that player. Or, it's time to think about having a different system for these games.
Why do you think his form will deteriorate? Age?
 
Not really arsed about the loss, it was a poor performance across the board for some reason so we deserved to lose. But regards to silver linings, we've negated another city record that they had their cocks out about, and we can now win the league at city and they'd have to give us a guard of honour - brilliant.
 
I think it's an inability to break down organised, low block teams rather than the absence of one player. Napoli,Sheffield United, Norwich, Atletico and now Watford. It doesn't help when the defence gifts chances to the opposition but the forwards have been feeding off scraps since the winter break mainly because there is little alternative to creativity from the flanks
It's also the fact that through some twist of fate, we've faced so many sides who set up that way right after a break, which upsets our rhythm & momentum.

Not playing any side who is willing to open up & let us build any momentum at all in between these games has been a real disadvantage imo.
 
Not really arsed about the loss, it was a poor performance across the board for some reason so we deserved to lose. But regards to silver linings, we've negated another city record that they had their cocks out about, and we can now win the league at city and they'd have to give us a guard of honour - brilliant.

Wouldn’t we have to win it before playing city if they’re going to give us a guard of honour?
 
If lallana gets that in they'd probs shit themselves and we'd probs win. We were totally bereft of ideas but the main problem yesterday, again, was Lovren. I'm sick of saying just how sick of him I am.

But overall, I wasn't that arsed. Dunno why.
 
giphy.gif


Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
Lovren!
 
You know we can talk and talk about this game constantly but there is a way to overcome such defences and even though we have the tools to do it, we don't use it anymore like we used to. They really needed to win the game, we should at times have let them come at us and organise for a blistering quick counter-attack. Part of the problem maybe that we had for most of that second half 5 players lined up against their back line, even having your own players in that same space actually causes an issue.

Just watching the city game now and their fist goal, they were up against a compact back 4/5 - yet the simplicity of the goal with Foden running at pace and providing a cross which Auguero slots away. The key to it all was just moving at pace and getting behind the back line to put in a good cross. They do this so well in nearly every game along with just moving into space and each player know where to pass that ball. It's the key to their dominance in most games.
 
Not really arsed about the loss, it was a poor performance across the board for some reason so we deserved to lose. But regards to silver linings, we've negated another city record that they had their cocks out about, and we can now win the league at city and they'd have to give us a guard of honour - brilliant.

We won't win the league at City, we will get beat - they will up it to a level never seen before, and we will probably not be up for the fight if we are still in the CL.
 
Just had the same conversation with someone about Lovren, he just upsets everything being so erratic and impulsive.

I do think there's an element of mental fatigue creeping in though. We struggled after the break last year, looking lethargic and like we'd been found out. We haven't, we just lack that top gear and generally this season, despite results and position, games have been relatively tight more often than not. I think the big difference would be a playmaker. I love our midfielders, but we do lack that creative force at times and unpredictability, especially if Bobby is out of sorts.
 
It wasn't Lovrens fault 100%, every player can look at themselves and see that they weren't 100%. Even Klopp wasn't at his best, should have been quicker to change things up tactically, and I'm not just talking about the substitutions.

We got complacent thinking Klopp time would save us again and it didn't work this time, simple.

Now we out of the "Invincibles Trophy" 2020 hopefully we can use this as a reset stop worrying about trying to go unbeaten all season and get back to playing at our strengths.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom