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Watford post-match

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This pundit analysis was surprisingly insightful and it got me thinking – in some way Watford wanted this more than us, because it's a matter of survival for them vs just a matter of pride and keeping records for us. Could it be that over the winter break the reality that the league is pretty much won kind of sunk in for the players and that's why they've been less convincing ever since? The passion, the feeling that we want it more than anyone is a crucial part of what makes this team so good (in fact, great) – no matter how mentally strong they are at some point when you're 20 points ahead of the nearest rival a drop-off is going to come.
 
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I had to watch this one out which is never great for taking everything in but it seems to me a lot like the last match against them except they weren’t utter shite in front of goal.

disappointing to lose the unbeaten record but in some ways a monkey of our backs in that we no longer need to worry about it. Kinda worrying form though.
 
rurikbird said:
One more thing on Lovren vs Gomez – don't forget that we conceded 2 against West Ham WITH Gomez and he didn't play well in that game at all. Klopp is being defensive saying "this has nothing to do with West Ham or Atletico results," but clearly it does. We similarly looked bereft of ideas and control against the Hammers, but somehow were able to dig deep and find the second gear and another win. This time we huffed and puffed, but there was nothing there – no one could provide a spark, there was nothing to grab on to.

Here is a clue as to why I think this is the case:

[xtable=skin1|318.2x@]
{tbody}
{tr}
{td=171x@}player name{/td}
{td=146.2x@}appearances this season{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Firmino{/td}
{td=146.2x@}40{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Robertson{/td}
{td=146.2x@}39{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Trent{/td}
{td=146.2x@}39{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Van Dijk{/td}
{td=146.2x@}38{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Salah{/td}
{td=146.2x@}37{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Wijnaldum{/td}
{td=146.2x@}36{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Mane{/td}
{td=146.2x@}35{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Henderson{/td}
{td=146.2x@}34{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Origi{/td}
{td=146.2x@}33{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Oxlade-Chamberlain{/td}
{td=146.2x@}32{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=171x@}Gomez{/td}
{td=146.2x@}31{/td}
{/tr}
{/tbody}
[/xtable]
It's end of February and there are 11 players who played in 30+ games this season – all really difficult games with much riding on the outcome, against a variety of opponents who all had a plan to stop this team. This is on the back of a similarly punishing run last season with not much of a summer break in between. This is all draining, mentally and physically. We were not coasting on massive talent superiority against most opponents; we had to dig deep time after time. I just saw a team that knew they simply could not do it one more time. This moment has been coming and now here we are.

How quickly can we recharge? Can Klopp find players who can provide a bit of a spark when we desperately need it? This would be a good moment for Minamino to show what he can do, for the likes of Fabinho, Keita, Ox, Lallana, Matip, Origi and others who have not played as much to provide a second wind. Can Jones and Williams deliver? Will Hendo come back flying after his injury break? This is not about the records and immortality now, we will need to fight for every point and every ball, because teams are sensing a weakness. Massive few weeks ahead.
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Great post mate.
 
Can i just ask...were any of you expecting defeat, i was never that confident about beating watford away, so for me it dont feel that bad, and to be honest i never expected us to go unbeaten all season because i kinda expect us to lose away at city and possibly the Arsenal game.
 
moron said:
Can i just ask...were any of you expecting defeat, i was never that confident about beating watford away, so for me it dont feel that bad, and to be honest i never expected us to go unbeaten all season because i kinda expect us to lose away at city and possibly the Arsenal game.
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Well, I actually thought we were almost certain to drop points against Watford in our home game this season; this is what I wrote on December 11th:
I think we will drop points against Watford. All the signs are there – we will be coming back from a psychologically tough away CL elimination game, some players' minds will be already on the trip to Qatar after the game, everyone including us here is getting a bit complacent due to "unassailable" lead at the top, the players' motivation will inevitably drop against a "worst of the league" team – who just got a new manager whose specialty is firing up and motivating his players. And they actually have the players, particularly in midfield, who can match us for quality and physicality. This reminds me of a January game against Swansea a couple of years back when they were bottom of the league and considered hopeless – and were exactly the only team who beat us. Klopp will know all this and do his best to stamp out any signs of complacency, but human nature cannot be fully overcome. I would be surprised if we don't drop points in this one.
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This team's mentality surprised me time and time again – no way any of us could have imagined that we would not drop a single point in the league from that point until almost March. But what I wrote in December was still true, Watford is one of the teams whose physicality in midfield and Sarr's pace could give us a real problem. And due to injuries Klopp was limited in his options about how to counter them.
 
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That is quite remarkable.
I have a feeling Bournemouth are gonna pay for this next weekend
 
LeTallecWiz said:
This loss has been coming ... We've been winning many games that felt like "Can't believe we did this again" ...
It's been a phenomenal run - 35-1-1 in 37 games in incredible.
The Gooner fans are gloating ... that's the only reason this sucks as one loss and one draw in Feb is unreal ... just a phenomenal season.

We need to turn it around and quick though - we've been coasting in too many games. Let's hammer the Cherries - and get some of our confidence back.
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Hendo
Donavan Ried said:
We have been too slow in selling players which have been simply average for us or have been injury prone...

Sturridge,Lovern,Lallana, AOC,Shaqiri,Origi..Sturridge should have went two or three season before he actually did. Lallana two seasons ago along with Lovren last season. While the Ox should never had been bought in the first place, and nor should Shaqiri, Origi he should be sold this summer has most of the time he has little impact on games...
We have one of the best managers in the world today who have worked wonders with this team, and has much as we or Klopp want it, some players are simply not good enough. Just because a cat has her baby's in the oven it does not make them biscuits. And those players are simply not good enough
There are so many young, talented footballers out there, better than the ones I have listed...Bayern Munich's Alphonso Davis (19) cost $13.5m (£10.6m) from Vancouver and despite watching him in 2017 we never made a move for him
Vinícius Jr. (19) Real bought him from Flamengo for €30 million to €45 million (£25.8m - £38.7m)
Two of the hottest young talents out there at present...
These are the types of player that we should be looking to sign instead of holding on to the Lovern, Lallana, AOC, Shaqiri, Origi of the world
Liverpool FC in the transfer market are far too slow to act. We seem to spot talent quicker than most club but are so slow to act that the talent ends up end up elsewhere
I am not saying this because of the lost today, although that lost has made me reiterate something that I have been saying for quite some time now we need to bring in better players
Take a look at Bayern Munich Thomas Müller use to be one of the first names on their team sheet, Although he is still a great player these day for Bayern he is more of a squad player instead of a starter, If we get better player those we have that are starters will become squad players and as a team we become stronger
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How is this even relevant to yesterday's defeat? Lallana looked sharp when he came on, Ox changed the game vs West Ham.

We missed Henderson. For all the old posts about Fabinho being crucial to us defensively, we've shipped 5 in 2 games without the captain there.
 
mark1975 said:
How is this even relevant to yesterday's defeat? Lallana looked sharp when he came on, Ox changed the game vs West Ham.

We missed Henderson. For all the old posts about Fabinho being crucial to us defensively, we've shipped 5 in 2 games without the captain there.
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Because without Hendo's work rate and discipline, our right flank is a bit more vulnerable ... doesn't help that Lovren was on that side yesterday.
 
Van Dijk has lost 5 premier league matches for Liverpool. Guess who is partner was in 4 of them?
 
I find it weird that Matip didnt start.
We know Watford are physical and Deeney will target the other CB.
Surely Matip would be better equipped to deal with that.
 
Hansern said:
I find it weird that Matip didnt start.
We know Watford are physical and Deeney will target the other CB.
Surely Matip would be better equipped to deal with that.
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Someone mentioned in the match thread that Lovren was the best choice for that reason. But as we've seen with Lovren for so long now, if you can drag him into a one on one physical battle, his concentration goes and he loses the big picture. Then, if you actually get the better of him, you probably win because you're basically playing against ten men and have destabilised the entire defence.
 
I reckon we’ll see a different side now with not as much pressure on them to break records even if they say they focus on the next game etc, Let’s put the league to bed , I’d put a strong eleven against Chelsea in the cup to spring us into our stride.
 
Shadey said:
I reckon we’ll see a different side now with not as much pressure on them to break records even if they say they focus on the next game etc, Let’s put the league to bed , I’d put a strong eleven against Chelsea in the cup to spring us into our stride.
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I'm not sure what Klopp's planned team was for Chelsea but I've a feeling it may be stronger now.
 
All three goals could been avoided. Robbos "attempt" to block the ball for the second goal was so pathetic it can't be described. We used to be extreme good at kill those situations. We need to get back to that level.
 
If we get past Atletico, I am just going to see the Watford game as yet another example of how good this team is at losing only when it makes no real difference.
 
Halmeister said:
Someone mentioned in the match thread that Lovren was the best choice for that reason. But as we've seen with Lovren for so long now, if you can drag him into a one on one physical battle, his concentration goes and he loses the big picture. Then, if you actually get the better of him, you probably win because you're basically playing against ten men and have destabilised the entire defence.
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I would rather start with 10 men than have Lovren in the side.
 
Lovren is leaving, so while shitting on him makes sense, the more relevant issues are elsewhere.

Two things I hope we don't hear as much now, if only for my sanity.

"How do you improve on this front three!"

"This midfield isnt about creativity, that's a job for the fullbacks!"

Not only are our attacking three not firing, they are bang, bang out of form as a unit. Our attacking play has regressed, and our midfield is exposed against deep lying opposition. We have the same remaining issue we've always had.

I know what a lack of creativity looks like, I've watched years and years of strikers being pushed out wide and passing to a full back. I can remember one instance of a midfielder finding any space between the lines yesterday.

Firmino really is the glue. And i love firmino, and we can't rely on him to do everything... And I've always said, firmino with more goals would be the best player in the world. Well, firmino is going to be worse next year, and worse the next. We should be looking for that player. Or, it's time to think about having a different system for these games.
 
I’ve not seen the highlights and I don’t plan on watching them, but I’ll repeat what’s been said already, it seems Hendo’s leadership is a HUGE miss, and another big factor in the last 2 league games.

We’ve been shit the last 3 games, needed a kick up the arse, let’s finish the season song and go and win the treble.
 
Some thoughts:
The players didn't look hungry yesterday. Lethargic, timid and complacent that's the words that come to mind.
It looked like they played knowing that the league is over and they didn't want to run those extra few yards or fight for loose balls.
Minds solely on the Atletico Madrid game.
Blame Lovren all you want, Im partly blaming him as well but one player didn't cause the result yesterday, everyone stopped playing. You don't beat a team fighting for their lives just by showing up.
Best attacking trio in the premier league and they were tamed by fucking Watford.
 
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The trend seems to be sending long balls either to the flanks or forwards to bypass our midfield press then try to win the second balls. With Lovren pissing himself, it worked a treat.
 
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