Tony Evans

[Pesam]

[quote author=StevieM link=topic=40864.msg1131231#msg1131231 date=1278325970]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=40864.msg1131225#msg1131225 date=1278325065]
I really don't buy into all these 'sinking-ship' rumours as we're still one of the biggest brands in the world of football and as such always an atttractive investment prospect and likewise workplace for the best players and coaches around.

IF Gerrard and Torres are indeed on their way then other potential starplayer will come in instead and we'll go from there.

It's not the end of the world.
[/quote]

If coke tastes like shit.... people will drink pepsi.

[/quote]

Explain Big Macs to me then?

 

[the_khl]

[quote author=Brendan link=topic=40864.msg1131228#msg1131228 date=1278325525]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=40864.msg1131225#msg1131225 date=1278325065]
I really don't buy into all these 'sinking-ship' rumours as we're still one of the biggest brands in the world of football and as such always an atttractive investment prospect and likewise workplace for the best players and coaches around.

IF Gerrard and Torres are indeed on their way then other potential starplayer will come in instead and we'll go from there.

It's not the end of the world.
[/quote]

So how did we end up with Woy?
[/quote]
Don't get me wrong I'm not over the moon with his appointment however I reckoned him to be the best of all the British-candidates anyways.

I guess he could actually prove rather solid. Whether it'll be more than that is questionable though. I don't think his appointment will make our club less attrative though.

Of course we'll be hurt if Torres, Masher and Gerrard all left but we'd get in the excess of £120M to spend on new players and as the WC has shown us there are good players outthere who's not necessarily playing for Spain, France or England and not that well known to us.

We could buy six to eight potential to proven star-players and would if nothing else still be competing for fourth.

Christian Eriksen, Eden Hazard, Simon Kjær, Coentrao, Sanchez, Arda Turan and Kwadwo Asamoah. And Zlatan.

 

[SummerOnions]

They'd never settle in that time though. That, and Woy suggested he was going for British talent players

 

[the_khl]

[quote author=SummerOnions link=topic=40864.msg1131255#msg1131255 date=1278329734]
They'd never settle in that time though. That, and Woy suggested he was going for British talent players
[/quote]
I know mate I was merely trying to underline that it's not be All end All if our starplayers should decide to leave the not so stable faring boat.

There's a lot of great and talented players outthere for whom a move to Liverpool would be a dream coming through. Gerrard or no Gerrard.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

If we sold Torres and Macher for a combined fee of say £90m, you'd have to think that our squad would be in a better state if most of that money was reinvested into the squad.

I don't want either to leave, but it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did.

 

[Y1]

[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40864.msg1131259#msg1131259 date=1278331484]
If we sold Torres and Macher for a combined fee of say £90m, you'd have to think that our squad would be in a better state if most of that money was reinvested into the squad.

I don't want either to leave, but it wouldn't be the end of the world if they did.
[/quote]

If & if. More ifs and buts.

 

[Irish_Red]

Re: FIXTURES WEEK 24

Evans is on talksport at the minute. He confirms Torres and Gerrard are looking for moves in the quietest way possible. So many broken promises over the last 18 month has left them with no option. Torres to chelsea as his most likely destination. Gerrard to madrid.

 

[peekay]

[quote author=KHL link=topic=40864.msg1131225#msg1131225 date=1278325065]
I really don't buy into all these 'sinking-ship' rumours as we're still one of the biggest brands in the world of football and as such always an atttractive investment prospect and likewise workplace for the best players and coaches around.

IF Gerrard and Torres are indeed on their way then other potential starplayer will come in instead and we'll go from there.

It's not the end of the world.
[/quote]

Nope we wont. First, I am not confident that the entire sales proceeds will be reinvested in the team. I know Broughton said otherwise but based on past evidence, I really cannot see that.

Second, I dont think we will be the number one choice for potential star players once Torres and Gerrard leaves. It is the equivalent of people thinking that once Rafa goes, Mourinho, Van Gaal and Capello will be standing outside Anfield, begging us to make them their manager.

 

[Oncy]

I'm not sure where these 'it might not be a bad thing' thoughts are coming from. If we lose Gerrard, Mascherano AND Torres we are quite simply finished as a force.

 

[doctor_mac]

Re: FIXTURES WEEK 24

[quote author=Irish_Red link=topic=40864.msg1131279#msg1131279 date=1278333832]
Evans is on talksport at the minute. He confirms Torres and Gerrard are looking for moves in the quietest way possible. So many broken promises over the last 18 month has left them with no option. Torres to chelsea as his most likely destination. Gerrard to madrid.
[/quote]

Torres is never going to Chelsea. No. fucking. Way. SG will go to Madrid.

 

[Judge Jules]

I think the argument runs that, if the big three go, we'd get a shedload of cash to spend on the squad which could then come out of it stronger overall, and IMO that's possible provided (a) we get the whole of the proceeds of sale back into the transfer kitty, (b) Roy spends it wisely, (c) players of sufficient quality are willing to come here and (d) Roy can get the best out of them. The trouble with that is (a) those are a lot of "ifs" at once and (b) unless big new investment arrives we'll probably have some barren years in the meantime, which in themselves will make the mountain even harder to climb.

 

[LadyRed]

[quote author=Irish_Red link=topic=40864.msg1131279#msg1131279 date=1278333832]
Evans is on talksport at the minute. He confirms Torres and Gerrard are looking for moves in the quietest way possible. So many broken promises over the last 18 month has left them with no option. Torres to chelsea as his most likely destination. Gerrard to madrid.
[/quote]

I will never forgive him if he goes to Chelsea, the bastard.

But this doesn't really make sense, who broke their promises? Rafa? He's gone. Parry? He's gone. The Americans? They're on their way out too, so who do they feel they can't trust anymore exactly?

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40864.msg1131289#msg1131289 date=1278334761]
I think the argument runs that, if the big three go, we'd get a shedload of cash to spend on the squad which could then come out of it stronger overall, and IMO that's possible provided (a) we get the whole of the proceeds of sale back into the transfer kitty, (b) Roy spends it wisely, (c) players of sufficient quality are willing to come here and (d) Roy can get the best out of them. The trouble with that is (a) those are a lot of "ifs" at once and (b) unless big new investment arrives we'll probably have some barren years in the meantime, which in themselves will make the mountain even harder to climb.
[/quote]

I might have missed this, but I thought Broughton's quote regards transfer fees received, was that we would be able to spend 'alot of it', or words to that effect?

 

[SaintGeorge67]

he said all of it

 

[Judge Jules]

Anita, H and G haven't gone yet and, even if they do, that wouldn't mean they hadn't broken promises in the meantime. However, if - IF - this story is true and Torres has simply had enough of the whole mess surrounding the club, he and his agent would only be doing what other players and their agents do when they want out, i.e.cobble together some sort of excuse to try and cover their arses, a bit like Cashley and his "Arsenal were *only* prepared to pay me £55,000 a week". Like you I'd lose a lot of respect for the man in that event, but he'd hardly be alone in such behaviour.

 

[mark1975]

And if Torres goes to Chelsea, or any other Premiership club for that matter, he can go fuck himself regardless of what the 'sympathisers' are saying on here.

If he feels he can't do anymore then fair enough, go back to Spain or Italy and win something there. Not to one of our Premiership rivals, not after expressing your love for the club for the past three years and how much you wanted them to get back to the top.

All this sympathy bollocks makes me laugh, so because we're going through a shit time it's justified that our best players can just fuck off without any ill feeling towards them from the fans who've spent a fortune watching them for however long??

BOLLOCKS.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=40864.msg1131296#msg1131296 date=1278335028]
he said all of it
[/quote]

Sound.

 

[peterhague]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40864.msg1131302#msg1131302 date=1278335261]
And if Torres goes to Chelsea, or any other Premiership club for that matter, he can go fuck himself regardless of what the 'sympathisers' are saying on here.

If he feels he can't do anymore then fair enough, go back to Spain or Italy and win something there. Not to one of our Premiership rivals, not after expressing your love for the club for the past three years and how much you wanted them to get back to the top.

All this sympathy bollocks makes me laugh, so because we're going through a shit time it's justified that our best players can just fuck off without any ill feeling towards them from the fans who've spent a fortune watching them for however long??

BOLLOCKS.


[/quote]


that's just how i feel - i feel sorry for the guy.

my reading of him is that he's someone with more integrity than most, who desperately wanted to succeed with atletico, and then tried a sort of compromise by going somewhere with the best of both worlds, - a bit more chance of success, but still a lot of 'soul' - but his gambles haven't paid off. he'spent a lot of his career, imo, trying to do things the 'right' way, and i think he deserves credit for it, and sympathy for his dilemna.

just my two cents.

 

[mark1975]

I'm losing all sympathy for the modern day footballer, Peter, and the game itself. Regardless of his love for the club, it seems that like many others, once the shit hits the fan it's time to jump ship.

Owen gave us more years than Torres and got abuse for not giving Rafa a season, for being ambiguous with his press statements and generally keeping us hanging on before jumping ship. This all seems reminiscent, yet many seem to be feeling sympathy towards him because of his initial loyalty to Atletico and his words of love for Liverpool (over three years).

It's ultimately one in the same if he does go. I know the modern day footballer only has so many years in the game, but Torres is 26, he's got time on his side to achieve things, whether it be here or somewhere else.

It's clear the club is at a crossroads, and it stands no chance if it loses it's best players, because its attraction will drop even more so.

 

[TheBunnyman]

I agree with all that, Mark, but Torres hasn't gone yet, nor has he said he wants to go. We should probably hold back on the anger and bitterness till we see what his actual intentions are.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40864.msg1131311#msg1131311 date=1278336375]
I agree with all that, Mark, but Torres hasn't gone yet, nor has he said he wants to go. We should probably hold back on the anger and bitterness till we see what his actual intentions are.

[/quote]

Yeah but hypothetically...... ;D

 

[peekay]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40864.msg1131289#msg1131289 date=1278334761]
I think the argument runs that, if the big three go, we'd get a shedload of cash to spend on the squad which could then come out of it stronger overall, and IMO that's possible provided (a) we get the whole of the proceeds of sale back into the transfer kitty, (b) Roy spends it wisely, (c) players of sufficient quality are willing to come here and (d) Roy can get the best out of them. The trouble with that is (a) those are a lot of "ifs" at once and (b) unless big new investment arrives we'll probably have some barren years in the meantime, which in themselves will make the mountain even harder to climb.
[/quote]

I dont think we will get a shedload of cash also. We got 5 - 6.5 million for Yossi, he had three years on his contract and we were selling to a club who had a shedload of cash.

I just cannot see (a) and (c) happening. We may spend about 40-50% of the incoming proceeds on new players and the owners will claim that all the money was reinvested on players. I am a bit more confident of (d) Roy getting the best out of whatever players he can attract.

 

[Paddy]

We can't lay all the blame at Benitez's door for last season's performances. Giving how Torres and Gerrard have always expressed their love and passion for the club, they should be disgusted with how it all went. Surely they want to stay and get us back in the top 4? Leaving after one bad season would be pathetic.

 

[manwithnoname]

I dont think we will get a shedload of cash also. We got 5 - 6.5 million for Yossi, he had three years on his contract and we were selling to a club who had a shedload of cash.

I just cannot see (a) and (c) happening. We may spend about 40-50% of the incoming proceeds on new players and the owners will claim that all the money was reinvested on players. I am a bit more confident of (d) Roy getting the best out of whatever players he can attract.

What's Casper got to do with it?

Masher, Gerrard and Torres - if sold - would fetch around £85 -95m

 

[peterhague]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40864.msg1131310#msg1131310 date=1278336056]
I'm losing all sympathy for the modern day footballer, Peter, and the game itself. Regardless of his love for the club, it seems that like many others, once the shit hits the fan it's time to jump ship.

Owen gave us more years than Torres and got abuse for not giving Rafa a season, for being ambiguous with his press statements and generally keeping us hanging on before jumping ship. This all seems reminiscent, yet many seem to be feeling sympathy towards him because of his initial loyalty to Atletico and his words of love for Liverpool (over three years).

It's ultimately one in the same if he does go. I know the modern day footballer only has so many years in the game, but Torres is 26, he's got time on his side to achieve things, whether it be here or somewhere else.

It's clear the club is at a crossroads, and it stands no chance if it loses it's best players, because its attraction will drop even more so.
[/quote]

well, i know modern footballers aren't the most sympathy-inducing people, but torres isl, when all's said and done, still a human being trying, imo, to do what's best in difficult circumstances. i really think this will be a tough choice for a decent person to make, and for that i feel for him.

i'm actually starting to doubt whether it matters a damn if he goes or not unless we are sold. i think as long as H&G hang on we're fucked anyway, so can't see that it makes a massive difference. it's certainly hard to see how we can possibly build a squad to match utd, chelsea, city, spurs, arsenal if we DON'T sell torres gerrard, probably more so than if we DO.

in short, i'm sick to death of it all, but the hopelessness is at least liberating - i feel i'll be able to enjoy whatever comes next season free of any expectations.

 

[Asbo]

30 30 50 at least I'd have thought?

Didn't Chelsea supposedly offer 90 for Torres and Gerrard last season?

 

[Portly]

I think Mascherano will go because he has a particularly strong reason for going, which is that his wife is unhappy here.

It would be unwise to welcome the departure of Gerrard and Torres, but there are positives to take if either or both of them go. Last season, Gerrard was well below his usual form, and as we know Torres was out injured a lot. There is no reason to assume that this will change next season.

Hodgson will try to persuade both of them to stay, but if they don't, this gives him to opportunity to start building a team with his own stamp on it, rather than trying to sort out the squad he inherited from Benitez. So I don't think he will view the departure of Gerrard and/or Torres as necessarily a totally bad thing.

 

[peekay]

[quote author=Brendan link=topic=40864.msg1131316#msg1131316 date=1278336651]

I dont think we will get a shedload of cash also. We got 5 - 6.5 million for Yossi, he had three years on his contract and we were selling to a club who had a shedload of cash.

I just cannot see (a) and (c) happening. We may spend about 40-50% of the incoming proceeds on new players and the owners will claim that all the money was reinvested on players. I am a bit more confident of (d) Roy getting the best out of whatever players he can attract.

What's Casper got to do with it?

Masher, Gerrard and Torres - if sold - would fetch around £85 -95m
[/quote]

I just don't see us getting full value for money. We need the cash. The players are desperate to move. Not an ideal situation to sell players.

 

[Squiggles]

[quote author=Portly link=topic=40864.msg1131320#msg1131320 date=1278337466]
I think Mascherano will go because he has a particularly strong reason for going, which is that his wife is unhappy here.

It would be unwise to welcome the departure of Gerrard and Torres, but there are positives to take if either or both of them go. Last season, Gerrard was well below his usual form, and as we know Torres was out injured a lot. There is no reason to assume that this will change next season.

Hodgson will try to persuade both of them to stay, but if they don't, this gives him to opportunity to start building a team with his own stamp on it, rather than trying to sort out the squad he inherited from Benitez. So I don't think he will view the departure of Gerrard and/or Torres as necessarily a totally bad thing.
[/quote]

I think that's pretty accurate, but it's worth noting that if Torres, Gerrard and Mascherano leave a squad already riddled with holes and shit players, Hodgson will do well to finish in the top half next season.

Liverpool are uttely fucked if are best players leave towards the end of the summer, and Hodgson will face more criticism than ever before, from a fan-base who are largely discontent with his appointment.

 

[manwithnoname]

I think that's pretty accurate, but it's worth noting that if Torres, Gerrard and Mascherano leave a squad already riddled with holes and shit players, Hodgson will do well to finish in the top half next season.

Liverpool are uttely fucked if are best players leave towards the end of the summer, and Hodgson will face more criticism than ever before, from a fan-base who are largely discontent with his appointment.

Woy won't take the bulk of the criticism. It's not his fault he was offered the job, and nor could you blame him for taking it.