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mark1975

mark1975

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(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.
 
Fair enough - I'm a little disappointed that there was so little to get excited about. I've enjoyed the way Kenny has extracted more out of the faded puzzle pieces Roy was fumbling over. But I do agree that a dull performance has people over-reacting.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44266.msg1287285#msg1287285 date=1297992363]
(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.


[/quote]

I disagree actually. We've had some decent momentum, playing football the right way. Our team doesn't need any more practice hoofing shit long balls for no reason in particular. And let's not pretend that it's sustainable either, or that it's the same as other years, because our defense will not stand up to any prolongued examination like in previous years.

I think it would be good to continue playing the way we are supposed to and instill that in our team, regardless of the second string players being fielded.
 
From everything I've read I'm not disappointed I missed this match.
 
Squiggles, you're lucky that you didnt have to endure the boredom.

I was disappointed that Kenny settled for the result. A little attacking ambition in the last 10 minutes would have been great.

Terrible game to say the least but at least Wilson got a run out and looks pretty decent. Magic was looking the business and our main threat on the night.

We'll slaughter this lot at Anfield.
 
Been reading a few people say that we'd cream them at home, but I'm not sure where this confidence comes from. If Gerrard & Agger are still out next week (I'm sick of mentioning "Agger" and "unavailable" in the same breath every month or so), we'll have basically the same team out there that played today (maybe even minus Aurelio). If Cole tweaks his eyebrow during training next week and is out as well (see "Agger&quot😉 we'll have the same, sickly-thin squad out there.

We should have Kelly back in at RB, but aside from that, we really haven't got anyone else to throw in and reliably make a meaningful, positive difference.

Here's hoping Kuyt has a good game, since he's already has his spell of two terrible games in a row. It'd be a bit out of sequence for him, but I guess we could hope.
 
Gerrard and Agger to return as per Kenny. Sparta are dire and if we can't slaughter them at Anfield, fuck then we deserved to be knocked out. It would be a crying shame not only for the club but for football as a whole.

Simple as!
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44266.msg1287285#msg1287285 date=1297992363]
(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.


[/quote]
OR we could play some of the youngsters and approach the game different as in say, go for goals?

I watched the Anderlecht - Ajax games earlier on at that was great entertainment with loads of attacking intent especially from the away side.

The line-up against Prague was one of the most dire (I know you agree although you had a go at me for saying so in the match thread) we've seen for ages and play was thereafter.
 
Blimey peoples expectations have changed, haven't they.

This is standard fayre for liverpool down the decades when playing average eastern european teams, or Turks.
They are pretty difficult places to go to for some reason.

We keep a clean sheet and try and snatch a goal, it's not pretty but it's a formula that has worked over the years.

Unfortunately trying to snatch a goal when you don't have a striker worth the name on the pitch is a bit of a problem.
Far be it from me to question Kenny, but I would have stuck Cole on the right at the start and played Dirk up front.

I could not believe Stan Collymore when he was talking about N'gog pre match , when he used the adjective strong

When our best attacking options left available are Miereles, who was playing much deeper and Johnson, you must know it is going to be a dire game. Maxi went missing all game which did not help.

The media have been blathering on about it being a poor result and a shite game last night and this morning. Trust me I have seen just as bad in the CL, in the knockout stages (or the EC prior to CL), and I was quite happy with 0-0 as a result although an away goal would have been handy. This comes on the back of the CL being lucky they had two stand-out games this week with English Teams.

This game just emphasises what a problem we had in just having Torres as an option up front. If he had stayed and him and Gerrard were injured this would be it...........thankfully it's not now.

It was a crap game, but it's not how pretty it all looks , it's all about the result.

regards
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=44266.msg1287362#msg1287362 date=1298022687]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44266.msg1287285#msg1287285 date=1297992363]
(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.


[/quote]
OR we could play some of the youngsters and approach the game different as in say, go for goals?

I watched the Anderlecht - Ajax games earlier on at that was great entertainment with loads of attacking intent especially from the away side.

The line-up against Prague was one of the most dire (I know you agree although you had a go at me for saying so in the match thread) we've seen for ages and play was thereafter.
[/quote]

We've played far far worse than that at times this season and the season before. Have you forgotten already so soon? Mark is spot on his assessment. These European ties can be chore and we've seen many like it before under Rafa. I thought it was a professional job done to take us to half time.

EDIT - Just seen Vladi's post and he's also spot on.
 
[quote author=Tinto link=topic=44266.msg1287384#msg1287384 date=1298025741]
[quote author=KHL link=topic=44266.msg1287362#msg1287362 date=1298022687]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44266.msg1287285#msg1287285 date=1297992363]
(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.


[/quote]
OR we could play some of the youngsters and approach the game different as in say, go for goals?

I watched the Anderlecht - Ajax games earlier on at that was great entertainment with loads of attacking intent especially from the away side.

The line-up against Prague was one of the most dire (I know you agree although you had a go at me for saying so in the match thread) we've seen for ages and play was thereafter.
[/quote]

We've played far far worse than that at times this season and the season before. Have you forgotten already so soon? Mark is spot on his assessment. These European ties can be chore and we've seen many like it before under Rafa. I thought it was a professional job done to take us to half time.

EDIT - Just seen Vladi's post and he's also spot on.
[/quote]
Bah.

Job done would've been a victory. One goal for Prague at Anfield and it's an uphill task.

Can't believe that we've been lulled into the belief that a scoreless draw at some rather obscure venue in Europe can be deemed as a professional job. Personally I'm tired of this approach. Perhaps I'd be less so if we actually won something whilst applying these tactics as we did back in the 70s and 80s but at this stage in time I'd be more than happy to see us play with far more adventure and bravery whilst showing attacking-intent.

How many goals did we have on target last night? I litterally almost fell asleep, it was that dire.
 
It was a very boring game indeed that was not helped by the pedestrian pace we possess as a team. But as Vlad says was a typical Liverpool away stifling performance
 
If we had lost 1-0 it still would not have been a bad result.
If we can't beat SP at home , we don't deserve to be in it anyway.


regards
 
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=44266.msg1287395#msg1287395 date=1298026598]
It was a very boring game indeed that was not helped by the pedestrian pace we possess as a team. But as Vlad says was a typical Liverpool away stifling performance
[/quote]
I want a different typical Liverpool away performance then. Hopefully Kenny would like that as well.

I know we don't have the squad these days but I'd be pleased to at least see some progress in games to come away from home in Europe compared to last night.

It was like watching a boring goal-less Serie A game in slowmotion.
 
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=44266.msg1287402#msg1287402 date=1298026860]
If we had lost 1-0 it still would not have been a bad result.
If we can't beat SP at home , we don't deserve to be in it anyway.


regards
[/quote]
I normally wouldn't mind a goalless draw away from home in Europe. Against Barca.

Against Prague or Brøndby or AEK Athens I'd expect Liverpool to go all out for the kill. We should be a far superior team to Prague, especially at this stage in time with them coming back from a 3 month spell without competitive mathces, but we didn't show that at all last night. I blame the players and I blame the approach from the manager as well.

I love Kenny to bits but last night wasn't one of his proudest moments.
 
Travelling half way across Europe with a makeshift team then playing on a frozen cowpatch and getting a draw used to be regarded as a decent result in years gone by. It still is.

It's all about getting to the final, not 'entertaining' people along the way. That was the seventh game undefeated, I didn't think I was going to be saying that at the start of this year.
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=44266.msg1287404#msg1287404 date=1298026889]
[quote author=Sunny link=topic=44266.msg1287395#msg1287395 date=1298026598]
It was a very boring game indeed that was not helped by the pedestrian pace we possess as a team. But as Vlad says was a typical Liverpool away stifling performance
[/quote]
I want a different typical Liverpool away performance then. Hopefully Kenny would like that as well.

I know we don't have the squad these days but I'd be pleased to at least see some progress in games to come away from home in Europe compared to last night.

It was like watching a boring goal-less Serie A game in slowmotion.
[/quote]

I want an Aston Martin mate but I'm not going to get one.
 
[quote author=jexykrodic link=topic=44266.msg1287410#msg1287410 date=1298027199]
Travelling half way across Europe with a makeshift team then playing on a frozen cowpatch and getting a draw used to be regarded as a decent result in years gone by. It still is.

It's all about getting to the final, not 'entertaining' people along the way. That was the seventh game undefeated, I didn't think I was going to be saying that at the start of this year.
[/quote]

Well said Jexy. The game was rubbish, but the result sets us up well for progression. Deal with it.
 
[quote author=KHL link=topic=44266.msg1287409#msg1287409 date=1298027103]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=44266.msg1287402#msg1287402 date=1298026860]
If we had lost 1-0 it still would not have been a bad result.
If we can't beat SP at home , we don't deserve to be in it anyway.


regards
[/quote]
I normally wouldn't mind a goalless draw away from home in Europe. Against Barca.

Against Prague or Brøndby or AEK Athens I'd expect Liverpool to go all out for the kill. We should be a far superior team to Prague, especially at this stage in time with them coming back from a 3 month spell without competitive mathces, but we didn't show that at all last night. I blame the players and I blame the approach from the manager as well.

I love Kenny to bits but last night wasn't one of his proudest moments.
[/quote]

You have not really seen much of us over the years have you KHL?

regards
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=44266.msg1287285#msg1287285 date=1297992363]
(like tonight).......we could argue against them being shown on TV, let's face it.

We all know they're a chore more than anything, we go there, get a narrow result, knowing full well we'll take them back to Anfield and beat them either way. A necessary evil, deal with it.

I really don't know why, after every one of these types of games, in the CL the Europa, whatever, we have to go through the same shit, which I'm sure we have tonight on here, people moaning about how shit we are, how much a waste of money some players are, how we should have dry humped them, etc, etc. We do this almost every season, go there, do a job, come home. Job done.

It's not pretty, it's shit TV. Ahh well.
[/quote]

Indeed. Its a good job that most our away performances in Europe during our glory years were not televised. They were mainly functional performances too. A means to an end with the odd Benfica away thrown in. A means to an end.
 
We've been spoiled with great results away from home by Rafa during the last few years.

Real 0-1

Barca 1-2

Leverkusen 1-3

Betis 1-2

Eindhoven 0-3

Marseille 0-4

Inter 0-1

etc.

I guess some of us expected more.
 
I missed the game last night, but heard it was diabolical.... I'm guessing there was some moans and groans in the match thread?

I don't see the need to read anything into a bit of moaning after suffering through *another* dreary 90mins of football. Let people vent without getting on your high horse.
 
We're well capable of good results away, when we have a good team on the pitch.

We didnt.

Perhaps you and KHL are right though; a team of Coady, Sterling and Robinson might have been able to dance around those cloggers and we might have scored a famous victory.

I, and a good number of others dont think so though.

We'd have seen a bunch of kids out of their depth, make mistakes and see their self-confidence plummet.

Aside from maybe playing Cole instead of Maxi, and possibly playing Pacheco I'm not sure what else could have been done.
 
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44266.msg1287454#msg1287454 date=1298033248]
We've been spoiled with great results away from home by Rafa during the last few years.

Real 0-1

Barca 1-2

Leverkusen 1-3

Betis 1-2

Eindhoven 0-3

Marseille 0-4

Inter 0-1

etc.

I guess some of us expected more.
[/quote]

I'll bet you most of the teams that we put out in those games were significantly stronger than last night. But yes, we have been spoiled in the past few years.

We are not here to entertain, we are here to win trophies. I entertain then fair enough. We drew nil nil in Nou Camp in 2001 which was one of the dullest games I've ever attended but it was a job well done.
 
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=44266.msg1287460#msg1287460 date=1298033675]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44266.msg1287454#msg1287454 date=1298033248]
We've been spoiled with great results away from home by Rafa during the last few years.

Real 0-1

Barca 1-2

Leverkusen 1-3

Betis 1-2

Eindhoven 0-3

Marseille 0-4

Inter 0-1

etc.

I guess some of us expected more.
[/quote]

I'll bet you most of the teams that we put out in those games were significantly stronger than last night. But yes, we have been spoiled in the past few years.

We are not here to entertain, we are here to win trophies. I entertain then fair enough. We drew nil nil in Nou Camp in 2001 which was one of the dullest games I've ever attended but it was a job well done.
[/quote]

I accept a 0-0 draw against Barca at the Nou Camp. It's Barca.
0-0 against Chelsea is also great.
You know where I'm going with this.
It was Sparta Prague.
Maxi and Kuyt who are both underachieving at the moment started the game. Kenny was playing it safe and I get it, but the only reason I watched the game yesterday was to see Raheem, Pacheco, Coady, Wilson and maybe Robinson. Sparta haven't played a competitive game since November.

I just don't see the risk in playing Pacheco instead of Maxi or Aurelio or Kuyt for that matter.
 
[quote author=Avvy link=topic=44266.msg1287459#msg1287459 date=1298033664]
We're well capable of good results away, when we have a good team on the pitch.

We didnt.

Perhaps you and KHL are right though; a team of Coady, Sterling and Robinson might have been able to dance around those cloggers and we might have scored a famous victory.

I, and a good number of others dont think so though.

We'd have seen a bunch of kids out of their depth, make mistakes and see their self-confidence plummet.

Aside from maybe playing Cole instead of Maxi, and possibly playing Pacheco I'm not sure what else could have been done.
[/quote]

So when are these kids gonna be given a chance I don't buy that we have to protect them all the time. If we had played some of the "kids" like Coady, Pacheco from start and we lost say 1-0. That wouldn't be the end of the world cause we'd still have a home tie to play.
 
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44266.msg1287472#msg1287472 date=1298034579]
[quote author=Avvy link=topic=44266.msg1287459#msg1287459 date=1298033664]
We're well capable of good results away, when we have a good team on the pitch.

We didnt.

Perhaps you and KHL are right though; a team of Coady, Sterling and Robinson might have been able to dance around those cloggers and we might have scored a famous victory.

I, and a good number of others dont think so though.

We'd have seen a bunch of kids out of their depth, make mistakes and see their self-confidence plummet.

Aside from maybe playing Cole instead of Maxi, and possibly playing Pacheco I'm not sure what else could have been done.
[/quote]

So when are these kids gonna be given a chance I don't buy that we have to protect them all the time. If we had played some of the "kids" like Coady, Pacheco from start and we lost say 1-0. That wouldn't be the end of the world cause we'd still have a home tie to play.
[/quote]

Lets try this then. Not when:
1. Our captain is out
2. We have no real striker to think of actually playing up front
3. The pitch is frozen
4. The players are frozen
5. Its an away game in Eastern Europe in the latter stages of a European competition

You say if we'd lost 1 nil it would have been ok. Why? So they could come to us and put 10 behind the ball and try and defend it. Or so that we lose our unbeaten streak.

Go and look back at our previously glorious European campaigns. We didn't blood kids, we played very functional and often dull football across the back four.

Oh and Wilson is a kid is he not? Plus we took several of our younger players to get them used to the whole European travel scenario. Real life is not like Champ manager you know.
 
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