The rebuild/transfer policy

[bluebell]

Yep this. There is no urgency, the sky is not falling, as some of our more 'emotional' posters would have you believe. This group are good, with blooding new players at an average of two per year, for the next 4-5 years.

Basically looking at the squad we have at least 7, maybe 8, positions covered for the next generation of this team (28, 24, 22, 27, 22, 27, 18, 20, 24, 17) noting that older players can easily play into their mid-30s in some positions (GK & CB and maybe DM for example), and these are already covered with the new contracts, and barring something unforeseen, for the next 5 years. Squad depth within that 5 years is another issue.

I'm assuming that Milner, Ox. Origi, Minamino and Nat will all be gone within the next 12-18 months.

Ali (28) + Kelleher (22) = good for the next 5 years at the very least.

VvD (30) + Matip (30) + Gomez (24) + Konate (22) = good for the next 5 years at the very least.

Robbo (27) + Tsimitas (25) = good for the next 3-4 years.

TAA (22) = clearly we need backup here as Neco W. isn't going to be around for much longer. Likely one of the key positions to address, especially if Trent moves into midfield at some time.

Fabs (27) + Hendo (31) linked here because Hendo is the de facto replacement when Fabs is missing for any reason = Fabs is good for the next 5 years though a replacement for Hendo will be required sooner rather than later (blooding within 2 years, take over in 3).

Thiago (30) + Keita (26) + Elliott (18) + Jones (20) = considering mobility required I'd give Thiago 2-3 seasons tops. So another couple of high quality midfielders are required over the next two seasons.

Firmino (soon to be 30) + Jota (24) + Salah (29) + Mane (29) = Good for the next two seasons but we'll need to address both Salah and Mane in the next 24 months (as in blooding replacements even if they don't relegate them to the bench for another season after that). I'm guessing Bobby will be gone within 2 years but it could be longer if he's happy to accept a bit part. Clearly Gordon is likely to be one of them.

By my reckoning that's maybe 6-7 new players over the next 3-4 years. That isn't a emergency and shows the value of tying down our existing stars with new contracts.

We've lost Gini and Shaq in the MF. We have a fifth of our team who are a constant injury concern (Matip, Ox, Kieta, Gomez and Hendo), we might lose Philips too this summer.
Our strike force is formidable but both Mane and Bobby have shown moments of regression and Div seems happy to collect a paycheque.

Elliott is a wonderful prospect but will only be able to manage a handful of games.
Personally this season I would have liked to have seen an AM and a box-to-box MF coming in

 

[tombrown]

 

[Frogfish]

We've lost Gini and Shaq in the MF. We have a fifth of our team who are a constant injury concern (Matip, Ox, Kieta, Gomez and Hendo), we might lose Philips too this summer.
Our strike force is formidable but both Mane and Bobby have shown moments of regression and Div seems happy to collect a paycheque.

Elliott is a wonderful prospect but will only be able to manage a handful of games.
Personally this season I would have liked to have seen an AM and a box-to-box MF coming in

1/5 of our team? Only 2 of those are guaranteed first teamers. Shaq. hardly ever played and was anonymous most of the time. Phillips has already been replaced by a better player.
Ever heard the saying " Past performance is no predictor of future returns? Injuries happen and will happen again this season. However it's more than odds on we won't see a repeat of last season's perfect storm. Stop wringing your hands.

 

[Hyena]

Shaq. hardly ever played and was anonymous most of the time. Phillips has already been replaced by a better player.
Ever heard the saying " Past performance is no predictor of future returns? It's odds on we won't see a repeat of last season's perfect storm. Stop wringing your hands.

To be fair, past performance is often the only predictor of future returns....

 

[Frogfish]

To be fair, past performance is often the only predictor of future returns....

It's the only one people bet on ... like the 12.30 at Carrick ! Which is why bookies are in business.

 

[moron]

Those of you who argue Thiago is the replacement for Gini - need to take another hard look. I actually think Thiago makes quite a few mistakes defensively in any 90 minute game, and needlessly gives away free kicks. Gini - for all his instructed limitations hardly put a foot wrong in most games. Yes Thiago - great passer, good on the ball, but he needs to also have some movement in midfield. We need to make some signings for midfield - we are just too thin in terms of first team quality. Would love it if we could get any of these two players:

1) Midfield tacklers and move us forward types in Bissouma or Houssem
2) Attack/Wingers either one of Damsgaard / Adama Traore

I mention those players because we have been linked with them in the past and are within our price range because we certainly can't afford the likes of Haarland/Mbappe or any player that the other rich boys want.

 

[King Binny]

Thoughts?



😛

 

[tombrown]

Thoughts?



😛

Someone saying that Liverpool have been blown away in the last 2 years is someone who measures football success by how much money is spent, as opposed to success on the field. He seems to be already extrapolating from the amount of money spent this summer to how the teams will finish next summer. So I look forward to his prediction that Arsenal are nailed on for top 4.

 

[King Binny]

Someone in my timeline just retweet these. 😢

 

[Fallon]

Given his age, how good he is already, the release clause becoming active, and having the coach he'd be most desiring to work with (not to mention out positive net spend)... It'll be a huge disappointment when we aren't in the conversation for Haaland next summer.

 

[keniget]

Yep this. There is no urgency, the sky is not falling, as some of our more 'emotional' posters would have you believe. This group are good, with blooding new players at an average of two per year, for the next 4-5 years.

Basically looking at the squad we have at least 7, maybe 8, positions covered for the next generation of this team (28, 24, 22, 27, 22, 27, 18, 20, 24, 17) noting that older players can easily play into their mid-30s in some positions (GK & CB and maybe DM for example), and these are already covered with the new contracts, and barring something unforeseen, for the next 5 years. Squad depth within that 5 years is another issue.

I'm assuming that Milner, Ox. Origi, Minamino and Nat will all be gone within the next 12-18 months.

Ali (28) + Kelleher (22) = good for the next 5 years at the very least.

VvD (30) + Matip (30) + Gomez (24) + Konate (22) = good for the next 5 years at the very least.

Robbo (27) + Tsimitas (25) = good for the next 3-4 years.

TAA (22) = clearly we need backup here as Neco W. isn't going to be around for much longer. Likely one of the key positions to address, especially if Trent moves into midfield at some time.

Fabs (27) + Hendo (31) linked here because Hendo is the de facto replacement when Fabs is missing for any reason = Fabs is good for the next 5 years though a replacement for Hendo will be required sooner rather than later (blooding within 2 years, take over in 3).

Thiago (30) + Keita (26) + Elliott (18) + Jones (20) = considering mobility required I'd give Thiago 2-3 seasons tops. So another couple of high quality midfielders are required over the next two seasons.

Firmino (soon to be 30) + Jota (24) + Salah (29) + Mane (29) = Good for the next two seasons but we'll need to address both Salah and Mane in the next 24 months (as in blooding replacements even if they don't relegate them to the bench for another season after that). I'm guessing Bobby will be gone within 2 years but it could be longer if he's happy to accept a bit part. Clearly Gordon is likely to be one of them.

By my reckoning that's maybe 6-7 new players over the next 3-4 years. That isn't an emergency and shows the value of tying down our existing stars with new contracts.

The team hasn't gone to shit overnight, of course. We still have a very good team that when in a groove are hard to stop. That being said, I think your assessment is very much on the optimistic side.

It doesn't really account for form / fitness issues that invariably crop up. A couple years ago and you might have said "Firmino good for another X years" based on his age alone but we've witnessed a steady decline in form since then. Mane's form has dropped off a cliff - will he recover it? We just don't know. And that's just two players.

We know Klopp likes a closely knit group - and these guys are - but we also know that a failure to bring in new blood can lead to players getting comfortable and a general staleness.

It's not always about going out specifically to replace a first teamer. It's about bringing in players for the squad that can compete. If a player we already have kicks it up a notch and keeps the new guy out, we win. If the new guy is a star and forces an existing player out the team, we win.

 

[peekay]

The team hasn't gone to shit overnight, of course. We still have a very good team that when in a groove are hard to stop. That being said, I think your assessment is very much on the optimistic side.

It doesn't really account for form / fitness issues that invariably crop up. A couple years ago and you might have said "Firmino good for another X years" based on his age alone but we've witnessed a steady decline in form since then. Mane's form has dropped off a cliff - will he recover it? We just don't know. And that's just two players.

We know Klopp likes a closely knit group - and these guys are - but we also know that a failure to bring in new blood can lead to players getting comfortable and a general staleness.

It's not always about going out specifically to replace a first teamer. It's about bringing in players for the squad that can compete. If a player we already have kicks it up a notch and keeps the new guy out, we win. If the new guy is a star and forces an existing player out the team, we win.

Exactly. At a bare minimum, we need additional competition for Mane and Firmino. Jota is there but we need one more. We will find it difficult against well-organized defenses with either one or both of them playing. It is no longer a temporary dip in form, or COVID-19, or tiredness.

If you watch one of the previous season's top moments of the season or top 20 goals videos, it is obvious how reliant we are on Salah. It was like Allison goal, followed by Salah, Salah, Salah, Salah, Jota, Salah, Salah, Salah. It felt like watching season highlight videos from 2005 to 2007 with Steven Gerrard being everywhere.

Ideally, we need a Gini replacement but that will be asking for too much.

 

[MomoWASright]

Another game where I don’t think we missed Gini.

 

[peekay]

Another game where I don’t think we missed Gini.

We definitely don't miss Gini now but December/January is a different situation.

 

[King Binny]

Someone in my timeline just retweet these. 😢

I reckon he will be writing another such article over the next 1-2 transfer windows...

 

[tomasjj]

I don't think we look weak mentally though.
We can always do with more quality.

 

[StevieM]

I don't think we look weak mentally though.
We can always do with more quality.

I agree, it’s not mentality, it’s more like an inability to adapt and change.

Our wide players cut in, we use full backs for width and we try to thread passes through the central eye of the needle.

Whenever we change players it’s variants of the same tactic - just slightly different skill sets trying to do the same thing.

That’s where we become predictable and an opposition back 5 nullifies most of our attacking patterns of play.

I think we have tweaked our midfield set up this season - feels like a more attacking inverted pyramid midfield 3 - but the balance isn’t there yet - the left AM slot hasn’t been nailed and as good as Harvey’s been, I worry about relying on him for the right attacking spot.

 

[binomial]

Mr James ‘no shit’’ Pearce stating the bleeding obvious.

 

[darkstarexodus]

I agree, it’s not mentality, it’s more like an inability to adapt and change.

Our wide players cut in, we use full backs for width and we try to thread passes through the central eye of the needle.

Whenever we change players it’s variants of the same tactic - just slightly different skill sets trying to do the same thing.

That’s where we become predictable and an opposition back 5 nullifies most of our attacking patterns of play.

I think we have tweaked our midfield set up this season - feels like a more attacking inverted pyramid midfield 3 - but the balance isn’t there yet - the left AM slot hasn’t been nailed and as good as Harvey’s been, I worry about relying on him for the right attacking spot.

I think we've shown an interest in mixing it up, with Trent coming inside and Mo going out wide. But generally agree, if Plan A isn't working, Plan B is to do Plan A but better.

 

[dmishra]

So the major news coming out today is that Michael Edwards is stepping down at the end of this year. Julian Ward likely to take over his role.

 

[bluebell]

So the major news coming out today is that Michael Edwards is stepping down at the end of this year. Julian Ward likely to take over his role.

No nothing about Ward, is he a "Yes Man"?

 

[beejay]

Think positive. Comparing last season's results with this (and Norwich as the best promotion team replacing Fulham as the highest finishing relegated side) then we are SIX points better off!

 

[Halmeister]

Think positive. Comparing last season's results with this (and Norwich as the best promotion team replacing Fulham as the highest finishing relegated side) then we are SIX points better off!

7 actually, since we lost at home to Chelsea last year

 

[Halmeister]

Actually, you're right. It's 6

Fulham away - draw. Norwich away - win. +2
Burnley home - loss. Burnley home - won +3
Chelsea home - loss. Chelsea home - draw +1

Sky is falling. We're shit

 

[bluebell]

Actually, you're right. It's 6

Fulham away - draw. Norwich away - win. +2
Burnley home - loss. Burnley home - won +3
Chelsea home - loss. Chelsea home - draw +1

Sky is falling. We're shit

We're not shit, but I want to be confident we'll be challenging... and I'm not sure we will. I think with the current squad we could be 10+ points behind the eventual winner

 

[SummerOnions]

So the major news coming out today is that Michael Edwards is stepping down at the end of this year. Julian Ward likely to take over his role.

No wonder we haven't signed anyone.

Saving it all for Ward to make his entry into the pantheon in the next transfer windows by pulling off the big Mbappe transfer

 

[King Binny]

Liverpool embracing scavenger status of top dogs

[article]
The reaction to Liverpool’s tribe getting back together again has been somewhat underwhelming. It is lovely to have Virgil Van Dijk back, of course. Still looks like a Rolls Royce revving up to full speed. Joe Gomez? Nice to see him for about a minute v Burnley. Joel Matip? Good gallop while it lasts, but let’s not expect him to jump too many before going lame.

While their rivals have strengthened and flexed their financial muscle with power signings, the narrative is that the Reds have gone down their rabbit hole of tight group depth rather than the (closed shop) bank of FSG. New faces are not the thing these days at Anfield; it’s more a case of trying to recreate existing signings within the camp, trying to resuscitate rusty engines or pick ‘sensational’ youngsters over proven internationals.

As Klopp said at his weekend press conference: “Ox has a dynamic that you cannot buy in the market at the moment.” Don’t laugh. He meant it. Harvey Elliott is old enough to drive a car so he’s old enough to play in Liverpool’s first team. Nobody complained when Michael Owen came along…

Chelsea are riding the wave Liverpool were surfing in 2019 – Champions League and Super Cup winners and ready to go all out to get that title. Manchester United are swinging with old friends and new firepower. Manchester City are gearing up their domestic hoover. It’s not that the Reds are a team of dockers against Monaco yacht-brokers but you get the point; their fuel contains a different energy. Anfield is a fury no-one else possesses. The fortress is weaponised again. But can the same troops hit the bullseye over and over again?

When Liverpool needed to unlock Chelsea on Saturday evening, they ran into the Great Wall. Having knocked out Kevin De Bruyne in Porto, this was bar brawl, rough-house Antonio Rudiger at his best. Chelsea were not backing down. The Reds did not have the quality/creativity/cunning (delete as appropriate) to break through. Did the manager need his glasses to see something else was required?

Klopp loves the hand fight as much as anyone but the worry is that his team are Liverpool Lite. Unable to crush all enemies with superior artillery, he was asked whether there was any worry over the lack of transfer activities: “Being ambitious in this league means you have to be ready to get some knocks, to get some punches here and there, you just have to get up and go again. Obviously at this moment nobody thinks that we are the best team in the world. Good. But we still want to beat the best teams…let’s give it a try.” Give it a try? This was the best team in the world two years ago…

Can you see the dichotomy with restoring Liverpool to their perch when what makes him tick is outmanoeuvring and outwitting those who possess superior resources? Klopp was never interested in being the best team. Only beating the best team. FSG have a ready-made excuse not to invest squillions.

All the value of Klopp’s work – to get Liverpool to this point where fans have turned from doubters to demanders – is being overshadowed by the constant perception at being in the queue at the Lidl supermarket. The other members of the VIP club are maxing out on their luxury credit cards. Is it a fair criticism? Quite possibly. Does it also miss the point of what Klopp’s Liverpool are all about? Quite possibly.

Reds fans have been waiting 30 years for what they wanted. They got it. The sense of joy was tinged with some regret that a global pandemic punctured the roll. Liverpool were a powerhouse back then, having lost two out of 70 league games at one point. Season 2020/21 was the lousiest follow-up since Jaws 2. The Reds had no bite and they certainly didn’t clear the beaches with any big signings during last summer either. There have been rumblings that this is not the behaviour of a title-winning machine.

Keeping up with the Joneses is the compare and contrast model that always leaves you wanting more. And Liverpool fans don’t mean Curtis. Looking over the garden fence at the neighbours won’t help. There are still some gifts within Melwood that haven’t quite made it out of the wrapping paper yet. Thiago anyone? Konate. Even Keita might come good now. Maybe.

Liverpool’s armoury will always be in their collective. To push and press until the bitter end. The worry is that the burden will fall on familiar faces to carry the team up the mountain again. When Dortmund manager JK said: “People have climbed Mount Everest before and had to turn around 10m from the top, but at least they’ve tried.” Is this the spirit that still takes Liverpool past that great wall when bones are creaking? We shall see.
[/article]