The King is Back

[Stulikesdrums]

[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=32892.msg900221#msg900221 date=1246713851]

[/quote]

Rafa : You know Kenny, goatee beards are all the rage these days. You should get one!

 

[reuque]

[quote author=Stu link=topic=32892.msg900227#msg900227 date=1246714290]
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=32892.msg900221#msg900221 date=1246713851]

[/quote]

Rafa : You know Kenny, goatee beards are all the rage these days. You should get one!
[/quote]

Didnt know Rafa went to work in his pajamas.

 

[Jürgen4PM]

[quote author=reuque link=topic=32892.msg900519#msg900519 date=1246778502]
[quote author=Stu link=topic=32892.msg900227#msg900227 date=1246714290]
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=32892.msg900221#msg900221 date=1246713851]

[/quote]

Rafa : You know Kenny, goatee beards are all the rage these days. You should get one!
[/quote]

Didnt know Rafa went to work in his pajamas.
[/quote]

Apparently he keeps a pair in his office, along with a pull out bed. Our Rafa works long hours.

 

[mark1975]

Great to see Kenny back, I'm not sure he'd have ever made a great manager had he returned, I think his bottle goes too easily at times, but anyway, great player, great bloke and a big asset to the club.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=32892.msg900561#msg900561 date=1246784890]
Great to see Kenny back, I'm not sure he'd have ever made a great manager had he returned, I think his bottle goes too easily at times, but anyway, great player, great bloke and a big asset to the club.
[/quote]

c'mon mark if anyone has bottle it's kenny. no one could blame kenny for leaving in the early 90's, and I chose to ignore what happended at n'castle because that club is a joke.

 

[Portly]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=32892.msg900563#msg900563 date=1246785584]
c'mon mark if anyone has bottle it's kenny. no one could blame kenny for leaving in the early 90's, and I chose to ignore what happended at n'castle because that club is a joke.
[/quote]

Don't forget Celtic, where Kenny pushed John Barnes into the firing line!!

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Portly link=topic=32892.msg900589#msg900589 date=1246787166]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=32892.msg900563#msg900563 date=1246785584]
c'mon mark if anyone has bottle it's kenny. no one could blame kenny for leaving in the early 90's, and I chose to ignore what happended at n'castle because that club is a joke.
[/quote]

Don't forget Celtic, where Kenny pushed John Barnes into the firing line!!
[/quote]

digger's a big lad (figuratively and literally speaking) he can take it.

 

[gkmacca]

McParland looks a bit pervy. Not an ideal look for someone in charge of kiddies. And he also looks as though he's standing the other side of a spy hole. Moving on...

 

[Squiggles]

It's good to see a former legend working with the club again.

I'm not expecting miracles though, nor any great change for that matter.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg898996#msg898996 date=1246562537]
Excellent news. This could be as important a signing as any we make this summer.
[/quote]

Erm, no.

It's feelgood and all that jazz, but let's call a spade a spade here - it's 'jobs for the boys'. Besides, The King's never away from the club in the first place. The difference is now he's getting paid for it.

 

[Judge Jules]

Disagree. Like Rafa or loathe him, he's simply not someone who'll hand out sinecures and, as for the feelgood factor, I rate the importance of that a good deal more highly than you do. I'm sure the King was often around anyhow, but I'm equally sure he'll have held back from offering too much in the way of input so as not to get in the way. Now that he's actually being paid to have an input, he can really get involved. This could affect the whole club for the better.

 

[FoxForceFive]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=32892.msg900988#msg900988 date=1246853520]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg898996#msg898996 date=1246562537]
Excellent news. This could be as important a signing as any we make this summer.
[/quote]

Erm, no.

It's feelgood and all that jazz, but let's call a spade a spade here - it's 'jobs for the boys'. Besides, The King's never away from the club in the first place. The difference is now he's getting paid for it.

[/quote]

V.true.

I've a feeling this is payback for the unequivocal, very vocal support he has given Rafa, which has played no small part in shaping the majority of fans opinion in him, & as such helped keep him employed.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901044#msg901044 date=1246869310]
Disagree. Like Rafa or loathe him, he's simply not someone who'll hand out sinecures and, as for the feelgood factor, I rate the importance of that a good deal more highly than you do. I'm sure the King was often around anyhow, but I'm equally sure he'll have held back from offering too much in the way of input so as not to get in the way. Now that he's actually being paid to have an input, he can really get involved. This could affect the whole club for the better.
[/quote]

Fowler?

 

[Richey]

Its great to see Kenny back at the club. The guy is obviously a legend and belongs at Liverpool.

However, I have a few concerns about it.

On the academy side there have always been problems between the academy and the manager. Not just under Benitez but also under Houllier. Will it be any different under Kenny?

His role seems quite vague too. I wonder what Benitez believes it to be? We have got the impression in the past that Benitez is something of a control freak.
Will he actually let Kenny do anything?

Also, not a season goes by without sections of the fans questionning some of Benitez's more bizarre decisions. He always rides the storm out to be fair to him. But now there will be someone else on the staff who will ALWAYS have the love of the fans on his side. If things start to go wrong will Benitez just want to use Kenny as a 'shield'? Will Kenny accept this?
Benitez doesn't always seem like the easiest person to work with.

Obviously this could be great move if everyone knows their position and what they have to do but I would really really hate for a situation to arise where Kenny Dalglish's relationship with the club was soured

 

[Judge Jules]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901071#msg901071 date=1246871693]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901044#msg901044 date=1246869310]
Disagree.  Like Rafa or loathe him, he's simply not someone who'll hand out sinecures and, as for the feelgood factor, I rate the importance of that a good deal more highly than you do.  I'm sure the King was often around anyhow, but I'm equally sure he'll have held back from offering too much in the way of input so as not to get in the way.  Now that he's actually being paid to have an input, he can really get involved.  This could affect the whole club for the better.
[/quote]

Fowler?
[/quote]

Not in my book, no.  We needed another striker option, we weren't flush with money, Robbie was free and obv.he knew the club from top to bottom already.  There was certainly a feelgood factor involved but I don't believe the cold calculator that is Rafael Benitez would have signed him just for that.  For a while (admittedly not a long while, but still) the signing paid off reasonably well too.  We were in a goal drought at the time, Robbie broke it with a nifty header against Fulham, we won that game 5-0 and we went on to score for fun in the last few games of the season.

 

[Richey]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901148#msg901148 date=1246882926]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901071#msg901071 date=1246871693]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901044#msg901044 date=1246869310]
Disagree. Like Rafa or loathe him, he's simply not someone who'll hand out sinecures and, as for the feelgood factor, I rate the importance of that a good deal more highly than you do. I'm sure the King was often around anyhow, but I'm equally sure he'll have held back from offering too much in the way of input so as not to get in the way. Now that he's actually being paid to have an input, he can really get involved. This could affect the whole club for the better.
[/quote]

Fowler?
[/quote]

Not in my book, no. We needed another striker option, we weren't flush with money, Robbie was free and obv.he knew the club from top to bottom already. There was certainly a feelgood factor involved but I don't believe the cold calculator that is Rafael Benitez would have signed him just for that. For a while (admittedly not a long while, but still) the signing paid off reasonably well too. We were in a goal drought at the time, Robbie broke it with a nifty header against Fulham, we won that game 5-0 and we went on to score for fun in the last few games of the season.
[/quote]

I agree. Obviously noone really expected the signing of Fowler to be anything but a back up as he was clearly finished at the top level but it gave us a chance to rest other players with one eye on the FA Cup while still maintaining our challenge for third place, which we achieved.

He didn't exactly do a lot the following season but at the time we signed him he did get a few important goals. In a couple of games he scored the only goal of the game. Looking back, if only for that short period he was one of our better free signings!

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901148#msg901148 date=1246882926]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901071#msg901071 date=1246871693]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901044#msg901044 date=1246869310]
Disagree. Like Rafa or loathe him, he's simply not someone who'll hand out sinecures and, as for the feelgood factor, I rate the importance of that a good deal more highly than you do. I'm sure the King was often around anyhow, but I'm equally sure he'll have held back from offering too much in the way of input so as not to get in the way. Now that he's actually being paid to have an input, he can really get involved. This could affect the whole club for the better.
[/quote]

Fowler?
[/quote]

Not in my book, no. We needed another striker option, we weren't flush with money, Robbie was free and obv.he knew the club from top to bottom already. There was certainly a feelgood factor involved but I don't believe the cold calculator that is Rafael Benitez would have signed him just for that. For a while (admittedly not a long while, but still) the signing paid off reasonably well too. We were in a goal drought at the time, Robbie broke it with a nifty header against Fulham, we won that game 5-0 and we went on to score for fun in the last few games of the season.
[/quote]

Would Rafa have signed Fowler if he wasn't a Liverpool legend?

 

[Judge Jules]

Quite possibly, considering we needed someone proven to sign on the cheap. It was no bigger a risk than signing the Crow for example.

 

[leftpeg]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901181#msg901181 date=1246885294]
Quite possibly, considering we needed someone proven to sign on the cheap. [/quote]

Wrong.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=32892.msg901181#msg901181 date=1246885294]
Quite possibly, considering we needed someone proven to sign on the cheap. It was no bigger a risk than signing the Crow for example.
[/quote]

*sigh*

God forbid you admit to anything, right?

 

[Judge Jules]

Look who's talking here. You're the one who seems to think Rafa's the kind of manager who would sign a player purely on the basis of his past connection with the club.

 

[Richey]

Strictly speaking I doubt he would have signed him if he wasn't a Liverpool legend, because he wouldn't have met him. I believe the story goes though that Fowler was signed after he and Benitez met and spoke after Istanbul. Fowler impressed Benitez so when we needed a cheap striker later the following season he turned to him.
If Fowler hadn't been a Liverpool legend their paths wouldn't have crossed but its not quite the same as just being a PR stunt.

Benitez is so serious about on the field activities I don't actually think he would have someone in the playing squad for that reason.

 

[Avmenon]

[quote author=Richey link=topic=32892.msg901193#msg901193 date=1246886020]
Strictly speaking I doubt he would have signed him if he wasn't a Liverpool legend, because he wouldn't have met him. I believe the story goes though that Fowler was signed after he and Benitez met and spoke after Istanbul. Fowler impressed Benitez so when we needed a cheap striker later the following season he turned to him.
If Fowler hadn't been a Liverpool legend their paths wouldn't have crossed but its not quite the same as just being a PR stunt.

Benitez is so serious about on the field activities I don't actually think he would have someone in the playing squad for that reason.

[/quote]

Agreed.

I think keni and JJ are right.

Fowler was NOT a PR stunt; it was a low risk option which might (and did) pay off.

Kenny is basically a 'feelgood' addition.

 

[keniget]

Fowler was a washed up, fat, unfit has-been when we signed him.

No top European club would've taken him at that point and after doing well for us, he went to Cardiff and then to the Australian league.

To say he was the same sort of signing as Voronin, a current International for a reasonable side and a first choice player for another reasonable'ish side, is laughable and just plain 'ol wrong.

 

[Avmenon]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901233#msg901233 date=1246891129]
Fowler was a washed up, fat, unfit has-been when we signed him.

No top European club would've taken him at that point and after doing well for us, he went to Cardiff and then to the Australian league.

To say he was the same sort of signing as Voronin, a current International for a reasonable side and a first choice player for another reasonable'ish side, is laughable and just plain 'ol wrong.
[/quote]

So your opinion is that Benitez wanted Fowler as just some sort of sentimental gesture to the long-suffering fans aching to see the prodigal son return?

His treatment of other Liverpool players doesn't really bear ths out.

 

[koze]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901233#msg901233 date=1246891129]
Fowler was a washed up, fat, unfit has-been when we signed him.

No top European club would've taken him at that point and after doing well for us, he went to Cardiff and then to the Australian league.

To say he was the same sort of signing as Voronin, a current International for a reasonable side and a first choice player for another reasonable'ish side, is laughable and just plain 'ol wrong.
[/quote]

Tbf, Voronin is fat too.

I hope he goes to Cardiff and then to A league, the shit cunt.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=32892.msg901237#msg901237 date=1246891467]
[quote author=keniget link=topic=32892.msg901233#msg901233 date=1246891129]
Fowler was a washed up, fat, unfit has-been when we signed him.

No top European club would've taken him at that point and after doing well for us, he went to Cardiff and then to the Australian league.

To say he was the same sort of signing as Voronin, a current International for a reasonable side and a first choice player for another reasonable'ish side, is laughable and just plain 'ol wrong.
[/quote]

So your opinion is that Benitez wanted Fowler as just some sort of sentimental gesture to the long-suffering fans aching to see the prodigal son return?

His treatment of other Liverpool players doesn't really bear ths out.
[/quote]

Before anything, I'm addressing the discussion with JJ:

1. There is no way we would've signed Fowler had he not been a Liverpool legend.

2. It's laughable to put that transfer alongside Voronin's.

Do you disagree with those two points?

If not, I'll address yours.

 

[Avmenon]

Disagree with 1.

Agree with 2 in that they're not that comparable.

Not exactly 'laughable' tho, keni.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=32892.msg901241#msg901241 date=1246891990]
Disagree with 1.

Agree with 2 in that they're not that comparable.

Not exactly 'laughable' tho, keni.
[/quote]

Dunno what to say then... you're mad as well.

 

[Avmenon]

Meh.

I disagree with 1 because your insinuation is that Fowler was brought in purely for the 'feelgood' factor because he was a Liverpool legend.

Benitez could care less about that on the pitch; he was free, cheap wages, and there weren't many options available in January.

I remember reading about how Benitez was looking for a cheap option who was a good finisher.

He was worth a gamble, which must have been paramount in Rafa's mind.

Yes, the feelgood factor was obviously present, and it undoubtedly had a hand in it.

But not as completely as you seem to suggest.

Considering how callously he's treated many players whom we've all respected, I think it's a bit fanciful to insist that we brought in Fowler because Rafa's some sort of a romantic at heart.