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The end is nigh

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I've probably been one of the only (if not *the* only) supporters of Insua this season and have said on a number of occasions that the stick he's gotten is unfair, however I do have to say that Insua has shown a fair bit of naivety in his defending this season, which has been disappointing to see.

You can of course point to the fact that Johnson has the far more dependable Kuyt ahead of him, whilst Insua has had to contend with the disappearing act of Yossi at LW, however even with that in mind Johnson has been better to the point where I wouldn't bother making a comparison. And when you also consider that Johnson has put in a number of truly stellar attacking performances, it's hardly surprising that people are less inclined to have a go.

You almost seem intent to use his price tag as a stick to beat him with and that's just as unfair as tearing down a young player just making the step up to the first team.
 
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.



Farky, i'm sorry but the S*n??
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998865#msg998865 date=1259184093]
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.



Farky, i'm sorry but the S*n??
[/quote]

I didn't post the quote, I just showed you how to google for it, rather than moaning about there not being a source. Now you'll now how to search for things in the future.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998865#msg998865 date=1259184093]
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.
[/quote]

It took Alves at least 10 games or so to really settle at Barca and that was in a very settled side on the top of their game. Johnson has had a good start to his Liverpool career in what have been troubled times. To judge him as you are is absurd, it really is.

We paid over the odds because we are lacking English players in our squad and the new rules are putting pressure on us to do something about that. Johnson was one of the few available players of sufficient quality we could buy for a position that needed filling. And on top of that, as a club without massive amounts of money we couldn't afford to let Arbeloa go on a free, which he would've done had we not have sold him to Madrid in the summer.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998865#msg998865 date=1259184093]
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.



Farky, i'm sorry but the S*n??
[/quote]

There, now the quote thing is right on this post. happy?

How can you begin to say that because i player comes out and says he wants to sign a new contract means he does. It's a playing driving up the price for other clubs to offer him. Owen is a prime example. A fair represetation? maybe not, but it's pig ignorant to think that players don't do it. Now whilst the novelty of you being the new glock is still here i'm not going to post anything particularly complicated.
If you're basing your "facts" about him wanting a new contract on the press, why is another piece of press saying the opposite wrong? If google found the story on the S**'s site, it's probably been taken from Marca, or another one of the spanish rags that like to whip up a frenzy. Same as the stories of him askign for a new contract
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=37418.msg998868#msg998868 date=1259184430]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998865#msg998865 date=1259184093]
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.
[/quote]

It took Alves at least 10 games or so to really settle at Barca and that was in a very settled side on the top of their game. Johnson has had a good start to his Liverpool career in what have been troubled times. To judge him as you are is absurd, it really is.

We paid over the odds because we are lacking English players in our squad and the new rules are putting pressure on us to do something about that. Johnson was one of the few available players of sufficient quality we could buy for a position that needed filling. And on top of that, had we have kept for a club without massive amounts of money, we couldn't afford to let Arbeloa go on a free, which he would've done had we not have sold him to Madrid in the summer.
[/quote]

So we need to spend 17million just because he was English?? We couldn't have just promoted Kelly to the first team squad and then moved for well priced young english talents like Delph or Sturridge?.

We need not need a rightback. Especially not a 17million one that can't defend.
 
[quote author=Fabio Alrighty-o link=topic=37418.msg998869#msg998869 date=1259184477]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998865#msg998865 date=1259184093]
Not when we don't have massive amounts of money to be throwing around and had very specific needs last summer. Johnson was a player we did not need. At a price that even Rafa admitted was too much. Give me Arbeloa/Kjaer/Krancjar anyday.

If Johnson was playing like a 17million right back it would be one thing. But he's not.

As for his performances, he's great going forward. On the ball he's quick, strong, beats his man and gets to the byline or into the box constantly but my problem with him is that he's had so many chances to create goals and score goals and he hasn't.



Farky, i'm sorry but the S*n??
[/quote]

There, now the quote thing is right on this post. happy?

How can you begin to say that because i player comes out and says he wants to sign a new contract means he does. It's a playing driving up the price for other clubs to offer him. Owen is a prime example. A fair represetation? maybe not, but it's pig ignorant to think that players don't do it. Now whilst the novelty of you being the new glock is still here i'm not going to post anything particularly complicated.
If you're basing your "facts" about him wanting a new contract on the press, why is another piece of press saying the opposite wrong? If google found the story on the S**'s site, it's probably been taken from Marca, or another one of the spanish rags that like to whip up a frenzy. Same as the stories of him askign for a new contract
[/quote]

Well since he said he wanted a new contract in a televised interview i think it's a bit more trust-worthy than a lie made up by the S*n.

Michael Owen has shown his true colours in the last 6 months. Hence he should never EVER be used as an example for anything Liverpool related again.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]


It's not my opinion that Arbeloa wanted to stay and then left because he'd been replaced. It is a fact.
[/quote]

Well strictly speaking it is your opinion isn't it? Since he hasn't publically said as much and Arbeloa himself hasn't told you personally.
 
And have Kelly and Insua as our first choice fullbacks?

Not a chance. Our squad is lacking dependable senior players as it is. I advocated Kelly as backup at CB as opposed to signing the Greek or another random CB, however it'd be lunacy to leave ourselves with only one out and out RB in Degen for a season.

As far as Sturridge goes, he's another name I put forward over the last year or so, but he wanted 70K+ and again, as a club without massive amounts of dosh, we were never going to be able to afford that.

And you're wrong about Johnson's defending, but we're not going to agree on this, so good night to you.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]
I'm only using Insua as a basis because he has been roundly criticised. He's no worse than Johnson defensively and produced more in attack. Johnson is clearly a better player but he has not been all that much better than insua this year, yet Insua gets ripped and Johnson gets praised to the sky.


[/quote]

Who ? Insua ?

Surely not.
 
[quote author=Richey link=topic=37418.msg998882#msg998882 date=1259184845]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]


It's not my opinion that Arbeloa wanted to stay and then left because he'd been replaced. It is a fact.
[/quote]

Well strictly speaking it is your opinion isn't it? Since he hasn't publically said as much and Arbeloa himself hasn't told you personally.


[/quote]

He did publicly say he wanted to stay and he didn't ask for a transfer AFTER Glen Johnson was signed. Hence. Fact.
 
[quote author=themn link=topic=37418.msg998885#msg998885 date=1259184883]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]
I'm only using Insua as a basis because he has been roundly criticised. He's no worse than Johnson defensively and produced more in attack. Johnson is clearly a better player but he has not been all that much better than insua this year, yet Insua gets ripped and Johnson gets praised to the sky.


[/quote]

Who ? Insua ?

Surely not.
[/quote]

1 goals and 3 assists = 4 goals from Insua

2 goals and 1 assist = 3 goals from Johnson. So yes.
 
[quote author=keniget link=topic=37418.msg998884#msg998884 date=1259184861]
And have Kelly and Insua as our first choice fullbacks?

Not a chance. Our squad is lacking dependable senior players as it is. I advocated Kelly as backup at CB as opposed to signing the Greek or another random CB, however it'd be lunacy to leave ourselves with only one out and out RB in Degen for a season.

As far as Sturridge goes, he's another name I put forward over the last year or so, but he wanted 70K+ and again, as a club without massive amounts of dosh, we were never going to be able to afford that.

And you're wrong about Johnson's defending, but we're not going to agree on this, so good night to you.

[/quote]

ARBELOA HAD ONE YEAR LEFT. We could have kept him even without a new contract. Had him stay at RB for a year until Kelly was ready to assume the mantle of starting RB. Or simply signed a rightback next summer.

Sturridge wanted 70k to stay at City, he signed for Chelski for less than half of it.

And no, i'm right about his defending. It's plain for everyone to see. You might just want to remove the tinted glasses.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998888#msg998888 date=1259184964]
[quote author=themn link=topic=37418.msg998885#msg998885 date=1259184883]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]
I'm only using Insua as a basis because he has been roundly criticised. He's no worse than Johnson defensively and produced more in attack. Johnson is clearly a better player but he has not been all that much better than insua this year, yet Insua gets ripped and Johnson gets praised to the sky.


[/quote]

Who ? Insua ?

Surely not.
[/quote]

1 goals and 3 assists = 4 goals from Insua

2 goals and 1 assist = 3 goals from Johnson. So yes.
[/quote]

Can some fact bod get on this because it can NOT be right.
 
So we took the opportunity to make some money on someone who wanted out and would have gone for free.

The club should have got him on a longer contract, but at the point where he has 1 year left, a club has very little leverage in the situation. The player clearly wanted to go, a club clearly wanted him, and we needed to sell him if we wanted any return.
 
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=37418.msg998898#msg998898 date=1259185357]
So we took the opportunity to make some money on someone who wanted out and would have gone for free.

The club should have got him on a longer contract, but at the point where he has 1 year left, a club has very little leverage in the situation. The player clearly wanted to go, a club clearly wanted him, and we needed to sell him if we wanted any return.
[/quote]

He didn't want to go until AFTER Rafa signed Johnson.

You lot aren't very good at reading are you?
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998900#msg998900 date=1259185434]
[quote author=Farkmaster link=topic=37418.msg998898#msg998898 date=1259185357]
So we took the opportunity to make some money on someone who wanted out and would have gone for free.

The club should have got him on a longer contract, but at the point where he has 1 year left, a club has very little leverage in the situation. The player clearly wanted to go, a club clearly wanted him, and we needed to sell him if we wanted any return.
[/quote]

He didn't want to go until AFTER Rafa signed Johnson.

You lot aren't very good at reading are you?
[/quote]

Reading your unsubstantiated bare assertions with the word fact sprinkled in?

No, you're right, your position makes so much sense, I'm sure he wanted to stay at liverpool, rather than go to his home country the year before a world cup and be part of one of the most decadent, glamourous, hyped, rebuilding projects ever.

Arbeloa's hints that he was going, when his agent was having contact in Madrid, were concurrent with our dealings with Johnson. This is how virtually every replacement transfer is conducted.
 
HE SAID, IN A TELEVISED INTERVIEW, THAT HE WANTED TO STAY.

HE ONLY ASKED TO LEAVE AFTER RAFA BOUGHT A REPLACEMENT FOR HIM.


Your claims are based on an article from the s*n.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998886#msg998886 date=1259184912]
[quote author=Richey link=topic=37418.msg998882#msg998882 date=1259184845]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]


It's not my opinion that Arbeloa wanted to stay and then left because he'd been replaced. It is a fact.
[/quote]

Well strictly speaking it is your opinion isn't it? Since he hasn't publically said as much and Arbeloa himself hasn't told you personally.


[/quote]

He did publicly say he wanted to stay and he didn't ask for a transfer AFTER Glen Johnson was signed. Hence. Fact.
[/quote]

I'm not saying you are wrong, because I don't know. Yet neither do you. Presenting opinion as fact hardly helps your credibility.

For the record I think Johnson is a decent right back signed for an absurd amount but in a team doing well he would do very well and would definately be an improvement on Arbeloa. But then I thought Arbeloa was overrated anyway.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998906#msg998906 date=1259185614]
HE SAID, IN A TELEVISED INTERVIEW, THAT HE WANTED TO STAY.

HE ONLY ASKED TO LEAVE AFTER RAFA BOUGHT A REPLACEMENT FOR HIM.


Your claims are based on an article from the s*n.


[/quote]

Hmmm...source ?
 
I do know that he said he wanted to stay. I say him say it. I also know he only asked for a transfer after Johnson was signed because there's a thing called time. And unless Arbeloa has a time machine, he made his request after Johnson was signed.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998707#msg998707 date=1259173530]
You seem to be obsessed with people living with their parents. I would hazard a guess that it is in fact you who lives with their mother.

And stop trying to become a spokeman for everyone else.

[/quote]

He's allowed to speak for me on this one though, cos I thought you were/are a bellend too.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998637#msg998637 date=1259166635]
Until February of last season we were a boring defensive team. [/quote]

What a load of shite.
 
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998915#msg998915 date=1259185912]
I do know that he said he wanted to stay. I say him say it. I also know he only asked for a transfer after Johnson was signed because there's a thing called time. And unless Arbeloa has a time machine, he made his request after Johnson was signed.
[/quote]

Source ?
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=37418.msg998918#msg998918 date=1259185996]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998707#msg998707 date=1259173530]
You seem to be obsessed with people living with their parents. I would hazard a guess that it is in fact you who lives with their mother.

And stop trying to become a spokeman for everyone else.

[/quote]

He's allowed to speak for me on this one though, cos I thought you were/are a bellend too.
[/quote]

Baaa, I mean, seconded !
 
[quote author=themn link=topic=37418.msg998895#msg998895 date=1259185249]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998888#msg998888 date=1259184964]
[quote author=themn link=topic=37418.msg998885#msg998885 date=1259184883]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998846#msg998846 date=1259183173]
I'm only using Insua as a basis because he has been roundly criticised. He's no worse than Johnson defensively and produced more in attack. Johnson is clearly a better player but he has not been all that much better than insua this year, yet Insua gets ripped and Johnson gets praised to the sky.


[/quote]

Who ? Insua ?

Surely not.
[/quote]

1 goals and 3 assists = 4 goals from Insua

2 goals and 1 assist = 3 goals from Johnson. So yes.
[/quote]

Can some fact bod get on this because it can NOT be right.
[/quote]

These are the leauge stats for both players

Insua goals 0 assists 3
Johnson Goals 2 Assists 3
 
[quote author=themn link=topic=37418.msg998914#msg998914 date=1259185893]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998906#msg998906 date=1259185614]
HE SAID, IN A TELEVISED INTERVIEW, THAT HE WANTED TO STAY.

HE ONLY ASKED TO LEAVE AFTER RAFA BOUGHT A REPLACEMENT FOR HIM.


Your claims are based on an article from the s*n.


[/quote]

Hmmm...source ?
[/quote]

Perhaps he didn't even ask to leave.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1201600/Liverpool-ready-offload-Alvaro-Arbeloa-3-5m-Real-Madrid-deal.html
 
[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=37418.msg998919#msg998919 date=1259185999]
[quote author=Doc_Rule link=topic=37418.msg998637#msg998637 date=1259166635]
Until February of last season we were a boring defensive team. [/quote]

What a load of shite.
[/quote]

No, it's true. Anyone who actually watched us play knows it.
 
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