Squad Next Season

[hamstrung_pigeon]

Oh, and for what it's worth, this is probably a bit of a wet blanket, but Dortmund's defence is quite the story of mean reversion. See, for 3 out of 4 seasons before Klopp joined, they averaged 43 goals conceded. In 07/08, right before Klopp arrived, they had an awful season - an exceptionally bad season defensively you could say - and finished with 62 goals allowed. Here's the full list of before / afters:

03/04: 48
04/05: 44
05/06: 42
06/07: 43
07/08: 62 !!!
08/09: 37 << Klopp's first season... immediate improvement (against a shit base yeah, but also against the previous average of 43 in the 3 seasons prior to 07/08)
09/10: 43 << wait... so they didn't improve... damn?
10/11: 22 << WTF... champions, and a massive improvement... exception perhaps?
11/12: 25 << boom... maybe not, real deal, baby!
12/13: 42 << da faq!?
13/14: 38 << better, but still... 10/11 and 11/12 now look like exceptions
14/15: 43 << woah and woe

13/14 and 14/15 were seasons crippled by injuries though, but 12/13 is a bit odd. Didn't and don't follow Dortmund so I don't know what happened - I usually just find numbers and read some bones.

Now, on the other hand, the offensive side is a different story.
03/04: 59
04/05: 47
05/06: 45
06/07: 41
07/08: 50
08/09: 60 << Klopp's 1st season
09/10: 54
10/11: 67
11/12: 80
12/13: 81
13/14: 80
14/15: 47 << injuries

As you can see, sustained improvement from 08/09, even given the somewhat dull 09/10, and then consistency from 11/12 to 13/14. 14/15 was a hell season with injuries, and Klopp's departure came at the end of it of course.

 

[Modo]

Scorch the earth.

I think a clear out is in order. I'm tired of seeing the same underachieving players getting chance after chance and not manage to reach the standard that is required of them.

It's very unlike Klopp to totally change a squad during a transfer window, but I think our squad needs it.
Let him build HIS team.

We can probably generate around £100 million in sales, which is enough for 3-4 top notch German players.
Gomez, Ings, Markovic are like new signings.

If Caulker proves himself, buy him. We'll get him for like £5-6 million.

 

[JohnnyRocket]

Found an applicable thread to post this.

After every game I get more and more concerned about just how much we have to fix in this squad. I can't think of a time in my entire LFC watching life (back to 97 or so) that so much is needed. Even under Hodgson we had a spine of Reina, Carra, Gerrard and Torres.

I keep reading on how unhealthy it is to change too many player in one season, but honestly a mass overhaul would make me extremely happy. There's some dead wood that we just have to be rid of.

Think about it, this is what we desperately need. Very few of these positions can wait too long:

Goalkeeper - enough said
Centre Back - one that can preferably fucking calm things down, organise a defense and not shit themsleves when defending a lead at home to Sunderland
Left Back – Moreno has been awful, Smith is a kid, Flanagan is right footed. This is one position we could possibly put on hold and hope one of these three come good.
DM – Lucas isn’t good enough to be first choice. I have major doubts about Can’s ability to play there. This is a position that’s needed filling for 3 or 4 years, but we’ve done nothing.
Pacey winger – All our attaking mids are one paced, except for Ibe, who hasn’t exactly set the world alight.
Striker – We desperately need quality here. Once we do and Firmino can play second striker it will make a world of difference.

So that leaves this:

(NEW)

Clyne Skrtel/Lovren (NEW) (NEW)

Henderson (NEW)

(NEW) Firmino Coutinho

(NEW)


That’s 6 position’s we’re desperately short of quality in.

On top of that, add FSG’s ultra conservative approach of one out – one in, and probably a ridiculous net spend target of 25 mil, and it all looks a bit depressing doesn’t it. We don’t even have anyone to sell for 50 – 60 mil.

 

[Nir.Barak]

Agree wholeheartedly. Looking at the squad there are no players other than the 5 you stated who are worth of a first team spot.

Preferably we'd also get shot of most of this squad so the losing mentality won't rub off on the new players Kloop brings in.

 

[mom]

Don't think for a second that lallana will be going anywhere. Klopp seems to have him as one of the first names on the sheet.

 

[Piedro]

I've said this in the pub to the lads the other day, I'd literally keep 9 players from the whole squad. The rest can be sold.

Let's rip it up and start again. So next season is gonna be shite. Ah well. Not like we aren't used to it.

Keep the below:

Lovren
Clyne
Flanagan
Can
Henderson
Coutinho
Firmino
Milner
Ings

 

[keniget]

The worst thing we can do is have another summer where we replace half the starting line-up. It's not like we can't see any light at the end of the tunnel with this group of players. In most games we've played, we've played well enough apart from the fact that our goalkeeper keeps sabotaging our efforts and we lack goal threat.

So that's where we need to start. Goalkeeper is our number one priority. Put a decent goalkeeper in yesterday's lineup and we'd have had 3pts. Ditto in the Arsenal game and probably a few others.

Next up, we need a top class pacey attacker, as highlighted. We're a team full of players that want to play a ball in for someone to run onto and nobody to make those runs.

Those two players, this season, would've seen us in the mix for a top 4 spot.

Matip may be coming on a free to replace one of our centre-backs and then we can decide what to do about the midfield area - we've got that young guy we bought in Jan coming in too.

 

[Oncy]

I've said this in the pub to the lads the other day, I'd literally keep 9 players from the whole squad. The rest can be sold.

Let's rip it up and start again. So next season is gonna be shite. Ah well. Not like we aren't used to it.

Keep the below:

Lovren
Clyne
Flanagan
Can
Henderson
Coutinho
Firmino
Milner
Ings

Agree pretty much.
Id be keen to keep Ibe as he is still very young and raw also I think id keep Skrtel. If you look whats happened since he has been out its clear how much better he is than the rest of the shit make him look.

 

[Piedro]

Sorry yeah I forgot about Ibe. Make it 10.

 

[Nir.Barak]

The worst thing we can do is have another summer where we replace half the starting line-up. It's not like we can't see any light at the end of the tunnel with this group of players. In most games we've played, we've played well enough apart from the fact that our goalkeeper keeps sabotaging our efforts and we lack goal threat.

So that's where we need to start. Goalkeeper is our number one priority. Put a decent goalkeeper in yesterday's lineup and we'd have had 3pts. Ditto in the Arsenal game and probably a few others.

Next up, we need a top class pacey attacker, as highlighted. We're a team full of players that want to play a ball in for someone to run onto and nobody to make those runs.

Those two players, this season, would've seen us in the mix for a top 4 spot.

Matip may be coming on a free to replace one of our centre-backs and then we can decide what to do about the midfield area - we've got that young guy we bought in Jan coming in too.

It's not replacing for the sake of replacing though.
Okay you put in Matip, do you have any confidence in whoever we put next to him? and Skrtel is starting to give in to age mind you.

Next you got our midfield. Hendo is the only one up to standard, and even if you like Can it's painfully obvious this role is too much too soon for him, he's young and should be a substitute at max. So you need 2 more players there.

And as you said we need a striker obviously.

So that is 6 new players to the first 11, including Matip. There's no escaping it.

 

[JohnnyRocket]

I've said this in the pub to the lads the other day, I'd literally keep 9 players from the whole squad. The rest can be sold.

Let's rip it up and start again. So next season is gonna be shite. Ah well. Not like we aren't used to it.

Keep the below:

Lovren
Clyne
Flanagan
Can
Henderson
Coutinho
Firmino
Milner
Ings

Allen should stick around as a squad player. Very handy to have around.

 

[Piedro]

Hmmmmm.

He's done well the last couple of weeks but he's not good enough for where we want to be.

 

[leftpeg]

I've said this in the pub to the lads the other day, I'd literally keep 9 players from the whole squad. The rest can be sold.

Let's rip it up and start again. So next season is gonna be shite. Ah well. Not like we aren't used to it.

Keep the below:

Lovren
Clyne
Flanagan
Can
Henderson
Coutinho
Firmino
Milner
Ings

Yep, that's about it...with Ibe as you said later.

 

[Fabio]

Hmmmmm.

He's done well the last couple of weeks but he's not good enough for where we want to be.

He's good enough for where we are though.

Sadly we're not enough of a draw for players to come and sit on the bench. Allen is more than good enough as back up

 

[hmmmmm1]

Dont think it is a massive rebuild. Need to add 2/3 quality players into the spine of the team

 

[Markeh]

You throw Cech and a Hyypia type into this side and we challenge for top 4.

Add an Alonso with a half decent striker and we could be close to the league.

We just dont have the 2,3,4 top players every top side has, we lose them when we have them. Sturridge is probably one when fit.

 

[leftpeg]

You throw Cech and a Hyypia type into this side and we challenge for top 4.

Add an Alonso with a half decent striker and we could be close to the league.

So you've added three world class players...now all we need are fit and reliable goalscorers. Hey this is easy.

 

[Piedro]

Dont think it is a massive rebuild. Need to add 2/3 quality players into the spine of the team

We say that every year. Final piece in the jigsaw and all that.

 

[Fabio]

Anyone who thinks we don't need a massive rebuild, and expects us to challenge for top 4 next year, is on crack

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Anyone who thinks we don't need a massive rebuild, and expects us to challenge for top 4 next year, is on crack

Well, you told me I should try it ... and we wll win the league next year.

Remember this Fabio - I am a fucking prophet.
OK? OK.

FACT

Over n out,
MORON

 

[Markeh]

So you've added three world class players...now all we need are fit and reliable goalscorers. Hey this is easy.

Suck my balls with your sarcasm, they didn't have world class footballer stamped on their heads at birth did they.

The point is that we don't need to buy a new team to get somewhere, we need a couple of properly good players in key positions. None of the players I mentioned came to the premier league at great expense either, it's neither easy or impossible.

 

[leftpeg]

Suck my balls with your sarcasm, they didn't have world class footballer stamped on their heads at birth did they.

The point is that we don't need to buy a new team to get somewhere, we need a couple of properly good players in key positions. None of the players I mentioned came to the premier league at great expense either, it's neither easy or impossible.

So you think two or three good (not great) players are all we lack?

 

[Markeh]

So you think two or three good (not great) players are all we lack?

Yes - It has been suggested that Ming has cost us 15 points so far, replace him and bring in a center half with a clue and imo like I said earlier we'd be around the top 4 this season.

 

[leftpeg]

Yes - It has been suggested that Ming has cost us 15 points so far, replace him and bring in a center half with a clue and imo like I said earlier we'd be around the top 4 this season.

We've scored 32 league goals this season...that's 15 fewer than Leicester and City...it's 14 fewer than Everton. How would an improved keeper and centre half improve that? Mignolet is a huge problem but he's by no means the only one.

 

[Frogfish]

.........It's very unlike Klopp to totally change a squad during a transfer window,.........

I think in fact he has proven the opposite is true.

 

[Markeh]

We've scored 32 league goals this season...that's 15 fewer than Leicester and City...it's 14 fewer than Everton. How would an improved keeper and centre half improve that? Mignolet is a huge problem but he's by no means the only one.

How many more have United scored though? I'm saying those two changes will put us on the brink of top 4 where United are, not anywhere near winning the league.

A keeper and a decent center back should be a ton easier to recruit than top forwards too.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

Id sell Ibe to City for £50m.

He's rubbish.

 

[leftpeg]

How many more have United scored though? I'm saying those two changes will put us on the brink of top 4 where United are, not anywhere near winning the league.

A keeper and a decent center back should be a ton easier to recruit than top forwards too.

Utd are six points off the top 4...and that's in a season where the top 4 have scored fewer points than usual. So yes, I agree we need a new keeper and a new centre half. But I'd go much further. We need 3 centre halves better than those we have. We also need more bite in midfield, possibly better width if that's a style we want to play and we need more goals up front. Collectively, we need a physically and mentally stronger group of players. In other words, this squad is a mile off. And it's not going to get any easier next season. Utd, City and Chelsea will all undoubtedly be stronger. Spurs and Arsenal will be no worse. So a new keeper and better centre half might help us challenge for 6th but it's going to be nowhere near enough to propel us into the top 4.

 

[Frogfish]

I'm pretty much in between Keniget and Markeh on one side and Pete, Fabio & Leftpeg on the other. We can build a Top 4 side from the better players in this squad with the addition of some quality additions. It's a pity we didn't get Alex Texeira because he fits the mould for one of them and it would leave us with less to do in the Summer.

GK : I don't hink Klopp will sell Mignolet, but he may well replace him as #1. Personally I'd sell both Mignolet and Bogdan (1 Buy for Klopp, 2 for Froggy)

FBs : Moreno can go and I'm in two minds over Clyne because as an attacking force he is useless, good defender mind. A huge issue for us are the wings where we over-rely on FBs to do a wingers job (just watching Hazard, Willian and even Pedro when he came on, emphasised this when compared to our wide options). Flanno, Clyne, Smith & Gomez stay. Maybe Klopp will sell Moreno if we're lucky, it's difficult to say what he plans to do. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy)

CBs : Assuming Matip arrives then I don't see Klopp doing much more unless Hummels is available, if he is then that's very useful. For me Matip, Hummels, Skrtel & Sakho is enough for the squad (for now, we have more urgent slots to fill). (2 Buys for Klopp, 2 for Froggy)

DM : Lucas has had his day. Younger legs required and I think this position is a cert. for Klopp. Stewart looks worth persisting with as a backup. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

CM : Klopp seems to like Milner and I don't see him disposing of his captain, both fit his mould. Writing is on the wall for Allen (no new deal) and Grujic will be joining up. (1 more Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

Wide : Obviously one new player at least since we virtually only have Ibe - (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy)

#10 : Coutinho, Lallana, Firmino. I don't think we'll see any changes here at all.

Strikers : We have a plethora and have to get rid. No doubt Bentkeke will be one of them, Balotelli of course and Ings will have to prove himself in pre-season all over again. Sturridge will stay, I've no doubt. Origi is young and shows promise, he'll stay. Firmino does dual duty. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

I'm on the wall about Can, I find him one of the most frustrating players in the team. He's proved nothing this season so he can go as far as I'm concerned. I prefer Brannagan anyway.

Klop : 8 new players IN (7-8 OUT), Froggy 9 new players IN & 9-10 OUT).

 

[leftpeg]

I'm pretty much in between Keniget and Markeh on one side and Pete, Fabio & Leftpeg on the other. We can build a Top 4 side from the better players in this squad with the addition of some quality additions. It's a pity we didn't get Alex Texeira because he fits the mould for one of them and it would leave us with less to do in the Summer.

GK : I don't hink Klopp will sell Mignolet, but he may well replace him as #1. Personally I'd sell both Mignolet and Bogdan (1 Buy for Klopp, 2 for Froggy)

FBs : Moreno can go and I'm in two minds over Clyne because as an attacking force he is useless, good defender mind. A huge issue for us are the wings where we over-rely on FBs to do a wingers job (just watching Hazard, Willian and even Pedro when he came on, emphasised this when compared to our wide options). Flanno, Clyne, Smith & Gomez stay. Maybe Klopp will sell Moreno if we're lucky, it's difficult to say what he plans to do. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy)

CBs : Assuming Matip arrives then I don't see Klopp doing much more unless Hummels is available, if he is then that's very useful. For me Matip, Hummels, Skrtel & Sakho is enough for the squad (for now, we have more urgent slots to fill). (2 Buys for Klopp, 2 for Froggy)

DM : Lucas has had his day. Younger legs required and I think this position is a cert. for Klopp. Stewart looks worth persisting with as a backup. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

CM : Klopp seems to like Milner and I don't see him disposing of his captain, both fit his mould. Writing is on the wall for Allen (no new deal) and Grujic will be joining up. (1 more Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

Wide : Obviously one new player at least since we virtually only have Ibe - (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy)

#10 : Coutinho, Lallana, Firmino. I don't think we'll see any changes here at all.

Strikers : We have a plethora and have to get rid. No doubt Bentkeke will be one of them, Balotelli of course and Ings will have to prove himself in pre-season all over again. Sturridge will stay, I've no doubt. Origi is young and shows promise, he'll stay. Firmino does dual duty. (1 Buy for Klopp, 1 for Froggy).

I'm on the wall about Can, I find him one of the most frustrating players in the team. He's proved nothing this season so he can go as far as I'm concerned. I prefer Brannagan anyway.

Klop : 8 new players IN (7-8 OUT), Froggy 9 new players IN & 9-10 OUT).

So you want to see 9 new players come in and 9 or 10 go out. I think you're coming down on the side of a fairly radical overhaul.