Poll [Poll] Firmino - Holgate incident update
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Well, like I said earlier. There was a precedent set by Suarez - South American uses a native cultural slur word that is deemed to be racist, spoken in Portuguese.
Here, South American loses temper in a similarly high profile and hotly contested rivals game, insults the other party in Portuguese. There's a possibility that the previous high profile incident comes into the thinking of the opposing player. It's possible, and it doesn't take Holgate to have to be Einstein (or Lawrence Olivier) to think that way, off the cuff.
For fucks sake man. If you have me on ignore I guess it mean I don't have to read your angry tense outbursts to my posts?
Do you believe they would have worded it different if it was Kane?
Is my argument backed up by facts if they i.e. charged Suarez and Terry for the same thing but handed Suarez double punishment?
I can't help it, it's the morbid curiousity of this thread
It's backed up by the fact the fa believe Suarez said it 5 times. Repeated racism is worse than one outburst (although both are abhorrent)
And also Suarez is believed to have replied to evras question of "why did you kick me?" With "because you're black"
THATS FUCKING RACIST AND VIOLENT AND WIND UP
If that's what the FA believe, then yes, that is entirely worse than Terry calling Anton Ferdinand a black cunt
BUT no more evra chatter.
I don't believe the fa were being racist against firmino
Like John Terry. Oh.
Does any mad cunt think the FA were being discriminatory against Firmino? Ignoring the well-known mad cunt.
And the other issue then raises its tin-foil hatted head.
Is there a suspicion that the FA did this purely because it was Liverpool? Fucking hell, please tell me that isn't the case.
All I can see wrong here is a lengthy process and some poor wording in the conclusion, and a young footballer who thought he heard something, and now knows he didn't, because nobody on the pitch, on either side, or the officials, or the linguistic experts backed him up.
They didn't clear John terry for the accusations did they?
Regardless, the FA have a sketchy and inconsistent record when it comes to racism. They fined (but didn't ban) Rio Ferdinand for his choc-ice comment about Ashley Cole, which is about as racially discriminate as it gets. Ferdinand then spouted all over Twitter that he didn't give a fuck and that he stood by his comment. And yeah, nothing happened. So there is some level of either bias, inconsistency, or both.
I don't believe for one second that Firmino's ethnicity had any influence over the FA one way or the other, but their ability to deal with any race related issues is farcical.
As for Terry and Suarez, you couldn't really get much more inconsistent. Terry got a £220,000 fine and a four match ban, Suarez got a £40,000 fine and an eight match ban. Suarez used the word several times, which you could argue constitutes a longer ban - though racial discrimination is just that, the precedent was set and Terry got half the ban Suarez got. I'm not sure what determined the fine amounts, but it's not very consistent, is it?
I don't believe for one second that Firmino's ethnicity had any influence over the FA one way or the other, but their ability to deal with any race related issues is farcical.
As for Terry and Suarez, you couldn't really get much more inconsistent. Terry got a £220,000 fine and a four match ban, Suarez got a £40,000 fine and an eight match ban. Suarez used the word several times, which you could argue constitutes a longer ban - though racial discrimination is just that, the precedent was set and Terry got half the ban Suarez got. I'm not sure what determined the fine amounts, but it's not very consistent, is it?
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Shitest counter ever. Terry was found guilty. It was unequivocal. Insignifigance is outarguing you to fuck. How do you like those apples?
But you've kinda summed it up there. Why did an organisation as big as the FA come out with such poor wording? Wouldn't you think that after seven fucking weeks they could have worded it better? And if Holgate thought he heard something but now knows he didn't, why didn't they say that, but also categorically state that Firmino did not say those things?
Our player didn't get punished. Can someone explain why this thread is still going?
And that he got away scot-free for a easily red card offence. Firmino should be asked to take advice from Rivaldo on how to react in such situations....he should have collapsed like a pack of sack and hit the advert boards. It would have got us probably more goals and him the immense satisfaction of seeing Holgate panned by all and sundry...his hot on the collar reaction served zero purpose and ultimately has worked against him.
I hope that thousands more accusations follow in the coming games, if you can make them with impunity and destabilise a rival player, then I'm afraid I thought I heard De Gea, De Bruyne, Augero, Kane, and Hazard use the N word. Not once, but multiple times, in every game.
But you do believe they would have worded it different if it was Kane?
And you also state it yourself: Suarez is believed to have said....! Believed is not a strong proof mate. Weak as piss.
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You'r wrong and hysteric in so many accounts. I don't believe it is down to it being Firmino and Liverpool. I still believe they would have treated it different if it was Kane though. With no evidence or indication on any racism remarks they would never leave that doubts hang in the air if their own Kane was the victim of these false accusations.
And please do come back with the Terry nonsence... it suits your misplaced outbursts perfectly.
Balance of probabilities and the FA believe he said it.
That's all that fucking matters
If Kane had called someone blackie 5 times l, and said they kicked them because they were black, then id be positive he'd be getting an 8 game ban, if not longer, because there wouldn't be any other interpretation
Nice try mate. Don't twist away. Do you believe Kane would have been left in doubt if they investigated him for 7 weeks with no trace of racism?
And I disagree. Even the FA should need more than belief when branding people racists.
I think you picked a bad example with a London-based player. In London, a race issue would be covered more intensely than anywhere, and would put huge pressure on the FA. (Mind you, if a player said something antisemitic at Spurs there'd be real confusion, seeing as those idiot fans use some of those offensive terms every week.)
Ferdinand - calls Ashley Cole a "Choc-Ice" and gets no ban, but a £45k fine. Then goes on to ridicule the FA and say he didn't regret his racist comment, no action taken.
Terry - Makes racist comment to Anton Ferdinand stating action he took on the pitch was because Ferdinand is "black". £220k fine and a four match ban
Luis Suarez - Calls Patrice Evra a "Negrito" multiple times during a game, receives a £40k fine and an eight match ban.
Firmino - is accused of racism, found not guilty and is then subject to a fairly damning closing statement from the FA.
The consistent, non-biased FA. Those fines and bans make no sense, nor resemble anything consistent.
Terry - Makes racist comment to Anton Ferdinand stating action he took on the pitch was because Ferdinand is "black". £220k fine and a four match ban
Luis Suarez - Calls Patrice Evra a "Negrito" multiple times during a game, receives a £40k fine and an eight match ban.
Firmino - is accused of racism, found not guilty and is then subject to a fairly damning closing statement from the FA.
The consistent, non-biased FA. Those fines and bans make no sense, nor resemble anything consistent.
They're not branding people racists, they're charging them for racist language
And it's chalk and cheese with kane.
If he said something that could have been misheard, then yes, I reckon it would take a while to deal with it
As it was Portuguese and misheard, it would take longer
Quite, it just means that people then question their integrity. The Ferdinand one in particular was ridiculous, again they skirted the subject and avoided confrontation in the aftermath when he continued to goad and ridicule them. A black guy makes a blatantly anti-white comment towards another black guy. They just didn't want to go there.
Its not implausible, and short of Holgate admitting he lied, we will never know.
I find it equally strange that someone thinks a giant biased leap needs to be made to understand that a footballer would act like something happened that didn't happen. Players literally train to exploit the incomplete information that refs have, and we watch them perform those lies constantly. The stage is so full of these performances that we have ceased judging the lies on any normal ethical grounds, but unto their own strange logic. It's like how many people view business.
We've watched a grown man simulate having a fucking seizure. We've watched thousands of invisible legs cause a thousand non-existent bruises. There's a limp you expect, a grimace you expect, and they are all more expected when they are more useful. We expect to be lied to from an attacker that did something wrong, every time. Hands up performance, avoiding tbe ref dance, ref performs no with two hands drawing a line.
So someone who should have had a red, heard something that no one else heard, and it's been proven he didn't say it. Instead he very loudly screamed an incredibly common swear that was lip readable the very first time the video was played.
And then he escaped punishment.
Yeah, I've connected a dot after all that.
I get the vibe, but feigning bad contact is surely a different mindset than claiming racist abuse surely?
Maybe he did plan a red. Maybe he planned to get firmino sent off by pretending to be headbutted if firmino got to him before the ref, and then had to quickly change tactic.
For me it's beyond the pale and I just can't accept in such a scenario, that THAT is what springs to mind.
Oh and on the fa being inconsistent, surely their inconsistency that's actually relevant is the part where
He didn't plan anything. Many peoples instinct is to lie.
He didn't plan anything. Many peoples instinct is to lie.
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