Mendy not guilty

[ibromurph]

The vast majority of rape accusations don't even get to court, as it can be very hard to prove.

You're right on the first part. And in general, I do believe there are many more instances where rapists (in wider society; especially in 3rd world countries; where there is little law & order) get away with it and it doesn't get to court. But when it does go to court, defendants are actually now more likely to be convicted than acquitted:

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2023/feb/juries-convict-defendants-rape-more-often-acquit

For some of these footballers/celebs though, I think it's a bit different. I think it's fair to believe, when proven not guilty, that these accusations are made by women who could be gold-diggers. In Mendy's case, he's been with 10,000 women. A handful are accusing him of luring them over to his house, partying and getting drunk, and then raping them. I think if you play the numbers game, and you've been with that many women, I am sure he's been a dirty boy and may have had sex, drunk himself, with blurred lines about how drunk each one of them was.

Who knows. With celebs, I think there's def a bit of a sickness with society where these women throw themselves at these celebs, and sex is so easy for these men that there's no real emotion/feeling to it for then, which leads to them feeling that sex is a guarantee when a women comes to their house at night, late. So who knows, I can't definitively say that Mendy is or is not a rapist, but I think it's unfair to not give him the benefit of the doubt, now he's been found not guilty.

I guess this should be a lesson for all men. Don't have sex outside of a relationship with random women, otherwise you run the risk of this sort of stuff happening. And make sure you take precautions to protect yourself by way of consent, if you do. (A friend of mine keeps a camera in his house for Tinder hookups, for this same reason).

And as for women, it should be a lesson to not to go to rich men's houses, or any random man's house for that matter, otherwise if they are indeed rapists, they may be able to get away with it, as the public/jury may view your actions unfavourably, as in "you should have known better" or that sex was the assumed activity you were going over there for. Which is obviously an unfair view, and shouldn't be that way, but the world is filled with unfairness, so we should protect our women by educating them on the dangers of this.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Yes.

And some of these girls expect money/gifts when you fuck them. But when you chew them up and spit them out like Mendy did, all of a sudden they feel like they've been abused.

From a pure numbers POV, if the man has slept with over 10,000 women. Even if 10 accused him of rape (which it only seemed like 1 originally, then another 9 piled on, but only 3 i think went to court).

Then you're looking at 0.1% of women he's slept with accusing him of rape and 99.9% not.

It appears to me that he and his friends were inconsiderate sluts who ran through women with flagrant disregard of their feelings. Chewed them up and spit them out. Some of these women probably expected more (financially/status-wise) from sleeping with a footballer. He may have even lied about his feeling for them to get them in bed. And thus they feel like they slept with him under false premises/expectations and feel abused. When really they're gold diggers who just got played themselves by a dickhead.

Just like there are many rapists out there who are ruled innocent, I am guessing there are equally as many men who have been falsely accused of rape/SA and found guilty, by women who simply changed their minds about the experience after they had had sex.

Only issue being that the bar for conviction is insanely high, higher than any other crime so I’d imagine the number of innocent men condicted is dwarfed by those who are guilty and not found as such in court.

 

[Dreambeliever]

You're right on the first part. And in general, I do believe there are many more instances where rapists (in wider society; especially in 3rd world countries; where there is little law & order) get away with it and it doesn't get to court. But when it does go to court, defendants are actually now more likely to be convicted than acquitted:

https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2023/feb/juries-convict-defendants-rape-more-often-acquit

For some of these footballers/celebs though, I think it's a bit different. I think it's fair to believe, when proven not guilty, that these accusations are made by women who could be gold-diggers. In Mendy's case, he's been with 10,000 women. A handful are accusing him of luring them over to his house, partying and getting drunk, and then raping them. I think if you play the numbers game, and you've been with that many women, I am sure he's been a dirty boy and may have had sex, drunk himself, with blurred lines about how drunk each one of them was.

Who knows. With celebs, I think there's def a bit of a sickness with society where these women throw themselves at these celebs, and sex is so easy for these men that there's no real emotion/feeling to it for then, which leads to them feeling that sex is a guarantee when a women comes to their house at night, late. So who knows, I can't definitively say that Mendy is or is not a rapist, but I think it's unfair to not give him the benefit of the doubt, now he's been found not guilty.

I guess this should be a lesson for all men. Don't have sex outside of a relationship with random women, otherwise you run the risk of this sort of stuff happening. And make sure you take precautions to protect yourself by way of consent, if you do. (A friend of mine keeps a camera in his house for Tinder hookups, for this same reason).

And as for women, it should be a lesson to not to go to rich men's houses, or any random man's house for that matter, otherwise if they are indeed rapists, they may be able to get away with it, as the public/jury may view your actions unfavourably, as in "you should have known better" or that sex was the assumed activity you were going over there for. Which is obviously an unfair view, and shouldn't be that way, but the world is filled with unfairness, so we should protect our women by educating them on the dangers of this.

What your friend is doing is illegal no? Unless he tells these tinder hook ups in advance?

 

[ibromurph]

What your friend is doing is illegal no? Unless he tells these tinder hook ups in advance?

I don't ask too many questions.

But my understanding is he has a camera in his living room, not his bedroom. And only turns it on if he thinks the woman is a bit unstable, as she might accuse him of physical/S assault.

 

[Dreambeliever]

I don't ask too many questions.

But my understanding is he has a camera in his living room, not his bedroom. And only turns it on if he thinks the woman is a bit unstable, as she might accuse him of physical/S assault.

Fair enough but still doesn’t sound great.

 

[doctor_mac]

From the outset it looked unprovable.

Review the reports and admitted behaviour of the girls that brought cases. They all put themselves into situations where sex was obviously part and parcel of the game being played.
These were not naive girls at a friends party / club who found themselves in situations beyond their control. Age doesn't come into it, they are all adults and well aware of the very predictable outcome of partying and going home to stay overnight at these guys' homes.

Mendy & Co. certainly attempted to have sex with many women including these, however, although having absolutely no sympathy with or for Mendy, from the evidence we have seen, to me these women just seem like gold diggers who saw a way to take advantage for a big pay day, especially once the first girl had made a claim. Any celebrity / affluent male takes that risk nowadays and these guys made themselves easy targets.

There's no way to prove it either way (he said she said) but these girls, whose admitted actions were far from naive & innocent, had already put themselves into situations where sex was expected and in most cases desired and freely given. The usual groupie mentality.

Of course there's almost no way of knowing if that was the case with all these girls and regardless no means no and previous sexual encounters with Mendy & Co. doesn't mean permission was given in those specific situations but the fact the jury came to such speedy verdicts, in all cases, would seem to support such a conclusion.

This opinion pertains to these cases and isn't universally transferable.

Do you have a daughter, Froggy?

I do, aged 18, and I can imagine her in a situation where some famous person was inviting her and a bunch of her friends to a house party. Is she basically giving carte blanche to some cunt to rape her?! Is sex 'part and parcel of the game' ? Fuck off. This whole attitude is disgusting to me. As is pretty much everything Ibro and his creepy mate has come out with too.

 

[ibromurph]

Fair enough but still doesn’t sound great.

Nah. I disagree. I think it's pretty smart.

If you ask a woman to leave your house and she says no, you really can't do anything but call the police. But if you call the police and she then says you physically or sexually assaulted her, now it's a case of "he said, she said". Dangerous territory.

He's simply protecting himself. I actually don't see a downside here? I think both men and women should take precautions to protect themselves.

 

[darkstarexodus]

Frankly I think someone who is sleeping around like that is pretty skeezy regardless of the specific details related to consent.

And when alcohol/drugs enter the picture, how informed can consent be?

Dunno enough about the case to know whether he should be found criminally liable but he's scum regardless and I'm not bothered how this impacts his reputation or career at all.

Yes, maybe I'm a bit of a prude. I can live with that.

 

[doctor_mac]

There are some disturbing views in this thread

I'm absolutely fucking disgusted by what I'm reading in this thread. Maybe you need to have a daughter, I don't know if I thought about women differently before then, but I know there is some shit here that is shameful in the way it is discussing women.

 

[The Nomad]

I'm absolutely fucking disgusted by what I'm reading in this thread. Maybe you need to have a daughter, I don't know if I thought about women before then, but I know there is some shit here that is shameful in the way it is discussing women.

I've got to admit. Since having a daughter myself (shes now 10 and not allowed a boyfriend until she's 35), it does make you look at life differently.

 

[Frogfish]

It's not so much that we should all presume there is some guilt, though I do have sympathy with Wolands point. It's all the sick bandwagon jumping of gold digger accusations against the woman, and the the extension that entrapment behaviour by women is widespread. That is a dangerous path to victim blaming.

The vast majority of rape accusations don't even get to court, as it can be very hard to prove. The accusers are given a traumatic time, on top of the trauma they have already been through, by the authorities to test if they will withstand the further trauma of cross examination and accusations if it does go to court. And then if they do go to court and the case is deemed not proven they are labeled evil gold diggers, which then reinforces the cycle of not reporting or not pursuing cases as the potential abuse and humiliation they face is not worth the risk.

You are clearly conflating the wider incidences of rape (well covered I think by Ibromurph & Modo above) with opinions on this case. Personally I specifically underlined that my opinions on this case were constrained to this case - which you have overtly chosen to ignore.

That said there is then an obvious lack of cognizance, or possibly a naivety about the real world, in some comments made here.You can not dismiss the potential for entrapment simply by ignoring it and saying it leads to victim blaming, both options are equally valid and need to be explored. In fact even recently there have been some high profile cases dismissed (and proven) as fantasy or revenge.

Some people are jumping on the Woke or MeToo bandwagons for the sake of wanting to be seen to conform to the modern views on these subjects. Whilst for many actual victims it was truly a cathartic experience with the genuine hope of bringing their assailant to justice, for many others it was just plain opportunistic gold digging. To ignore that and indeed rail against it is frankly to bury your head in the sand.

Telling who was guilty and who innocent is nigh impossible with the passage of time and lack of witnesses or conclusive evidence. Until science finds a way to overcome this I'm afraid injustice is a by-product. I've no doubt innocent men have been found guilty by virtue of the general population's demand, and therefore influence, for retribution. Likewise many many more actual rapists have undoubtedly gone free due to poor legislation or policing. I doubt that is applicable here.

It doesn't matter how despicable we find Mendy's behaviour (and it clearly was) there will be some that are majorly influenced by a) the fact he was a City football player (and they want to see him get his comeuppance) and b) there may be a degree of unconscious jealousy (money, girls throwing themselves at him, and the ease with which he obtained sex). Such is human nature. Neither is pertinent when it comes to the jury's findings.

Finally (and, whilst not all of the above may be pertinent to you, clearly the first and this paragraph are) you have chosen to completely ignore not only that the jury found him innocent - but that they did so in a ridiculously short time (an ave. of 1.25 hrs per case) which means in their opinion it was very clear that there was no case to answer (and that the girls were lying and by inference, gold digging).

 

[Woland]

Come on now you prissy bastards, what is the world coming to when you can't tell a drunk teenager she can come and see your multi million quid pad and have a few drinks and then tag team her with your mate when she's got no escape. I think you're being very harsh on the pure danger.

 

[binomial]

I'm absolutely fucking disgusted by what I'm reading in this thread. Maybe you need to have a daughter, I don't know if I thought about women differently before then, but I know there is some shit here that is shameful in the way it is discussing women.

Don't think you do Mac...we might not all have daughters, but we all have mothers, a lot of us have (younger) sisters, not every woman out there in the world will have the morals and principles ones raised ones own daughter to have.....sorry but this is life.

Whether you like to admit it or not there are manipulating, conniving women out there just as much as there are sick perverted men who look to take advantage.

Not gonna speak in Mendy's case in particular as it doesn't concern me and I really couldn't care less.

 

[Frogfish]

Do you have a daughter, Froggy?

I do, aged 18, and I can imagine her in a situation where some famous person was inviting her and a bunch of her friends to a house party. Is she basically giving carte blanche to some cunt to rape her?! Is sex 'part and parcel of the game' ? Fuck off. This whole attitude is disgusting to me. As is pretty much everything Ibro and his creepy mate has come out with too.

I do. But that isn't what happened here. You are as bad as TB in conflating this case with the norm.

I suggest you go back and study the events as admitted and entered into evidence. I find it strange that a jury of our peers can find not guilty in minutes and yet you, like me just someone on the internet, can think otherwise.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Nah. I disagree. I think it's pretty smart.

If you ask a woman to leave your house and she says no, you really can't do anything but call the police. But if you call the police and she then says you physically or sexually assaulted her, now it's a case of "he said, she said". Dangerous territory.

He's simply protecting himself. I actually don't see a downside here? I think both men and women should take precautions to protect themselves.

Don’t see a downside?
How about the fact it’s illegal?
Just go to their place or you know don’t bring them home until you trust them.
Recording women in your home is not ok and I’m pretty sure if you told them you were doing it they wouldn’t step foot inside.

 

[doctor_mac]

I do. But that isn't what happened here. You are as bad as TB is conflating this case with the norm.

I suggest you go back and study the events as admitted and entered into evidence. I find it strange that a jury of our peers can find not guilty in minutes and yet you, like me just someone on the internet, can think otherwise.

You said that going to a rich influential person's house meant that sex 'was part of the game'. I completely disagree with that, and I'm afraid too may juries of our peers carry this reprehensible opinion that you seem to enjoy.

 

[Frogfish]

You said that going to a rich influential person's house meant that sex 'was part of the game'. I completely disagree with that, and I'm afraid too may juries of our peers carry this reprehensible opinion that you seem to enjoy.

Oh that's what I said did I? No it's fucking not. Go back and read it again - in context this time. I await your apology.

 

[Dreambeliever]

I'm absolutely fucking disgusted by what I'm reading in this thread. Maybe you need to have a daughter, I don't know if I thought about women differently before then, but I know there is some shit here that is shameful in the way it is discussing women.

Do you have sisters? I’ve felt this way since as long bask as I can remember. She’s 4 years younger and as a non drinker I grew up seeing what guys did on alcohol so have always been super protective.

 

[doctor_mac]

Do you have sisters? I’ve felt this way since as long bask as I can remember. She’s 4 years younger and as a non drinker I grew up seeing what guys did on alcohol so have always been super protective.

I have a younger sister right enough, and as a drinker, I still was shooing my friends away from her.

 

[ibromurph]

I do. But that isn't what happened here. You are as bad as TB in conflating this case with the norm.

I suggest you go back and study the events as admitted and entered into evidence. I find it strange that a jury of our peers can find not guilty in minutes and yet you, like me just someone on the internet, can think otherwise.

Mac is just gaslighting with his posts which is why I chose to ignore it.

So because we don't agree with his world view that all women should be believed immediately and that it's possible that there are women out there that lie for money, we are now creepy, disgusting people who support rapists.

I can't be bothered to respond to that sort of debating. In my opinion, this sort of wokeness/meToo thinking actually does a disservice to women and puts them in these sorts of dangerous situations where predators and rapist do lurk. Women and men are NOT equal, and that's OK. We all know men are the stronger sex, so we should do all we can to protect our wives and daughters from strange men. Similarly, we should do all we can to protect our sons and brothers from cunning women who can destroy men with lies.

 

[The Nomad]

Why do I get the feeling this thread could be the one to destroy SCM as we know it?

 

[Woland]

There's a massive difference between going out looking to get laid and going out looking for drunk idiots. Absolutely no problem with people of either sex doing as much shagging of people they just met as they can manage, as long as that's what everyone involved wants to do. Big fan of it in fact. The point here is that at times I don't think mendy gave a fuck what anyone other than himself wanted, and if you were a young naive girl on one of those nights then it seems it was just tough shit.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Why do I get the feeling this thread could be the one to destroy SCM as we know it?

SCM will never die.

 

[ibromurph]

Don’t see a downside?
How about the fact it’s illegal?
Just go to their place or you know don’t bring them home until you trust them.
Recording women in your home is not ok and I’m pretty sure if you told them you were doing it they wouldn’t step foot inside.

It's not illegal to record in your own living room.

It's illegal to record in places where you'd expect privacy. A bedroom, a bathroom, etc.

Morever, it's not just women you're using a camera for. You can be using it to ensure your hired cleaner isn't stealing from you. Like I said, my friend would only turn the camera on in his living room on if any sort of disagreement happened, or he got the feeling of hostility, and he may very well tell them he's recording there and then. And guess what, when a woman knows she is being recorded, they all of a sudden change their behaviour on camera. They will then get up and leave, with no problems, and you don't risk them accusing you of anything untowards.

You're just thinking it's for creepy purposes, probably because you've never been in a situation where it's needed to protect yourself.

 

[The Nomad]

Don’t see a downside?
How about the fact it’s illegal?
Just go to their place or you know don’t bring them home until you trust them.
Recording women in your home is not ok and I’m pretty sure if you told them you were doing it they wouldn’t step foot inside.

Yeah it's not illegal. More and more people are installing cctv inside their homes. Ring are making making a killing from it.

 

[doctor_mac]

Hahahaha. I'm gaslighting? Do you actually know what that term means? For your information, it is an extended process of psychological manipulation resulting in a change of personality in the victim. Have I gaslighted you Ibro? Do you need some professional help? Or have I said something that countered your clearly nasty perspective on women?

 

[Frogfish]

Mac is just gaslighting with his posts which is why I chose to ignore it.

So because we don't agree with his world view that all women should be believed immediately and that it's possible that there are women out there that lie for money, we are now creepy, disgusting people who support rapists.

I can't be bothered to respond to that sort of debating. In my opinion, this sort of wokeness/meToo thinking actually does a disservice to women and puts them in these sorts of dangerous situations where predators and rapist do lurk. Women and men are NOT equal, and that's OK. We all know men are the stronger sex, so we should do all we can to protect our wives and daughters from strange men. Similarly, we should do all we can to protect our sons and brothers from cunning women who can destroy men with lies.

Mac has clearly led a very sheltered life. That still doesn't permit him to take my comments (made with a VERY clear disclaimer that they were in regard to the Mendy case) and apply them to all young male-female interactions simply because he has a daughter (as do I and so does another 50% of the global population).

There are millions of gold diggers from those looking to extort via lurid photos, to Asian 'brides' who scam their new husbands, to black widow types, to those looking to gain through litigation, to those finding a new partner and emptying the bank accounts. And no doubt thousands of other scenarios. It's truly naive to think of only men as conniving & scheming.

 

[Dreambeliever]

It's not illegal to record in your own living room.

It's illegal to record in places where you'd expect privacy. A bedroom, a bathroom, etc.

Morever, it's not just women you're using a camera for. You can be using it to ensure your hired cleaner isn't stealing from you. Like I said, my friend would only turn the camera on in his living room on if any sort of disagreement happened, or he got the feeling of hostility, and he may very well tell them he's recording there and then. And guess what, when a woman knows she is being recorded, they all of a sudden change their behaviour on camera. They will then get up and leave, with no problems, and you don't risk them accusing you of anything untowards.

You're just thinking it's for creepy purposes, probably because you've never been in a situation where it's needed to protect yourself.

Funny that though, I’ve never been that situation and I’ve slept with my fair share of women. But fair enough based on your explanation.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Yeah it's not illegal. More and more people are installing cctv inside their homes. Ring are making making a killing from it.

It’s ok to have them. I thought you had to inform people they were recording when sound was involved especially. But I guess I was wrong there.

 

[Woland]

Women looking to extort people don't make it past the CPS. Hardly any rape claims get to trial, this is the whole point. Crazy women exist and they can get in the bin, but it's Vegas odds that all these women duped the whole system. There clearly wasn't enough evidence to convict, but that's the nature of this type of crime, not evidence no crime was committed, at all