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Kenny - We Must Focus On Bringing The Title Back

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[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179714#msg1179714 date=1285139476]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179708#msg1179708 date=1285139127]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

it's not about what is said to the players, it's about what is said to the fans. if the fans believe, it will reflected in the support and the support drives the players. remember when rafa said 'we WILL beat chelsea' in the CL semi final, imagine if he said 'chelsea are the stronger team and are favorites to go through' (a perfectly valid tactic to take pressure off the team), maybe the support on 'that' night wouldn't have had the belief we would make the final via a superior chelsea.
[/quote]

He's in a no win situation Neil, what are our expectations this season? Have we got any realistic ones other than keeping things steady and qualifying for Europe in (at best) the Champions League? What's he supposed to say? Benitez came in and said he came in to win the title, what did that achieve domestically?
[/quote]

I'm not talking about roy throwing down the gauntlet with regards to the title, I'm talking about approaching games with confidence and having that confidence reflected on the pitch. the very LAST thing I want to hear to is he didn't expect to win, if that's the case, roy, then tell the supporters in advance so they can decide whether or not to travel round the country and spend hundreds of pounds to watch.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179722#msg1179722 date=1285139776]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179714#msg1179714 date=1285139476]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179708#msg1179708 date=1285139127]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

it's not about what is said to the players, it's about what is said to the fans. if the fans believe, it will reflected in the support and the support drives the players. remember when rafa said 'we WILL beat chelsea' in the CL semi final, imagine if he said 'chelsea are the stronger team and are favorites to go through' (a perfectly valid tactic to take pressure off the team), maybe the support on 'that' night wouldn't have had the belief we would make the final via a superior chelsea.
[/quote]

He's in a no win situation Neil, what are our expectations this season? Have we got any realistic ones other than keeping things steady and qualifying for Europe in (at best) the Champions League? What's he supposed to say? Benitez came in and said he came in to win the title, what did that achieve domestically?
[/quote]

I'm not talking about roy throwing down the gauntlet with regards to the title, I'm talking about approaching games with confidence and having that confidence reflected on the pitch. the very LAST thing I want to hear to is he didn't expect to win, if that's the case, roy, then tell the supporters in advance so they can decide whether or not to travel round the country and spend hundreds of pounds to watch.
[/quote]

This is all bollocks. Did he give a pre-match interview stating he didn't expect to win? Did he fuck.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179725#msg1179725 date=1285139902]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179722#msg1179722 date=1285139776]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179714#msg1179714 date=1285139476]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179708#msg1179708 date=1285139127]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

it's not about what is said to the players, it's about what is said to the fans. if the fans believe, it will reflected in the support and the support drives the players. remember when rafa said 'we WILL beat chelsea' in the CL semi final, imagine if he said 'chelsea are the stronger team and are favorites to go through' (a perfectly valid tactic to take pressure off the team), maybe the support on 'that' night wouldn't have had the belief we would make the final via a superior chelsea.
[/quote]

He's in a no win situation Neil, what are our expectations this season? Have we got any realistic ones other than keeping things steady and qualifying for Europe in (at best) the Champions League? What's he supposed to say? Benitez came in and said he came in to win the title, what did that achieve domestically?
[/quote]

I'm not talking about roy throwing down the gauntlet with regards to the title, I'm talking about approaching games with confidence and having that confidence reflected on the pitch. the very LAST thing I want to hear to is he didn't expect to win, if that's the case, roy, then tell the supporters in advance so they can decide whether or not to travel round the country and spend hundreds of pounds to watch.
[/quote]

This is all bollocks. Did he give a pre-match interview stating he didn't expect to win? Did he fuck.
[/quote]

I said if he didn't feel he could win the game, he should have (said in a pre-match interview).
 
With all due respect to Kenny - thanks for stating the fucking obvious! We've been saying it for the past 20 odd years! Even when we were being distracted by the allure of European glory under Rafa's reign, many of us were thinking that it would be nice to be even challenging for the title not fighting for a Champions League berth.

Its nice that he's saying it obviously, but frankly its about as obvious as it gets for anyone connected with Liverpool Football Club.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179708#msg1179708 date=1285139127]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

it's not about what is said to the players, it's about what is said to the fans. if the fans believe, it will reflected in the support and the support drives the players. remember when rafa said 'we WILL beat chelsea' in the CL semi final, imagine if he said 'chelsea are the stronger team and are favorites to go through' (a perfectly valid tactic to take pressure off the team), maybe the support on 'that' night wouldn't have had the belief we would make the final via a superior chelsea.
[/quote]

Remember when Rafa said we were 'guaranteed' to finish fourth? That worked well. The power of words, eh?
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=41992.msg1179738#msg1179738 date=1285140379]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1179708#msg1179708 date=1285139127]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

it's not about what is said to the players, it's about what is said to the fans. if the fans believe, it will reflected in the support and the support drives the players. remember when rafa said 'we WILL beat chelsea' in the CL semi final, imagine if he said 'chelsea are the stronger team and are favorites to go through' (a perfectly valid tactic to take pressure off the team), maybe the support on 'that' night wouldn't have had the belief we would make the final via a superior chelsea.
[/quote]

Remember when Rafa said we were 'guaranteed' to finish fourth? That worked well. The power of words, eh?
[/quote]

well, maybe if he hadn't said that we'd have been relagated 😉
 
[quote author=Glock link=topic=41992.msg1179692#msg1179692 date=1285134533]
Roy is and will not be the man to bring us the title.
[/quote]

No shit, sherlock.
 
I think its a case of Kenny trying to remind us all that there is a golden sky at the end of this perpetual shit, Roy cannot be expected to talk of the title considering the shit we are in, Kenny on the other hand can just say what needs to be done.... state the spiritual aim so to speak.

Its nice words to hear when you are in the middle of a shitstorm.

Also it could well be argued that after the monumental fuck up of last season, we have sort of accepted that the best we can do is position X in the table etc etc.... that is definitely the wrong attitude, hoping to finish fourth is one thing but playing to finish there is a bad idea, weve got to have the desire to win or it will count against us in the long run.

Although we lost the other day we certainly didnt play like a bunch of losers, and that was important, its important to have that pride and that desire to win and im pleased that Kenny mentions it every now and then.
 
Kenny is Mr Liverpool and is saying what we'd expect him to say. It's difficult to be cynical about Kenny as I'm sure what he says is heartfelt.

As regards the power of words, you only have to read some of the quotes attributed to Bill Shankly to know that they can be motivational and they do make a lasting impression.
 
[quote author=Spionkop69 link=topic=41992.msg1179733#msg1179733 date=1285140176]
With all due respect to Kenny - thanks for stating the fucking obvious! We've been saying it for the past 20 odd years! Even when we were being distracted by the allure of European glory under Rafa's reign, many of us were thinking that it would be nice to be even challenging for the title not fighting for a Champions League berth.

Its nice that he's saying it obviously, but frankly its about as obvious as it gets for anyone connected with Liverpool Football Club.
[/quote]

Thats what I was thinking too
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
 
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179866#msg1179866 date=1285153027]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
[/quote]

Amazing isn't it?

People twist all kinds of shit to suit their established viewpoint.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179866#msg1179866 date=1285153027]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
[/quote]

Are you serious? If United hadnt scored we would have been very happy trying to keep the ball without creatiating anything. Roy would have snapped a 0-0 draw with both hands if he could. If that aint negative approach I dont know what is....
 
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1180005#msg1180005 date=1285167722]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179866#msg1179866 date=1285153027]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
[/quote]

Are you serious? If United hadnt scored we would have been very happy trying to keep the ball without creatiating anything. Roy would have snapped a 0-0 draw with both hands if he could. If that aint negative approach I dont know what is....
[/quote]

It.
Was.
AT.
Manchester.
United.
 
[quote author=Whaddapie link=topic=41992.msg1180016#msg1180016 date=1285168320]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1180005#msg1180005 date=1285167722]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179866#msg1179866 date=1285153027]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
[/quote]

Are you serious? If United hadnt scored we would have been very happy trying to keep the ball without creatiating anything. Roy would have snapped a 0-0 draw with both hands if he could. If that aint negative approach I dont know what is....
[/quote]

It.
Was.
AT.
Manchester.
United.
[/quote]

And that means we should not try to win?
 
It means that if you go out all guns blazing if with a squad like ours they'll probably pick you off.

Add to that the ref factor at Old trafford and the occasion of the match and it does mean that you should probably approach the match tentatively.

Or atleast, I think you should.
 
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1180005#msg1180005 date=1285167722]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179866#msg1179866 date=1285153027]
[quote author=Insignificance link=topic=41992.msg1179842#msg1179842 date=1285150775]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=41992.msg1179699#msg1179699 date=1285137876]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1179698#msg1179698 date=1285137637]
And things like motivation, belief and will to win have nothing to do with words?
[/quote]

Obviously, because I'm sure everything said in the press is a reflection of what's said behind closed doors. And after all, *everything* Roy has said so far has been negative.
[/quote]

Far from. However all five league games so far have been approached negative, and given the grand returnere of four goal..
[/quote]

How were the games against City and United approached as negative? That's bullshit.
[/quote]

Are you serious? If United hadnt scored we would have been very happy trying to keep the ball without creatiating anything. Roy would have snapped a 0-0 draw with both hands if he could. If that aint negative approach I dont know what is....
[/quote]

He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
 
He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
Click to expand...

I didn't want it. I said it was mental to select Maxi, and Agger should have played instead of Skittles.

Chat shit? You said it. But I'm loving this "Leave Budgie alone!" persona you are displaying. It's sweet.
 
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180037#msg1180037 date=1285169907]
He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
Click to expand...

I didn't want it. I said it was mental to select Maxi, and Agger should have played instead of Skittles.

Chat shit? You said it. But I'm loving this "Leave Budgie alone!" persona you are displaying. It's sweet.
[/quote]

who would you rather have on the right that game bren?
 
roy wanted to consolidate the draw when we got to 2-2, simple as fucking that. people can talk about about being at manu, the amount of strikers we had on the pitch or fucking whatever, we got to 2-2 and simply dropped off and allowed manu to pick their crosses at will with no intent from us to press the crossers and no further intent from ourselves to press the adventage we had 'somehow' craved out for ourselves. chatting shit? fucking BULLSHIT! roy wanted the draw at 2-2.
 
Everyone is a bit strong, but there were few complaints as the squad was announced. People are going on like we played similarly to how Houllier went to the Nou Camp - 11 men behind the ball and nobody across the halfway line. It's nonsense, and it's only getting suggested because of Hodgson's stupid comments after the Birmingham match.
 
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=41992.msg1180038#msg1180038 date=1285170177]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180037#msg1180037 date=1285169907]
He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
Click to expand...

I didn't want it. I said it was mental to select Maxi, and Agger should have played instead of Skittles.

Chat shit? You said it. But I'm loving this "Leave Budgie alone!" persona you are displaying. It's sweet.
[/quote]

who would you rather have on the right that game bren?
[/quote]

Babel, Jova, Patches, Cole....fucking ANYONE other than that South American Ms Doubtfire lookalike.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1180039#msg1180039 date=1285170256]
roy wanted to consolidate the draw when we got to 2-2, simple as fucking that. people can talk about about being at manu, the amount of strikers we had on the pitch or fucking whatever, we got to 2-2 and simply dropped off and allowed manu to pick their crosses at will with no intent from us to press the crossers and no further intent from ourselves to press the adventage we had 'somehow' craved out for ourselves. chatting shit? fucking BULLSHIT! roy wanted the draw at 2-2.
[/quote]

We switched a tired/injured LB for Daniel Agger. Apart from that I'm quite perplexed as to how did Roy communicated to all the players to suddenly sit back?

You also completely fail to acknowledge that United pass the ball better than we do, have a better team, and always push a team back at some point or another at Old Trafford. It happens week in, week out, and their in-form striker bagged a third goal, because we've got a defence who cannot jump.

If it were not for the Birminham comments this 'sitting back' business would not be getting mentioned.
 
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180042#msg1180042 date=1285170478]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=41992.msg1180038#msg1180038 date=1285170177]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180037#msg1180037 date=1285169907]
He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
Click to expand...

I didn't want it. I said it was mental to select Maxi, and Agger should have played instead of Skittles.

Chat shit? You said it. But I'm loving this "Leave Budgie alone!" persona you are displaying. It's sweet.
[/quote]

who would you rather have on the right that game bren?
[/quote]

Babel, Jova, Patches, Cole....fucking ANYONE other than that South American Ms Doubtfire lookalike.
[/quote]

They all have to be ahead of Maxi from this point on. He's started the season terribly.
 
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180042#msg1180042 date=1285170478]
[quote author=Fabio link=topic=41992.msg1180038#msg1180038 date=1285170177]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41992.msg1180037#msg1180037 date=1285169907]
He picked a team that everyone wanted, and at one point had three strikers on the pitch.

You're chatting shit.
Click to expand...

I didn't want it. I said it was mental to select Maxi, and Agger should have played instead of Skittles.

Chat shit? You said it. But I'm loving this "Leave Budgie alone!" persona you are displaying. It's sweet.
[/quote]

who would you rather have on the right that game bren?
[/quote]

Babel, Jova, Patches, Cole....fucking ANYONE other than that South American Ms Doubtfire lookalike.
[/quote]

Fair enough. Jova i like but am not convinced by and thought maxi deserved a shot ahead of him just to check he wasn't completely useless. Cole i felt was better implemented behind torres. Babel or Patches though i agree with, but i can understand the arguments for not starting either
 
* I didn't have a problem with the team roy picked

* I had no problem with the formation (though meireles playing ahead of gerrard made little sense)

* keeping to tight away from home is a sound tactic

* roy made a VERY good sub with ngog

---

however when we got to 2-2 we should have gone for manu's fucking THROATS, they were clearly rattled and thinking about the previous week.

subbing meireles when he was finally pulling the strings (having dropped deeper into midfield) was stupid

and allowing manu to cross time and time again whilst putting no pressure on them by pushing up the pitch because we were intent to defend on the edge of our own area was fucking IDIOTIC, especially since the people asked to defend those crosses against a rampant beracunt was carra and skrtel (hardly dominant in the air)

tactical naivety from roy when at one stage (amazingly) we had manu on the ropes, but oh yeah the people that point this out are talking shit.
 
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=41992.msg1180039#msg1180039 date=1285170256]
roy wanted to consolidate the draw when we got to 2-2, simple as fucking that. people can talk about about being at manu, the amount of strikers we had on the pitch or fucking whatever, we got to 2-2 and simply dropped off and allowed manu to pick their crosses at will with no intent from us to press the crossers and no further intent from ourselves to press the adventage we had 'somehow' craved out for ourselves. chatting shit? fucking BULLSHIT! roy wanted the draw at 2-2.
[/quote]

Yeah, because your fucking love child number two couldn't block a cross. What are you miffed about? That he didn't bring love child number one on?
 
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