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Gen-Gen Depressing

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Think we should just lock this and re-visit at the end of the season and we can see who was right. That'll be fun!
 
manwithnoname said:
There's plenty of people on here who slavishly follow managers, and afford them God-like status. Who quack on about 4-3-3 and pressing, and whatever.

.....
So I'd be unsure if even greats like Gerrard, Torres, Rush or Owen could play for a Klopp team.
Click to expand...

You know what I love about this Gen-Gen-Goodstuff ?

1) I worry less watching us play now because for most of a game we have the ball no matter who the opposition is - I can see that the opposition is having very few chances against us in open play these days. The system is making our players some of the best and quickest passers of the ball.

2) We force the issue and take matters into our hands - not waiting for the opposition fuckers come to us or try to control the game from midfield.

3) We don't wait for those moments of 'transition' - to get an opportunity - we force them to happen on a minute by minute basis - so for people like Jose who rely on such moments against like quality opposition to 'nick' a result - we are effectively negating their one tactical method.

4) All of those players you mention could play in such a system if they wanted to - the problem with Sturridge (which is your real question) - is that he has a confidence problem and probably deliberately does not run like he use to and does not get involved in the pressing because he is not that type of player - that is a problem for any team that would need to accommodate him.

5) As for Mane - yes I have noticed that he is participating with less intensity but to be honest he has not needed to be more intense - he had two very good chances to score the other day but did not - so I don't actually think he is losing out. In fact if I remember for Southampton he did well at the start of their season then faded and then came back when we lost that game against them later in the season.

6) General fitness level of our players is much higher than any in our league - so when the going gets touch I reckon we will have a lot left over in our tanker than nearly all the teams in this league.

In summary you would not be asking these questions and about Sturridge if our team would put away all the 10's of chances we create in nearly every game because we would be winning games like 4-0, 6-0, 7-0. No one would question our tactics.

MORON
 
Piedro said:
Think we should just lock this and re-visit at the end of the season and we can see who was right. That'll be fun!
Click to expand...

If you do, the following will happen:

a) as you may have noticed, we don't usually win the title so on balance we probably won't do it this year either.
b) Firmino will probably get about 15 league goals and 10 assists.
c) Brendan will say 'told you so, you stupid gurning thundermelts' or words to that effect.
d) People will say that 'just because we didn't win the league this time, that doesn't mean it's not possible without a 20 goal a season striker'.
e) posts 0 to 240 redux.
 
dantes said:
Make no mistake, the times now are worse. Before we had Rush or Fowler getting close to 30 goals, and other players still getting double figures.

These times we are happy with just partially one of those and in continual fear of having neither.
Click to expand...

Nah. Rush and Fowler only had a few seasons where they got over twenty goals. I'd guess about a quarter. And yeah we probably won the league those years. But yeah that's probably coz we were boss and that's why they scored.
 
Last edited:
Fucking hell I just read the rest of the thread and now my response to that looks entirely out of place.

If I was a mod I'd ban myself for my constant bullshit
 
Woland said:
Fucking hell I just read the rest of the thread and now my response to that looks entirely out of place.

If I was a mod I'd ban myself for my constant bullshit
Click to expand...

Don't worry. Spouting constant bullshit is a prerequisite for modding
 
gene hughes said:
If you do, the following will happen:

a) as you may have noticed, we don't usually win the title so on balance we probably won't do it this year either.
b) Firmino will probably get about 15 league goals and 10 assists.
c) Brendan will say 'told you so, you stupid gurning thundermelts' or words to that effect.
d) People will say that 'just because we didn't win the league this time, that doesn't mean it's not possible without a 20 goal a season striker'.
e) posts 0 to 240 redux.
Click to expand...

Not going to argue with this, but while obviously winning the title is something of a priority, I'd still be very pleased of Firmino got 15 league goals and 10 assists.
 
If we could just win the league I'd even give Arn the chance to be right. Lucas with 10 goals and a PFA award for his incredible performances.

This scenario wont happen. For obvious reasons.
 
The season so far reminds me of the 13/14 season. We smashed lots of goals and looked vulnerable at the back. Even though we beat Palace and it was great to beat Pardew I finished the game more concerned about Firminos unnecessary yellow and Karius not coming out with his arms up.

As a result nope not that worried about a 20 goal a season striker, about a quarter of the way through we have 3 players on 4 and another on 3. If it carries on and the defenders continue to chip in the way Lovren, Matip have done then we should be ok.
The other thing with the pressing game is that it will work for us at the moment with the league and cup games but if we add European football into the mix then we might well struggle to keep the pace and intensity. As it is I would say we can keep the intensity this season but will end up third
 
gene hughes said:
If you do, the following will happen:

a) as you may have noticed, we don't usually win the title so on balance we probably won't do it this year either.
b) Firmino will probably get about 15 league goals and 10 assists.
c) Brendan will say 'told you so, you stupid gurning thundermelts' or words to that effect.
d) People will say that 'just because we didn't win the league this time, that doesn't mean it's not possible without a 20 goal a season striker'.
e) posts 0 to 240 redux.
Click to expand...

While it will obviously play out like you say, I think if we don't win the league, it won't be down to a lack of goals. And the binary folk looking in that direction will be spectacularly missing the point. In my view, anyway.
 
Based on discussion earlier in the thread regarding having a striker who scores 20+ goals a season or having multiple players chipping in, i looked at the stats from the PL era from the title winning teams and see if there are any clear relationships made from either of the two scenarios.

[xtable=border-color:#000000|bcenter|998x@]
{tbody}
{tr}
{td=63x@}Year{/td}
{td=171x@}Champions{/td}
{td=81x@}Points{/td}
{td=86x@}Goals Scored{/td}
{td=86x@}Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=89x@}2nd Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=89x@}3rd Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=106x@}% of Goals scored by Top scorer{/td}
{td=113x@}% of Goals scored by Top 2{/td}
{td=114x@}% of Goals scored by Top 3{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1992–93{/td}
{td}Manchester United {/td}
{td=81x@}84{/td}
{td=86x@}67{/td}
{td=86x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}22%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}58%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1993–94{/td}
{td}Manchester United {/td}
{td=81x@}92{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}23%{/td}
{td=113x@}39%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1994–95{/td}
{td}Blackburn Rovers {/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}34{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}6{/td}
{td=106x@}43%{/td}
{td=113x@}61%{/td}
{td=114x@}69%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1995–96{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}19%{/td}
{td=113x@}34%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1996–97{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}75{/td}
{td=86x@}76{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=89x@}8{/td}
{td=106x@}24%{/td}
{td=113x@}38%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1997–98{/td}
{td}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}78{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}16{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}24%{/td}
{td=113x@}41%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1998–99{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}23%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}59%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1999–00{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}91{/td}
{td=86x@}97{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}19{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}21%{/td}
{td=113x@}40%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2000–01{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}19%{/td}
{td=113x@}32%{/td}
{td=114x@}43%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2001–02{/td}
{td}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}24{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}30%{/td}
{td=113x@}46%{/td}
{td=114x@}58%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2002–03{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}83{/td}
{td=86x@}74{/td}
{td=86x@}25{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}34%{/td}
{td=113x@}53%{/td}
{td=114x@}65%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2003–04{/td}
{td=171x@}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}90{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}30{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}4{/td}
{td=106x@}41%{/td}
{td=113x@}60%{/td}
{td=114x@}66%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2004–05{/td}
{td=171x@}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}95{/td}
{td=86x@}72{/td}
{td=86x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}18%{/td}
{td=113x@}35%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2005–06{/td}
{td}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}91{/td}
{td=86x@}72{/td}
{td=86x@}16{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}22%{/td}
{td=113x@}39%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2006–07{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}83{/td}
{td=86x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}8{/td}
{td=106x@}20%{/td}
{td=113x@}37%{/td}
{td=114x@}47%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2007–08{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}31{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}39%{/td}
{td=113x@}56%{/td}
{td=114x@}71%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2008–09{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}90{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}26%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2009–10{/td}
{td}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}103{/td}
{td=86x@}29{/td}
{td=89x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}28%{/td}
{td=113x@}50%{/td}
{td=114x@}61%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2010–11{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}78{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}26%{/td}
{td=113x@}42%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2011–12{/td}
{td}Manchester City{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}93{/td}
{td=86x@}23{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=106x@}25%{/td}
{td=113x@}40%{/td}
{td=114x@}54%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2012–13{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}26{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}30%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2013–14{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester City{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}102{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}16{/td}
{td=106x@}20%{/td}
{td=113x@}36%{/td}
{td=114x@}52%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2014–15{/td}
{td=171x@}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}7{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}47%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2015–16{/td}
{td}Leicester City{/td}
{td=81x@}81{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}24{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}6{/td}
{td=106x@}35%{/td}
{td=113x@}60%{/td}
{td=114x@}69%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 92-93 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}21{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 00-01 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}28%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 05-06 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 10-11 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{/tbody}
[/xtable]

Top Scorer
  • On average the top scorer in a title winning sides scores 21 goals per season which are 27% of total goals by the team.
    • # of seasons in the PL ear where the top scorer for the champions has scored <20 goals is 11 which is 46% of the times, however since 2010-11 all title winning sides have had a 20+ goals scorer
    • # of seasons where top scorer has scored <27% of all goals for the champions is 15 which is around 63% of all seasons
Top 2 Scorers
  • On an average Top 2 scorers combined score 35 goals per season which is 45% of all goals scored by title winning sides
    • # of seasons where top 2 scorers have scored <35 goals is 12 which is 50% of the time
    • # of season where top 2 scorers have scored <45% of all goals is 13 which is 54% of the time
Top 3 Scorers
  • On an average Top 3 scorers combined score 45 goals per season which is 56% of all goals scored by title winning sides
    • # of seasons where top 3 scorers have scored <45 goals is 13 which is 54% of the time
    • # of season where top 3 scorers have scored <56% of all goals is 10 which is 42% of the time
So it seems like you can win PL titles whilst having either a 20+ goal scorer or spreading the goals across the team.
 
i-would-love-k8l5n5.jpg
 
Well I don't know about anyone else, but when you've got three attackers capable of 10-15 a season, I don't think it's that stupid to see a room for improvement by also having a goalscorer who gets a lot of goals. Like I said earlier, they're not mutually exclusive. If you want to continue to get better as a team, you look for things you can improve. It's not hypercritical to suggest as much, however well things are going.

Chelsea won the league once with Drogba as top scorer on 13, rightly they recognised it wasnt something that was sustainable.
 
It's probably also worth noting that in the majority of those seasons, one of the top 3 scorers took penalties.
 
mark1975 said:
Well I don't know about anyone else, but when you've got three attackers capable of 10-15 a season, I don't think it's that stupid to see a room for improvement by also having a goalscorer who gets a lot of goals. Like I said earlier, they're not mutually exclusive. If you want to continue to get better as a team, you look for things you can improve. It's not hypercritical to suggest as much, however well things are going.

Chelsea won the league once with Drogba as top scorer on 13, rightly they recognised it wasnt something that was sustainable.
Click to expand...

Well, yeah, the idea is to score as many as possible. But who cares where they come from as long as they come.
 
mark1975 said:
Well I don't know about anyone else, but when you've got three attackers capable of 10-15 a season, I don't think it's that stupid to see a room for improvement by also having a goalscorer who gets a lot of goals. Like I said earlier, they're not mutually exclusive. If you want to continue to get better as a team, you look for things you can improve. It's not hypercritical to suggest as much, however well things are going.

Chelsea won the league once with Drogba as top scorer on 13, rightly they recognised it wasnt something that was sustainable.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone thinks that would be stupid. Unrealistic, probably, but not that stupid or contentious.

That's a massively diluted version of one side of this debate though.
 
We're really lucky that our left back scores pens. That leaves room for even more goals elsewhere. Imagine having that threat from a defensive position AND a top, clinical goalscorer to boot. Of course it doesn't matter where the goals come from, top teams have players chipping in all over, it's great that that's what we've become, but we could get better again by having a lethal edge.
 
mark1975 said:
Way to go, missing the point.
Click to expand...

Is it? If we're going to be suggesting ways to improve, how about instead of one those players scoring 5-10 more goals we work on getting 2-3 more goals out of each of them, and improving the tally of the rest of the team by a total of 4-5 goals?

That would surely be better than a reliance on one player who can get the extra goals, but might get injured or suspended.

With respect Mark, I think you might be missing the point on this one.
 
YNWA said:
Based on discussion earlier in the thread regarding having a striker who scores 20+ goals a season or having multiple players chipping in, i looked at the stats from the PL era from the title winning teams and see if there are any clear relationships made from either of the two scenarios.

[xtable=skin1|border-color:#000000|bcenter|50x@]
{tbody}
{tr}
{td=63x@}Year{/td}
{td=171x@}Champions{/td}
{td=81x@}Points{/td}
{td=86x@}Goals Scored{/td}
{td=86x@}Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=89x@}2nd Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=89x@}3rd Top Goalscorer{/td}
{td=106x@}% of Goals scored by Top scorer{/td}
{td=113x@}% of Goals scored by Top 2{/td}
{td=114x@}% of Goals scored by Top 3{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1992–93{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}84{/td}
{td=86x@}67{/td}
{td=86x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}22%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}58%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1993–94{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}92{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}23%{/td}
{td=113x@}39%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1994–95{/td}
{td}Blackburn Rovers{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}34{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}6{/td}
{td=106x@}43%{/td}
{td=113x@}61%{/td}
{td=114x@}69%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1995–96{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}19%{/td}
{td=113x@}34%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1996–97{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}75{/td}
{td=86x@}76{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=89x@}8{/td}
{td=106x@}24%{/td}
{td=113x@}38%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1997–98{/td}
{td}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}78{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}16{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}24%{/td}
{td=113x@}41%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1998–99{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}23%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}59%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}1999–00{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}91{/td}
{td=86x@}97{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}19{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}21%{/td}
{td=113x@}40%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2000–01{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}19%{/td}
{td=113x@}32%{/td}
{td=114x@}43%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2001–02{/td}
{td}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}24{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}30%{/td}
{td=113x@}46%{/td}
{td=114x@}58%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2002–03{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}83{/td}
{td=86x@}74{/td}
{td=86x@}25{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}34%{/td}
{td=113x@}53%{/td}
{td=114x@}65%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2003–04{/td}
{td=171x@}Arsenal{/td}
{td=81x@}90{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}30{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}4{/td}
{td=106x@}41%{/td}
{td=113x@}60%{/td}
{td=114x@}66%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2004–05{/td}
{td=171x@}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}95{/td}
{td=86x@}72{/td}
{td=86x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}18%{/td}
{td=113x@}35%{/td}
{td=114x@}49%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2005–06{/td}
{td}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}91{/td}
{td=86x@}72{/td}
{td=86x@}16{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}22%{/td}
{td=113x@}39%{/td}
{td=114x@}53%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2006–07{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}83{/td}
{td=86x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}8{/td}
{td=106x@}20%{/td}
{td=113x@}37%{/td}
{td=114x@}47%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2007–08{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}31{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}39%{/td}
{td=113x@}56%{/td}
{td=114x@}71%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2008–09{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}90{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}18{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}9{/td}
{td=106x@}26%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2009–10{/td}
{td}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}103{/td}
{td=86x@}29{/td}
{td=89x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=106x@}28%{/td}
{td=113x@}50%{/td}
{td=114x@}61%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2010–11{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}78{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=89x@}11{/td}
{td=106x@}26%{/td}
{td=113x@}42%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2011–12{/td}
{td}Manchester City{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}93{/td}
{td=86x@}23{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}13{/td}
{td=106x@}25%{/td}
{td=113x@}40%{/td}
{td=114x@}54%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2012–13{/td}
{td}Manchester United{/td}
{td=81x@}89{/td}
{td=86x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}26{/td}
{td=89x@}12{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}30%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2013–14{/td}
{td=171x@}Manchester City{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}102{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}16{/td}
{td=106x@}20%{/td}
{td=113x@}36%{/td}
{td=114x@}52%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2014–15{/td}
{td=171x@}Chelsea{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}73{/td}
{td=86x@}20{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}7{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}47%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td}2015–16{/td}
{td}Leicester City{/td}
{td=81x@}81{/td}
{td=86x@}68{/td}
{td=86x@}24{/td}
{td=89x@}17{/td}
{td=89x@}6{/td}
{td=106x@}35%{/td}
{td=113x@}60%{/td}
{td=114x@}69%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 92-93 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}79{/td}
{td=86x@}21{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}44%{/td}
{td=114x@}56%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 00-01 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}80{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}28%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 05-06 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}87{/td}
{td=86x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}15{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{tr}
{td=colspan:2}Average 10-11 till date{/td}
{td=81x@}86{/td}
{td=86x@}82{/td}
{td=86x@}22{/td}
{td=89x@}14{/td}
{td=89x@}10{/td}
{td=106x@}27%{/td}
{td=113x@}45%{/td}
{td=114x@}57%{/td}
{/tr}
{/tbody}
[/xtable]
Top Scorer
  • On average the top scorer in a title winning sides scores 21 goals per season which are 27% of total goals by the team.
    • # of seasons in the PL ear where the top scorer for the champions has scored <20 goals is 11 which is 46% of the times, however since 2010-11 all title winning sides have had a 20+ goals scorer
    • # of seasons where top scorer has scored <27% of all goals for the champions is 15 which is around 63% of all seasons
Top 2 Scorers
  • On an average Top 2 scorers combined score 35 goals per season which is 45% of all goals scored by title winning sides
    • # of seasons where top 2 scorers have scored <35 goals is 12 which is 50% of the time
    • # of season where top 2 scorers have scored <45% of all goals is 13 which is 54% of the time
Top 3 Scorers
  • On an average Top 3 scorers combined score 45 goals per season which is 56% of all goals scored by title winning sides
    • # of seasons where top 3 scorers have scored <45 goals is 13 which is 54% of the time
    • # of season where top 3 scorers have scored <56% of all goals is 10 which is 42% of the time
So it seems like you can win PL titles whilst having either a 20+ goal scorer or spreading the goals across the team.
Click to expand...

So the average number of goals scored by the top scorer in a Title-winning team is 22.

And of the last 20 years of title-winning sides, 65% of them had a player who scored more than 20 goals. And if you look to more recent, relevant timescales - say, the last 10 years - 80% of the title-winning teams had a player who scored 20 or more goals.

So you're more likely to win the title if you have a player who scores more than 20 goals.

I've already said all this. Tsk.
 
mark1975 said:
We're really lucky that our left back scores pens. That leaves room for even more goals elsewhere. Imagine having that threat from a defensive position AND a top, clinical goalscorer to boot. Of course it doesn't matter where the goals come from, top teams have players chipping in all over, it's great that that's what we've become, but we could get better again by having a lethal edge.
Click to expand...
Imagine if we had Rogerio Ceni as goalkeeper! Over 100 goals from him!
 
Mamma Mia said:
Is it? If we're going to be suggesting ways to improve, how about instead of one those players scoring 5-10 more goals we work on getting 2-3 more goals out of each of them, and improving the tally of the rest of the team by a total of 4-5 goals?

That would surely be better than a reliance on one player who can get the extra goals, but might get injured or suspended.

With respect Mark, I think you might be missing the point on this one.
Click to expand...

With respect, I think you're missing my point completely.

So the alternative to not having a player who is clinical and capable of grabbing large amount of goals, is to work on getting 2-3 more from the players we already have? Isn't that what we've already done this season, or on our way to doing, with Lallana, Firmino and Coutinho? How much more do you think we can realistically get from them? Lallana got 4 Premiership goals last season, Coutinho got 8 and Firmino got 10. That's 22 goals from three players who are instrumental to our current attack, an average of 7.3 each.

You and a few others have missed the point about a top goalscorer, it doesn't have to be someone who we over rely on (why do people keep taking this myopic view that it's an either/or?), it can be someone who fits the system and is prolific. Is that so fanciful? Really? Are you telling me you would turn down a host of big scoring strikers if they were available to us, because of this perspective over lesser numbers from more players?

And I'm missing the point.
 
I hope every player in our squad scores 4 goals (22 players x 4 = 88) and we win the league.
Just to fuck up this horrid discussion.
 
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