And the alternative is?
Fabinho leaving?
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You are making it sound like this the only option available? Who says? These aren’t mutually exclusive options.
Well no it's not the only alternative but I see it as a chance for us to be able to rejuvenate our midfield and also rectify mistakes we've done earlier by letting players go for nothing. Now we're actually get a decent price for these players that are in the twilight of their careers. Yeah it's ruthless, a player like Hendo should get a better send off, but will another team ever offer us that amount for him? Or Fabs?
Also, is keeping him worth more than £10 mill or the £40 mill we might get for soon to be 30 year old Fabs?
I'm not sure how much money the club has to spend on new players, we've already spent around £100 mill without getting anything back.
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So did Robbo?
Rubans. Forget the whole too good to refuse BS for a second because roll on a few years and they all leave for nothing, clubs need to spend out their own pocket to replace them anyway…better get whatever we can now, to replace them now. This represents good smart business as it’d save us a few bob down the line. It seems logical, we aren’t going forward as stands with those 3 next season.
We don't have to get money for every single player.
They won the lot, some are allowed to leave for nothing because they would have played into the ground by Klopp.
I don't buy a car thinking it's an appreciating asset always.
It depends on the depreciating asset and circumstance at the time...
But why wouldn’t you if the money was on the table and it made sense? There is zero point keeping players around on high wages to bench warm and clearly well past their best. Give Klopp the money and he will make good use of it to improve the team’s chances of success, i.e when we took the money for Phil.
Chelsea don't have to sell. He would be Jude money. He's a high profile, very talented young English cb, playing for a direct rival. There's no way they'd take less than 70
Where do you draw the line though? Every example on its own makes absolute sense and I doubt anyone would disagree but when the number of departures start to pile up in key areas there has to be a point where you say no.
This will be what 7/8th first teamer gone in the same window?
Suspect we'll buy 2
I don't think the number matters, it's about what role they had and how much cover we have. Two of the players were Firmino and Carvalho, I think we're covered in that area. You're right though, we did lose Milner, Ox and Keita in midfield. But how much of a loss was it really?
Milly is 37 and the two others were never fit or couldn't be relied on.
I admit that selling both Fabs and Hendo in this window is too excessive or too much of a reboot, but we put ourselves in this situation because we didn't rejuvenate the team earlier. Instead we persisted with the likes of Ox and Keita and let them go for free instead.
I don't see us getting £10 mill and £40 mill for Hendo and Fabs next season. I feel like the club has to take this chance.
We have to, I'd even suggest buying a right back so that Trent can get games in midfield.
If both Fabs and Hendo leave, we'll have:
Szobo
Mac
Thiago
Trent
Jones
New DM
Bajetic
Elliott
I'm fine with that.
I'd like a bit more at RCM, especially when we get to afcon and szoboszlai probably moves to rw. I know Trent could work there, but we don't know if he would work there in klopps system
I agree, but I guess that's the position Elliott is supposed to play in, but having Elliott and Trent on the same side of the pitch isn't ideal.
So despite never playing there for us, Trent is now considered a midfielder for us, based on Southgate playing him there against a shit tier national team.
Who are qe playing at right back in these fantasy teams? Is it Gomez? Tyler Morton? Is Arthur resigning because he's determined to prove himself in England? Are we getting the right back equivalent of him on loan and who could that be?
I'm intrigued and excited!
Who are qe playing at right back in these fantasy teams? Is it Gomez? Tyler Morton? Is Arthur resigning because he's determined to prove himself in England? Are we getting the right back equivalent of him on loan and who could that be?
I'm intrigued and excited!
I don't understand the reaction here to Trent playing in midfield. Is it totally unfathomable to change positions in football?
I mean you have to start somewhere, right?
Gareth Bale went from LB to winger.
Ronaldo from Winger to striker.
Barnes from Winger to midfielder.
Mascherano from DM to CB
Gerrard played all over the pitch
Milner too.
Why can't Trent suddenly be a midfielder?
Here he is playing for the youth teams in midfield:
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To some yes, it's as if changing position is like going from playing golf to cricket.
Apparently the game is "too evolved now far beyond players limitations, far beyond manager's thinking that they should be switch positions" but now if you're a "LCB" whatever the fuck that is, you can't play at RCB. Load of tosh.
The more I think of this, the more I feel this is a bad idea. It's true that we're unlikely to receive this sort of money for Fabinho again, but it's also true I think that we're not going to be able to replace him.
Firstly, I think you need to appreciate the significant gap in importance between Henderson and Fabinho. Prime Henderson was a good player, but statistically very replaceable. Prime Fabinho was a top 3 DM in Europe - that's a rare and elite talent, who isn't easily replaced. Add to that the fact that Henderson is 33, and Fabinho is 30, it is clear whose loss we'll feel more.
I think it is probably right to say that the days of Fabinho playing single pivot are over, but it'd be stupid to ignore the importance of his positioning, defensive coverage as a 6 in the double pivot. He still reads and understands the game at a very high level, and that's simply not available in the market readily. At any given point, there are rarely more than 5-6 elite DMs in the world. Fabinho was one of them, and still offers stability to the spine of Alisson-VVD-Fabinho. I simply don't think we win anything without that spine.
The calibre of player we'd need to replace Fabinho simply won't be available to us - I'm talking Caicedo and Tchouameni. What are the odds we sign them?
It's good to start thinking about transitioning to a new era, but abandoning the idea of actually winning anything quickly isn't a smart idea. Klopp is here for just 3 more seasons. I don't want those years to be like from 2015-2018 where we won nothing. The likes of Lavia or Bajcetic are simply too young, and won't be any better than the likes of Can or Joe Allen we had at that time. Very few teams in PL history have won anything without a great GK-CB-DM axis.
Firstly, I think you need to appreciate the significant gap in importance between Henderson and Fabinho. Prime Henderson was a good player, but statistically very replaceable. Prime Fabinho was a top 3 DM in Europe - that's a rare and elite talent, who isn't easily replaced. Add to that the fact that Henderson is 33, and Fabinho is 30, it is clear whose loss we'll feel more.
I think it is probably right to say that the days of Fabinho playing single pivot are over, but it'd be stupid to ignore the importance of his positioning, defensive coverage as a 6 in the double pivot. He still reads and understands the game at a very high level, and that's simply not available in the market readily. At any given point, there are rarely more than 5-6 elite DMs in the world. Fabinho was one of them, and still offers stability to the spine of Alisson-VVD-Fabinho. I simply don't think we win anything without that spine.
The calibre of player we'd need to replace Fabinho simply won't be available to us - I'm talking Caicedo and Tchouameni. What are the odds we sign them?
It's good to start thinking about transitioning to a new era, but abandoning the idea of actually winning anything quickly isn't a smart idea. Klopp is here for just 3 more seasons. I don't want those years to be like from 2015-2018 where we won nothing. The likes of Lavia or Bajcetic are simply too young, and won't be any better than the likes of Can or Joe Allen we had at that time. Very few teams in PL history have won anything without a great GK-CB-DM axis.
This is where Trent, Robbo and Virgil need to become the vocal leaders in the dressing room. Ideally the big hole vacated by Hendo and/or Fabinho can be filled by Trent, but we have to buy a right back. I don't think we can go into the season with a pretty much brand new midfield and expect Trent to not be all over the place at right back, I'm not sure I completely believe in the hybrid role, because it relies heavily on too many other factors to make it work, notably Konate remaining fit, which is unlikely. If you're then relying on Gomez or Matip, we're back to square one, again. Just buy an accomplished right back who can defend and be done with it. Trent is far too good now to be exposed like that again, you expose him and his form dips, he should be our linchpin and the player the team is built around, and not from fucking right back.
Despite my reactionary post when the bid was announced, I do agree that Fabs will be difficult to replace.
There's a definitely a bigger chance that he starts this season than Hendo.
No, we won't get a superstar DM for £40 mill, but we could find a 22-24 year old who's on rise and yes it's a risk, but there's always a risk and that money won't always be available.
So you'd actually start him as the RCM and bring in someone new to start at RB?
What does that mean for our 2 new signings then? Would they be the other 2 in that midfield? Not sure the protection would be there in front of the back 4.
We did win everything there was to win with Trent at RB and the engine in midfield covering in his absense....it worked a treat....nobody was really talking about Trent defensively back then, certainly not as much as last season.
Hybrid role also worked a treat for the last 12 games of the season, unbeaten.....if it weren't for the move, we would've finished 7th or 8th. Can't factor an injury to Ibou for that not to work because an injury to Ibou is any sense would dent us.
I think the best young DMs in the 21-25 age bracket are - Tchouameni, Rice, Caicedo, Ugarte and Florentino Luis.
Rice is going to Arsenal. Real would never sell Tchouameni. Brighton would demand 100 million for Caicedo. Ugarte just moved to PSG. Luis is a big talent, but is a risk given that he's not played in a big league yet.
There are a bunch of other players who're a tier below talent-wise (Onana, Zubimendi, Adams etc.) who you could take a shot on, and hope Klopp works his magic. But I wouldn't be convinced.
Then there are a bunch of players in the 18-21 age bracket. I'm sure some of them will end up joining this top bracket (Lavia and Bajcetic may be among them), but it's simply too soon to expect them to play at that level at this age.
I know it's a question directed at Mark, but imo I think it's a perfect way to transition Trent to a full time role in midfield. Let Trent grow into the role by rotating with Szobo.
Some say that Szobo will cover for Salah at RW during the AFCON, which will open up that RCM spot for Trent. Also, it makes us less predictable, our opponents won't know if Trent will play in midfield or in defence. I guess you can say that it'll depend on the opposition.
Also, in games where we might be chasing a goal and Trent started in midfield, we can sub Szobo or someone else in, move Trent to his "special" RB position and we'll be even more attacking.
Also most importantly, Trent wants to play in midfield and it gives him a chance to start for England.
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It's a interesting one, we have 2 or 3 different ways to go about our set up.
To be clear, I want Trent playing in midfield....he has the natural flow there, it frees up his all round game to suit him better Imo but it's how we
make that all work personnel wise so that everyone is comfortable in the roles they're in the side to do as well.
Hmmmm. Can't wait for pre-season tbh, going to be very telling.
Those are some good names, but I'm missing a German. I'm hearing good things about Eric Martel.
Thuram might be a good shout too.
Or we steal Amrabat from Man U
Or Palinha
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Oh it's completely doable and if anyone could, it's Trent. The issue I have is that people think it'll just be a seamless transition. I think it'll take a season and a lot of hard work to get us to that position. Henderson already was a cm, and it took him a bit of time to adapt to klopps style.
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