'Class and dignity': a great Carra interview

[manwithnoname]

*sigh*

Fine, but my post has all the relevant information and facts.

I can't quite believe this is still rumbling on in so many threads.

Just - everyone - shut the fuck up

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=kingjulian link=topic=41756.msg1170185#msg1170185 date=1283712282]
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=41756.msg1170175#msg1170175 date=1283711490]
it's crazy to suggest that masch did us a favour by staying last year, and comparing his situation to a normal working environment is completely pointless.

the fact is, liverpool did not want to sell him, and didn't have to, so therefore any decision to allow him to go is actually a 'favour' on the club's part. i don't know how anyone can think otherwise.

player's need to realise what their responsibilities are when they sign up for the obscne rewards detailed in their contracts.
[/quote]

So you think it is alright to keep a person playing for a club against his wish because he makes 40,000 pounds a week as opposed to 1000/2000 pounds a week the average employee out there makes?

So Contract law has distinctions based on the face value of contract? Beyond what is reasonable the player can move to file a case, and everybody will end up losing in that scenario. That is the reason clubs usually agree to do a deal. Give me one example of a player who has wanted to move away from a club year after year but has been forced to serve out his contract. I will concede this point to you....

Majority of the time, when players want to leave a club for personal reason they leave, and in exceptional cases some players wait out a year or a bit more...and that is mostly out of respect to the club and fans...see Barry the year before last.
[/quote]

Presumably Mascherano or any other player stuck in a contract they don't like can apply to serve out a notice period like the average oerson does, the length of which depends on the length of service laid down in statute.

However the club can still hold onto the player registration for the duration of the contract, meaning he can go and get a normal job in whatever country he wants but won't be able to play football for anyone else.

Football players are completely different to your average employee because of the player registrations, not the amount of money involved in the contract.

 

[keniget]

Well, there is nothing to really disagree with Brendan's post. Why would there be? It's just a rundown of what happened.

I thought the argument was centred more around player power and whether a player is within his rights to force a move. Which has also been done to death on these boards and much like arguing about religion, goes round in circles with neither side able to convince the other.

 

[Woland]

[quote author=Brendan link=topic=41756.msg1170192#msg1170192 date=1283712585]
*sigh*

Fine, but my post has all the relevant information and facts.

I can't quite believe this is still rumbling on in so many threads.

Just - everyone - shut the fuck up
[/quote]

You first.

 

[kingjulian]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=41756.msg1170189#msg1170189 date=1283712496]
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=41756.msg1170184#msg1170184 date=1283712269]
but in that scenario i can't see how a player is treated unfairly. they're given a choice, even in the extreme:

[/quote]

Well, the club had a choice as well. They could've held onto Masher and refused him a move.
[/quote]

Indeed!!!

 

[kingjulian]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=41756.msg1170194#msg1170194 date=1283712621]
Well, there is nothing to really disagree with Brendan's post. Why would there be? It's just a rundown of what happened.

I thought the argument was centred more around player power and whether a player is within his rights to force a move. Which has also been done to death on these boards and much like arguing about religion, goes round in circles with neither side able to convince the other.
[/quote]

Oh!

Really....I didn't know that. In that case...i'm going to shut up, as suggested by few.

 

[peterhague]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=41756.msg1170189#msg1170189 date=1283712496]
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=41756.msg1170184#msg1170184 date=1283712269]
but in that scenario i can't see how a player is treated unfairly. they're given a choice, even in the extreme:

[/quote]

Well, the club had a choice as well. They could've held onto Masher and refused him a move.
[/quote]


right...tbh i'm not sure what we're arguing about. a contract exists, both parties should honour it. refusing to play imo is a refusal to honour it. i can't see any course of action a club can take, perhaps short of deliberate psychological torture of the player, that would be an equivalent action.

therefore my sympathies lie with the club and not the player.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=peterhague link=topic=41756.msg1170199#msg1170199 date=1283713027]
right...tbh i'm not sure what we're arguing about. a contract exists, both parties should honour it. refusing to play imo is a refusal to honour it. i can't see any course of action a club can take, perhaps short of deliberate psychological torture of the player, that would be an equivalent action.

therefore my sympathies lie with the club and not the player.
[/quote]

Heh, well I kinda arrived late into the argument, so if all you're trying to convince me of is that Masher is a cunt for not playing against City, I agree.

 

[kingjulian]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=41756.msg1170201#msg1170201 date=1283713304]
[quote author=peterhague link=topic=41756.msg1170199#msg1170199 date=1283713027]
right...tbh i'm not sure what we're arguing about. a contract exists, both parties should honour it. refusing to play imo is a refusal to honour it. i can't see any course of action a club can take, perhaps short of deliberate psychological torture of the player, that would be an equivalent action.

therefore my sympathies lie with the club and not the player.
[/quote]

Heh, well I kinda arrived late into the argument, so if all you're trying to convince me of is that Masher is a cunt for not playing against City, I agree.
[/quote]

Thats a definite no-no and probably a breach of contract too. He clearly let himself down.

I thought the argument was about him forcing a move through, in spite of the club not getting the expected compensation.

 

[manwithnoname]

No, this isn't a conversation about contracts

It's about Mascherano expecting a transfer, and making it quite clear that he didn't want to play for Liverpool again until it was granted

Which is what happened, despite all the fucking dismal, desperate drivel from all quarters subsequently

 

[Oncy]

Hes a jeb. Hes gone now.

 

[Squiggles]

Yep.

I appreciate the difficult situation he was in, but refusing to play for the club is both unacceptable and unforgivable, and I think Jamie Carragher has it spot on.

 

[Dreambeliever]

Class and dignity?

Blaming our demise entirely on our 1 of our greatest players..........

How is that dignified?

 

[SaintGeorge67]

[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=41756.msg1170243#msg1170243 date=1283727504]
Class and dignity?

Blaming our demise entirely on our 1 of our greatest players..........

How is that dignified?
[/quote]

I agree, not keen on those comments.

 

[Jack D Rips]

Forget about Carra. The real argument here is about the reasons Mascher left.

For over a year now we were all agreed that he should be allowed to leave for family reasons. So he leaves for Barca having forced that. But then we hear that he claims the club were lieing by saying that it was for family reasons.

So tell us Mascher what were the actual reasons you wanted out of your contract?

I have to say that I really liked him as a player, didnt want him to go but understood why he would want to leave for those family reasons we all thought were the case. Now I've lost my respect for him and simply think that he shafted us.

End of..

 

[Dreambeliever]

[quote author=Jack D Rips link=topic=41756.msg1170247#msg1170247 date=1283730419]
Forget about Carra. The real argument here is about the reasons Mascher left.

For over a year now we were all agreed that he should be allowed to leave for family reasons. So he leaves for Barca having forced that. But then we hear that he claims the club were lieing by saying that it was for family reasons.

So tell us Mascher what were the actual reasons you wanted out of your contract?

I have to say that I really liked him as a player, didnt want him to go but understood why he would want to leave for those family reasons we all thought were the case. Now I've lost my respect for him and simply think that he shafted us.

End of..
[/quote]

Mash was my fav player while he was here.

I loved watching him play. So much heart, determination and desire.

 

[Y1]

"I'll tell you what I would say to him. I'd say he never knocked Liverpool off their fucking perch. That's nonsense that. Graeme Souness did that. United were competing with Norwich and Aston Villa for their first title. They weren't competing with Liverpool, were they?"

This is an excellent sound bite from our 23 Carra Gold.