Can England win the World Cup?

[Fox]

yes there is still gerrard on the left, heskey still playing and the english mentality but bar Spain and Brazil alot of top sides are struggling so surely this is a good chance for us.

Capello is a legend, would love him to replace Rafa when he has had enough or we have. He has sorted a right bunch of show offs out and got them playing for their place.

I enjoy watching England again (not friendlies so much) and I think we have a decent chance of at least semi finals.

We have always been short of goals hence why we end up in so many penalty shootouts, now we are scoring for fun.

If we beat Croatia comfortably on wednesday I really will believe we have a decent shout.

anyone else?

 

[Stulikesdrums]

No European team wins the WC when it is not in Europe.
Brazil ftw.

 

[spider-Neil]

cruff said - (paraphrashing) 'england have no perticular style of play but the longer they go the better they get'

so its a case of surviving the group stages and then it's anyones game. the key will be how they defend because usually it's a case of grabbing the lead and then hanging on for dear life. they've got a chance but they need their big players to perform and their lesser players to be at the very least competant.

 

[gkmacca]

England might have a chance if they stop talking about winning it and just concentrate on playing the next game. The same with us and the league. We've both become the most neurotic of chatterboxes, assisted by premature media hype.

 

[spider-Neil]

also the press/media should concentrate on the team not the wives and girlfriends of the team, the coverage of the last world cup was a fucking joke.

 

[Stulikesdrums]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939939#msg939939 date=1252397212]
also the press/media should concentrate on the team not the wives and girlfriends of the team, the coverage of the last world cup was a fucking joke.
[/quote]

Yes, they should, but you know there isn't a fucking chance of that.
But the England players don't help themselves either.
Only last week Terry was saying the usual 'We have a good enough sqaud to win it, we are one of the favourites' tripe. Why do the England players always play up to it?

 

[Rosco]

England have a great chance of winning the World Cup.

Look at the the squad - they have the best defence in the world. Cole and Johnson are the best fullbacks in world football at the moment, Terry and Ferdinand are miles better than anything Argentina and Brazil can put on the field.

Then you have the midfield containing two of the best attacking midfielders in the world in Gerrard and Lampard. Supplemented by one of the most underrated holding midfielders in the game in Gareth Barry. Alongside them you have a selection of great wingers - SWP, Ashley Young, Beckham.

Up front you currently have a partnership of Donkey and Shrek which seems to bring the best out of Rooney. You also have the luxury of calling on Crouch (whose scoring record in internationals is exceptional), Defoe who is in red hot form, and also the fall back option of one of the best English strikers ever in Michael Owen.

Frankly if England don't win it, Capello should be sacked.

Look at last weeks Argentina v. Brazil game. Would you be worried about a Brazil side when their best midfielder is Gilberto Silva ? Would you be worried about trying to score against an Argentine defence containing Heinze ?

 

[keniget]

England have a decent chance as there aren't that many outstanding teams these days.

Spain are probably the only team that consistently impress.

The problem is that it's England. They bottle it on the big occasion and still don't look like a team.

 

[FoxForceFive]

the biggest obstacle in Englands way is their mental strength IMO. Everything else is there

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Stu link=topic=35711.msg939944#msg939944 date=1252397724]

Only last week Terry was saying the usual 'We have a good enough sqaud to win it, we are one of the favourites' tripe. Why do the England players always play up to it?
[/quote]

I know. If there's one quality, on and off the pitch, that the England team radiates it's stupidity. They usually play stupid football in key matches - they don't often get outplayed as such, but nearly always outwitted - and, as you say, they always get drawn into saying stupid things. Even players who seem sensible with their clubs, such as Gerrard, seem to get their brains deactivated when they join up with England.

 

[Stulikesdrums]

All of that is true Rosco, but England seem to have something ingrained into their mentallity about how not to win a major competiton, whether it is having a man sent off at crucial stages of the game (Beckham & Rooney) or just being shit at taking penalties. There always seems to be something.

Brazil might not have the steadiest defence, but when in the last 30/35 years has that not been the case? The have the attacking talent to outscore anyone but more importantly than that, they know how to put it together over a 3/4 week period and win a competiton.

 

[Y1]

The question should be asked - Has England or Brazil hit top form too early? 9 months is a long time to maintain form.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=Stu link=topic=35711.msg939954#msg939954 date=1252398532]
Brazil might not have the steadiest defence, but when in the last 30/35 years has that not been the case? The have the attacking talent to outscore anyone but more importantly than that, they know how to put it together over a 3/4 week period and win a competiton.
[/quote]

Brazil's defence isn't that bad. The difference between the old Brazil and the Brazil of today however is that they rely on it. They almost play like a Premiership side - very strong, physical, compact, organized and a major threat on the counter attack.

 

[Squiggles]

Of course they can

Much, much less talented sides have won the WC than the one England have at their disposal.

They still need to somehow unlock Gerrard or Lampard for England, IMO. Neither are really pulling their weight compared with their effectiveness for their clubs; however Capello is the perfect man for the job. He'll have put an end to the playboy mentality of Sven, the primitive tactics, 'kid in a sweet shop' McClaren, and finally has injected this team with the right mentality.

I don't think England will blow the world away with their football because for whatever reason the team has never gelled as well as it could have. But the defence will certainly remain solid and there's enough creativity on the pitch to outscore anybody.

If we don't get to the Semi's I'll be very disappointed. This team owes the country.

 

[Judge Jules]

Agree.  Capello's a winner.  If anyone out there can take this squad all the way, he can.  England aren't favourites, but they certainly are good enough to come through on the rails if the favourites slip up.

Incidentally, while it's true that European teams haven't won outside of Europe, Holland and West Germany came pretty damn close.  This tournament won't be held in South America, as previously on most occasions when S.American teams won it, so those teams may not have quite the advantage they've had previously outside of Europe.

 

[Ryan]

No.

In reply to rosco - they always have quality, all over the park. Yet they never go beyond the quarter finals. Don't be fooled by their comfortable path through the qualifiers, they nearly always progress through these things with minimal fuss, and their group is a fuckin easy one.

Twice in recent memory they haven't been capable of beating a very average portugese side, which is saying a lot.

England are in the second tier of international sides around the world.

 

[jexykrodic]

Yes.

There have been some very ordinary winners of the World Cup, witness Italy last time out.

It seems to me that mental attitude is as, if not more important than, the perceived talents of individuals or squads.

If Capello can prepare his team well and instill them with the belief then they are capable of beating any other team.

 

[gkmacca]

One of the weaknesses many England managers have shown in the past has been a preference for reputations over form and fitness. Greenwood had a crocked Keegan as a passenger. Robson - farcically - had perma-crock Captain Marvel Bryan Robson as a passenger. Sven had Owen, Beckham and Rooney. Capello actually seems shrewd about this point, which is one thing that bodes well.

 

[spider-Neil]

one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.

 

[Stulikesdrums]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

Do they not wrap the league up a couple of weeks earlier in a World Cup year?

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=35711.msg939988#msg939988 date=1252402230]
One of the weaknesses many England managers have shown in the past has been a preference for reputations over form and fitness. Greenwood had a crocked Keegan as a passenger. Robson - farcically - had perma-crock Captain Marvel Bryan Robson as a passenger. Sven had Owen, Beckham and Rooney. Capello actually seems shrewd about this point, which is one thing that bodes well.
[/quote]

also they continually play the star players hoping they find their form. when shearer was out of form, 'oh, give him one more game he will come good', (nothing) 'oh, give him one more game he will come good', (nothing) ten games later 'YES! shearer is BACK!!'. farcial. play the people in form, if the star in question wants his place back he should rise to challenge, the bar shouldn't be lowered to accomadate the star who is going through a rough patch.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

True. Other countries are fortunate that they don't have Leagues. Or players that play in England.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg939996#msg939996 date=1252402677]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

True. Other countries are fortunate that they don't have Leagues. Or players that play in England.
[/quote]

their leagues aren't as tough (well maybe spain) or gruelling. top english players like gerrard, rooney, lampard will be involved in every game and probably the later rounds of the CL.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939999#msg939999 date=1252403020]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg939996#msg939996 date=1252402677]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

True. Other countries are fortunate that they don't have Leagues. Or players that play in England.
[/quote]

their leagues aren't as tough (well maybe spain) or gruelling. top english players like gerrard, rooney, lampard will be involved in every game and probably the later rounds of the CL.
[/quote]

Whereas the Spanish side that won the Euros containing Torres, Fabregas, Arbeloa and Alonso were all given a two month layoff prior to the tournament?

 

[Mors]

There's no 'can', we will win it.

 

[themn]

They can but they won't.

 

[Oncy]

Of course they can. They wont. Spain are by miles the best team in the world Iniesta, Xabi, Silva, Xavi, Riera, Fabregas, Senna......*deep breath*......joaquin, Mata, Vicente behind them........Villa, Torres.....its just a different league between the two.
We dont have a Left midfielder and even now we're playing Lampard and Gerrard by squeezing Gerrard (the best am/ss in the world) out left. I cant see it.
We can. We wont. Quarter finals at best.....again.

 

[themn]

[quote author=Mors link=topic=35711.msg940006#msg940006 date=1252403266]
There's no 'can', we will win it.
[/quote]

You do realise this isn't a "can we win the premiership ?" thread ?

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg940004#msg940004 date=1252403230]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939999#msg939999 date=1252403020]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg939996#msg939996 date=1252402677]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

True. Other countries are fortunate that they don't have Leagues. Or players that play in England.
[/quote]

their leagues aren't as tough (well maybe spain) or gruelling. top english players like gerrard, rooney, lampard will be involved in every game and probably the later rounds of the CL.
[/quote]

Whereas the Spanish side that won the Euros containing Torres, Fabregas, Arbeloa and Alonso were all given a two month layoff prior to the tournament?

[/quote]

that's the european championship. what's the record of european teams winning the world cup (outside of europe)?

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg940020#msg940020 date=1252404236]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg940004#msg940004 date=1252403230]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939999#msg939999 date=1252403020]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35711.msg939996#msg939996 date=1252402677]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35711.msg939991#msg939991 date=1252402447]
one big problem is the league is long and hard and doesn't leave a long time to prepare for the world cup group stage.
[/quote]

True. Other countries are fortunate that they don't have Leagues. Or players that play in England.
[/quote]

their leagues aren't as tough (well maybe spain) or gruelling. top english players like gerrard, rooney, lampard will be involved in every game and probably the later rounds of the CL.
[/quote]

Whereas the Spanish side that won the Euros containing Torres, Fabregas, Arbeloa and Alonso were all given a two month layoff prior to the tournament?

[/quote]

that's the european championship. what's the record of european teams winning the world cup (outside of europe)?
[/quote]

I don't know, or care.

I do know that England haven't come close to winning anything in over 40 years, and every 2 years this discussion pops up accompanied by misguided optimism, and then followed by excuses and scapegoating whenever their latest failure happens.