Building upon success

[Richey]

I would reckon almost everyone would agree that next season will be even tougher, I don't think anyone has said it won't be.

Yep, sure. And my point was regarding how we deal with that.

As I said, I don't think that losing yesterday suddenly means we are shit. It doesn't change the fact that we have been the best team in England this season. It doesn't in any way devalue what we have done this year. That would be an overreaction.

But it should be a warning (combined with the fact that we were declining in February and March) that we do need to be looking at strengthening in the summer.

 

[6TimesaRed]

When did this City get their act together thing begin? yesterday?

Cos they lost to Chelsea last week.

Yes they will strengthen, yes they are our biggest rivals yes we need to build on success -100% agree on all those points.
we lost to them 5-1 a few seasons ago and it toughened us up loads. We all know that the two teams are so much closer than the scoreline suggests.
The players have been waiting to win the league since the lockdown, they've been immensely professional for years.

They will probably end up with 3 Trophies.. Despite being outplayed by ourselves in the league most of the Season

 

[peterhague]

I agree with a lot of what Ninja has said here. The top sides down the years have built on success, and as had been said elsewhere, the harder work is retaining the title.

In terms of this season, last night didn't really matter, of course. We won the league, and that is the important thing. But it is as clear a reminder as there is that our closest rivals are capable of destroying our full stength side. And that is our closest rivals who will be desperate to get the title back and won't be afraid to strengthen to do so.

We have looked pretty poor since the restart, and actually we were hardly at our best in the month or so before lockdown either (couple of defeats, a few scraped wins).

Maybe with another break and pre-season training we will reset, and sort things out, but we are kidding ourselves if we don't think that next season is gonna be even tougher and we don't need to at least think about strengthening to deal with it.

We were great against Palace tbf.

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

not so sure, even when we were 15 pts up there was pressure.

As champions if we get 10 pts clear it’ll be done.

It will 100% be tougher. This is likely to be City's lowest points total for years. They will not drop as many next year.

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

Yep, sure. And my point was regarding how we deal with that.

As I said, I don't think that losing yesterday suddenly means we are shit. It doesn't change the fact that we have been the best team in England this season. It doesn't in any way devalue what we have done this year. That would be an overreaction.

But it should be a warning (combined with the fact that we were declining in February and March) that we do need to be looking at strengthening in the summer.

Yep. I'd agree with you but yours is a lot more reasonable than the opening post.

 

[6TimesaRed]

It will 100% be tougher. This is likely to be City's lowest points total for years. They will not drop as many next year.

Which is absolutely key why we need to strengthen, to aid building upon our success

Man Utd and Chelsea will both be much stronger next season

 

[Dreambeliever]

It will 100% be tougher. This is likely to be City's lowest points total for years. They will not drop as many next year.

Maybe, maybe not. Depends on a number of factors. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them be just as inconsistent next year.

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

Which is absolutely key why we need to strengthen

Man Utd and Chelsea will both be much stronger next season

I agree we need to strengthen but that doesn't mean your original post wasn't completely over the top.

 

[Atlas]

They will probably end up with 3 Trophies.. Despite being outplayed by ourselves in the league most of the Season

I appreciate that but

A- would people swap this?
B- They are still an excellent, top club with (as much as he's a dick) a quality manager. To deny this is ridiculous.

Things change quickly in football and the world.

I'm in total agreement we need to focus the transfer activity and get in a couple of quality players for sure.
On the other hand, the Covid thing might affect the transfer market and City upcoming ban and associated challenges will also have an impact on their transfer activity.

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

Maybe, maybe not. Depends on a number of factors. I wouldn’t be surprised to see them be just as inconsistent next year.

I would reckon a new centre half and maybe having Laporte fit for longer will make a huge difference. Plus if the CL ban is upheld the league will be 100% their main priority.

 

[Beamrider]

I think a few other factors cost us last night:

1. The intensity of behind closed doors footy is visibly lower, and so much of our game is built on intensity. We were slow-paced against Everton and it cost us a couple of points and we were off the pace last night and rightly punished. No one seems to be saying it in so many words so I will - behind closed doors footy is shit, proper shit. And if it goes on too long the game will lose a lot of its appeal. In the absence of well-crafted goals, there's not much to enjoy and I can't be arsed to watch anyone other than us as the games don't hold my interest.
2. I also don't think the stop-start thing is helping us - with still being in the FA Cup, City had an extra game between our two and were able to keep their momentum going. Meanwhile our lads were getting wankered at Formby Golf Club.
3. When a team gets on top of us, we sometimes fold, and fold disastrously. It doesn't happen very often, but I think this is the other side of the coin of Klopp's passion - when we're on top it's great, but when we suffer a set-back, as last night, as in the game against City when Mane was sent off, the Lovren nightmare against Tottenham, we don't just lose, we lose big, and Klopp seems to lose interest - once the game is gone he doesn't seem to care about keeping the scoreline respectable. Same with Barca away, better finishing from them in those last 5 minutes and we'd have been 4 or 5 down, despite having played well.

But Klopp and his team have worked their bollocks off this season and delivered the trophy we've all been longing for. I'm not happy with how things panned out last night, but they get a pass from me. They've earned it.

 

[6TimesaRed]

I agree we need to strengthen but that doesn't mean your original post wasn't completely over the top.

I wouldn't say it was..

Last night was a reality check..

Whilst I wasn't bothered too much, coiled together with our recent form it highlights problems we may be facing moving forward.

We could learn a lot from the trophy winning mentality of Man City to continue our success over a sustained period..

Its certainly been great over last 12 months or so. But thats history now, there is now work to be done on and off the field to sustain it moving forward..

 

[The Nomad]

Fuck me.. yes we didn't play well, but they hardly battered us. We beat ourselves.

First half.
3 shots on target
3 goals

That's hardly a laughing stock.

 

[Hansern]

Talk about underreacting. Since City got their act together again they've looked better than us. And they'll strengthen. They're our biggest rivals and if you think the nature of that defeat was something to dismiss with a giggle you're in for a sobering surprise.

I dont think anyone is giggling, but I think most know that a one off game after we've won the league with 7 games to go, isnt something to worry to much about.
Its quite normal that the players mentality and concentration drop some percent when there isnt something to play for.

Roy Keane said as much regarding the Utd teams, Shanklys team didnt win any of their 3 games after winning the league in '64 and Paisley's team lost 5 of the last 6 after winning the league in '83. Its quite normal. If this was the start of the 20/21 season, then I'd be worried.

Man City away was probably the worst fixture to play after winning the league and having some days to celebrate. And the worst part is, the game wasnt that loopsided that warranted a 4-0 defeat anyway. They took their chances, we didnt.

This one game analysis for whats to come or how the team is evolving is very strange.

 

[6TimesaRed]

I dont think anyone is giggling, but I think most know that a one off game after we've won the league with 7 games to go, isnt something to worry to much about.
Its quite normal that the players mentality and concentration drop some percent when there isnt something to play for.

Roy Keane said as much regarding the Utd teams, Shanklys team didnt win any of their 3 games after winning the league in '64 and Paisley's team lost 5 of the last 6 after winning the league in '83. Its quite normal. If this was the start of the 20/21 season, then I'd be worried.

Man City away was probably the worst fixture to play after winning the league and having some days to celebrate. And the worst part is, the game wasnt that loopsided that warranted a 4-0 defeat anyway. They took their chances, we didnt.

This one game analysis for whats to come or how the team is evolving is very strange.

But isn't a one game analysis really is it.. ?

Crystal Palace game aside, our form has not been great pre and post lockdown in all competitions.

It highlights issues and the need to strengthen to sustain success moving forward..

That's exactly what this thread is about..

 

[Hansern]

But isn't a one game analysis really is it.. ?

Crystal Palace game aside, our form has not been great pre and post lockdown in all competitions.

It highlights issues and the need to strengthen to sustain success moving forward..

That's exactly what this thread is about..

Would you have started this thread if the game yesterday ended 1-1?
I struggle to see what the thread is about. The thread title is one thing, but the post in itself something completely different.

[bcolor=#fdfbf8]"Yesterday was an opportunity to lay down a marker, an absolute statement of intent..[/bcolor]​

[bcolor=#fdfbf8] Instead we wake up this morning to be a bit of laughing stock.."[/bcolor]​

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

I wouldn't say it was..

Last night was a reality check..

Whilst I wasn't bothered too much, coiled together with our recent form it highlights problems we may be facing moving forward.

We could learn a lot from the trophy winning mentality of Man City to continue our success over a sustained period..

Its certainly been great over last 12 months or so. But thats history now, there is now work to be done on and off the field to sustain it moving forward..

Nobody thinks there isn't work to be done. I think everyone agrees City will be very strong next year and as we've shown no club has a right to walk the league. Your post above is way at odds with your original post.

 

[6TimesaRed]

Would you have started this thread if the game yesterday ended 1-1?
I struggle to see what the thread is about. The thread title is one thing, but the post in itself something completely different.

[bcolor=#fdfbf8]"Yesterday was an opportunity to lay down a marker, an absolute statement of intent..[/bcolor]​

[bcolor=#fdfbf8] Instead we wake up this morning to be a bit of laughing stock.."[/bcolor]​

From our main rivals, who we should be concerned about.. we are..

Not taking away our success of winning the League..

We are struggling against big Teams at the moment in all competitions, beating City would have put that notion to bed as well as arguably laying a marker and an absoloute statement of intent..

They are our biggest rivals to winning Trophies, they may likely pick up another 2 for a domestic treble to maintain what some people would see as their superiority..

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

Who gives a shit what 'some people see as their superiority'? They are an excellent team, anybody could see that. Again, concern over a few games pre and post lockdown which is legitimate and your first post are completely at odds with each other.

 

[Hansern]

From our main rivals, who we should be concerned about.. we are..

Not taking away our success of winning the League..

We are struggling against big Teams at the moment in all competitions, beating City would have put that notion to bed as well as arguably laying a marker and an absoloute statement of intent..

They are our biggest rivals to winning Trophies, they may likely pick up another 2 for a domestic treble to maintain what some people would see as their superiority..

Our stats against the "top 6" this season;

Played 8 games: won 6, draw 1, lost 1.
A draw against Utd away and loss to City away after the title was won. Still to play Arsenal away and Chelsea at home.

I struggle to see how we perform worse against the top teams this season.

 

[Dreambeliever]

I would reckon a new centre half and maybe having Laporte fit for longer will make a huge difference. Plus if the CL ban is upheld the league will be 100% their main priority.

Silva is finished
Fernandinho is finished
Sane is gone
Ageuro will be 33

I don’t think they’ll have the stomach for it.

 

[6TimesaRed]

Our stats against the "top 6" this season;

Played 8 games: won 6, draw 1, lost 1.
A draw against Utd away and loss to City away after the title was won. Still to play Arsenal away and Chelsea at home.

I struggle to see how we perform worse against the top teams this season.

Are you forgetting other competitions and our form before lockdown ? [emoji849]

 

[6TimesaRed]

Silva is finished
Fernandinho is finished
Sane is gone
Ageuro will be 33

I don’t think they’ll have the stomach for it.

Behave..

They will just stregthen as always..

That Foden is a class act..

De Bruyne outstanding..

Bernardo Silva too..

They just need a Centre half, and someone to replace the outgoing Sane.. Job done..

They will add more obviously maybe in midfield.. Though Rodri is seen as the long term replacement for Fernandinho..

 

[LeTallecWiz]

City are the top challengers.

Arsenal may surprised if Saliba is as good as advertised, and Arteta is as good as Pep claims he is.
Chelsea are a goalie and ~2-3 additions to their backline from challenging for the league ... and that's assuming Kante doesn't move to Madrid.
Manure lack a goalie and their backline, bar Bissaka is average at best. I'm glad they're doing well now.

I still don't understand why one bad result - where we missed a lot of good chances - should worry us more than we were worried before?
We know we need 1 more good attacker - which is why we wanted Werner.
We know we need LB cover.
But we know we still have the best goalie in the world, top FBs, a top CB partnership, a solid midfield that does what is needed and a deadly front 3.
Yes, it will be much harder next year ... but I think we've been on for almost 1.5 years now in the league ... This was bound to happen eventually - and hopefully the gaffa will use it to ensure the troops are ready for next year's challenge.

 

[Hansern]

Are you forgetting other competitions and our form before lockdown ? [emoji849]

No, but we would probably have progressed against Atletico bar an Adriano howler. Shite happens, and it usually does the year after you win the whole competition.
The loss to Chelsea in the FA cup away. Again not to bothered. Look at the team we fielded. A team with some first team players combined with youth, thats a calculated risk away to another top 6 contender. City have had some of the most easy games in the cup competitions for a few years now. Its quite bizzarre really.

Our form before the lock down. Yeah, we were having some issues regarding form, but we only had one loss in the league, Watford away.
Still won the last league game before the lockdown, 2-1. 3 points. You can get much more than that regardless of form. And how the form would have been after that is impossible to know. We've lost 3 games in the last 2 years. Every game wont be pretty and the form will vary during a season.
Its why I hated Utds guts when they were winning. Playing like crap, but winning the game. Its the sign of Champions. That when you're bad, you can still get results.

And for all this talk about how we perform against the other top teams. Just look at City this season:

Played 10: won 4, drawn 1, lost 5.

 

[HC]

I wouldn't say it was..

Last night was a reality check..

Whilst I wasn't bothered too much, coiled together with our recent form it highlights problems we may be facing moving forward.

We could learn a lot from the trophy winning mentality of Man City to continue our success over a sustained period..

Its certainly been great over last 12 months or so. But thats history now, there is now work to be done on and off the field to sustain it moving forward..

How was it a reality check ?

Most players had like what 2/3 days of training after benders that went on for a day of two , we had ample chances to score and take the lead , it felt like a standard city match , take your chances or lose

 

[Aidan O' Neill]

Silva is finished
Fernandinho is finished
Sane is gone
Ageuro will be 33

I don’t think they’ll have the stomach for it.

How many of them played last night?

 

[Farkmaster]

I understand being annoyed at that result, and even more being angry if we don't take advantage of our position and strengthen.

But I'd be more annoyed if anyone who is actually at the club would make any different decision based on that result. This has been an incredible season but even just looking at the manner of it, huge swaths of it were gritty and uncomfortable. Yes, that's our team, but it need not be as much.

So no, don't dismiss it with a giggle, but if you can't giggle right now, hang it up. This is as good as it gets. It'll never be enough.

 

[tombrown]

Yesterday was an opportunity to lay down a marker, an absolute statement of intent..

Instead we wake up this morning to be a bit of laughing stock.

I personally don't think we are a laughing stock.

On page 1 of this thread. I stopped reading after that

 

[Halmeister]

Jesus Christ, have people always been this fucking finished? Or is it a recent thing with the internet and all that?

Yes, of course yesterday was a bit shit. Yes, of course you should always strengthen from a position of power and while you're on top. I don't think anyone at the club doubts any of that.

What IS embarrassing, however, is people coming on here labelling this group of players as twats and unprofessional, and questioning their mentality after everything they've achieved and the seemingly impossible odds they've overcome.

You're the real laughing stock here. Take a look at yourselves.