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Ole at the wheel choice...

Discussion in 'The Football Forum' started by Stevesquash, Oct 16, 2021.

?

Which do you prefer?

  1. Smash the scum, Ole sacked.

    6 vote(s)
    9.4%
  2. Smash the scum, Ole stays.

    58 vote(s)
    90.6%
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  1. Hass

    Hass Well-Known Member

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    Don't be silly. It will end in failure. DOF? What's Murtough doing there?
     
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  2. King Binny

    King Binny Part of the Furniture Honorary Member

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    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  3. FreshRed

    FreshRed Well-Known Member

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    Getting replaced, if they are smart.

    It could end in failure, for sure. But, this appointment has a much higher probability of success than the last 4 and, possibly includes some future vision, which would be a first in the Glazer era.

    I hope I am completely paranoid for no reason.
     
  4. rurikbird

    rurikbird Part of the Furniture Honorary Member

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    So they lurch from one manager to another for years and then, mid-season they make a “strategic,” long-term appointment in the form of a caretaker/consultant? Nah, that smacks of another box-checking exercise, not evidence of any kind of coherent plan. It’s kind of hard to square patiently building with younger players around a gegenpressing philosophy, which is what Rangnick is known for, with signing a 36-year-old Ronaldo.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2021
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  5. King Binny

    King Binny Part of the Furniture Honorary Member

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    I have a genuine question though - why, despite his reputation, did he end up at Lokomotiv Moscow (when there were so many managerial changes going on)?
     
  6. Hass

    Hass Well-Known Member

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    I'd like to know this. Last year when he was linked with the Chelsea job he turned it down saying he didn't want to be an interim manager so why the stance now? Because it's united? He won't have influence on signings in Jan if he's only there for 4 months. Various sources saying he will get some consultancy role after the summer. Wtf? Baffling
     
  7. rurikbird

    rurikbird Part of the Furniture Honorary Member

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    Didn’t he have some issues with depression or burnout a few years back? No laughing matter, obviously, but not sure watching Fred and Maguire every week will help...
     
  8. Hass

    Hass Well-Known Member

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    Hahahahaha
     
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  9. momoWASboss

    momoWASboss If you take me seriously then you’re an idiot Member

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    What’s he actually won? A single cup?
     
  10. FreshRed

    FreshRed Well-Known Member

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    I hope this is right! I am likely giving too much credit to the United board and the possibility that they have hit rock bottom and decided to change how they think about things.
     
  11. the count

    the count SCM's least favourite muppet Honorary Member

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    I don't know. They really cheer me up.
     
  12. Judge Jules

    Judge Jules SCM Addict Member

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    Maybe they want him as DoF but can't get Pochettino (or whoever) till the summer so have asked him to steady the ship meanwhile?
     
  13. Dreambeliever

    Dreambeliever From Doubter to Believer Member

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  14. Alan Hardaker

    Alan Hardaker Active Member

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    Undermined before he comes in. 6 months...what real authority does that give him. Most of the problems are down to player attitude. Lazy and complacent squad. Turn up one week, go missing the next. Pogba typical example when he's fit. Martial...wonders in and out of games as does Rashford. Maquire can't maintain any level of consistency. Ditto Shaw. Gone for a short term fix, usually means nobody has a vision. Mess.
     
  15. bluebell

    bluebell Well-Known Member

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  16. FreshRed

    FreshRed Well-Known Member

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    Exactly my fear.
     
  17. localny

    localny Well-Known Member

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    He's never managed a big club for a reason. It has potential, but only if he moves upstairs and oversees things and a new manager is OK, with that approach.

    Definitely has a higher probability of success, but other issues enhancing failure as well

    1. Never managed a big club with big egos
    2. Never won anything really of note.
    3. He's a generation removed from the spoiled brats of United in their 20's - that's a massive cultural gap
    I know it sounds much better, but after a few managerial bump wins, I'm thinking this is going to go badly.
     
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  18. Judge Jules

    Judge Jules SCM Addict Member

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    I'd love to agree, Niall, but I'm not so sure. As a DoF he could sadly turn out to be a good choice, being the guy who's done more than anyone to establish the Red Bull set-up. As a manager his record is more spotty, but he won't take any cr@p from the prima donnas in their changing-room and they badly need that.

    BTW the media are already getting on my wick with their pronunciation of his name. It's not "Ran-yick" FFS. Like the twerp who presents "Catchphrase" tells the contestants, say what you see. Rang-nick. Simples. :mad:
     
  19. Hansern

    Hansern SCM Addict Member

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    Getting in someone as interim manager for 6 months who hasn't been involved in management for a while to steady the ship, sounds like a recipe for disaster though.
    Hope it burns and that we'll see him fighting Ronaldo at the training ground.
     
  20. King Binny

    King Binny Part of the Furniture Honorary Member

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    Article: I met the man four times since he arrived in Moscow in July. I’ve turned down interviews with him (clash of schedules) twice and had questions submitted to him refused once. We did manage to chat off the record, while on the record he told me of his views on Moscow and his plans to make Lokomotiv a super club.

    Ralf Rangnick was brought in to revolutionise FC Lokomotiv Moscow ahead of a move to the Luzhniki Stadium. His bombast fizzled out with less than 5,000 fans watching Loko capitulate to a poor Akhmat Grozny at the RZD Arena last Saturday.

    Long lost summer of hope
    There were rumours going back to 2018 that Loko would move to the Luzhniki for big matches in the UEFA Champions League. The then-club CEO said never as he wanted to build an identity. Plus there would never be a demand for 60,000 tickets or more, even in 2019 when Cristiano Ronaldo and Juventus strolled into town.

    Having rid Loko of the putrid Olga Smorodskaya and her sport director son-in-law, the club went up a gear in 2016. In came former Zenit commercial director Ilya Gerkus and he brought back fan legend Yuri Semin. To remove the smell of corruption and Semin’s sticky fingers from transfer dealings, he made a huge step in appointing former Schalke 04 man Erik Stoffelshaus the next year. The German made an immediate impact with low-to-no cost signings like Maciej Rybus, Jefferson Farfan and Eder, who fired Loko to a shock 2017-18 Russian Premier League win.

    On and off the field the club were thriving, but worrying sounds came from Russian Railways (the club’s owner) and Yuri Semin. Semin was peeved that he was no longer the sole arbiter of who to buy and sell, even moreso when his friends in the south of Spain were out of the loop. Eventually, in mid-December 2018, eight months after winning the league, two of the men most responsible for the on and off field revolution in the east of Moscow were gone.

    In the kitchen
    Back in 2007 I had my first experience working on a project with Lokomotiv Moscow. Since then I’ve dealt with them in a media and professional sense every year since. There were personnel changes, ups and downs, but it always felt more homely than any other Moscow club. In 2016 I’d the depressing experience of seeing them play an almost dead rubber in front of 5,000 fans and the club actually setting the police on them.

    When Ilya Gerkus came in, then Erik Stoffelshaus, I was a little skeptical, but gave them time. Changes were made, putting supporters first, bringing in really good professionals at every level of the club and proper plans into action. They were raking in more money than boastful Spartak and winning everywhere. But Semin was unhappy. While I was working on a Capital FM-Lokomotiv project, he avoided interviews because he had his go-to fanboys in the media to use, he made sure the only news was anti-Gerkus/Stoffelshaus. He lasted another year and a bit before he too was shafted by new forces moving within the club.

    By this time, Loko had purged the club of the professional media and commercial staff, because high priced staff were no longer needed. I was still in the kitchen, as they say here, but almost out the back door. Despite a friendly facade, they were gradually withdrawing from the local community.

    German revolution
    A plan was hatched to move Lokomotiv Moscow from the 20-year-old RZD Arena to the Luzhniki in 2020. Ostensibly to renovate the area and stadium, as there were some minor issues with the roof. However those involved saw dollar signs. Where Lokomotiv Moscow are located, in Cherkizovo, there are fine transport facilities and the entire area contains not only the main RZD Arena, but also the 10,000 all-seater Sapsan Arena, an indoor multisport centre and ice rink. A full size field within an air dome, a park, academy housing, a multi-story car park, tennis courts and a number of outdoor training fields – including a full-size field with an identical surface to the RZD Arena.

    When one of the directors of the club said in April this year “this is a huge piece of real estate”, he let the cat out of the bag. A Roman Abramovich associate, Evgeni Merkel, appeared on the Board of Directors and the big man himself was supposed to be buying a stake. The truth was far more unpalatable. A 50-year lease with the operating company for the Luzhniki Stadium had a clause in it that the club would immediately rent a training field within the complex for a minimum of 10 years, beginning in June 2021. The club are still paying heavily for this, while not using it. The plan was to move the club and sell the land for redevelopment. Moscow needs housing and the area is within the MKAD (Moscow Circle Road) which is the accepted boundary of the city and it’s power.

    Once rumours became louder and leaks wetter, the Mayor of Moscow, Sergei Sobyanin, announced that Lokomotiv would not be moving to the Luzhniki and that there would be no way the Lokomotiv sports complex would be sold off for redevelopment. The trouble was, they’d already taken a downpayment for the sale, signed off on the training facilities at the Luzhniki and brought in Ralf Rangnick on a contract higher than any of the players at the club to “create a Russian Red Bull”.

    When he told me that in our first meeting, alarm bells went off in my head. Six years ago I wrote about it on these pages and until now not a single journalist has investigated Red Bull, nor have any football authorities. Ralf’s dream of a Red Bull in Moscow had turned even the most dedicated from the club, except journalists who were desperate for a quote or two.

    With Rangnick came Spartak Moscow reject Thomas Zorn as technical director and lots of odd transfer dealings, topped off with massive agents fees. This was no surprise, except to Russian sports media, given the CEO appointed by the club owners. A fish rots from the head down and Lokomotiv were back in the bad old days of 2016. The players who arrived in where largely terrible. Alexis Beka Beka has been ok but the others like Tin Jedvaj, Tino Andjorin and Gyrano Kerk, remain baffling choices. The senior players at the club also rejected his ideas and “advice”, with some willing to go on the record with their complaints.

    Top down chaos
    As Loko crashed to a 2-1 loss against one of the worst away teams in the league last Saturday, I noticed the camera zoom in on both Ralf and the man who installed him, Vladimir Leonchenko, the club CEO. To say that Leonchenko is out of his depth is an understatement. The former journeyman footballer, wannabe agent and dupe for one of the blackest of black eyes for Russian football, the Professional Footballer and Coach and Agent Union, Leonchenko was at his lowest ebb.

    Having signed Rangnick to a €2.3million-a-year contract, given him tens of millions to spend and then letting him install a puppet, Gisdol, on the bench, Leonchenko was swimming with bigger sharks than even at Fakel Voronezh. After being the face of the disgraced PSFT, he was desperate to have all traces removed once his benefactor was hounded out of FIFPRo. At Loko he knew by August he’d made an almighty mess. He desperately tried to hang onto his job by offloading Rangnick, Zorn and Gisdol last month, yet there were no takers. Now, Manchester United look like willing gillies.

    Rangnick fit in perfectly to the absolute madness at Lokomotiv Moscow. They purged themselves of top level media and sales operators. They alienated supporters and former players. Even community clubs, like my own Moscow Shamrocks GAA Club, found it hard to keep up with rent increases each quarter. Sponsors have not renewed contracts and the product on the pitch has also become difficult to sell. If Serbian Marko Nikolic’s conservative style was tough, the anti-revolution dross at the RZD is worse.

    The English media will talk now about gegenpressing. About intensity. Manchester United fans will want to see him push their failing stars. Yet not one, I guarantee you, not one will point out his links to Bernd Pansold at Red Bull, nor his disdain for anti-doping. He has a history that will not be explored, but as with all fanbases, will any care if he gets results?

    King Ralf will be happy to get away from Moscow, he’ll have another few months with a fat contract and possibly the players at Old Trafford might not refuse to follow his “program”, as happened at Lokomotiv. Lokomotiv Moscow’s gain is now Manchester United’s loss.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2021
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