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When will Jurgen Flopp learn...

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Glock21

HMS2001
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...that in PL you fucking need at least a fucking striker up front. Playing with false 9 majority of the game are suicidal.

Almost 1 and half months into the job and he did nothing. Half way into the season and we got fucked by smaller teams. Shit.

Jurgen Flopp is an overhyped, inept manager which will not win us the title. Fuck the Bundlesliga title hype!

Sadly now, and the truth is that we will finish 6th behind Manure, no Champions League to play, no top class players joining us in the summer.

Its a mistake to extend his contract until 2022. Big mistake.

Ok children, i know you miss me, please behave and reply wisely. Blind faith aint going to get you nowhere.
 
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It's too soon to make a judgment call on Klopp. Over Half the squad he didn't buy. Hes got another Season at the very least in my book..

Striker and defence has to be a priority in the Summer
 
I nearly stopped reading when I saw the tired and lazy play on his name. Is it not possible to actually debate without it being polarised and using pretty shite and unfunny names for the players and manager.

In terms of the actual debate, it's been two months since this "slump" started in terms of results but if you look a bit further back to West Ham at home in December, it looked like this kind of form was possible.

Solutions? Well I know it's de rigeur to get on Lucas' back but since when was he the solution to our centre back problem? Lovren has never looked a consistent, stable performer since he joined. Klavan has not had many real opportunities but for the price has looked good. Matip looked great pre his injury, Gomez is just back after long term injury and we let Kolo and Sakho go.

Look at the recent consistent teams in a defensive context and there's consistency in the CB position. This also helps the keeper as they get to know each other as a unit. We've had x3 transfer windows since Jurgen arrived. We've conceded 50 league goals a season for at least the past 4 seasons. So it's pretty clear where the issues lie. We don't know the money he has or hasn't had to spend, but two CBs who look value for money but wouldn't get into any of our rivals first XI is pretty telling for me.

Plus we are missing a truly nasty, spiteful, enforcer in midfield. Henderson can run all day and in my opinion his contribution is underrated by many. But he's not an enforcer and he's not a consistent tackler or one to roll his sleeves up when it becomes a battle. I miss Mascherano.

Back to Klopp. Playing Lucas at CB invites the opposition on. Yes he's played well at CB on occasion, but he's not a CB for a side wanting to be in the Top 4/ contending for the title.

It's not his team yet, but is that because he's got a stubbornness in the market to only go for the top target or is it that he's financially hamstrung by the owners in the market. I like that he wants players who want to buy in to his philosophy and the long term plan. I like that he says we are not the club for players who just want high wages.

I'd also add that our preXmas results and form have sent expectations soaring in parts of our fan base. We have a good first XI but our 25 man squad is not as strong as other contenders around us. I want to see him address the CB issue this summer and a proper DM too.

But the last few performance have looked tired, de-motivated and seriously lacking in confidence. You just knew we would lose to Leicester - I hope people took the 9/2 on Leicester on Monday night because that was a gift - that's the worrying thing. You could see it but we couldn't prevent it. The moment Vardy put that marker down on Mane in the first couple of mins, you just knew. That's when I placed my bet on Leicester.

We need to salvage what we can from the rest of the season. Klopp needs to use his motivational skills to get them firing again. If this continues, then I won't see the season as progression.
 
Regardless of the players you have, the tactics we have deployed against the 'weaker' sides this season don't work and Klopp doesn't seem to be learning that.
While great players can often paper over the cracks in tactics and or formation it's not always the case. Even with better players the way we approach these games would lead to defeat.

The first thing that needs to change is how Klopp sets us up in these games
 
Regardless of the players you have, the tactics we have deployed against the 'weaker' sides this season don't work and Klopp doesn't seem to be learning that.
While great players can often paper over the cracks in tactics and or formation it's not always the case. Even with better players the way we approach these games would lead to defeat.

The first thing that needs to change is how Klopp sets us up in these games
I can't disagree with that.
 
I can't disagree with that.
I was stunned at how we set up against them. Everyone knew they would try to do that and we played right into their hands.
Rediculous and he doesn't even have the excuse of being new, they did it to us last season and to everyone else.
 
I was stunned at how we set up against them. Everyone knew they would try to do that and we played right into their hands.
Rediculous and he doesn't even have the excuse of being new, they did it to us last season and to everyone else.

The funny thing is a large part of their failure this season is that everybody in the league knows exactly how they are going to play and sets up to deny them. Once they don't get space behind to run into they are a fairly one dimensional side. Sadly we are even more one dimensional and lacked the capacity to negate their incredibly obvious tactic. Either that or we were so arrogant we figured that we could give them a free run at our porous defence and still beat them.
 
The funny thing is a large part of their failure this season is that everybody in the league knows exactly how they are going to play and sets up to deny them. Once they don't get space behind to run into they are a fairly one dimensional side. Sadly we are even more one dimensional and lacked the capacity to negate their incredibly obvious tactic. Either that or we were so arrogant we figured that we could give them a free run at our porous defence and still beat them.
Yep so people can use Lucas as a scapegoat all they like, this one is squarely on Klopp
 
Yep so people can use Lucas as a scapegoat all they like, this one is squarely on Klopp

It's on Klopp for picking him, but Lucas can be criticised for being consistently at fault for goals. Ok, so it's not his fault he's been used at centre half, but it's been a facet of his game anyway, to be a liability.

Klopp is baffling me playing Lucas while his own signing sits on the bench, so the whole "oh it's not his team" crap is just grating. He said at the start of the season this is "his" team, he's happy with who he kept, who he got rid of and who he brought in. The rest is just excuses.
 
It's too soon to make a judgment call on Klopp. Over Half the squad he didn't buy. Hes got another Season at the very least in my book..

Striker and defence has to be a priority in the Summer

What a load of shite excuse, so a new manager need to bring a whole lot of his own choice of players so we can judge him fair and square?

Fuck it
 
If thats the case then its time for Flopp to go.

Don't be a dullard. He needs to start showing a bit more than he is, but it's still relatively early days. He needs backing big in the Summer, but the rest of the season now is down to him to start getting things right and to start changing things instead of persisting with the same things that just aren't working.

And contrary to the stuff posted in the match and post match threads, it's not a cliche or an empty observation to suggest he needs to get his team fired up for every game. It's his fucking job
 
I nearly stopped reading when I saw the tired and lazy play on his name. Is it not possible to actually debate without it being polarised and using pretty shite and unfunny names for the players and manager.

In terms of the actual debate, it's been two months since this "slump" started in terms of results but if you look a bit further back to West Ham at home in December, it looked like this kind of form was possible.

Solutions? Well I know it's de rigeur to get on Lucas' back but since when was he the solution to our centre back problem? Lovren has never looked a consistent, stable performer since he joined. Klavan has not had many real opportunities but for the price has looked good. Matip looked great pre his injury, Gomez is just back after long term injury and we let Kolo and Sakho go.

Look at the recent consistent teams in a defensive context and there's consistency in the CB position. This also helps the keeper as they get to know each other as a unit. We've had x3 transfer windows since Jurgen arrived. We've conceded 50 league goals a season for at least the past 4 seasons. So it's pretty clear where the issues lie. We don't know the money he has or hasn't had to spend, but two CBs who look value for money but wouldn't get into any of our rivals first XI is pretty telling for me.

Plus we are missing a truly nasty, spiteful, enforcer in midfield. Henderson can run all day and in my opinion his contribution is underrated by many. But he's not an enforcer and he's not a consistent tackler or one to roll his sleeves up when it becomes a battle. I miss Mascherano.

Back to Klopp. Playing Lucas at CB invites the opposition on. Yes he's played well at CB on occasion, but he's not a CB for a side wanting to be in the Top 4/ contending for the title.

It's not his team yet, but is that because he's got a stubbornness in the market to only go for the top target or is it that he's financially hamstrung by the owners in the market. I like that he wants players who want to buy in to his philosophy and the long term plan. I like that he says we are not the club for players who just want high wages.

I'd also add that our preXmas results and form have sent expectations soaring in parts of our fan base. We have a good first XI but our 25 man squad is not as strong as other contenders around us. I want to see him address the CB issue this summer and a proper DM too.z

But the last few performance have looked tired, de-motivated and seriously lacking in confidence. You just knew we would lose to Leicester - I hope people took the 9/2 on Leicester on Monday night because that was a gift - that's the worrying thing. You could see it but we couldn't prevent it. The moment Vardy put that marker down on Mane in the first couple of mins, you just knew. That's when I placed my bet on Leicester.

We need to salvage what we can from the rest of the season. Klopp needs to use his motivational skills to get them firing again. If this continues, then I won't see the season as progression.

We lost to Leicester because his stubborness in playing Firmino up front alone, no striker and also the fucking Lucas!

Matip was never going to be a top class centre back. Klavan just another average centre back. A poor mans Henchoz. Can consistently inconsistent. Milner another old turn who needs to retire at the end of the season. Clyne forgotten how to defend after 90 mins of attacking and running down the flanks.

Flopp is lost.
 
Regardless of the players you have, the tactics we have deployed against the 'weaker' sides this season don't work and Klopp doesn't seem to be learning that.
While great players can often paper over the cracks in tactics and or formation it's not always the case. Even with better players the way we approach these games would lead to defeat.

The first thing that needs to change is how Klopp sets us up in these games

He had the whole fucking January and February to think about this and all he did was?
 
If we could talk about football for a second, the point about the striker in the original post is hard to argue with.

Firmino is a perfect example of a 'second striker' - the player in a 4-4-2 or 4-4-1-1 who drifts deeper and picks up space in the channels and between the lines in support of the main front man. He would have been perfect in Benitez's system playing behind the striker.

As has been said many times, its incredibly difficult to win a league title if your central striker struggles to get over 10 a season.
 
It's on Klopp for picking him, but Lucas can be criticised for being consistently at fault for goals. Ok, so it's not his fault he's been used at centre half, but it's been a facet of his game anyway, to be a liability.

Klopp is baffling me playing Lucas while his own signing sits on the bench, so the whole "oh it's not his team" crap is just grating. He said at the start of the season this is "his" team, he's happy with who he kept, who he got rid of and who he brought in. The rest is just excuses.

Absolutely agree with this. No matter how poor Klavan could be, he would not have lost the aerial duel with Vardy that night. Lucas was just ....too fucking short.
 
If we could talk about football for a second, the point about the striker in the original post is hard to argue with.

Firmino is a perfect example of a 'second striker' - the player in a 4-4-2 or 4-4-1-1 who drifts deeper and picks up space in the channels and between the lines in support of the main front man. He would have been perfect in Benitez's system playing behind the strikers.

As has been said many times, its incredibly difficult to win a league title if your central striker struggles to get over 10 a season.

i'd say we stick with Origi up front and give him the confidence he need and Firmino, Lallana and Coutinho can help from behind. Origi has the pace, positioning to keep opposition defence on their toes all the time.

Until Flopp learn how to properly play with a pure striker up front until then we will get fucked by smaller and mid table teams.
 
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