We need to talk about Jurgen

[leftpeg]

I'm worried about him. I'm worried that the job and the people around him aren't living up to his expectations. He's obviously figured out by now that his squad is not short on talent but is almost completely bereft of bottle. Where he oozes fight and effort his players are weak of body, mind and spirit.

He's falling out with other managers on an almost weekly basis...and while I don't mind that I sense Klopp loves to be loved or at least respected and outside of Anfield, he's not getting much of either.

And then there's the press. He's doing a great job of keeping his spirits up during pressers but it's not hard to spot his understandable disdain towards some hacks and their lazy reporting. If results don't improve he's going to quickly grow to hate the English press and their intrusion on his private life.

It must be frustrating to him that he's having to try to instill a bond between players and fans that clearly doesn't come naturally any longer. He's putting an arm around the shoulder of the players who need it (eg Mignolet) and he's taking a harder line where it's required elsewhere (Sturridge). It must be doing his nut in that his coaching and management methods are so far not cutting through.

So I worry that while Klopp might be the man for Liverpool, are we the right club for him? Or is England the right country for him? This is already the biggest test of his managerial career and for him to stick around long enough to succeed, he's going to need a hearty appetite for it.

No need to panic just yet but before too long Klopp's commitment to the job is going to be tested...either by interest from elsewhere or just a sense of disillusionment. The club has to be in better shape when that time comes otherwise I fear it'll be auf wiedersehen Klopp.

 

[Frogfish]

Nah. You underestimate his resolve, especially since he's barely got his trainer wheels off in the PL ! He's going to love it here and he's going to be successful at LFC. Give the man time, he said himself 3-4 years.

 

[leftpeg]

Nah. You underestimate his resolve, especially since he's barely got his trainer wheels off in the PL ! He's going to love it here and he's going to be successful at LFC. Give the man time, he said himself 3-4 years.

I'm very happy to give him time...I'm less sure he'll give us time.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

So when the people of 6CM lamented how shit their club really were, they put on their Sack Klopp and mourned for days.

 

[mom]

Way way too early to be worrying about him.
He's gonna be just fine.
The only reason people are throwing hissy fits now is because they got ridiculously carried away with the mini run that we had. One minute we were gonna win the league and now, we have an absolutely shit squad.
We're closer to the former than the latter, but it's going to take time.

 

[leftpeg]

So when the people of 6CM lamented how shit their club really were, they put on their Sack Klopp and mourned for days.

That probably read better in your head than it does on the screen but it does rather miss the point. This isn't a 'sack Klopp' thread...that would be silly.

 

[mom]

So when the people of 6CM lamented how shit their club really were, they put on their Sack Klopp and mourned for days.

?

 

[leftpeg]

Way way too early to be worrying about him.
He's gonna be just fine.
The only reason people are throwing hissy fits now is because they got ridiculously carried away with the mini run that we had. One minute we were gonna win the league and now, we have an absolutely shit squad.
We're closer to the former than the latter, but it's going to take time.

I'm not throwing a hissy fit. I think Klopp is an outstanding coach and manager and is absolutely the man I want in this job. I just worry we, this league and this country aren't going to prove a good fit for him personally and sooner rather than later he'll just bugger off.

 

[Judge Jules]

Lefty mate, I rate you as a poster but I reckon the case you're trying to make here is a bit overcooked. Klopp's had just a couple of spats with other managers, the reason for them has been pretty specific (he's objected to some nasty tackling, from teams which have obv.set out to bully us) and, as an emotional guy (his own description of himself, and obv.true), he's made his feelings clear, but no more so than he did in the Bundesliga. I don't get the impression that either he or they have been massively concerned by what's happened, nor am I worried about his future relations with the media - they mostly seem to like him, so I don't anticipate a huge problem with them trying to find skellingtons in his cupboard. He does seem frustrated on the sidelines at times, but he's already said winning the title will take a few seasons to achieve and I feel sure he realises that this first season at least will necessarily be a voyage of discovery.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

I think what Carra said post Sunderland was bang on -
He was saying it's stupid to compare his record to Rodgers because it's Rodgers's team. He's working currently with a team that Rodgers assembled - that was POORLY assembled for the type of football Rodgers wanted to play. Now he's trying to work with a similar system with the same issues.

I think he's doing ok ... and I'm not worried if I'm honest with you because the man has always been about 'projects.' I just hope he gets the right players in Jan & the summer because the patience of our fans is rather low because we still think like we're a big club, which we're not.

 

[leftpeg]

Lefty mate, I rate you as a poster but I reckon the case you're trying to make here is a bit overcooked. Klopp's had just a couple of spats with other managers, the reason for them has been pretty specific (he's objected to some nasty tackling, from teams which have obv.set out to bully us) and, as an emotional guy (his own description of himself, and obv.true), he's made his feelings clear, but no more so than he did in the Bundesliga. I don't get the impression that either he or they have been massively concerned by what's happened, nor am I worried about his future relations with the media - they mostly seem to like him, so I don't anticipate a huge problem with them trying to find skellingtons in his cupboard. He does seem frustrated on the sidelines at times, but he's already said winning the title will take a few seasons to achieve and I feel sure he realises that this first season at least will necessarily be a voyage of discovery.

I hope you're right.

 

[Judge Jules]

Wizzy: yes, we are. We're clearly underperforming by a long way, but if we weren't a big club Jürgen Klopp would not be our manager.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

Am I the only one who's never been convinced about Klopp ?? Or is it taboo to ask this question ??

 

[Judge Jules]

I hope you're right.

So do I mate, and I know there are no guarantees. But the man badly wanted this job and I'm confident he did so with his eyes open.

 

[Judge Jules]

Am I the only one who's never been convinced about Klopp ?? Or is it taboo to ask this question ??

It's fair enough to ask, and you may not be, but I don't know what such doubts would be based on, given his record at Dortmund.

 

[leftpeg]

I'm not worried if I'm honest with you because the man has always been about 'projects.'

Indeed. And at Dortmund everybody at the club bought into his philosophy. Our existing bunch of overpaid shithouses don't share his enthusiasm for this project. If the players he brings in don't either, I think he'll be off in search of the next project.

 

[My_Blood_Bleeds_Red]

You meant his last season at Dortmund ?

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Indeed. And at Dortmund everybody at the club bought into his philosophy. Our existing bunch of overpaid shithouses don't share his enthusiasm for this project. If the players he brings in don't either, I think he'll be off in search of the next project.

I think most of the players do - the problem is they don't have the ability/consistency to implement it every game.

 

[gkmacca]

I get the sense Klopp puts a lot of trust in his assistants, the ones he brought with him from Dortmund, and these first few months have presumably been a period of serious analysis by them, whilst Jurgen has concentrated on lifting the mood, trying to get the basics changed in training and working on the mentality. The games themselves seem a bit surreal so far, like self-contained experiments, ideas to either be logged for later development or screwed up into a ball and thrown away. Hopefully pretty soon they'll get together and work out what's needed to push on.

 

[leftpeg]

So do I mate, and I know there are no guarantees. But the man badly wanted this job and I'm confident he did so with his eyes open.

To be fair he couldn't be expected to understand the enormity of the job, the limitations of his squad or the pressure of dealing with our shitty media until he'd actually climbed aboard. Liverpool, with all of its history and the opportunity to create a future, came calling so of course he couldn't resist. I'd say he's only just beginning to have his eyes opened to the reality.

 

[Jack D Rips]

Indeed. And at Dortmund everybody at the club bought into his philosophy. Our existing bunch of overpaid shithouses don't share his enthusiasm for this project. If the players he brings in don't either, I think he'll be off in search of the next project.

Why would he bring in players don't share an enthusiasm for his project?

 

[Judge Jules]

Macca: indeed, especially with the transfer window now upon us. It'll be even more interesting than usual to see whom we bring in - here's hoping we go for quality over quantity.

 

[leftpeg]

I think most of the players do - the problem is they don't have the ability/consistency to implement it every game.

Sorry LTW, I fundamentally disagree with that. The ability is there. The mentality, ambition and energy are sadly lacking.

 

[LeTallecWiz]

Sorry LTW, I fundamentally disagree with that. The ability is there. The mentality, ambition and energy are sadly lacking.

We can agree to disagree mate - it happens. I only wish you and your loved ones a happy new year! 🙂

 

[Judge Jules]

Why would he bring in players don't share an enthusiasm for his project?

One can't always tell, not fully anyway, whether that commitment is truly there until they actually arrive and start contributing to the common effort. I read lefty as referring to those who turn out not to share that enthusiasm after some time has gone by.

 

[leftpeg]

Why would he bring in players don't share an enthusiasm for his project?

Obviously he'll try to find those who do but there are no guarantees. And our recent history is littered with managers who bought players in good faith only to find their attitudes were utterly lousy.

 

[gkmacca]

Sorry LTW, I fundamentally disagree with that. The ability is there. The mentality, ambition and energy are sadly lacking.

Yep. It's a squad mainly of thickoes. Really dim-witted athletes. We need at least a couple of brains in there.

 

[Frogfish]

I'm very happy to give him time...I'm less sure he'll give us time.

He's proven himself to be one of THE most loyal managers in the game. You are doing the man a great discredit by doubting his resolve to see this through. Especially so after just a few games !

 

[Judge Jules]

Yep. It's a squad mainly of thickoes. Really dim-witted athletes. We need at least a couple of brains in there.

Interesting. Don't you think it's more of a backbone deficit than an intellectual one?

 

[leftpeg]

Interesting. Don't you think it's more of a backbone deficit than an intellectual one?

I think it's both. Ability is certainly not the issue.