United Post Match
- Thread starter Frogfish
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Well thank fuck I wasn't in Manchester. If we get top 4 I won't really care but its something to urgently fix next season to have a team shape that suits big game aways. 3 big losses where we look stupid
It was a good game though regardless.
Exactly this. They got their goals and knew it'd be enough.
We played ok to a degree but they completely nullified our front 3, which is a concern. De Gea didn't have to make any saves, which in a game where we dominated possession and were apparently 'on top' doesn't really stack up.
They identified and successfully targeted a weakness of ours and it gave them 2 goals. They also had another golden opportunity with Mata. Based on that, compared to our chances, they deservedly won even though we should have had a minimum of 2 penalties.
All of our best chances were from corners. Van Dijk is a huge asset in the threat he gives us.
How come Rashford wasn't booked for his celebration for the first goal when he ran into the crowd? That's always a booking (not that I think it should be). Then his foul for the yellow card he actually got. However, he should have been off.
WTF was Lovren doing trying to go through Fellaini? It was totally disproportionate and struck me that it was more of an ego thing in some vain attempt to hammer the pantomime villain. Given all his talk in the build up about his 'rivalry' with Lukaku, he showed himself right up.
Felt bad for Trent as it was clear they were targeting him. Can't help your own self-confidence especially when you're then exposed. However, its a lesson that will do him a huge favour for the years to come. Letting Rashford get the run on him and then charging in allowing him to cut back - if he'd measured his run, Rashford was screwed as he'd gone wide and on his weaker side - were poor errors which you can't afford at this level. However, that's exactly what Mourinho had identified.
Always shit losing against them and I've already had shit from workmates so Monday will be a long day. However, hopefully Sevilla knock them out on Tuesday now.
They identified and successfully targeted a weakness of ours and it gave them 2 goals. They also had another golden opportunity with Mata. Based on that, compared to our chances, they deservedly won even though we should have had a minimum of 2 penalties.
All of our best chances were from corners. Van Dijk is a huge asset in the threat he gives us.
How come Rashford wasn't booked for his celebration for the first goal when he ran into the crowd? That's always a booking (not that I think it should be). Then his foul for the yellow card he actually got. However, he should have been off.
WTF was Lovren doing trying to go through Fellaini? It was totally disproportionate and struck me that it was more of an ego thing in some vain attempt to hammer the pantomime villain. Given all his talk in the build up about his 'rivalry' with Lukaku, he showed himself right up.
Felt bad for Trent as it was clear they were targeting him. Can't help your own self-confidence especially when you're then exposed. However, its a lesson that will do him a huge favour for the years to come. Letting Rashford get the run on him and then charging in allowing him to cut back - if he'd measured his run, Rashford was screwed as he'd gone wide and on his weaker side - were poor errors which you can't afford at this level. However, that's exactly what Mourinho had identified.
Always shit losing against them and I've already had shit from workmates so Monday will be a long day. However, hopefully Sevilla knock them out on Tuesday now.
He also stopped us taking a quick free kick by kicking the ball away. He got away with all of it.
The new tactic though was for one of their players to just fall down in their own area when we were attacking, causing the nice ref to stop play. That's going to be interesting to see if it's a one-off or they use it again. It was ridiculous.
Mourinho has beaten Klopp twice in nine attempts. Klopp has the best record of any manager against Mourinho.
Anyone reading this would think the opposite was true. Your argument's been clouded by emotion today. Tomorrow, hopefully, you'll admit it.
Not for us he hasn't. I'm not arsed how they did when Dortmund played Madrid or whatever. Under Klopp's watch we've beaten Manure in the Europa and either drawn or got beaten in the league. Two defeats and three draws I think.
Maureen couldn't have scripted that game better for himself. Bullied his way to 2-0 then deployed the flat back 10.
We weren't good enough and he walked the managerial battle.
We weren't good enough and he walked the managerial battle.
A game of no surprises.
RB is our weak spot & it was exploited.
Hoof it long to nullify the high press.
2 banks of four sitting deep in and around the box - controlling & contesting the key space just outside the box.
Sitting deep nullifies our speed to get in behind.
Rely on our reliably fallible CB's to fuck up at some point.
Play on the counter and hope to convert whatever chances came.
That's Mourinho for you - nothing new or startling or earth-shatteringly amazing in terms of tactics.
The game was always going to hinge on who scored first.
I thought Klopp got it right - we started patiently and controlled possession. The pivotal moment was the first goal.
We're just not good enough to break down a fully focused, high end Mourinho team.
We're not solid enough at the back and the central midfielder trio of Can, Milner & Ox, while being perfectly capable against most teams, aren't good enough when space is that constricted.
RB is our weak spot & it was exploited.
Hoof it long to nullify the high press.
2 banks of four sitting deep in and around the box - controlling & contesting the key space just outside the box.
Sitting deep nullifies our speed to get in behind.
Rely on our reliably fallible CB's to fuck up at some point.
Play on the counter and hope to convert whatever chances came.
That's Mourinho for you - nothing new or startling or earth-shatteringly amazing in terms of tactics.
The game was always going to hinge on who scored first.
I thought Klopp got it right - we started patiently and controlled possession. The pivotal moment was the first goal.
We're just not good enough to break down a fully focused, high end Mourinho team.
We're not solid enough at the back and the central midfielder trio of Can, Milner & Ox, while being perfectly capable against most teams, aren't good enough when space is that constricted.
Why didn't Klopp try to remedy the problem that was obvious to everyone?
Lovren was getting bullied by Lukaku and was allowing himself to be dragged out of position. We used to defend against him high up the pitch when he was at Everton, because he got zero support and you could easily then take him out the game. The difference against United is that they get players around him to feed off the scraps, so if he wins the flick on, someone is in behind picking it up. Lovren kept leaving his position in the back four, creating a gap between TAA and VVD, so TAA was repeatedly finding himself exposed. It doesn't excuse his rather naive defending, but at least that can be put down to inexperience, his more experienced teammate did him no favours and his manager did nothing to change the problem. It was infuriating watching Klopp doing the typical animated angry pointing, it's no fucking good and doesn't wash when the problem is that apparent and is continuously being targeted - fucking change it!
Can wasn't having the greatest of games, but he'd have been best deployed by marking Lukaku and leaving a flat back four behind him. You don't go to Old Trafford and leave your back 4/5 horribly open line that. If you get among our back line and drag a player or two out of position, you know we'll have problem because of how brittle our confidence is defensively and how naive and open we still are.
Once again our problem was hesitating to fix an obvious problem in the game (see Spurs at Wembley, WBA at home in the cup). Lovren should never have played again after that Spurs game, and once again the idiot has been allowed to play in a big game and fuck us over. I hope the cunt is permanently resigned to the bin. Matip isn't all that but him or Gomez should get a go now until the end of the season and then we'd better buy a decent centre half to partner VVD. As Carragher said, anyone who thinks VVD was going to singlehandedly shore up our defense, is kidding themselves. Lovren is muck, while Matip and Klavan are squad players at best, although the latter was in very good form and inexplicably got dropped completely. While that fucking gobshite Lovren gets reprieve after reprieve.
Klopp needs to start getting more ruthless with players who've had too many chances - get rid of the deadwood in the Summer and buy players in positions where we are actually struggling, those players we've seemed to have needed forever and for some daft, unknown reason, still haven't bought. You're not telling me in the last 4 windows we couldn't have rectified the CD and DM issues. It's criminal both areas haven't been sorted yet. He also needs to start getting his shit together during games, the hesitancy to change things has been an ongoing problem.
And yes, yesterdays game is exactly the sort of tight match that highlights the problem with the lack of a credible playmaker. How many times did Milner, Can and AOC try to force the killer pass and get it horribly wrong? That's where you need a "specialist", who can pick that kind of ball.
Lovren was getting bullied by Lukaku and was allowing himself to be dragged out of position. We used to defend against him high up the pitch when he was at Everton, because he got zero support and you could easily then take him out the game. The difference against United is that they get players around him to feed off the scraps, so if he wins the flick on, someone is in behind picking it up. Lovren kept leaving his position in the back four, creating a gap between TAA and VVD, so TAA was repeatedly finding himself exposed. It doesn't excuse his rather naive defending, but at least that can be put down to inexperience, his more experienced teammate did him no favours and his manager did nothing to change the problem. It was infuriating watching Klopp doing the typical animated angry pointing, it's no fucking good and doesn't wash when the problem is that apparent and is continuously being targeted - fucking change it!
Can wasn't having the greatest of games, but he'd have been best deployed by marking Lukaku and leaving a flat back four behind him. You don't go to Old Trafford and leave your back 4/5 horribly open line that. If you get among our back line and drag a player or two out of position, you know we'll have problem because of how brittle our confidence is defensively and how naive and open we still are.
Once again our problem was hesitating to fix an obvious problem in the game (see Spurs at Wembley, WBA at home in the cup). Lovren should never have played again after that Spurs game, and once again the idiot has been allowed to play in a big game and fuck us over. I hope the cunt is permanently resigned to the bin. Matip isn't all that but him or Gomez should get a go now until the end of the season and then we'd better buy a decent centre half to partner VVD. As Carragher said, anyone who thinks VVD was going to singlehandedly shore up our defense, is kidding themselves. Lovren is muck, while Matip and Klavan are squad players at best, although the latter was in very good form and inexplicably got dropped completely. While that fucking gobshite Lovren gets reprieve after reprieve.
Klopp needs to start getting more ruthless with players who've had too many chances - get rid of the deadwood in the Summer and buy players in positions where we are actually struggling, those players we've seemed to have needed forever and for some daft, unknown reason, still haven't bought. You're not telling me in the last 4 windows we couldn't have rectified the CD and DM issues. It's criminal both areas haven't been sorted yet. He also needs to start getting his shit together during games, the hesitancy to change things has been an ongoing problem.
And yes, yesterdays game is exactly the sort of tight match that highlights the problem with the lack of a credible playmaker. How many times did Milner, Can and AOC try to force the killer pass and get it horribly wrong? That's where you need a "specialist", who can pick that kind of ball.
AOC is only decent when he has space to run into otherwise his pace is totally nullified. Hes useless against a packed disciplined defence. Lallana is about the only midfielder we have who can play in tight spaces since selling Coutinho.
No idea why people are clamouring to draw them in the CL. They are a terrible match up for us.
Fuck off.
Coutinho in that side ahead of any of the midfield three would have given us more chance of success, because he's better than the three of them.
We've done ok without him so far, but the midfield is still largely mediocre and inconsistent, it was better with him in it because he's top quality.
WHY?!?! What the FUCK is wrong with you?!
It's worth it
Well if it was Lukaku, Pogba or Sanchez and we won, it would have got a ton of likes by now
If you can't laugh at yourself, no point laughing
0-0 against West Brom at home when 2 of their only 3 wins this season came in their first three games. What use was he then?
The way to win yesterday was to have Lovren in a back four and not attacking Lukaku for headers, which after we watched him fuck up so much away at Spurs was clearly a midfielder's task, and in this case Can's job. How Klopp doesn't see this, I don't know.
Coutinho would have given us a different option (no doubt a better one), but when you consider just how congested it was, i don't know if he could have done much
I agree with woland. It's a tactical issue letting lovren come THAT far forward to challenge lukaku
Can should have been deeper, or just let lukaku win it unchallenged
I agree with woland. It's a tactical issue letting lovren come THAT far forward to challenge lukaku
Can should have been deeper, or just let lukaku win it unchallenged
Well you can all relax now. Dermot Gallagher has confirmed that Pawson got all the disputed decisions correct..
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