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Sunderland

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The thing is, we lose that ball far too easily. We're just not patient enough as a team. The mentality that Gerrard and Suarez in particular play with is to attack, attack, attack. They don't look to probe, are not patient, nor do they wait for openings. They're always trying to force the opening with an incisive pass or dribble. This means when we lose the ball (and it's often), Johnson and Enrique (who are instructed to almost play as wingers are sprinting back to get back into position and we're left exposed far too often).

I think it's quite simple. Be patient and keep the ball better! We need to realise, that the consequence more men forward means we're exposed to counters at the back. It's a balancing act. But if we keep the ball better as an attacking force, we simply won't be exposed to the counter so often. I think the defenders are doing the job they have been instructed to do, going forward (splitting etc). But it's the lack of discipline in midfield (Gerrard biggest culprit) and upfront (Suarez's must-turn-and-nutmeg-an-opponent-or-kick-it-off-his-heels mentality) that's been most costly for us.
 
------------------------Reina
Johnson-----Skrtel------Agger-----Enrique
------------ Henderson (Gerrard)
----------------Allen--------Sahin
Gerrard (Suarez)--------------------Sterling
-----------------------Borini
Never ever would i pick henderson.
 
I think it's a bit more complex than that, though I agree with the points you've mentioned Ibro, I do think the lack of a defensive anchor man is costly in this system, because when the fullbacks push on, it's his job to drop in, so the problem is two fold, we don't have one and the players trying to fill in lack the defensive instinct to make it successful in a positional sense. The midfield is nowhere at the minute, which is criminal given the players we have. I really would either change Gerrard's role or put him on the bench for a bit. Henderson is shite but he will sit and is disciplined so could do a job alongside Allen, as for Sahin, it's going to be difficult incorporating him as things stand. Shelvey deserves a chance more than any of them because he's looked more effective.
 
Henderson? Seriously?
He's decent in the tackle and is good at making sideways low-risk passing. And is capable of playing a disciplined, albeit low risk game. That's good enough for a defensive midfielder for me. We need someone to sit infront of the defence, and Gerrard doesnt seem to want to do it. And when he does, he invariably looks for the hollywood ball.
 
Henderson? Seriously?

We need to get it together at the minute, at least he'll hold his position and keep things simple, which is what we're missing with Lucas being out. Sahin is going to take a while to get upto speed, Gerrard has been rubbish for ages now, Shelvey deserves a chance and I'd put Henderson in there to sit alongside Allen. He might be limited but he'll sit infront of the defense and he'll cover more ground than most when he has to.
 
We need to get it together at the minute, at least he'll hold his position and keep things simple, which is what we're missing with Lucas being out. Sahin is going to take a while to get upto speed, Gerrard has been rubbish for ages now, Shelvey deserves a chance and I'd put Henderson in there to sit alongside Allen. He might be limited but he'll sit infront of the defense and he'll cover more ground than most when he has to.


For me, whilst Henderson was vastly overpriced. He's still a good player with potential. I look at him a bit like when Lucas arrived (and like other fans looked at Fletcher/Song/Flamini). Nothing extraordinary, but still relatively young and he has all the raw physical attributes you need for a midfielder. Can pass, is mobile, has a good engine, decent in the tackle, has a goodshot on him and is technically fine. I personally think he just needs education and encouragement in a specific role. He's young enough to learn and adapt. Mentally and tactically there's much room for improvement, but i don't look at him as a total dud. If he kept things simple and was a little bit more positive, then I don't see why he can't be a good player for us still.
 
We need to get it together at the minute, at least he'll hold his position and keep things simple, which is what we're missing with Lucas being out. Sahin is going to take a while to get upto speed, Gerrard has been rubbish for ages now, Shelvey deserves a chance and I'd put Henderson in there to sit alongside Allen. He might be limited but he'll sit infront of the defense and he'll cover more ground than most when he has to.
The game just passes him by, he really is pretty shit. He's not great defensively and not great going forward. I remember people on here saying how henderson will be great under rogers, ive yet to see that. Doesn't matter how much you polish it a turd is a turd.
 
The game just passes him by, he really is pretty shit. He's not great defensively and not great going forward. I remember people on here saying how henderson will be great under rogers, ive yet to see that. Doesn't matter how much you polish it a turd is a turd.

Yeah, and you've made your feelings obvious about him Glen. He's limited, as said, but he's also better than many have him painted. He played some great passes last week against Hearts that were once again deemed pointless due to shit forward play. He's not bad defensively and he'll keep it simple. And what? You've yet to see him be great under Rodgers? He hasn't figured in the league at all so that's a bit of a pointless observation.

I think most people appreciate he hasn't lived upto expectations, but he's not quite as bad as you and a few others paint him either.
 
I think Rodgers needs to realise that we need to be comfortable as a team first, before becoming expansive. It's cost us against WBA and Arsenal, being so open. It worked against City, but then we played that high line against them last season too and it worked then, it doesn't work in every game. We need to be controlling and compact, once we get players upto speed and aware of their team mates, THEN we can start to open up a bit more when we're comfortable in the setup and the lineup.

Definitely this. Just play keep ball to stifle the fuck out if the game & tire them. Then last 20/25 make a couple of changes (sterling maybe) & try to stretch them.
 
Yeah, and you've made your feelings obvious about him Glen. He's limited, as said, but he's also better than many have him painted. He played some great passes last week against Hearts that were once again deemed pointless due to shit forward play. He's not bad defensively and he'll keep it simple. And what? You've yet to see him be great under Rodgers? He hasn't figured in the league at all so that's a bit of a pointless observation.

I think most people appreciate he hasn't lived upto expectations, but he's not quite as bad as you and a few others paint him either.
And why hasn't he figured in the league? Because Rodgers doesn't think he's good enough. In fact if its true he offered henderson to fulham that how highly he rates him. He comes across as having a weak mentality hence why he plays it safe all the time and Rodgers said one of the things he looks for in a player is strong mentality.

Don't deny he did a few good passes against hearts credit where credit is due. But I can see rodgers trying to flog him off come next summer when he brings in other players. Shelvey has stormed ahead of him now, but in theory henderson is a better passer of the ball than shelvey, but shelvey has the strong mentality to try things even when it goes horribly wrong. Whereas Henderson would just never take the risk in the first place.
 
Definitely this. Just play keep ball to stifle the fuck out if the game & tire them. Then last 20/25 make a couple of changes (sterling maybe) & try to stretch them.
Yeah definitely agree. We are way too open at the moment. Lets just keep the ball, stifle the team and then push for it in the last 20 mins. Having sterling on in the last 20 mins when the team is tired would mean he could rip them a new one.
 
------------------------Reina
Johnson-----Skrtel------Agger-----Enrique
------------ Henderson (Gerrard)
----------------Allen--------Sahin
Gerrard (Suarez)--------------------Sterling
-----------------------Borini

OMG, IBROMURPH IS BACK!
 
OMG, IBROMURPH IS BACK!
Heh. Never really been away. Just been disillusioned with the last year and the way LFC has conducted itself in the media (the whole Suarez/Dalglish affair). Thus not been bothered to post about football. Just been visiting the forum.

But Rodgers is a manager I firmly believe in getting behind and one I have faith in. He'll make mistakes but I believe in the philosophy he is trying to implement, and that it will take TIME. Not 2 or 3 games, but 2 or 3 years. But with today's media, people will be calling for his head if we finish outside the top 10. Whereas I would be liable to give him another year to implement the strategy, which could have us finishing in the top 4 in a season or two, when the players have done enough repitition, for it to stick.

P.s. Brizzle - don't recognise the name. What was your previous username?
 
Steven Fletcher to run wild.

Sunderland 3 - Liverpool 1.

Fletcher WILL score.

When the opposition make a new signing whose deemed to be generally shit, have a player who hasn't scored in an age then that = Will score against Liverpool. It's an unwritten law of the universe.
 
Fair enough. He's fekin Ian Rush and Van basten combined when compared to the finishing skills of Suarez!

Yeah, Fletcher was second in clear chance conversion last season (first the season before) with 70%. Suarez at 24% was bottom of the league.
 
And why hasn't he figured in the league? Because Rodgers doesn't think he's good enough. In fact if its true he offered henderson to fulham that how highly he rates him. He comes across as having a weak mentality hence why he plays it safe all the time and Rodgers said one of the things he looks for in a player is strong mentality.

Don't deny he did a few good passes against hearts credit where credit is due. But I can see rodgers trying to flog him off come next summer when he brings in other players. Shelvey has stormed ahead of him now, but in theory henderson is a better passer of the ball than shelvey, but shelvey has the strong mentality to try things even when it goes horribly wrong. Whereas Henderson would just never take the risk in the first place.

You said he's been shit so far, I was just pointing out he's barely played, that's two completely different points. As for offering him to Fulham, Villa reportedly offered a deal worth £8m, which we turned down. Shall we dismiss that one as speculation and the Fulham story as being gospel cos it suits your point?

Like I said, it's clear you don't rate the lad as you've made it abundently clear every time someone mentions the word midfield.I don't know where the 'in theory he's a better passer than Shelvey' bit comes from either, Shelvey was renowned for his passing ability, Henderson was brought in on the back of some good displays central and outwide for Sunderland, and scoring goals, It didn't work out but you're distorting the point and the truth. He's shown similar awareness and sensibility as Lucas, and ability to sit, keep it simple and cover ground to hassle players in midfield. That's all we're saying. The set up isn't working and on paper you can see the flaws in it, he might have better players ahead of him, but to help us be a better unit, it might be worth using him, at least in 'some' games. I get that you don't like him, but by your reckoning we should just play Gerrard as the DM, given he's better than the rest of the midfield. Oh.
 
Had we paid 12 mill for Fletcher the forum would have exploded.

Adam Johnson out ofEnglands games with a thigh injury.
 
Had we paid 12 mill for Fletcher the forum would have exploded.

Adam Johnson out ofEnglands games with a thigh injury.

That's because we play football the proper way, hitting the post and missing pens. We don't want one of those backward thugs who finishes anything you stick in front of him.
 
That's because we play football the proper way, hitting the post and missing pens. We don't want one of those backward thugs who finishes anything you stick in front of him.

Fletcher is a good finisher, but I think you're stretching it a bit mate. He's got 88 goals in 300 games.
 
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