Sky's Dumbit Pundits off to a predictable start

[gkmacca]

Sky Sunday Supplement today:

Brian Woolly Woolnough, who used to claim Rafa had blown seasons by 'resting' Torres instead of playing him week in week out, has now warned that Rafa will probably ruin his chances by playing Torres week in week out. Apparently Torres has 'bad hamstrings'.

Oliver Kay, who is usually sensible, has caught Sky Sports-itis, as he has just declared that Arbeloa was a 'fringe' player who was a 'better left back than anyone else at the club' and will therefore be hugely missed.

Rob 'J.T.' Beesley has made the observation that without Torres and Gerrard 'Liverpool ain't much'.

Henry Winter, again a sensible man infected with Sky Sports fever, has opined that Mascherano will be less effective now that Alonso is no longer around as 'he has no discipline' and needs a 'puppet master' to pull his strings.

All in all: our chances have been dismissed.

One thing I don't look forward to is another season of these idiots. 'Turn the sound down'/'change channels'? Yes, but I'd prefer better programmes with more thoughtful contributions.

 

[FoxForceFive]

Well said Macca.

I made the mistake of listening to Talksport the other day, equally as risible. They're "pundits" are possibly even worse. Listening to Alvin fucking Martin trying to tell me that Liverpool are a struggling that much financially they've sold Alonso to balance the books & that, plus the fact Torres 2only plays half the season, we've got nowhere near the strength in depth to challenge, all means we'll finish behind Chelsea, Utd, & possibly Arsenal & City. He then went on to go even further, saying our striekr situation was ludicrpus & no side could challenge with our strikers, cos FOUR top class strikers are a minimum.

Fucking hell, four top strikers. Yeah, right. Oh, by the way Alvin, we DID challenge last season, with the same number of strikers we currently have.

It annoys me they class him as speaking for Liverpool fans, he's as biased a Chelsea fan as I've ever heard on the radio. He just happened to be born in Bootle.

 

[FoxForceFive]

Oh yeah, & let's not forget his son actually plays for us, so you'd think he'd be a little more balanced in his viewpoint.

 

[gkmacca]

Yes, he's a strange one. Grew up as a Red, with a son, as you say, now playing for us, but now amazingly out of touch. I know some will just say they ignore these twits, and I don't spend much time bothering about them, but it does puzzle me that TV producers ignore the obvious need to draw in as broad an audience as possible. Seeming southern-biased, even casually, or unbalanced in any other way, is a broadcasting error. It's like eavesdropping on a London cab drivers' tea break on Sky. They will bend over backwards to be factually correct about Chelski or Arsenal, yet make the most bizarrely inaccurate comments about all northern sides except Ginsoak's. Going five months, for example, repeating that 'Benitez rested Torres' myth, when the player had clearly been injured, was one example: they must have had emails, calls etc pointing it out, but on and on they went. It's really bad broadcasting, and they charge a fortune for it.

 

[Avmenon]

[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35141.msg921386#msg921386 date=1249808859]
Well said Macca.

I made the mistake of listening to Talksport the other day, equally as risible. They're "pundits" are possibly even worse. Listening to Alvin fucking Martin trying to tell me that Liverpool are a struggling that much financially they've sold Alonso to balance the books & that, plus the fact Torres 2only plays half the season, we've got nowhere near the strength in depth to challenge, all means we'll finish behind Chelsea, Utd, & possibly Arsenal & City. He then went on to go even further, saying our striekr situation was ludicrpus & no side could challenge with our strikers, cos FOUR top class strikers are a minimum.

Fucking hell, four top strikers. Yeah, right. Oh, by the way Alvin, we DID challenge last season, with the same number of strikers we currently have.

It annoys me they class him as speaking for Liverpool fans, he's as biased a Chelsea fan as I've ever heard on the radio. He just happened to be born in Bootle.

[/quote]

Let the morons rant tho.

I'd rather that than everyone piling on the pressure and expectations.

PS : I can't even imagine someone born in Liverpool supporting Chelsea.

Blech.

 

[Frogfish]

Both the Guardian & Telegraph have tipped us to win it (can't remember who but United fans were up in arms) 🙂

 

[Avmenon]

I read the Guardian one, decent read.

 

[FoxForceFive]

[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=35141.msg921394#msg921394 date=1249810251]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35141.msg921386#msg921386 date=1249808859]
Well said Macca.

I made the mistake of listening to Talksport the other day, equally as risible. They're "pundits" are possibly even worse. Listening to Alvin fucking Martin trying to tell me that Liverpool are a struggling that much financially they've sold Alonso to balance the books & that, plus the fact Torres 2only plays half the season, we've got nowhere near the strength in depth to challenge, all means we'll finish behind Chelsea, Utd, & possibly Arsenal & City. He then went on to go even further, saying our striekr situation was ludicrpus & no side could challenge with our strikers, cos FOUR top class strikers are a minimum.

Fucking hell, four top strikers. Yeah, right. Oh, by the way Alvin, we DID challenge last season, with the same number of strikers we currently have.

It annoys me they class him as speaking for Liverpool fans, he's as biased a Chelsea fan as I've ever heard on the radio. He just happened to be born in Bootle.

[/quote]

Let the morons rant tho.

I'd rather that than everyone piling on the pressure and expectations.

PS : I can't even imagine someone born in Liverpool supporting Chelsea.

Blech.
[/quote]

Add in the fact he played for West Ham for years & it's even more confusing.

I can only imagine that those based in & around London are aware simply of the facts that surround London clubs more & it leads to bias. Or there's a fucking huge conspiracy, which is unlikely, despite what Rebel thinks.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Four "top class" strikers is probably stretching it, but you do need two and two decent back-ups.
We have one and a half, plus Voronin. We are disgracefully short in that department.
We were short when we signed Keane, and we still could have done with more back up when he was signed.
Eight months later we are still short. Unless someone comes through or we sign another top class striker we will not win anything.
We can not rely on Torres all season.

regards

 

[rebel23]

they should pin all the 'you're not good enough' headlines up at Melwood so the team can see

 

[spider-Neil]

torres was missing for a fair few games last season
gerrard missed some games last season
we actually scored MORE goals when a recognised striker was released

to be honest I perfer it when we get written off it takes pressure off us.
it's nice to see the media all but ignoring manu releasing two big sources of goals and replacing them with one.
a critisism I would accept from the media is liverpool aquired 12 draws last season and haven't purchased somone to address that (you could say johnson but that would be stretch) and they also released alonso (albeit itforced on them) which isn't exactly going to help.

 

[Oncy]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35141.msg921411#msg921411 date=1249812707]
Four "top class" strikers is probably stretching it, but you do need two and two decent back-ups.
We have one and a half, plus Voronin. We are disgracefully short in that department.
We were short when we signed Keane, and we still could have done with more back up when he was signed.
Eight months later we are still short. Unless someone comes through or we sign another top class striker we will not win anything.
We can not rely on Torres all season.

regards
[/quote]
But so are United. They have ONE goalscorer and two link players. Chelsea and Arsenal have options but as i said in another thread, Chelsea lose Lampard its over. Same with Arsenal and Fabregas.
I just think we should worry about things when they arrive rather than what ifs.
We have Torres who God willing will be fit, then Babel, Voronin, Kuyt, Nemeth, N'gog who can all do a stint if needed. Kuyt scored 7 goals in a dozen or so games up front last year. We're worrying for nowt imo.

 

[TheBunnyman]

I much prefer that kind of ignorant dismissal to pundits constantly saying that Liverpool are going to win the title. It'll only make it even sweeter when we do win it.

 

[SaintGeorge67]

Not long until the return of Jamie "please stop playing Gerrard on the right" Redknapp, and Andy "I can't believe he's not brought another striker on" Gray.

Maybe you should ask Didi Hamann his views on not bringing a striker on at half time in Istanbul eh Andy?

 

[mark1975]

We did a hell of alot last season without Torres for much of it, I doubt he'll miss as much football this season.

Not saying that we don't need a striker, but it's daft to be so dismissive of our chances when we clearly managed exceptionally well last season when Gerrard and Torres were missing. And as shit as Voronin is, he WILL get a few goals that will make up for what Keane contributed. If Babel decides to come good (admittedly a BIG if) then better still.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

Guys,for fucks sake we got lucky last season.
If any one of you think that we could rely on any two from Kuyt, Voronin and N'gog to maintain a challenge you must be more daft than I fucking thought.


regards

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35141.msg921423#msg921423 date=1249813550]
We did a hell of alot last season without Torres for much of it, I doubt he'll miss as much football this season.

Not saying that we don't need a striker, but it's daft to be so dismissive of our chances when we clearly managed exceptionally well last season when Gerrard and Torres were missing. And as shit as Voronin is, he WILL get a few goals that will make up for what Keane contributed. If Babel decides to come good (admittedly a BIG if) then better still.
[/quote]

there were two massive factors last season and this season could make or break our season

1) beating two out of three of our direct rivals home and away.
a massive ask to expect that again

2) 12 draws
that two seasons in row our draws have entered double figures.
can we expect a change this season?

 

[mark1975]

Guys, like I said I'm not saying we don't need a striker, but we shouldn't underestimate what we can do either, to finish four points off United (who are IMO now weakened) without Torres and Gerrard for much of the campaign shows there is more to us than just those two.

Ideally, as I've said all Summer, we'll bring in a versatile attacker. Who though for a relatively small price?

 

[gkmacca]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35141.msg921429#msg921429 date=1249813869]
Guys,for fucks sake we got lucky last season.
If any one of you think that we could rely on any two from Kuyt, Voronin and N'gog to maintain a challenge you must be more daft than I fucking thought.


regards

[/quote]

Holiday did you good, I see, Vladi. 😀

 

[red_maradona]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35141.msg921411#msg921411 date=1249812707]
Four "top class" strikers is probably stretching it, but you do need two and two decent back-ups.
We have one and a half, plus Voronin. We are disgracefully short in that department.
We were short when we signed Keane, and we still could have done with more back up when he was signed.
Eight months later we are still short. Unless someone comes through or we sign another top class striker we will not win anything.
We can not rely on Torres all season.

regards
[/quote]

exactly.

 

[Frogfish]

[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35141.msg921429#msg921429 date=1249813869]
Guys,for fucks sake we got lucky last season.
If any one of you think that we could rely on any two from Kuyt, Voronin and N'gog to maintain a challenge you must be more daft than I fucking thought.

regards

[/quote]

Seconded.

Also do not forget that Gerrard is now one of our strikers. If he gets sucked back into MF with injuries to Aquilani and one of Lucas / Masherano then we are drastically short up front. Rafa knows this hence the interest in Lavezzi. I still think we are in for another 2 arrivals before the end of August.

 

[red_maradona]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35141.msg921431#msg921431 date=1249814299]
Guys, like I said I'm not saying we don't need a striker, but we shouldn't underestimate what we can do either, to finish four points off United (who are IMO now weakened) without Torres and Gerrard for much of the campaign shows there is more to us than just those two.

Ideally, as I've said all Summer, we'll bring in a versatile attacker. Who though for a relatively small price?
[/quote]

how about trezeguet?

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=35141.msg921433#msg921433 date=1249814689]
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=35141.msg921429#msg921429 date=1249813869]
Guys,for fucks sake we got lucky last season.
If any one of you think that we could rely on any two from Kuyt, Voronin and N'gog to maintain a challenge you must be more daft than I fucking thought.


regards

[/quote]

Holiday did you good, I see, Vladi. 😀
[/quote]

Indeed so Macca, I have come back fighting fit 😉

regards

 

[Squiggles]

How did we "get lucky" last season? Kuyt and Yossi exceeded expectations, as did Riera to a degree, but I see no reason why that form can't be continued.

We were lacking the best striker in the world for half of it, and the Gerrard/Torres combo got few chances to shine. If we get a bit more luck with those two this season I'm confident we'll win the league.  

We are short up front, but we can win the league as things stand.

 

[gkmacca]

Roy Evans has advised Rafa to monitor Simon Church at Reading. Apparently. Anyway, yes, we do need one strong and pacy striker. Nemeth and N'Gog will improve if given a chance, but we need experience. But no need for doom and gloom. We didn't get lucky last season, we got unlucky.

 

[Molbystwin]

[quote author=gkmacca link=topic=35141.msg921383#msg921383 date=1249807961]
Sky Sunday Supplement today:

Brian Woolly Woolnough, who used to claim Rafa had blown seasons by 'resting' Torres instead of playing him week in week out, has now warned that Rafa will probably ruin his chances by playing Torres week in week out. Apparently Torres has 'bad hamstrings'.

Oliver Kay, who is usually sensible, has caught Sky Sports-itis, as he has just declared that Arbeloa was a 'fringe' player who was a 'better left back than anyone else at the club' and will therefore be hugely missed.

Rob 'J.T.' Beesley has made the observation that without Torres and Gerrard 'Liverpool ain't much'.

Henry Winter, again a sensible man infected with Sky Sports fever, has opined that Mascherano will be less effective now that Alonso is no longer around as 'he has no discipline' and needs a 'puppet master' to pull his strings.

All in all: our chances have been dismissed.

One thing I don't look forward to is another season of these idiots. 'Turn the sound down'/'change channels'? Yes, but I'd prefer better programmes with more thoughtful contributions.
[/quote]

Torres does have bad hamstrings, most of us have ignored it but I definitely think last season damaged him physically, and without him and Gerrard it is true we aint much,we are organised and determined be we aint much else but then without Rooney United aint much etc.

Truth is we played out of our fucking skins last season so sitting around feelng confident we will do it again despite some pretty major changes to the midfield and defense which IMO have failed to bring in much in the way of more quality.... It might be annoying punditry but it isnt bizarre.

We should have strengthened.

 

[SaintGeorge67]

We don't need four strikers as we only really play with one.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=35141.msg921439#msg921439 date=1249814983]
How did we "get lucky" last season? Kuyt and Yossi exceeded expectations, as did Riera to a degree, but I see no reason why that form can't be continued.

We were lacking the best striker in the world for half of it, and the Gerrard/Torres combo got few chances to shine. If we get a bit more luck with those two this season I'm confident we'll win the league.

We are short up front, but we can win the league as things stand.
[/quote]

Two players exceeding expectations sound more luck than good judgment to me Squiggs.
Being a good manager in any walk of life includes contingency planning. We needed a striker as everyone knew, and brought in Keane, we took a flyer and let him go without replacing him. That is flying by the seat of your pants. That was circumstances at the time and I am not being critical of the manager for that, but eight months on and that has not been sorted , yet and that worries me.

regards

 

[gkmacca]

Another wish for next season: someone finally points out to Andy Gray that making a substition at around the hour mark is NOT some weird idiosyncrasy on Rafa's part but probably the norm over the past 50 or more years. Waiting until half time, changing a few things and then waiting ten to fifteen minutes before making a change is incredibly normal. This 'heh heh heh, I knew it, heh heh heh, it's time!' is absolute nonsense. True, Benitez could be a bit more active, but then so could most managers.

 

[Vlads Quiff]

[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=35141.msg921443#msg921443 date=1249815244]
We don't need four strikers as we only really play with one.
[/quote]

That is the exact problem. The one that we do play with is the only one capable of playing up front alone and the system is tailored around that. If Torres is not there we need to revert to a traditional two up front.

regards