reds pass on rhone
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From Tony Barrett: (the content behind the BenSmith tweet)
The deadline for the Rhone Group's £100m bid for a 40 per cent stake in Liverpool passed last night. Does that mean the deal is off and if so, have Liverpool got any other potential investors lined up?
Tony Barrett replies: "The Rhone Group is an interesting case but there were always suspicions that they were no more than a stalking horse and being used to possibly flush out interest from other potential investors.
"Their whole approach was very public and open, which is unusual. Everyone knew the asking price was around £100 million for a 40 per cent stake in the club and it was almost as if it was being done to publicly set a price for that stake in the club. No one knew for sure whether the Rhone Group were in cahoots with the owners or senior figures at the club and were being used to try and tempt other parties into declaring their interest. There are indications that there are at least two other interested parties but they appear to be biding their time for now.
"It seems that Liverpool, for whatever reason, have now decided not to take up the offer from the Rhone Group, whether that was genuine or not. They would come back to the negotiating table if Liverpool wanted to continue discussions but it is hard to see that happening now.
"The situation will become more interesting if Liverpool miss out on fourth place and qualification for next season's Champions League. It has always been hard to apply logic to the ownership of Hicks and Gillett. It would have been logical for them to accept the offer from DIC two years ago because they could have walked away with a handsome profit. Now the situation has changed and it seems that football's bubble is not far from bursting.
"Some of the bigger clubs may escape the worst of the financial crisis but as long as the owners' valuation remains where it does, which is understood to be around £500 million for a total buyout, it is hard to see things moving forward. Even RBS have intimated that the asking price is unrealistic and you can understand why.
"If an interested party wanted to buy the club for £500 million, clear the clubs debts of around £237 million and then find the funds for a new stadium, they are going to have to find close to £1 billion and that is not a sensible outlay for any club at the moment."
The deadline for the Rhone Group's £100m bid for a 40 per cent stake in Liverpool passed last night. Does that mean the deal is off and if so, have Liverpool got any other potential investors lined up?
Tony Barrett replies: "The Rhone Group is an interesting case but there were always suspicions that they were no more than a stalking horse and being used to possibly flush out interest from other potential investors.
"Their whole approach was very public and open, which is unusual. Everyone knew the asking price was around £100 million for a 40 per cent stake in the club and it was almost as if it was being done to publicly set a price for that stake in the club. No one knew for sure whether the Rhone Group were in cahoots with the owners or senior figures at the club and were being used to try and tempt other parties into declaring their interest. There are indications that there are at least two other interested parties but they appear to be biding their time for now.
"It seems that Liverpool, for whatever reason, have now decided not to take up the offer from the Rhone Group, whether that was genuine or not. They would come back to the negotiating table if Liverpool wanted to continue discussions but it is hard to see that happening now.
"The situation will become more interesting if Liverpool miss out on fourth place and qualification for next season's Champions League. It has always been hard to apply logic to the ownership of Hicks and Gillett. It would have been logical for them to accept the offer from DIC two years ago because they could have walked away with a handsome profit. Now the situation has changed and it seems that football's bubble is not far from bursting.
"Some of the bigger clubs may escape the worst of the financial crisis but as long as the owners' valuation remains where it does, which is understood to be around £500 million for a total buyout, it is hard to see things moving forward. Even RBS have intimated that the asking price is unrealistic and you can understand why.
"If an interested party wanted to buy the club for £500 million, clear the clubs debts of around £237 million and then find the funds for a new stadium, they are going to have to find close to £1 billion and that is not a sensible outlay for any club at the moment."
Surely an offer of £500m would include the club's debts (ie H and G would make 'only' £273m)?
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=39672.msg1083154#msg1083154 date=1270572456]
Surely an offer of £500m would include the club's debts (ie H and G would make 'only' £273m)?
[/quote]
Thats what I thought aswell, and rumoured bid of 300 mill from Sahara Group kind of proves something a long those lines.
237 mill for the debt
263 mill for the rest of the club. I e a bid of 300 mill which would see dumb and dumber getting 37 mill to split between them.
Surely an offer of £500m would include the club's debts (ie H and G would make 'only' £273m)?
[/quote]
Thats what I thought aswell, and rumoured bid of 300 mill from Sahara Group kind of proves something a long those lines.
237 mill for the debt
263 mill for the rest of the club. I e a bid of 300 mill which would see dumb and dumber getting 37 mill to split between them.
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=39672.msg1083405#msg1083405 date=1270595239]
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=39672.msg1083108#msg1083108 date=1270566365]
If you put The O'Tomkins Chalkboard in an 6CM Insiders only, subscription forum, you could make a fortune
[/quote]
Hi Cochyn.
[/quote]
Haha. All we need now is Keni.
[quote author=Brendan link=topic=39672.msg1083108#msg1083108 date=1270566365]
If you put The O'Tomkins Chalkboard in an 6CM Insiders only, subscription forum, you could make a fortune
[/quote]
Hi Cochyn.
[/quote]
Haha. All we need now is Keni.
Let's pray that this doesn't happen!!!!
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
[quote author=Hansern link=topic=39672.msg1084387#msg1084387 date=1270709078]
Let's pray that this doesn't happen!!!!
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
[/quote]
Why do you hope this doesn't go ahead ?
Do you want to see all our best players sold to cover the debt ?
Would you like to see go into administration and have a nine point penalty at the start of next season ?
Let's pray that this doesn't happen!!!!
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
[/quote]
Why do you hope this doesn't go ahead ?
Do you want to see all our best players sold to cover the debt ?
Would you like to see go into administration and have a nine point penalty at the start of next season ?
Yep. It will be disastrous for the club if they succeed in getting another high-interest loan to pay off part of the current high-interest loan.
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=39672.msg1084406#msg1084406 date=1270711730]
[quote author=Hansern link=topic=39672.msg1084387#msg1084387 date=1270709078]
Let's pray that this doesn't happen!!!!
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
[/quote]
Why do you hope this doesn't go ahead ?
Do you want to see all our best players sold to cover the debt ?
Would you like to see go into administration and have a nine point penalty at the start of next season ?
[/quote]
Because it will be the end of player purchases as we now it, we won't have any money to spend at all. We'll have an even higher interest rate to pay off, if they get a new refinancing deal with RBS we'll only be digging our grave even deeper.
We won't sell players to cover the debt, as that can only be decided by a board ruling.
And we won't go into administration, as our situtation is nothing like Pompeys. We're not insolvent, and are still a "functional" business. RBS might take control and sell us, but we won't be docked 9 points.
I want a full change of ownership, thats why I don't want them to renegotiate a new deal with an higher interest rate than today.
[quote author=Hansern link=topic=39672.msg1084387#msg1084387 date=1270709078]
Let's pray that this doesn't happen!!!!
Liverpool co-owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett in London to discuss refinancing
By Paul Kelso Football Last updated: April 7th, 2010
As Liverpool prepare to try and stay in the Europa League this week the club’s owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett have been in London discussing their next financial move, and considering the implications should Rafael Benitez fail to deliver on his promise to steer the club into next season’s Champions League.
I understand that the American owners, enjoying a rare joint visit to the UK, spent yesterday afternoon at the London client offices of leading City lawyers Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer. By co-incidence Freshfields partner Mark Rawlinson is one of the ‘Red Knights’ plotting the purchase of Manchester United from the Glazers.
Hicks and Gillett have faced similar supporter disquiet over their ownership of Liverpool and are attempting to re-finance the club’s £237m debts. RBS, their principle lender, has requested that they reduce the debt by £100m ahead of a refinancing deadline in the summer.
Rothschilds and Merryl Lynch, the advisors retained by Gillett and Hicks respectively, and club managing director Christian Purslow have been engaged in a global search for third-party investment for months but a deal is yet to be struck. The deadline for a £105m offer from New York-based investors the Rhone Group, who were hoping to secure a 40% stake in the club, passed on Monday.
Sources close to the owners say that yesterday’s talks were a general discussion of the owners’ options rather than focused on a specific deal. “There’s nothing imminent,†said one.
Purslow has previously said that five or six interested parties are still in play but it appears that all are some distance from meeting the Americans’ valuation. Hicks and Gillett have previously maintained that any third-party investor would have to pay a price that reflects the club’s potential increase in value after the new Anfield, which is yet to leave the drawing board, is built.
With the credit markets still depressed and the RBS deadline looming it may be harder for the owners to meet their valuation, but that does not mean refinancing will fail.
While RBS would like to see the debt come down it is still highly likely that the bank would offer the Americans a fresh deal. The downside for Hicks and Gillett, as they seek yet another short-term fix to their problems at Anfield, is that such a deal would cost significantly more in fees and interest.
If they succeed it will be the third time in as many years that they have had to strike a new deal with the banks, racking up fees every time. The need for a long-term solution that allows work on the new stadium to begin remains.
[/quote]
Why do you hope this doesn't go ahead ?
Do you want to see all our best players sold to cover the debt ?
Would you like to see go into administration and have a nine point penalty at the start of next season ?
[/quote]
Because it will be the end of player purchases as we now it, we won't have any money to spend at all. We'll have an even higher interest rate to pay off, if they get a new refinancing deal with RBS we'll only be digging our grave even deeper.
We won't sell players to cover the debt, as that can only be decided by a board ruling.
And we won't go into administration, as our situtation is nothing like Pompeys. We're not insolvent, and are still a "functional" business. RBS might take control and sell us, but we won't be docked 9 points.
I want a full change of ownership, thats why I don't want them to renegotiate a new deal with an higher interest rate than today.
If RBS say "We'd like our 237m back today please" - we'll be in administration and selling all our players.
Hansern you've mentioned previously about how the Board wouldn't sanction something else, you do realise that the Board is Hicks, Gillett, each of their sons and Christian Purslow ? And probably Moores still.
They'll do whatever they have to.
And on the having no money to spend - we're increasing revenues all around through sponsorship , if Rafa had even been competent this past year then we'd qualify for the Champions League and we would have money to spend. It looks like the increases in Sponsorship will cover the losses from the CL and we'll be in the same position this summer as last.
Hansern you've mentioned previously about how the Board wouldn't sanction something else, you do realise that the Board is Hicks, Gillett, each of their sons and Christian Purslow ? And probably Moores still.
They'll do whatever they have to.
And on the having no money to spend - we're increasing revenues all around through sponsorship , if Rafa had even been competent this past year then we'd qualify for the Champions League and we would have money to spend. It looks like the increases in Sponsorship will cover the losses from the CL and we'll be in the same position this summer as last.
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=39672.msg1084422#msg1084422 date=1270712816]
If RBS say "We'd like our 237m back today please" - we'll be in administration and selling all our players.
Hansern you've mentioned previously about how the Board wouldn't sanction something else, you do realise that the Board is Hicks, Gillett, each of their sons and Christian Purslow ? And probably Moores still.
They'll do whatever they have to.
[/quote]
If RBS can say; hey, we want our money back today please, we must have gotten the worst bank loan in the history of world football. Can your bank call you and say; hey, we'd like your morgage paid off tomorrow?
The article says that RBS would like the debt to be downpaid by 100 mill £, which is very vague. So, they won't put any pressure on the owners if they can't find any new investment. That would lead to a new refinancing deal with higher interest, and would be like pissing in your pants to stay warm.
I honestly don't think a fire sale could happen, as it would get vetoed by certain board members. Hicks and Gillett agreeing on something, fat chance. Purslow and Moores would be against it, and Hicks Jr has lost his place. The club would be less attractive for a new investor or owner, and I don't think they'd risk that.
If RBS say "We'd like our 237m back today please" - we'll be in administration and selling all our players.
Hansern you've mentioned previously about how the Board wouldn't sanction something else, you do realise that the Board is Hicks, Gillett, each of their sons and Christian Purslow ? And probably Moores still.
They'll do whatever they have to.
[/quote]
If RBS can say; hey, we want our money back today please, we must have gotten the worst bank loan in the history of world football. Can your bank call you and say; hey, we'd like your morgage paid off tomorrow?
The article says that RBS would like the debt to be downpaid by 100 mill £, which is very vague. So, they won't put any pressure on the owners if they can't find any new investment. That would lead to a new refinancing deal with higher interest, and would be like pissing in your pants to stay warm.
I honestly don't think a fire sale could happen, as it would get vetoed by certain board members. Hicks and Gillett agreeing on something, fat chance. Purslow and Moores would be against it, and Hicks Jr has lost his place. The club would be less attractive for a new investor or owner, and I don't think they'd risk that.
If RBS put some weight on the owners for not paying the loan or getting it refinanced in time, I still fail to see how we can end up in administration.
We're not insolvent, we can pay our bills/wages and we're still a functioning business.
IF RBS can say hey, we're taking control of the club and selling it to get our money. I still fail to see how that will lead us into administration.
Doesn't that mean RBS can sell us for 237 mill £, the owners won't make a profit as RBS is in control and call the shots. We get new owners and the bank gets their money.
The situation is nothing like Pompeys, and I really can't see how we will end up in administration.
We're not insolvent, we can pay our bills/wages and we're still a functioning business.
IF RBS can say hey, we're taking control of the club and selling it to get our money. I still fail to see how that will lead us into administration.
Doesn't that mean RBS can sell us for 237 mill £, the owners won't make a profit as RBS is in control and call the shots. We get new owners and the bank gets their money.
The situation is nothing like Pompeys, and I really can't see how we will end up in administration.
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