Rafa tells Babel to sort himself out

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930064#msg930064 date=1250928258]
[quote author=rage link=topic=35389.msg930063#msg930063 date=1250928209]
what did our leader say in the lucas interview about it being easy to pick on the less superstar players after the spurs game.

one game in and rafa has a public go at this lad. go rafa you bloody hypocrite.

the fact that i agree with you is irrelevant seeing as you bought this lad in the 1st place, oh was it parry when keane failed? 😉
[/quote]

Babel's been shit for three seasons Rage and consistently flattered to deceive. His attitude stinks aswell in comparison to Lucas.
[/quote]

He was promising in his debut season (liverpool young player of the season) rubbish in his second second (but still contributed in places) and started the third season with mare.

 

[cochyn]

[quote author=rage link=topic=35389.msg930068#msg930068 date=1250928810]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930064#msg930064 date=1250928258]
[quote author=rage link=topic=35389.msg930063#msg930063 date=1250928209]
what did our leader say in the lucas interview about it being easy to pick on the less superstar players after the spurs game.

one game in and rafa has a public go at this lad. go rafa you bloody hypocrite.

the fact that i agree with you is irrelevant seeing as you bought this lad in the 1st place, oh was it parry when keane failed? 😉
[/quote]

Babel's been shit for three seasons Rage and consistently flattered to deceive. His attitude stinks aswell in comparison to Lucas.
[/quote]

oh i agree with most of that though i think he was as good as we could expect in his first season mark.

its just the hypocrisy of our leader that annoys me here.

babel will be sat in the changing room thinking 'that lucas has cost us games last season and still gets played, me i got injury time sub appearances and scored the winner against utd and hardly ever see 2 games in a row - i don't need this, o could be mc B'
[/quote]

How tiresome, your one man mission against rafa is growing old my friend! You are just twisting anything you can to give it anti-rafa slant

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35389.msg930107#msg930107 date=1250934055]
is it just me or is any one else getting annoyed with Rafa for airing his critical views on our players in public? - contrast this with Fergie publicly supporting berbatov and owen - Rafa should keep these sentiments in house - his team selection says it all.
[/quote]

Fergie's comments today :

"The ratio of goals last season was our poorest for 15 years in terms of goal difference," Ferguson said. "That was an issue last term and it's going to be an issue this season unless our strikers step up to the mark."

"Michael is exactly the same as Dimitar," Ferguson said. "He could do with a goal. He had two [chances] on Wednesday and should have scored both of them.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/aug/21/manchester-united-strikers-goal-shortage

 

[red_maradona]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930115#msg930115 date=1250935662]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35389.msg930107#msg930107 date=1250934055]
is it just me or is any one else getting annoyed with Rafa for airing his critical views on our players in public? - contrast this with Fergie publicly supporting berbatov and owen - Rafa should keep these sentiments in house - his team selection says it all.
[/quote]

Fergie's comments today :

"The ratio of goals last season was our poorest for 15 years in terms of goal difference," Ferguson said. "That was an issue last term and it's going to be an issue this season unless our strikers step up to the mark."

"Michael is exactly the same as Dimitar," Ferguson said. "He could do with a goal. He had two [chances] on Wednesday and should have scored both of them.

[/quote]

I don't really the the similarit, fergies comments in the first place are generalised without referring to one player whereas in the second place they are more direct, but referring to one match as opposed to a whole players career and future. For me the torres comments were far worse though - that stuff shoul be kept in house. I don't recall them all, but I know there have been other incidences of rafa having a go at players. Fergie is overall much better in this dept. and just becuase he may lapse s occasionally doesn't change my view that manages should, in public, defend their plyers to the hilt. Leave the criticism of players to amateurs like us and journos needing space to fill.

 

[cochyn]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930115#msg930115 date=1250935662]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35389.msg930107#msg930107 date=1250934055]
is it just me or is any one else getting annoyed with Rafa for airing his critical views on our players in public? - contrast this with Fergie publicly supporting berbatov and owen - Rafa should keep these sentiments in house - his team selection says it all.
[/quote]

Fergie's comments today :

"The ratio of goals last season was our poorest for 15 years in terms of goal difference," Ferguson said. "That was an issue last term and it's going to be an issue this season unless our strikers step up to the mark."

"Michael is exactly the same as Dimitar," Ferguson said. "He could do with a goal. He had two [chances] on Wednesday and should have scored both of them.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2009/aug/21/manchester-united-strikers-goal-shortage
[/quote]

Exactly fergie does it a bit more surreptitiously, but has been known to be direct as well!!

 

[spider-Neil]

if rafa wants to blast his players in public more power to him, sometimes players have to realise that what they are given isn't good enough and need to pull their finger out of their arse, enough of the arm around the shoulder rubbish.

 

[red_maradona]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930126#msg930126 date=1250936403]
if rafa wants to blast his players in public more power to him, sometimes players have to realise that what they are given isn't good enough and need to pull their finger out of their arse, enough of the arm around the shoulder rubbish.
[/quote]

would do wonders for team morale and spirit, eh?

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35389.msg930127#msg930127 date=1250936522]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930126#msg930126 date=1250936403]
if rafa wants to blast his players in public more power to him, sometimes players have to realise that what they are given isn't good enough and need to pull their finger out of their arse, enough of the arm around the shoulder rubbish.
[/quote]

would do wonders for team morale and spirit, eh?
[/quote]

they are men not boys (you'd hope).

 

[TheBunnyman]

Sometimes it's the only way to snap a player out of a rut of some kind. Remember Houllier having a very public go at Gerrard? That worked - Gerrard responded, and admitted afterwards that it was the public nature of the rebuke which had the desired effect.

It does seem a bit odd that Rafa's done the same kind of thing twice in such a short period of time, but he was clearly right about Torres - and the response against Stoke was good. Hopefully Torres is professional enough not to bear a grudge against the manager for going public.

With Babel, it's such an obvious thing to say that it hardly seems surprising. He does need to step up or ship out. We all know it, and I'm sure he does too. I guess this is Rafa's last roll of the dice. Either that, or he's still hoping to sell him this summer, in which case this is a coded message to other managers that the player is available.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=35389.msg930135#msg930135 date=1250937182]
Sometimes it's the only way to snap a player out of a rut of some kind. Remember Houllier having a very public go at Gerrard? That worked - Gerrard responded, and admitted afterwards that it was the public nature of the rebuke which had the desired effect.

It does seem a bit odd that Rafa's done the same kind of thing twice in such a short period of time, but he was clearly right about Torres - and the response against Stoke was good. Hopefully Torres is professional enough not to bear a grudge against the manager for going public.

With Babel, it's such an obvious thing to say that it hardly seems surprising. He does need to step up or ship out. We all know it, and I'm sure he does too. I guess this is Rafa's last roll of the dice. Either that, or he's still hoping to sell him this summer, in which case this is a coded message to other managers that the player is available.


[/quote]

I guess like everyone else, Rafa is sick of people pussyfooting around Babel and pinning hopes on potential. There's no room for any of that anymore, especially now the squad is so stretched, everyone has to pull their weight when they're played.

Same goes for Lucas, it's great as it is for him getting picked because of the departure of Alonso and the injury to Aquilani, there's also no hiding place for him now, he HAS to perform.

 

[Ryan]

Rafa should play him at centre-back. His ball-repelling shins would clear every bit of danger.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930138#msg930138 date=1250937368]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=35389.msg930135#msg930135 date=1250937182]
Sometimes it's the only way to snap a player out of a rut of some kind. Remember Houllier having a very public go at Gerrard? That worked - Gerrard responded, and admitted afterwards that it was the public nature of the rebuke which had the desired effect.

It does seem a bit odd that Rafa's done the same kind of thing twice in such a short period of time, but he was clearly right about Torres - and the response against Stoke was good. Hopefully Torres is professional enough not to bear a grudge against the manager for going public.

With Babel, it's such an obvious thing to say that it hardly seems surprising. He does need to step up or ship out. We all know it, and I'm sure he does too. I guess this is Rafa's last roll of the dice. Either that, or he's still hoping to sell him this summer, in which case this is a coded message to other managers that the player is available.


[/quote]

I guess like everyone else, Rafa is sick of people pussyfooting around Babel and pinning hopes on potential. There's no room for any of that anymore, especially now the squad is so stretched, everyone has to pull their weight when they're played.

Same goes for Lucas, it's great as it is for him getting picked because of the departure of Alonso and the injury to Aquilani, there's also no hiding place for him now, he HAS to perform.
[/quote]

100% agree.

 

[Rafiagra]

Lucas has knuckled down and by all accounts has put a lot of work in in pre-season.

I'm betting Babel hasnt done the same.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=Rafiagra link=topic=35389.msg930157#msg930157 date=1250940355]
Lucas has knuckled down and by all accounts has put a lot of work in in pre-season.

I'm betting Babel hasnt done the same.
[/quote]

Babel could work like a sheepdog and he'd still be fucking shite.

 

[FoxForceFive]

If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.

 

[mark1975]

[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.

 

[cochyn]

[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=35389.msg930127#msg930127 date=1250936522]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930126#msg930126 date=1250936403]
if rafa wants to blast his players in public more power to him, sometimes players have to realise that what they are given isn't good enough and need to pull their finger out of their arse, enough of the arm around the shoulder rubbish.
[/quote]

would do wonders for team morale and spirit, eh?
[/quote]

He has pussyfooted around him for long enough, now its time for a shock tactics!!

 

[LeTallecWiz]

[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930064#msg930064 date=1250928258]
[quote author=rage link=topic=35389.msg930063#msg930063 date=1250928209]
what did our leader say in the lucas interview about it being easy to pick on the less superstar players after the spurs game.

one game in and rafa has a public go at this lad. go rafa you bloody hypocrite.

the fact that i agree with you is irrelevant seeing as you bought this lad in the 1st place, oh was it parry when keane failed? 😉
[/quote]

Babel's been shit for three seasons Rage and consistently flattered to deceive. His attitude stinks aswell in comparison to Lucas.
[/quote]


How can you say that and then claim you want him to succeed? He was 'shit' his first season?

 

[mom]

He's had long enough to improve, so it's time to sell him and spend the proceeds elsewhere. I can't really see him getting ahead of Benayoun.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930181#msg930181 date=1250942742]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.
[/quote]

It's a fair point actually. It's all fair and well applying the pressure to Babel publicly like this, but it's Rafa who paid 11.5M for the fucking useless cunt.

I always wondered why Wenger never followed through on his interest back in the day. A few early glimpses from Babel was enough reason to know why.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35389.msg930488#msg930488 date=1250978491]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930181#msg930181 date=1250942742]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.
[/quote]

It's a fair point actually. It's all fair and well applying the pressure to Babel publicly like this, but it's Rafa who paid 11.5M for the fucking useless cunt.

I always wondered why Wenger never followed through on his interest back in the day. A few early glimpses from Babel was enough reason to know why.
[/quote]

all hail wenger the transfer genius, who ALWAYS stays well clear of duds and people who have nothing less perfect control of the ball.

 

[Ryan]

Don't get upset Neil. It must be tough for you that the player you've backed unwittingly for all these years, is now fulfilling his true shiteness, and making you look like a clueless cunt in the process.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35389.msg930536#msg930536 date=1251014164]
Don't get upset Neil. It must be tough for you that the player you've backed unwittingly for all these years, is now fulfilling his true shiteness, and making you look like a clueless cunt in the process.
[/quote]

you win some you lose some, I'm not fickle and wont join the babel bashing bandwagon no matter what. I'm not bothered about looking clueless I've never had a rep to lose and a rep on an internet site isn't really anything to brag about anyway.

'on 6 crazy minutes they all think I'm knowledgable and aces'

'six crazy what now?

'...er, never mind'

 

[Avmenon]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930534#msg930534 date=1251013883]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35389.msg930488#msg930488 date=1250978491]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930181#msg930181 date=1250942742]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.
[/quote]

It's a fair point actually. It's all fair and well applying the pressure to Babel publicly like this, but it's Rafa who paid 11.5M for the fucking useless cunt.

I always wondered why Wenger never followed through on his interest back in the day. A few early glimpses from Babel was enough reason to know why.
[/quote]

all hail wenger the transfer genius, who ALWAYS stays well clear of duds and people who have nothing less perfect control of the ball.
[/quote]

Interesting point.

Someone should list out major transfers of Rafa,Wenger and Ginsoak to see fees paid and received.
I would, but I think the result might depress me.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=35389.msg930548#msg930548 date=1251015938]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930534#msg930534 date=1251013883]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35389.msg930488#msg930488 date=1250978491]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930181#msg930181 date=1250942742]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.
[/quote]

It's a fair point actually. It's all fair and well applying the pressure to Babel publicly like this, but it's Rafa who paid 11.5M for the fucking useless cunt.

I always wondered why Wenger never followed through on his interest back in the day. A few early glimpses from Babel was enough reason to know why.
[/quote]

all hail wenger the transfer genius, who ALWAYS stays well clear of duds and people who have nothing less perfect control of the ball.
[/quote]

Interesting point.

Someone should list out major transfers of Rafa,Wenger and Ginsoak to see fees paid and received.
I would, but I think the result might depress me.
[/quote]

someone said on another site that whinger always buys players with good control of the ball who are able to slot into total football (paraprashing) .

...dear me.

 

[Rosco]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=35389.msg930488#msg930488 date=1250978491]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=35389.msg930181#msg930181 date=1250942742]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=35389.msg930179#msg930179 date=1250942426]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=35389.msg930169#msg930169 date=1250941457]
If you're Dutch, have been playing professionally as long he is & still dont have a decent touch you never will have.
[/quote]

He's a bit of a contradiction really, being Dutch and having a shit touch.
[/quote]

Rafa has a talent for spotting them.
[/quote]

It's a fair point actually. It's all fair and well applying the pressure to Babel publicly like this, but it's Rafa who paid 11.5M for the fucking useless cunt.

I always wondered why Wenger never followed through on his interest back in the day. A few early glimpses from Babel was enough reason to know why.
[/quote]

To be a little clearer - the general perception is that Dutch footballers have exceptional technique. Yet all the ones we've signed don't. Kuyt is very inconsistent with his touch, Babel does half his running chasing his first touch, Zenden wasn't up to much and neither was Kromkamp.

 

[keniget]

[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930552#msg930552 date=1251017026]
someone said on another site that whinger always buys players with good control of the ball who are able to slot into total football (paraprashing) .

...dear me.
[/quote]

I don't know anything about Arsenal playing total football (because they don't), but Wenger does tend to buy players who have good technique. Of course you can always pick a few that don't fit the exact profile such as Bendtner who can be a bit erratic, Song and so forth, but a lot of his players do.

 

[spider-Neil]

[quote author=keniget link=topic=35389.msg930559#msg930559 date=1251017756]
[quote author=spider-neil link=topic=35389.msg930552#msg930552 date=1251017026]
someone said on another site that whinger always buys players with good control of the ball who are able to slot into total football (paraprashing) .

...dear me.
[/quote]

I don't know anything about Arsenal playing total football (because they don't), but Wenger does tend to buy players who have good technique. Of course you can always pick a few that don't fit the exact profile such as Bendtner who can be a bit erratic, Song and so forth, but a lot of his players do.
[/quote]


so it's hit and miss, like rafa and fergie. you really can't hold up whinger as the guru of top class buys because he has bought some stinkers, 'oh, whinger passed on babel because he knows a dud when he sees one' lol, like the football matches he watches his vision is at times dubious.

 

[keniget]

Erm, "hit and miss" wasn't really what I was saying there. If I was to wade into the argument, I'd say that Song is a defensive player, Bendtner is clearly the physical presence with height option that he never really used to have and then the rest of his attackers all have very good technique.. bar perhaps Walcott who has still got a ways to go.