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Ok, this is getting a bit ridiculous now in regards to Aquilani

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I know, I doubt it too.

I think Roma published all the details of the deal on their official site, I'll try and find it.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002487#msg1002487 date=1259588615]
[quote author=J Macleod link=topic=37538.msg1002471#msg1002471 date=1259587678]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002313#msg1002313 date=1259572497]
We've just beaten Everton, FFS. I know that may not mean much to those who are banging away on their keyboards from around the globe, but I thought it would let up the moaning at least.

Ah well.
[/quote]

Oh, do fuck off with that. Just because I'm curious about a player, that makes me a moaner and someone who doesn't care or understand about the importance of the win because I'm from "around the globe."
[/quote]

You're calling it "ridiculous" when you have no access to any details other than the fact he's on the bench. which according to SCM means he 'must be perfectly fit', which isn't actually true. We've had half fit players on the bench plenty of times in the past. A fact that get curiously overlooked when this debates rises up again and turns into yet another Benitez slag-fest.

It's all been said before in the umpteen other threads so really I don't see the point.
[/quote]

It wasn't really the issue he was calling you up on tho.

In any event,playing Aqui if he weren't fully fit would have been gross stupidity.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002537#msg1002537 date=1259590826]
Alright I'll wade into the idle speculation baseless nonsense bollocks debates with: is there be any weight behind the idea we can't afford to play him?

We paid a down-payment on Aquilani of £5M, a figure so low it pretty much explains why he was our number 1 target, with the rest is made up of performance related payments. Much like Mascherano at West Ham, perhaps there's a clause we can't afford to trigger at the moment.
[/quote]

See what happens when you get excited Squiggles? Your mind starts to play tricks on you and its not good for you. Like I said it would be much better if you just ignored the thread
 
Ah it looks as if all evidence points towards him just not being ready yet.

A shame for forums everywhere.
 
[quote author=Jack D Rips link=topic=37538.msg1002558#msg1002558 date=1259591350]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002537#msg1002537 date=1259590826]
Alright I'll wade into the idle speculation baseless nonsense bollocks debates with: is there be any weight behind the idea we can't afford to play him?

We paid a down-payment on Aquilani of £5M, a figure so low it pretty much explains why he was our number 1 target, with the rest is made up of performance related payments. Much like Mascherano at West Ham, perhaps there's a clause we can't afford to trigger at the moment.
[/quote]

See what happens when you get excited Squiggles? Your mind starts to play tricks on you and its not good for you. Like I said it would be much better if you just ignored the thread
[/quote]

Sorry, didn't I bash Rafa enough for you? I'll try harder next time to fit in.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002563#msg1002563 date=1259591543]
[quote author=Jack D Rips link=topic=37538.msg1002558#msg1002558 date=1259591350]
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002537#msg1002537 date=1259590826]
Alright I'll wade into the idle speculation baseless nonsense bollocks debates with: is there be any weight behind the idea we can't afford to play him?

We paid a down-payment on Aquilani of £5M, a figure so low it pretty much explains why he was our number 1 target, with the rest is made up of performance related payments. Much like Mascherano at West Ham, perhaps there's a clause we can't afford to trigger at the moment.
[/quote]

See what happens when you get excited Squiggles? Your mind starts to play tricks on you and its not good for you. Like I said it would be much better if you just ignored the thread
[/quote]

Sorry, didn't I bash Rafa enough for you? I'll try harder next time to fit in.
[/quote]

I dont want you or anyone to bash Rafa. Im firmly in the Rafa camp. Just not the RCDNW one.
 
[quote author=Stu link=topic=37538.msg1002472#msg1002472 date=1259587732]
[quote author=Mamma Mia link=topic=37538.msg1002307#msg1002307 date=1259571392]
That's bullshit Stu. You have no idea what's going on behind the scenes, and neither do you have any right to know.

Sure, question why, but to be pissed off and to slate Rafa (as you did last week), from a position of ignorance, is bollocks.
[/quote]

Firstly, you are right, I do not know what is going on behind the scenes. I know what Rafa has said publically about the Aquilani situation and that is that he needs games to get sharp and to get match fit. So why isn't he getting the games then? It is a fair question. He has been fit for 4/5 weeks and many are starting to question the player/purchase. And why shouldn't they if Lucas is getting in the team ahead of him?

Secondly, I did not 'slate' Rafa and have never slated Rafa on here. I am a Rafa fan. I went on national radio (in Ireland) on Saturday evening defending the man. Highlighting the positive aspects of his tenure and why he deserves and has earned the right to stick with this team and see the job through. I said that I thought Rafa has handled the Aquilani situation badly and I still stand by that comment.
[/quote]

That's the comment I was referring to when I said 'slate' How the hell do you know he has handled the situation badly? Simply because you, as a fan, don't know exactly why Aquilani isn't playing?
 
That post should be nailed onto every Aquilani thread in the past two months.
 
[quote author=Mamma Mia link=topic=37538.msg1002598#msg1002598 date=1259593406]
That's the comment I was referring to when I said 'slate' How the hell do you know he has handled the situation badly? Simply because you, as a fan, don't know exactly why Aquilani isn't playing?
[/quote]

Compared to some of things said abotu Rafa on here, I'd hardly call that slating him, MM.
I don't know, as you have pointed out, the ins and outs of the situation, but if the guy is fit enough to make the bench that would tell us he is not still caryying an injury. If he is not carrying an injury, he needs to be on the pitch to get 'match fit'. If he is not getting on the pitch due to the current form of Lucas then we are all fucked.

Here is a quote from Rafa on the 19th Nov:
"You can see in everything he does that he has got quality," said Benitez. "He knows when to pass at the right time and to the right players, he makes good decisions on the pitch.

"Alberto is training really well and he is doing extra work to make sure he is in the best possible condition. I spoke with him in the gym yesterday and he is very positive, his spirits are good.

"We have meetings every day with our medical staff to see how much we can keep pushing him and when the time is right to increase the levels of his work.

"He is a player who can pass the ball and we have seen that in the games he has played so far, even though he has not had too much time."

How out of shape is this guy?
How much conditioning does he need?
 
Stu, do you honestly believe we've never had half fit/semi-injured players on the bench before?

We're fucking playing a half fit and Johnson and Gerrard right now, and only because we know they can cope.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002657#msg1002657 date=1259595393]
Stu, do you honestly believe we've never had half fit/semi-injured players on the bench before?

We're fucking playing a half fit and Johnson and Gerrard right now, and only because we know they can cope.
[/quote]

I'm sure that we have Squiggs, of course.
But that is not what we are hearing from within the club is it?
There is no talk of injury, no talk of being him half fit, the same thing is being repeated by Rafa over and over. He needs match fitness, he won't get that on the bench.

Part of my stance on this is bourne out of frustration, no doubt. I was excited when we signed him and I am looking forward to seeing him get onto the pitch and settle into the team. When you see him make the bench and you hear Rafa saying he needs games, then it just seems obvious to me that Rafa will throw him on.
 
[quote author=Momo link=topic=37538.msg1002401#msg1002401 date=1259581729]
He'll start when Rafa has coached all the indivudual flair out of him and not before.
[/quote]

Like he's done with Gerrard and Torres?
 
[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=37538.msg1002901#msg1002901 date=1259618602]
It is quite strange considering how many are playing half injured for the cause.
[/quote]

"Half injured" ?

Is that like falling into half a hole ?
 
What quantifies a 'half injury' anyway?

Depression? - C'mon, we all know that's not a real excuse.
No laces for your boots?
An Italian missing his headband?
 
Maybe the theme for this years fancy dress party is Lord Of The Rings and the squad are falling out as to who can come as Elrond Half-Injured.
 
Rafa on subject:

Liverpool manager Rafa Benitez insists he will not bow to critics who want Alberto Aquilani to be rushed into the first team.


The Reds boss' tactics have been questioned as his £20million summer signing has remained on the substitutes bench over recent weeks and only earned a strange 30-second outing in the UEFA Champions League win at Debrecen.


Fans have been desperate to see Aquilani start a match amidst the club's struggling form, but Benitez does not want to rush the 25-year-old's recovery from ankle surgery, which took place prior to his move from Roma, and a virus.


The Spaniard decided to keep the Italy midfielder absent from Sunday's win over Everton, resisting the urge of exposure in the fierce atmosphere of a Merseyside derby, and will continue to err on the side of caution.


"It's more simple than people think," said Benitez in the Liverpool Echo. "He has been out for longer than we expected and, because he has been injured during the summer, he couldn't train properly.


"Now it is much better and it is a case of improving his match fitness. We want to play him and we thought we might have been able to do that with the reserves at Wigan.


"That was called off (last week) but we had some games at Melwood and he played 45 minutes against our reserves last week. We are trying to improve him as quick as we can.


"But when you have a player who is not fit, he is always going to need time to settle in to a game; if the game is tight and he makes mistakes, then you have a problem.


"We want to protect the player but, at the same time, we want to keep winning games; he understands that he needs to be a little bit fitter before he can play."


Benitez is eager to select Aquilani, who produced an encouraging 14 minutes in October's Carling Cup defeat at Arsenal, and has no doubts regarding his ability, but will still not rush.


"It has not been easy (to not play him) but we are giving him more encouragement in training sessions and he is getting much, much better," added the Reds boss on a player who has a reputation in Italy for being prone to injury.


"We know he is a top-class player and we want to do the best for him and the team; but the best for the player and the team sometimes means he cannot play.


"Think about this example. We were winning 1-0 (against Debrecen) the other day and me and (assistant manager) Sammy (Lee) were talking about playing him.


"But if we played him for the last 20 minutes, when they were attacking a little bit more and he is not settled, maybe it will be the situation will become worse. It is not easy finding the balance but he is getting better all the time."
 
[quote author=themn link=topic=37538.msg1002918#msg1002918 date=1259619951]
Maybe the theme for this years fancy dress party is Lord Of The Rings and the squad are falling out as to who can come as Elrond Half-Injured.
[/quote]

I can wait.
 
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=37538.msg1002895#msg1002895 date=1259618205]
[quote author=Momo link=topic=37538.msg1002401#msg1002401 date=1259581729]
He'll start when Rafa has coached all the indivudual flair out of him and not before.
[/quote]

Like he's done with Gerrard and Torres?
[/quote]

give him time...
 
I didn't expect him to play against everton, and he certainly wontplay against an allardyce 11 but the Fiorentina Game next Wednesday shound be perfect for him.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1002313#msg1002313 date=1259572497]
We've just beaten Everton, FFS. I know that may not mean much to those who are banging away on their keyboards from around the globe, but I thought it would let up the moaning at least.

Ah well.
[/quote]

would have more if they hadn't been in awful form and us playing at there level
 
We were never going to steam roll Everton, regardless of their form.

A scrappy win was the best we could've hoped for, and we got it.

That said, it was probably the most meaningless derby in recent years.
 
I am very happy with the result. And I see the tides turning. I think Benitez is gonna go full throttle against Fiorentina. I want to watch this game and see Aqua score (if he starts its the perfect game back in Italy against a team he's used to with nothing to play for).

I hope Gerrard clicks into gear soon enough. He seems to need Torres to be playing to justify playing him in the no. 10. I don't think our answer lies in the 4-2-3-1.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=37538.msg1003693#msg1003693 date=1259689559]
We were never going to steam roll Everton, regardless of their form.

A scrappy win was the best we could've hoped for, and we got it.

That said, it was probably the most meaningless derby in recent years.
[/quote]

Meaningless how? Because the Media said so? This was probably one of Rafa's most important Derby matches given our situation.
 
Because both clubs have very little to play for.

Even a few seasons ago the derby was even bigger game because it aided CL qualification for either of the teams, like playing Man City now, I guess.

Both sides have started the season in appalling form, and while it maybe a morale boosting victory for Benitez, it doesn't cloud the fact that there have far more important clashes in recent times.
 
I think KopKing's right. While we're all disappointed and demoralized by the fact that we're effectively playing for a top 4 position in November, we mustn't forget the significance of it in the bigger picture. Failing to qualify for next season's Champions League is unthinkable and as such, the derby was an absolutely vital game for us to turn our fortunes around.

Shit performance, 2-0 win. I'd take a few more of them to settle the nerves.
 
I don't know Del. The United game was meant to be the catalyst for our season and look what happened there.

In short I think the game was bigger for Rafa than it was for the club. Time will tell if it's as important as KopKing makes out.
 
May have been more important for Benitez, it wasn't for me

Which is exactly what I said before the United game: 'We'll probably win, then lose against the next shit team we play, plus it's largely irrelevant because our season is over and the squad is worse than ever"

Or something like that

It was obvious we'd beat Everton. Nice, but so what really?
 
[quote author=Assulin link=topic=37538.msg1003704#msg1003704 date=1259692147]
I am very happy with the result. And I see the tides turning. I think Benitez is gonna go full throttle against Fiorentina. I want to watch this game and see Aqua score (if he starts its the perfect game back in Italy against a team he's used to with nothing to play for).

I hope Gerrard clicks into gear soon enough. He seems to need Torres to be playing to justify playing him in the no. 10. I don't think our answer lies in the 4-2-3-1.
[/quote]

Finally you've said something insightful that I agree with! That's almost worthy of its own thread.
 
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