Liverpool U18s and U23s

[choperman.v01]

Splitting this out from the other thread...

Of the kids, Ojo has been the greatest disappointment. He's had so much encouragement, so much coaching, and he hasn't seemed to listen and learn. He appears to have concluded, like Ibe did before him, that he'd rather go somewhere where they'll let him carry on as usual rather than work to improve here. He's even 'done an Ibe' this season and, at times, removed any sign of LFC from his social media outlets - sad that being at a great club doesn't seem like something to be proud of. (I see he's re-inserted LFC images to his twitter page recently, but he remains a semi-detached player in terms of emotional commitment to the club.)

In that case, hopefully The Great White English Hope Eddie Howe Future England Manager (tm) has been watching him and wants to pay us a tidy sum to add him to the burgeoning ex-Liverpool entourage at Bournemouth then. Maybe there's a place there for Stewart too.

Have you heard anything on the futures of Brannagan, Chirivella and Kent? I've not been able to watch any of the Academy games this season so haven't been able to keep abreast of the lads' performances, so I hope you can shed some light here - has Toni Gomes hit a wall? I loved his power and aggression but it doesn't feel like he's been making much noise this season. Also, how is Liam Coyle progressing? Was pretty impressed by him when I first saw him put in a superb commanding performance against either Man Utd or Everton.

 

[gkmacca]

Splitting this out from the other thread...



In that case, hopefully The Great White English Hope Eddie Howe Future England Manager (tm) has been watching him and wants to pay us a tidy sum to add him to the burgeoning ex-Liverpool entourage at Bournemouth then. Maybe there's a place there for Stewart too.

Have you heard anything on the futures of Brannagan, Chirivella and Kent? I've not been able to watch any of the Academy games this season so haven't been able to keep abreast of the lads' performances, so I hope you can shed some light here - has Toni Gomes hit a wall? I loved his power and aggression but it doesn't feel like he's been making much noise this season. Also, how is Liam Coyle progressing? Was pretty impressed by him when I first saw him put in a superb commanding performance against either Man Utd or Everton.

Brannagan, sadly, will probably be sold. He's talented, but has been a victim of his own versatility, like a few before him, and Ejaria has eclipsed him as a midfield prospect.

Chirivella, I think, will be given every chance to progress at the club. Klopp likes him and won't give up on him yet.

I'd be really alarmed if we let Kent go. He's fast, skillful and clever, and ought to be kept on. He's done pretty well on loan this season (he won Barnsley's young player of the year award), has been monitored closely and seems to remain well-regarded.

I don't think Toni Gomes has stalled at all. He's had some good games this season and is one who'll be expected to progress next season.

Liam Coyle only just signed a contract with the club and is very much seen as a real talent. Not only does Pep Lijnders work with him one on one at times, but Gerrard also loves him and has started guiding him. He's by some distance the most competitive character in midfield at that level, and I wouldn't be surprised if he gets some cup games early next season. In him and Alexander-Arnold we've got two genuine Reds who will fight like mad to make it here.

 

[choperman.v01]

Cheers for the updates on the young'uns as usual , macca. Good to read that Gomes isn't stagnating and is still pretty much in the frame. I like the kid.

 

[gkmacca]

I've been a big, big fan of Kent's for ages and I think it's more a case of will he stay with us than will we want to keep him. I'd expect all three of the promoted sides to inquire about him, as well as a few other clubs. At the moment, as you'll see from this clip, he's not any more accurate than Milner in terms of crossing, and he's so keen to bomb down the line that he doesn't always see the need for a quick pass inside, but he's quick, very strong for his age and he'd give us width, which could be so useful at Anfield against all of those ultra defensive sides.I think we really need to give him plenty of encouragement.

 

[Kay Age El]

Having seen the clip, I like the look of that Kent lad as well..

 

[gkmacca]

Interesting snippet in The Times this morning. Good to see Klopp making a move to shake things up a bit at the Academy. Too much has been accepted just because 'that's how it's always been' - such as our use of the loan system. And too many youth coaches have, post-Heighway and in spite of Inglethorpe's good work, shown a lack of a coherent long-term plan for development. In that sense, his encouragement of Gerrard there takes on greater and broader significance.



“Young players are judged so soon,” Liverpool’s Jürgen Klopp says. “It seems a test every day. I’d create circumstances where they know we trust them. I speak to academy coaches and go, ‘What about him?’ ‘Yesterday, he had a bad session.’ ‘Well, I can tell you 500 world-class players who’ve bad sessions some days, so it’s completely normal.’ The decision on whether he’s good or not we have to make at the beginning of the season and then don’t judge them every day. You have to tell them many times what’s right or wrong before the coin drops.”

Encourage, coach, coax, believe. It worked with Steven Gerrard, Jamie Carragher and Michael Owen. It’s working with Trent Alexander-Arnold, particularly, and Ben Woodburn. Liverpool employ some exceptional youth coaches, including alumni such as Karl Robinson who have gone on to management careers notable for nurturing flair such as Dele Alli’s. But a legitimate lament persists among those involved in youth coaching that the pay is insufficient, that some see it as a stepping-stone to more lucrative, higher-profile jobs closer to the first team and that in the age of Elite Player Performance Plan, which undeniably has many positives, that coaches can get tangled up in red tape. “The problem with EPPP is that coaches are saturated with paperwork,” says one coach. “There’s too much box-ticking, ‘Have you completed this or that?’”

Coaches need freeing to spend longer with players, working on flaws over a period, not being forced to make snap-judgments that so annoys Klopp. Youngsters are being judged relentlessly and some jettisoned precipitously. “If somebody judged me at 17-18, I have no chance to sit here [after a long playing career with Mainz and then as a successful coach at Mainz, Borussia Dortmund and Liverpool],” Klopp adds.

“But with footballers we say, ‘We decide, they need to be ready now.’ How can we do that? We need to create another system and atmosphere for the boys. Yes, they have to learn, and sometimes you’re a bit more strict with your kids, not because you don’t love them but because you do really love them, and you say, ‘If you don’t do this, it could go wrong.’ ” But practice will make perfect.

Loans can inhibit youngsters, Klopp argues. “The problem is the pressure we put on the shoulders of these boys starts too early,” he says. “I came here, and we had not enough players for the number of games we had so we brought all these guys back from other clubs. Why is he on loan? Because nobody believes really in under-21 teams — it’s not real competition. All the best players are away. Send a player to, for example, Swindon Town, and he’s 18 and has to fight for his position in the team against a lad, 33, [in the] last few months of his career. How can that work? The pressure is too early.”

 

[rurikbird]

Interesting snippet in The Times this morning. Good to see Klopp making a move to shake things up a bit at the Academy. Too much has been accepted just because 'that's how it's always been' - such as our use of the loan system. And too many youth coaches have, post-Heighway and in spite of Inglethorpe's good work, shown a lack of a coherent long-term plan for development. In that sense, his encouragement of Gerrard there takes on greater and broader significance.



“Young players are judged so soon,” Liverpool’s Jürgen Klopp says. “It seems a test every day. I’d create circumstances where they know we trust them. I speak to academy coaches and go, ‘What about him?’ ‘Yesterday, he had a bad session.’ ‘Well, I can tell you 500 world-class players who’ve bad sessions some days, so it’s completely normal.’ The decision on whether he’s good or not we have to make at the beginning of the season and then don’t judge them every day. You have to tell them many times what’s right or wrong before the coin drops.”

Encourage, coach, coax, believe. It worked with Steven Gerrard, Jamie Carragher and Michael Owen. It’s working with Trent Alexander-Arnold, particularly, and Ben Woodburn. Liverpool employ some exceptional youth coaches, including alumni such as Karl Robinson who have gone on to management careers notable for nurturing flair such as Dele Alli’s. But a legitimate lament persists among those involved in youth coaching that the pay is insufficient, that some see it as a stepping-stone to more lucrative, higher-profile jobs closer to the first team and that in the age of Elite Player Performance Plan, which undeniably has many positives, that coaches can get tangled up in red tape. “The problem with EPPP is that coaches are saturated with paperwork,” says one coach. “There’s too much box-ticking, ‘Have you completed this or that?’”

Coaches need freeing to spend longer with players, working on flaws over a period, not being forced to make snap-judgments that so annoys Klopp. Youngsters are being judged relentlessly and some jettisoned precipitously. “If somebody judged me at 17-18, I have no chance to sit here [after a long playing career with Mainz and then as a successful coach at Mainz, Borussia Dortmund and Liverpool],” Klopp adds.

“But with footballers we say, ‘We decide, they need to be ready now.’ How can we do that? We need to create another system and atmosphere for the boys. Yes, they have to learn, and sometimes you’re a bit more strict with your kids, not because you don’t love them but because you do really love them, and you say, ‘If you don’t do this, it could go wrong.’ ” But practice will make perfect.

Loans can inhibit youngsters, Klopp argues. “The problem is the pressure we put on the shoulders of these boys starts too early,” he says. “I came here, and we had not enough players for the number of games we had so we brought all these guys back from other clubs. Why is he on loan? Because nobody believes really in under-21 teams — it’s not real competition. All the best players are away. Send a player to, for example, Swindon Town, and he’s 18 and has to fight for his position in the team against a lad, 33, [in the] last few months of his career. How can that work? The pressure is too early.”

Seems very reasonable when Klopp says it, but isn't this kind of the opposite of what you've been preaching, @gkmacca? About the youth teams not being competitive enough, young players being coddled etc?

 

[gkmacca]

Well I think the problem is mainly with the league system at that level. Once coaches get sucked into the aimlessness of those games, they don't so much coddle the players as leave them to exist in that listlessness. Klopp's right to say they need more care and attention, but allied with a new Gerrard-style emphasis on competing. Gerrard himself was all over the place at times at that age, trying and failing as well as shining, and I think that's what Klopp is getting at. There's become a bit of a fatalistic attitude among some (but not all) coaches at Kirkby - they look for consistency at a stage where, quite often, it's the mediocre players who give you that consistency. There needs to be a greater emphasis on developing talented competitors, whilst recognising that they need to feel trusted as they go through trials and errors.

 

[choperman.v01]

Didn't realize that MrBoywunder had done a series of great clips (as usual) of Chirivella's appearances for Go Ahead Eagles in the Eredivisie. He plays as a holding mid for them in these clips. They're rather boring if you're looking for sexy passes, showy tackles or pulsating bursts of speed - it's mainly just a fair bit of neat and tidy play - keeps things simple, and keeps the ball moving, looking to distribute or play out of tight spots with a quick pass.

 

[rurikbird]

Didn't realize that MrBoywunder had done a series of great clips (as usual) of Chirivella's appearances for Go Ahead Eagles in the Eredivisie. He plays as a holding mid for them in these clips. They're rather boring if you're looking for sexy passes, showy tackles or pulsating bursts of speed - it's mainly just a fair bit of neat and tidy play - keeps things simple, and keeps the ball moving, looking to distribute or play out of tight spots with a quick pass.

His style reminds me of Busquets, he likes to turn with the ball to find the angles for the pass. Clearly a good passer, the question is – will he develop the defensive and physical side of his game enough to make it as a midfielder in the EPL?

 

[choperman.v01]

This is MB's clip on Chirivella's performance against West Ham in the FA Cup last season:

 

[YNWA]

His style reminds me of Busquets, he likes to turn with the ball to find the angles for the pass. Clearly a good passer, the question is – will he develop the defensive and physical side of his game enough to make it as a midfielder in the EPL?

The one thing in the clips above which somewhat surprised me was his willingness to make a tackle and in most cases he ended up winning the ball cleanly. He also seems quite calm and composed on the ball whilst taking up good positions. Going forward he needs to work on the physical aspects i.e. bulking up a bit and strengthening his upper body, as he looks quite short & does not have a lot of pace. With the right opportunities and coaching he could turn into a very decent center midfielder.

 

[King Binny]

Interesting name

 

[Hansern]

His style reminds me of Busquets, he likes to turn with the ball to find the angles for the pass. Clearly a good passer, the question is – will he develop the defensive and physical side of his game enough to make it as a midfielder in the EPL?

I've read a few places that Klopp rates him very highly.

 

[refugee]

Interesting name

He looks like is 12years old

 

[choperman.v01]

We just signed another for the U18s - 16-year-old Patrik Raitanen, Finnish centreback.

Here he is with Edvard Tagseth...

... before Gerrard got to Tagseth...

 

[choperman.v01]

Dal Varesanovic at 16:

Patrik Raitanen at 16:

 

[choperman.v01]

And this is Mak Varesanovic, Dal's much taller 18-year-old brother, who plays for the Udinese U19s.



Some of you may recall that our last transfer from Bosnia and Herzegovina was Armin Hodzic. He moved to Dinamo Zagreb on a free transfer after a couple of seasons on loan to the club that sold him to us (Zeljeznicar). He's 22 now; finished 3rd on the scorers' charts in the last 2 seasons of the Croatian league, scoring 13 and 16 goals.

 

[choperman.v01]

And this is what Armin Hodzic is doing now... Well, it's a lower tier European league, but still, the quality of some of his finishing in this clip is really delightful.

 

[737Max]

Buy him back