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Lionel Messi(ah)

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I thought he was really unlucky at the WC. He must have hit the post about 8 times. It also wasn't helpful that he had a loon managing the team.
 
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279266#msg1279266 date=1296981611]
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279264#msg1279264 date=1296981131]
[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=44075.msg1279261#msg1279261 date=1296979084]
The best player on the planet and fastly becoming the greatest of all time.


[/quote]

Relax Dreamy - he's not there yet.
[/quote]

If he wins Argentina the World cup.
To become an icon you must prove yourself of on the international stage as well. It's what made Pele and Maradona legends.
[/quote]And Ronaldo and Zidane and Muller and Cryuff etc.
 
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=44075.msg1279275#msg1279275 date=1296983723]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279266#msg1279266 date=1296981611]
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279264#msg1279264 date=1296981131]
[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=44075.msg1279261#msg1279261 date=1296979084]
The best player on the planet and fastly becoming the greatest of all time.


[/quote]

Relax Dreamy - he's not there yet.
[/quote]

If he wins Argentina the World cup.
To become an icon you must prove yourself of on the international stage as well. It's what made Pele and Maradona legends.
[/quote]And Ronaldo and Zidane and Muller and Cryuff etc.

[/quote]

Tbf Zidane had a nightmare world cup in 1998 before the final. He was red carded and suspended.
They were nearly knocked out by Paraguay etc. So I can't say that he lead them to a world cup win.

However when he finally did lead them to a world cup final, he got sent off and they lost.
So it kinda makes it 0,5+0,5 = 1
 
Maradona is the best player ever for sure.
Zidane is in the following group for me with Pele, Ronaldo etc.
 
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279270#msg1279270 date=1296982714]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=44075.msg1279267#msg1279267 date=1296981702]
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279264#msg1279264 date=1296981131]
[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=44075.msg1279261#msg1279261 date=1296979084]
The best player on the planet and fastly becoming the greatest of all time.


[/quote]

Relax Dreamy - he's not there yet.
[/quote]

interesting, i've been thinking about this for a while, every time he plays he makes his case stronger - an even better formance at the next world cup could see him get there.
[/quote]

He was terrible in the WC ... disappeared ... You ever Maradona disappearing in World Cups? I know he really works well with a pacey fullback behind him (Alves), but he's gotta at least be able to drive the Argies forward to start being serious considered for Maradona's title ...
[/quote]

not sure we were watching the right WC? it is a common misconception that he was shocking, however, he actually played well admittedly not to the high standards he normally sets himself.
 
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=44075.msg1279293#msg1279293 date=1296986308]
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279270#msg1279270 date=1296982714]
[quote author=red_maradona link=topic=44075.msg1279267#msg1279267 date=1296981702]
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279264#msg1279264 date=1296981131]
[quote author=Dreambeliever link=topic=44075.msg1279261#msg1279261 date=1296979084]
The best player on the planet and fastly becoming the greatest of all time.


[/quote]

Relax Dreamy - he's not there yet.
[/quote]

interesting, i've been thinking about this for a while, every time he plays he makes his case stronger - an even better formance at the next world cup could see him get there.
[/quote]

He was terrible in the WC ... disappeared ... You ever Maradona disappearing in World Cups? I know he really works well with a pacey fullback behind him (Alves), but he's gotta at least be able to drive the Argies forward to start being serious considered for Maradona's title ...
[/quote]

not sure we were watching the right WC? it is a common misconception that he was shocking, however, he actually played well admittedly not to the high standards he normally sets himself.
[/quote]

You're the best player in the world - 'playing well' and seeing your team hammered to leave the tournament isn't ...uuuuh ... good. I judge Messi by the standards he's set for himself. He was average AT BEST ...
 
I prefer Zidane to Maradona myself. Maradona was a footballing genius but very much an individual genius. Zidane was also an individual genius, not as dynamic as Maradona, but also had that seldom found ability to knit a team together and make it work. That's the sign of a truly great footballer for me. Saying that, Messi seems to have both and could outdo them both in the future.
 
[quote author=SaintGeorge67 link=topic=44075.msg1279381#msg1279381 date=1296993470]
I don't like saying it, but George Best is the man.
[/quote]

i'm glad someone said it
 
He's leading the group following Tottenham's bid for the Olympic stadium for some reason.

I couldn't think of any viagra type jokes sadly.
 
[quote author=Herr Onceared link=topic=44075.msg1279140#msg1279140 date=1296949814]
Someone just pointed out to me that he is on FORTY goals this season so far, with three months to go.
So i did a bit of checking and this is fucking astounding...

Career totals Games 163 Goals112 Assists 52.

Thats 164 goals and assists in 163 games.

Lionel Messi scores or creates a goal EVERY SINGLE GAME.

Is that not unbelievable.


[/quote]

You mean my fb status last night??
 
[quote author=IGotALuvlyBunchOfCoconuts link=topic=44075.msg1279240#msg1279240 date=1296971223]
18 games 21 goals 14 assists in La Liga this season.


[/quote]

Incorrect... 19 games 24 goals...
 
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
 
[quote author=Wizardry link=topic=44075.msg1279484#msg1279484 date=1297001848]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
[/quote]

best was the most talented by a long way, only his career didn't turn out as great. but if you had to pick a team to play for your life, it wouldn't really matter if the other side had pele, maradona and messi on it. you'd put your life on the team with george best in it.
 
[quote author=Mr_V link=topic=44075.msg1279481#msg1279481 date=1297001586]
[quote author=IGotALuvlyBunchOfCoconuts link=topic=44075.msg1279240#msg1279240 date=1296971223]
18 games 21 goals 14 assists in La Liga this season.


[/quote]

Incorrect... 19 games 24 goals...
[/quote]



The stats are just insane , 40 goals in 33 games this season.
 
[quote author=Wizardry link=topic=44075.msg1279484#msg1279484 date=1297001848]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
[/quote]

Who's better than him from Argentina?

And you cannot really use Pele, a player who played in Brazil his entire career in a league that makes Serie A look 100% clean.
 
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279491#msg1279491 date=1297002837]
[quote author=Wizardry link=topic=44075.msg1279484#msg1279484 date=1297001848]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
[/quote]

Who's better than him from Argentina?

And you cannot really use Pele, a player who played in Brazil his entire career in a league that makes Serie A look 100% clean.
[/quote]

di stefano?
 
[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=44075.msg1279485#msg1279485 date=1297002313]
[quote author=Wizardry link=topic=44075.msg1279484#msg1279484 date=1297001848]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
[/quote]

best was the most talented by a long way, only his career didn't turn out as great. but if you had to pick a team to play for your life, it wouldn't really matter if the other side had pele, maradona and messi on it. you'd put your life on the team with george best in it.
[/quote]

Domestically his record is none too shabby but, you're right, his career could have been far greater if he hadn't self sabotaged with his lifestyle. I know some who suggest that he wouldn't have been the same player on the pitch if he was more disciplined off it but I'm far from convinced of that.

Still, in his playing days he was sensational in a very, very good manc side and looked a superstar in an average national team.
 
someone posted this a while ago. it makes me smile.

In 1976, Northern Ireland were drawn against Holland in Rotterdam as one of their group qualifying matches for the World Cup. Back then the reporters stayed at the same hotel as the team and travelled with them on the coach to the game. As it happened I sat beside George on the way to the stadium that evening.

Holland - midway between successive World Cup final appearances - and Johan Cruyff were at their peak at the time. George wasn't. I asked him what he thought of the acknowledged world number one and he said he thought the Dutchman was outstanding. 'Better than you?' I asked. George looked at me and laughed. 'You're kidding aren't you? I tell you what I'll do tonight... I'll nutmeg Cruyff first chance I get.' And we both laughed at the thought.

A couple of hours later the Irish players were announced one by one on to the pitch. Pat Jennings, as goalkeeper, was first out of the tunnel to appreciative applause. Best, as No 11, was last. 'And now,' revved up the PA guy, 'Number 11, Georgie [long pause] Best.' And out trotted George. Above him, a beautiful blonde reached over with a single, long-stemmed red rose.

Given his nature, his training and his peripheral vision there was no way he was going to miss her or the rose, so he stopped, trotted back, reached up to take the flower, kissed her hand and ran out on to the pitch waving his rose at the punters as the applause grew even louder.

Five minutes into the game he received the ball wide on the left. Instead of heading towards goal he turned directly infield, weaved his way past at least three Dutchmen and found his way to Cruyff who was wide right. He took the ball to his opponent, dipped a shoulder twice and slipped it between Cruyff's feet. As he ran round to collect it and run on he raised his right fist into the air.

Only a few of us in the press box knew what this bravado act really meant. Johan Cruyff the best in the world? Are you kidding? Only an idiot would have thought that on this evening.
Click to expand...
 
[quote author=LeTallecWiz link=topic=44075.msg1279491#msg1279491 date=1297002837]
[quote author=Wizardry link=topic=44075.msg1279484#msg1279484 date=1297001848]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44075.msg1279288#msg1279288 date=1296985444]
Maradona is 2nd to none.
[/quote]

Please - he's not even the best player from Argentina with or without Messi getting a World Cup medal.

Pele is the number one South American but the greatest was certainly George Best.
[/quote]

Who's better than him from Argentina?

And you cannot really use Pele, a player who played in Brazil his entire career in a league that makes Serie A look 100% clean.
[/quote]

Well, I was a little confused by your question mate and Dantes answer has further confused me. My own answer was, I thought, already stated; I think Messi is already a better player than Diego was.

As for Pele? He remains the best goal scorer I've ever seen but he could hold his own in midfield and take care of himself in the physical stakes as well.
 
[quote author=monsieurdantes link=topic=44075.msg1279500#msg1279500 date=1297003335]
someone posted this a while ago. it makes me smile.

In 1976, Northern Ireland were drawn against Holland in Rotterdam as one of their group qualifying matches for the World Cup. Back then the reporters stayed at the same hotel as the team and travelled with them on the coach to the game. As it happened I sat beside George on the way to the stadium that evening.

Holland - midway between successive World Cup final appearances - and Johan Cruyff were at their peak at the time. George wasn't. I asked him what he thought of the acknowledged world number one and he said he thought the Dutchman was outstanding. 'Better than you?' I asked. George looked at me and laughed. 'You're kidding aren't you? I tell you what I'll do tonight... I'll nutmeg Cruyff first chance I get.' And we both laughed at the thought.

A couple of hours later the Irish players were announced one by one on to the pitch. Pat Jennings, as goalkeeper, was first out of the tunnel to appreciative applause. Best, as No 11, was last. 'And now,' revved up the PA guy, 'Number 11, Georgie [long pause] Best.' And out trotted George. Above him, a beautiful blonde reached over with a single, long-stemmed red rose.

Given his nature, his training and his peripheral vision there was no way he was going to miss her or the rose, so he stopped, trotted back, reached up to take the flower, kissed her hand and ran out on to the pitch waving his rose at the punters as the applause grew even louder.

Five minutes into the game he received the ball wide on the left. Instead of heading towards goal he turned directly infield, weaved his way past at least three Dutchmen and found his way to Cruyff who was wide right. He took the ball to his opponent, dipped a shoulder twice and slipped it between Cruyff's feet. As he ran round to collect it and run on he raised his right fist into the air.

Only a few of us in the press box knew what this bravado act really meant. Johan Cruyff the best in the world? Are you kidding? Only an idiot would have thought that on this evening.
Click to expand...
[/quote]

but to be fair that doesn't really prove Best was a better player than Cruyuff, does it? The only thing it proves clearly is that Best was self indulgent beyond doubt in every possible way...
 
I dunno ... I just don't think a player who dominates a corrupt league can not be equaled by a man who did what Diego did in his time (Pele never had to 'lead' Brazil or a Napoli anywhere) ... And Messi still isn't there but probably will be.
 
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