I think I know one of the games you're talking about (4 years ago), but the for the life of me I can't recall the second performance.
Joel Matip
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Away at Chelsea and away at Man City, I think both games were in the same season.
Lucas starting so much in Rafa's last season wasn't the plan though.
We were going to win the league with Mascher and Aquilini running the engine room.
As manwithnoname says, every season he has been around as a regular starter, you can pretty much bet your house that we would struggle to get close to top 4.
The thing that i'm happy about is this ; I can feel that Klopp has sussed that Lucas is inadequate in the extreme. Whenever he has got a chance to drop him, he has taken it more often than not. He has still started a lot of games due to the fixture congestion and the long injury lists when he took over.
But I think we are on the cusp seeing the end of the hapless cunt start game after game and ruin our experience of supporting the club...and we may soon see the end of all Lucas threads. I can see light at the end of the tunnel.
The thing that i'm happy about is this ; I can feel that Klopp has sussed that Lucas is inadequate in the extreme. Whenever he has got a chance to drop him, he has taken it more often than not. He has still started a lot of games due to the fixture congestion and the long injury lists when he took over.
But I think we are on the cusp seeing the end of the hapless cunt start game after game and ruin our experience of supporting the club...and we may soon see the end of all Lucas threads. I can see light at the end of the tunnel.
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Yes, integral. How many league starts was it again?
And our best run of form (which propelled us in to the title fight), he was dropped
Dunno to be honest.
I just think its a simplistic argument to say we are a 7th place team with him in it.
We are a 7th place team with Gerrard, Carragher, Suarez etc.
We had one good season in the past decade and he played 27 times in it.
Maybe if he had played only 5 times we would have won the league, or maybe if he had played 38 times we would have finished 12th.
But I doubt it.
Hes a good player, but hes not a game winning player.
No, the obvious conclusion is that our best teams and most successful seasons - in which we perform best, win trophies, reach finals, and genuinely contest the league title - are teams that do not include Lucas.
As a logical extension of this hypothesis, backed up by empirical evidence as discussed in the previous paragraph, we can conclude that in order to be successful, we need better players than Lucas, and more of them, so that Lucas - and other players demonstrably not very good - do not play, because we have a better chance of winning things with teams that have more good players in them.
In conclusion, Lucas isn't a very good player, and our team is better when better players than Lucas are in it.
I hope this has helped,
Well blimey, the conclusion is that we need better players to win stuff. Never crossed my mind, but you are making it look as if Lucas is solely the one standing between us and winning titles, reaching finals etc.
We reached the CL final in 2005 with the help of players like Biscan, Letallec, Traoré, Sinama, Mellor etc, weren't they "average"?
Hasn't helped at all, by the way.
No, most of them were shit. But you appear to be labouring under a logical fallacy. I'm not trying to say that Liverpool, or any team, have won trophies without any average players contributing. I'm just saying that it's better to have fewer mediocre or poor players and more better ones. It makes the chances of winning much higher.
So I simply find it hard to understand why Lucas has been at Liverpool for nearly a decade, because he isn't very good. And fine, it's clear that in that 10 years, we've usually had better players in the squad, so he hasn't played as often as he might have, and this has coincided with us winning things and being a good side, and when he does play regularly we win nothing and finish 7th or 8th.
Again, not all entirely his fault, but his inclusion in sides is an obvious symptom - we don't have enough good players to ensure he *doesn't* play often - with a predictable outcome: we don't win enough games.
The argument would be exactly the same if we were discussing Traore, assuming he had been here as mystifyingly long as Lucas.
Perhaps you disagree and think Lucas is a really good player. Great. I don't fucking care, because as I think we've already discussed, I find it scarcely credible that anyone cares what you think about anything, as you're very often wrong.
The thing is that any player who isn't evidently brilliant or ever going to be has to be moved on and replaced by someone who is brilliant or has a good chance of being brilliant.
The average players you have need to be a byproduct of your pursuit of brilliance. The ones you get wrong. The thing about Lucas that's so damning is his longevity. We've known for many years that he'll never be a brilliant player, the fact that he's still here shows how messed up the club has been.
The average players you have need to be a byproduct of your pursuit of brilliance. The ones you get wrong. The thing about Lucas that's so damning is his longevity. We've known for many years that he'll never be a brilliant player, the fact that he's still here shows how messed up the club has been.
How did we sign Matip and end up with a Lucas thread, again?
You know how every conversation always ends up at Hitler? That's SCM, but with Lucas
When I put "Godwin's Law" in SCM Translate, it came up with "Wonderman's Law" ...
And he was out of the team up to the point were Henderson got sent off vs City at home.
I still think we would have won the league if he hadnt been suspended against Chelsea and Crystal Palace.
Or Rafa.
Agger.
HITLER
Josemi
Do you think Rafa and Lucas realise how much time people waste arguing over them?
Fucksake Athens. Just what this thread needed...
Only when they're making passionate love to each other ....
Lucas would be quietly efficient throughout but would possibly make a bit of a mess at the end.
This could be the start of a joke: Rafa and Lucas walk into a thread...
Josemi ffs
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