In defense of the defence

[mark1975]

It looks shite full stop. We do look a bit more organised when Carra is there, but it's still brittle to the point that it looks like it'll cave in under minimal pressure.

Skrtel's all over the place, though he's been treated like shite it has to be said and was dragged in from the cold yesterday looking short of confidence.

Agger just stands there, doesn't take control and consequentially doesn't dominate or leave himself open to error, although he seems to have at least one piss poor clearance in him lately, cf the one yesterday late on that Skrtel had to bail him out for.

Johnson, yes he's a great attacker, he makes mistakes. His defensive game has come on and he's been one of our better performers for a while now, but the mistakes are always there, as are, even more alarmingly at his age and with his experience, his lapses in concentration, poor decision making and general inability to but out a cross. He's not good enough as a fullback and will always make mistakes.

Enrique's the only one doing himself justice at the minute and even he is full of flaws.

As a unit and individually I couldn't give a fuck if we sold all of them in the Summer.

 

[refugee]

It's the exact same defence as last year and yet it looks significantly worse. The system needs looking at.

 

[StevieM]

I think lots of people confuse the phrase "Ball Playing Centre Back" with "Centre Back Playing Balls".

Our Centre Backs have been balls all season.

 

[Ryan]

Johnson's gonna get a free pass from me after this one as he's been largely excellent all season.

Skrtel, and to a greater extent Daniel Agger, not so much. Both fucking rubbish. The latter in particular has had a particularly poor season. At fault for so many goals I've lost count, and there are no excuses anymore. He's fit, playing regularly, at the supposed peak of his career, and is giving us bugger all.

We've won nothing with him to this point, fuck him off if you get a decent offer. I can't stand him either. Swanning out of defence like he's fucking Beckenbaeur. Learn to defend you overrated chump.

 

[FoxForceFive]

Johnson's gonna get a free pass from me after this one as he's been largely excellent all season.

Skrtel, and to a greater extent Daniel Agger, not so much. Both fucking rubbish. The latter in particular has had a particularly poor season. At fault for so many goals I've lost count, and there are no excuses anymore. He's fit, playing regularly, at the supposed peak of his career, and is giving us bugger all.

We've won nothing with him to this point, fuck him off if you get a decent offer. I can't stand him either. Swanning out of defence like he's fucking Beckenbaeur. Learn to defend you overrated chump.

As much as the thought of losing two centre backs at once scares me, I'm inclined to agree.

As for Johnson, he's invariably been our third best player in every game this season imo & is a massive reason the attack is functioning so well.

 

[nealmac]

I really don't like being harsh on Johnson. He's been fucking excellent this season. But it has to be said, when he makes 1 mistake, you just know he's in for a 'mare of a game.

Having said that, I still think he's good enough for us.

Our centre backs should definitely be our 2 biggest concerns. They both need replacing. And like Jon says, losing them both scares the shit out of me too.

 

[StevieM]

I think we keep Agger - but we bring in 2 new CB's and pick them on merit.

A good, organised CB - one that's comfortable actually defending - might be able to organise Agger better.

My biggest issue is playing 4 up fron, with Suarez in a central role behind Sturridge - he doesn't drop back in to midfield to help out the CM's when required, so they get overrun -now that it's so blatantly fucking obvious that flooding the midfield and pressing hard will lead to us folding.

 

[Gary25]

I think we keep Agger - but we bring in 2 new CB's and pick them on merit.

A good, organised CB - one that's comfortable actually defending - might be able to organise Agger better.

My biggest issue is playing 4 up fron, with Suarez in a central role behind Sturridge - he doesn't drop back in to midfield to help out the CM's when required, so they get overrun -now that it's so blatantly fucking obvious that flooding the midfield and pressing hard will lead to us folding.

Might be able to organise Agger better? He's not a kid ffs.

And how have you come to the conclusion we're playing with 4 up front? Atm, we're playing with an attacking midfielder on the left in Coutinho and a winger on the right in Downing.

 

[Ryan]

Might be able to organise Agger better? He's not a kid ffs.

Exactly. He's 28, earning a fuckload with us, and has been in the Premier League for half a decade - why does he need someone to hold his fucking hand?

Shouldn't he be the fulcrum of our defence?

If he's staying, I want us to be at a point where he's having to fight for his place with us.

 

[StevieM]

Might be able to organise Agger better? He's not a kid ffs.

And how have you come to the conclusion we're playing with 4 up front? Atm, we're playing with an attacking midfielder on the left in Coutinho and a winger on the right in Downing.

Sturridge leading the line with Coutinho, Suarez & Downing in behind - they're all attack-minded players.

 

[StevieM]

Exactly. He's 28, earning a fuckload with us, and has been in the Premier League for half a decade - why does he need someone to hold his fucking hand?

Shouldn't he be the fulcrum of our defence?

If he's staying, I want us to be at a point where he's having to fight for his place with us.

Maybe because that might get the best out of him and ads sone sort of continuity rather than continuing this cycle of replacing players every 5 seconds.

It's clear that not playing consistently has stunted his career - but there is some ability there - and anyway - quite often the partnership of 2 CB's brings out the best in each.

Maybe because the end result of bashing Agger is always the same - and it involves KHL & another 10 pages of "Agger discussions"

 

[the_khl]

Johnson's gonna get a free pass from me after this one as he's been largely excellent all season.

Skrtel, and to a greater extent Daniel Agger, not so much. Both fucking rubbish. The latter in particular has had a particularly poor season. At fault for so many goals I've lost count, and there are no excuses anymore. He's fit, playing regularly, at the supposed peak of his career, and is giving us bugger all.

We've won nothing with him to this point, fuck him off if you get a decent offer. I can't stand him either. Swanning out of defence like he's fucking Beckenbaeur. Learn to defend you overrated chump.

You can't stand him because of the way he runs?

Tell us more, please, you seem very knowledgeable about football.

Oh and for the record, I'd say you better get used to his swagger. He stays and plays as long as he's fit because Rodgers, despite his flaws, knows his football and knows how to appreciate a great player.

 

[Delinquent]

*cringe*

 

[LeTallecWiz]

this is what makes this site so great! 🙂

 

[Lastboyscout]

The defence looks very dysfunctional and unorganized when Carra isnt starting.
No oneis taking command of thesituation, no leadership or vocal presence.
The midfield has looked better in recent months after Lucas came back but when Carra is out you can see how the back 5 shifts over from balanced to all over the place.

No doubt Rodgers needs to tweak his tactics as far as the midfield is concerned, but our biggest taskthis summer is replacing Carra. Skrtel is off and thats fine by me.

We also have no one like Lucas in our squad. The rest of the midfielders have their best attributes in the attacking part of the game.

I think it's both Lucas and Carragher missing that causes the issue. As a defender you get used to not only the movement beside to you, but also in front of you. Lucas was also giving them an option, any of the back four when under pressure. Take that away and it's one less option they have when they are under pressure, and if recent games are to go by, their preferred, assured option.

 

[the_khl]

*cringe*

I was even contemplating calling him Ryan O'Stupid.

 

[Delinquent]

I was even contemplating calling him Ryan O'Stupid.

Cutting! He'd never have come back from that.

 

[the_khl]

Cutting! He'd never have come back from that.

You have to draw the line somewhere.

I am not here to make people cry real tears.

 

[Ryan]

*cringe*

Yup, pretty much what I did too.

 

[Modo]

I think what bothers both me and KHL, is that Agger didn't do anything wrong against Southampton and has been pretty good lately, but still gets singled out for past mistakes.
You see people saying that he needs to learn how to defend. However you don't see someone saying "he needs to learn how to control a ball" about another defender....cause that's evidently taboo on this board.

 

[Ryan]

I think what bothers both me and KHL, is that Agger didn't do anything wrong against Southampton and has been pretty good lately, but still gets singled out for past mistakes.
You see people saying that he needs to learn how to defend. However you don't see someone saying "he needs to learn how to control a ball" about another defender....cause that's taboo on this board.

Yes we're weird in that we want defenders to defend.

And he's made countless errors this season, or are they simply "past mistakes" which are to be forgotten?

 

[Fabio]

People can criticise a player for not controlling a ball Modo because they're top level professionals and trapping a football is fucking basic.

Second to that is performing the task you're paid to do, I. E. Defenders defend and strikers score goals.

Everything after that is a bonus

 

[gkmacca]

Unless you're Carragher.

 

[Hansern]

So, seems as though Rodgers has shaped up the defence in the 2nd part of the season.
Conceding 43 vs 40 goals last season but scoring 24 more, 71 vs 47.

16 clean sheets (2nd in the league) compared to 12 last season.

Something to build on this summer and continuing to improve towards a top 4 finish.

 

[StevieM]

So, seems as though Rodgers has shaped up the defence in the 2nd part of the season.
Conceding 43 vs 40 goals last season but scoring 24 more, 71 vs 47.

16 clean sheets (2nd in the league) compared to 12 last season.

Something to build on this summer and continuing to improve towards a top 4 finish.

I'd say Carragher coming in and organising the defence might have something to do with it.

 

[Modo]

I'd say Carragher coming in and organising the defence might have something to do with it.

I'd say Coutinho joining the team and being out of this world might have something to do with it as well.

 

[Hansern]

Thats certainly one of the key factors. Rodgers was right about the leadership and vocal part.

 

[StevieM]

I'd say Coutinho joining the team and being out of this world might have something to do with it as well.

.... With us keeping clean sheets.... Really???

Is it that hard to admit Carragher is good at defending?

 

[Modo]

.... With us keeping clean sheets.... Really???

Is it that hard to admit Carragher is good at defending?

Kinda meant the goals scored.

 

[mark1975]

I'd say Coutinho joining the team and being out of this world might have something to do with it as well.

Ever quick to take something away from the guy. We've looked ALOT more confident and controlled at the back since he came in.