Gerrard to Saudi Arabia
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Saudi Arabia: Imminent execution of seven teenagers
June 15, 2023
In 2018, Saudi Arabia introduced the Juvenile Law which set a maximum penalty of 10 years in prison for anyone under the age of 18 convicted of a ta’zir crime. A 2020 Royal Order also prohibited judges from imposing discretionary death sentences on individuals under 15 years old at the time of the crime they are convicted of.
In November 2022, the country resumed executions for drug-related offences, ending a moratorium on such executions which the Saudi Human Rights Commission said had been in place since January 2020.
Unfair trials
Six of the seven young men were convicted of terrorism-related charges, including for taking part in anti-government protests or attending the funerals of those killed by security forces. The six young men sentenced to death are from the Shi’a minority, who routinely face discrimination and grossly unfair trials on vague and wide-ranging charges stemming from their opposition to the government.
Yousef al-Manasif, who was between 15 and 18 years old at the time of the alleged offence, was sentenced to death by the Specialized Criminal Court (SCC) in November 2022. According to his charge sheet and verdict, which Amnesty International reviewed, al-Manasif was convicted on several charges including: “Seeking to disrupt the social fabric and national cohesion, and participating and inciting sit-ins and protests that disrupt the state’s cohesion and security.” His family said they were not allowed to see or visit him until over six months after his arrest, during which time they said he was held in solitary confinement. The appeals court upheld his sentence in March 2023.
Another defendant, Abdullah al-Darazi, was 17 years old at the time of the alleged offence. Amongst other charges, he was convicted of “participating … in riots in al-Qatif, and chanting slogans against the state and causing chaos” and “attacking security officials with Molotov cocktails”. He told the court that he was held in pre-trial detention for three years and not allowed access to a lawyer throughout his investigations and pre-trial detention.
According to his court documents, which Amnesty International reviewed, he told the judge: “I demand an independent medical evaluation to prove the torture that I have been subjected to…The records of the Dammam investigations unit hospital prove that I continue to be treated as a result of beatings on my ears during my interrogation, and I continue to call for a medical report on this.”
“Executing people who were under 18 years old at the time of the crime they have been convicted of, or for crimes not involving intentional killing, or after unfair trials including on the basis of confessions obtained by torture or other ill-treatment violate international law. The death penalty is the ultimate cruel, inhumane, and degrading punishment,” said Morayef.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/n...omise-to-abolish-death-penalty-for-juveniles/
June 15, 2023
In 2018, Saudi Arabia introduced the Juvenile Law which set a maximum penalty of 10 years in prison for anyone under the age of 18 convicted of a ta’zir crime. A 2020 Royal Order also prohibited judges from imposing discretionary death sentences on individuals under 15 years old at the time of the crime they are convicted of.
In November 2022, the country resumed executions for drug-related offences, ending a moratorium on such executions which the Saudi Human Rights Commission said had been in place since January 2020.
Unfair trials
Six of the seven young men were convicted of terrorism-related charges, including for taking part in anti-government protests or attending the funerals of those killed by security forces. The six young men sentenced to death are from the Shi’a minority, who routinely face discrimination and grossly unfair trials on vague and wide-ranging charges stemming from their opposition to the government.
Yousef al-Manasif, who was between 15 and 18 years old at the time of the alleged offence, was sentenced to death by the Specialized Criminal Court (SCC) in November 2022. According to his charge sheet and verdict, which Amnesty International reviewed, al-Manasif was convicted on several charges including: “Seeking to disrupt the social fabric and national cohesion, and participating and inciting sit-ins and protests that disrupt the state’s cohesion and security.” His family said they were not allowed to see or visit him until over six months after his arrest, during which time they said he was held in solitary confinement. The appeals court upheld his sentence in March 2023.
Another defendant, Abdullah al-Darazi, was 17 years old at the time of the alleged offence. Amongst other charges, he was convicted of “participating … in riots in al-Qatif, and chanting slogans against the state and causing chaos” and “attacking security officials with Molotov cocktails”. He told the court that he was held in pre-trial detention for three years and not allowed access to a lawyer throughout his investigations and pre-trial detention.
According to his court documents, which Amnesty International reviewed, he told the judge: “I demand an independent medical evaluation to prove the torture that I have been subjected to…The records of the Dammam investigations unit hospital prove that I continue to be treated as a result of beatings on my ears during my interrogation, and I continue to call for a medical report on this.”
“Executing people who were under 18 years old at the time of the crime they have been convicted of, or for crimes not involving intentional killing, or after unfair trials including on the basis of confessions obtained by torture or other ill-treatment violate international law. The death penalty is the ultimate cruel, inhumane, and degrading punishment,” said Morayef.
https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/n...omise-to-abolish-death-penalty-for-juveniles/
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I know we aren't supposed to care, and just take their money - but here's some of the things the Saudi system of government does.
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In February 2015, the Saudi Arabian authorities publicly flogged blogger Raif Badawi, sentenced to 1,000 lashes and 10 years in prison for 'insulting Islam' and founding an online forum for political debate.
Due to be flogged 50 times every week, Raif’s lashes have so far been postponed on a weekly basis. For the first couple of weeks in January, the authorities cited medical advice given by doctors who examined Raif, who had found his wounds ‘hadn’t healed enough’ for him to be flogged again ‘safely’. Latterly, the Saudi Arabian authorities have refrained from flogging Raif, without giving a reason. He continues to be told on a weekly basis whether his 950 lashes will begin again that week.
Courts in Saudi Arabia continue to sentence people to be punished by torture for many offences, often following unfair trials. Corporal punishment like flogging, for example, is a cruel, inhuman and degrading punishment that has no place in the justice system.
Besides Raif Badawi, dozens more outspoken activists remain behind bars, simply for exercising their rights to freedom of expression, association and assembly.
In the last two years, all of Saudi Arabia’s prominent and independent human rights defenders have been imprisoned, threatened into silence, or fled the country. The authorities have targeted the small but vocal community of human rights defenders, including by using anti-terrorism laws to suppress their peaceful actions to expose and address human rights violations.
Going to a public gathering, including a demonstration, is a criminal act, under an order issued by the Interior Ministry in 2011. Those who defy the ban face arrest, prosecution and imprisonment on charges such as ‘inciting people against the authorities’.
Women and girls remain subject to discrimination in law and practice, with laws that ensure they are subordinate citizens to men - particularly in relation to family matters such as marriage, divorce, child custody and inheritance.
Former detainees, trial defendants and others have told us that the security forces frequently use torture in detention, and that those responsible are never brought to justice.
You can be detained and arrested with no good reason - Scores of people have been arrested and detained in pre-trial detention for six months or more, which breaches the Kingdom’s own criminal codes. Detainees are frequently held incommunicado during their interrogation and denied access to their lawyers. Some human rights activists have been detained without charge or trial for more than two years.
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In February 2015, the Saudi Arabian authorities publicly flogged blogger Raif Badawi, sentenced to 1,000 lashes and 10 years in prison for 'insulting Islam' and founding an online forum for political debate.
Due to be flogged 50 times every week, Raif’s lashes have so far been postponed on a weekly basis. For the first couple of weeks in January, the authorities cited medical advice given by doctors who examined Raif, who had found his wounds ‘hadn’t healed enough’ for him to be flogged again ‘safely’. Latterly, the Saudi Arabian authorities have refrained from flogging Raif, without giving a reason. He continues to be told on a weekly basis whether his 950 lashes will begin again that week.
Courts in Saudi Arabia continue to sentence people to be punished by torture for many offences, often following unfair trials. Corporal punishment like flogging, for example, is a cruel, inhuman and degrading punishment that has no place in the justice system.
Besides Raif Badawi, dozens more outspoken activists remain behind bars, simply for exercising their rights to freedom of expression, association and assembly.
In the last two years, all of Saudi Arabia’s prominent and independent human rights defenders have been imprisoned, threatened into silence, or fled the country. The authorities have targeted the small but vocal community of human rights defenders, including by using anti-terrorism laws to suppress their peaceful actions to expose and address human rights violations.
Going to a public gathering, including a demonstration, is a criminal act, under an order issued by the Interior Ministry in 2011. Those who defy the ban face arrest, prosecution and imprisonment on charges such as ‘inciting people against the authorities’.
Women and girls remain subject to discrimination in law and practice, with laws that ensure they are subordinate citizens to men - particularly in relation to family matters such as marriage, divorce, child custody and inheritance.
Former detainees, trial defendants and others have told us that the security forces frequently use torture in detention, and that those responsible are never brought to justice.
You can be detained and arrested with no good reason - Scores of people have been arrested and detained in pre-trial detention for six months or more, which breaches the Kingdom’s own criminal codes. Detainees are frequently held incommunicado during their interrogation and denied access to their lawyers. Some human rights activists have been detained without charge or trial for more than two years.
It's not about not caring, there is nothing more we can really do but be disgusted by it and say it's against standard moral/human principles......what is it exactly you're calling for, to get as many soldiers out there to take over their country and start a war? Like I don't understand your thought logic here.
And it's not just about "taking their money", "blood money" or whatever people wanna call it because at the end of the day people like Bobby or Stevie are going out there to work....like anybody in Western society would do.
This is not just a Saudi Arabia thing, it's the whole of the Arabia world + a large portion of middle eastern civilisation.
Of course not. Why would you invade a country. Lasting change only happens from within.
If Saudi Arabia wants to be loved in the west, then they need to start reforming
I'm saying don't take the money, until they start to reform. Set some conditions for taking the money. SA is the one seeking to sportswash right now, so say yeah ok sportswash away, but first here's some people you need to free and things you need to do (stop flogging, stop torture, allow people to speak on Twitter etc).
right now, players are taking the money without using leverage.
How much was Firmino on with the pool? He's a wealthy man, he can afford to set the terms a little. The world won't change until we start to call this stupidity out.
If Saudi Arabia wants to be loved in the west, then they need to start reforming
I'm saying don't take the money, until they start to reform. Set some conditions for taking the money. SA is the one seeking to sportswash right now, so say yeah ok sportswash away, but first here's some people you need to free and things you need to do (stop flogging, stop torture, allow people to speak on Twitter etc).
right now, players are taking the money without using leverage.
How much was Firmino on with the pool? He's a wealthy man, he can afford to set the terms a little. The world won't change until we start to call this stupidity out.
You’re asking them to change their culture because it suits us?
An Islamic law they’ve been ruled under for the best part of 60 decades?
You’d still go to countries like Mexico and Chile though wouldn’t you for vacation or if they offered you an obscene amount
If money……countries where they’re long known for their drug trafficking and extortions in their numbers by cartels and even police.
This. With you 100%, horse. Very saddened by this news, both Stevie and now Bobby too. Seems everybody has their price, sadly. Even those who don't need the money and could get lots (less, yes, but still lots) elsewhere.
No he really couldn’t if he did want to sign. It’s a strange take anyone as pretty much everything of convenience in there has their finger prints all over it. It was the same hypocritical stance rolled out time and time again when LIV came into the golf scene.
How? Because the PGA caved in the end? I don't think they look foolish... I think they stood by their principals, did the right thing and were eventually betrayed by their own leadership.
There is right and wrong out there, and multi-millionaires taking their blood money to be part of their sports-washing propaganda is wrong. It just is. The fact that it's inevitable doesn't make it any less so, and I'm very disappointed in those players I once respected for doing what they've done here.
not looking for them to change their culture. Just stop killing / torturing / imprisoning innocents. I disagree with you in that I don’t think that is “culture”. There are Islamic countries that don’t engage in that on that level
course he could. If he had principles and willing to walk away. He might even get a few more on board. It’s all about leadership - it wouldn’t be hard for someone like him to move the needle on this
A lot of them do. Iran, Iraq, Syria, Afganistan UAE, Qatar, Oman, Kuwait....still so many countries out there which have yet to outlaw the death penalty.
We don't live in an ideal world unfortunately, we have a government who love making the rich richer and do nothing to help those in need......they keep the working class' tax for themselves instead of improving areas in deep deep crisis (Liverpool being one).
I'd love the Russians to stop killing Ukrainians.
I'd love the Israeli's to stop killing the Palestinians
I'd love the Mexicans to stop killing their own innocents.
I'd love the Chinese to stop killing people in Hong Kong/Taiwan.
I'd love the North Koreans to stop their nuclear tests they always seem to have going on.
I'd love the Iranians to take away their death penalty and give women their right of way.
I'd love the Americans to sort out their gun problems and stop letting teenage kids commit mass murders (typically in schools)
One can dream, I suppose.
And..? I don't understand your point here... Because it happens, we should all just be ok with it all? What's wrong with criticizing those who play a role in the normalizing of this dark ages bullshit?
Tiger Woods and Rory Mcilroy couldn’t. What chance has Gerrard? Sure he could have said no but it wouldn’t have made a bit of difference.
You'd rather be alone, shown no love & miserable?
What if those people were young ladies Markeh eh? ^^
What's awful about a bunch of excited kids singing his name wanting to take a photo with him on their phones? Don't be so silly.
This is a big deal for Al Ahli fans.
Give it couple hours before you OD'd.
I’d save that for day 30
They have no experience in how to actually do anything at this level.
It would make a BIG difference to many, who used to respect him and wish he'd not sold his soul like this. Who hoped there was more about him that this...
And before you say that we don't matter, and it doesn't matter, it matters to US. That's why we're dissapointed.
You honestly think they are doing this to be loved in the West ? - what are you on about. They are doing this because people in the middle east and Asia love football, and they can afford to do this.
Everyone keeps going on about human rights - like they understand the culture over there in the middle east. It's really simple - live your life how you want to as long as it's within the Islamic framework and does not involve anything that resembles insurrection. For those of you who think getting rid of these Kings/Emirs/Dictators - think very carefully and just look at the disaster that is Iraq/Libya. A long time ago the "Christian" Foreign Secretary of Saddam Hussain was asked about the consequences of the then Iraqi regime being overthrown, his response was really simple "You have no idea the nutters that would come and replace us, and how hard it is to keep them locked up and down" - well we all know who these nutters are now. The way I see it, and the way you should see it for the middle east - the people have the leaders in place that is right for their society.
I hope the Saudi league really does take off and does well, the changes taking place under MBS are long overdue.
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