Forest vs PGMOL

[tomasjj]

And if VAR is uncertain, send the ref to the screen.

 

[Markeh]

Agreed. I think they need to stop VAR being run by referees, there should be a qualified referee reviewing the video, but there should be an intermediary who runs the whole process i.e. ascertaining referee decision making (as per previous post above this) and running a clear set of checks where the VAR Ref (who has the video) gives their assessment and the on field gives theirs. I don't think the VAR should talk to the Ref.

Imagine this:

VAR Intermediary: Ref - what was your view
Ref: Defender played the ball
VAR Intermediary: VAR - what happened in the video
VAR: Defender didn't play the ball
VAR Intermediary: Ref - the player didn't play the ball, please change you decision

There is too much discussion between VAR and Ref trying to help the ref justify his decision. The aim here is for the whole refereeing team to run a game by the rules, at the moment it feels very Ref vs VAR.

i like this idea but if there’s something we know about referees it’s that they’ll butcher a good idea and end up worse off

i’d suggest a set of questions to answer for every scenario but it would just take them longer and they’d never stick to it rigidly.

scenario 6a possible foul in the box (no handball suspected):
did the defender make contact with the ball?
did the incident occur entirely inside the box?
upon review do you have any suspicion that the attacker intentionally initiated contact?
upon review was the attacker offside?
upon review did the ball make contact with the attackers hand?

 

[Beamrider]

And if VAR is uncertain, send the ref to the screen.

They need to get beyond this idea that the ref will always change his view when sent to the screen. They should be sending them to the screen where there is doubt and the ref should feel able to stand by the original decision if they consider that appropriate. The only time I can remember that happening to us was a CL game against Atletico a few years back. It's far too rare.
At present, VAR is letting the ref down by standing by too many on-field decisions which are incorrect. And it would surely help the ref to concentrate if they weren't talking shite into his ear-piece all the time.

 

[darkstarexodus]

They need to get beyond this idea that the ref will always change his view when sent to the screen. They should be sending them to the screen where there is doubt and the ref should feel able to stand by the original decision if they consider that appropriate. The only time I can remember that happening to us was a CL game against Atletico a few years back. It's far too rare.
At present, VAR is letting the ref down by standing by too many on-field decisions which are incorrect. And it would surely help the ref to concentrate if they weren't talking shite into his ear-piece all the time.

I'd be ok if the ref went to the screen for any subjective (e.g. not offside) decisions by default. Stops the dynamic of 'embarrassing' your mates. Get a chance to review your own decision.

 

[Frogfish]

I'd be ok if the ref went to the screen for any subjective (e.g. not offside) decisions by default. Stops the dynamic of 'embarrassing' your mates. Get a chance to review your own decision.

Agreed. Which is why I mentioned, somewhere in another lifetime, that what is wrong with having iPad Minis (or whatever, but not a phone) in their pockets and then VAR can directly send replays of whatever the ref wants to see to it, in real time. Surely a time saver as well as an embarrassment saver (since it can be de rigueur and not VAR sending a red-faced ref to a monitor).

 

[Beamrider]

This might sound a bit radical but I would also be OK with them always continuing to play while the VAR check is being done and then calling it back at the next stoppage in play after a thorough check, even if that means, for example, a player who should be red carded staying on for a couple more minutes while the review is carried out, or a penalty being awarded after the opposition has gone down the other end and scored on the counter.
Better to take the time and reduce errors than rush things and get it wrong. Would also reduce unnecessary stoppages and would have meant, for example, that the Diaz goal at Spurs could have been awarded after Darren England realised he'd fucked up.

 

[Markeh]

i’m not sure that’s for me, do the continuations in play stand? my most hated aspect of the current system is ‘dead play’ where you know the current phase of play is completely meaningless because should a goal occur it’ll all be rolled back as something was missed by the referee in the buildup.

 

[Beamrider]

i’m not sure that’s for me, do the continuations in play stand? my most hated aspect of the current system is ‘dead play’ where you know the current phase of play is completely meaningless because should a goal occur it’ll all be rolled back as something was missed by the referee in the buildup.

Get that, and appreciate it's not a perfect suggestion, but all these stoppages for VAR reviews that conclude no intervention is required 2 minutes later do my head in.
I'd suggest that anything in the continuation of play would stand. Teams would know that so should play to the whistle as with offsides at present So as an example, when we played City at Anfield a few years back, they had a penalty shout, we went down the other end and Fabs scored a screamer. The place would have gone mental if VAR had then given Ciry the pen and disallowed our goal, and it's possible that VAR bottled the decision on that basis. In our fa our, obvs, so who cares right? Under my proposal, Fabs's goal would still stand but VAR could still award City the penalty. Alisson would have saved it anyway so it wouldn't have mattered.

 

[Markeh]

Get that, and appreciate it's not a perfect suggestion, but all these stoppages for VAR reviews that conclude no intervention is required 2 minutes later do my head in.
I'd suggest that anything in the continuation of play would stand. Teams would know that so should play to the whistle as with offsides at present So as an example, when we played City at Anfield a few years back, they had a penalty shout, we went down the other end and Fabs scored a screamer. The place would have gone mental if VAR had then given Ciry the pen and disallowed our goal, and it's possible that VAR bottled the decision on that basis. In our fa our, obvs, so who cares right? Under my proposal, Fabs's goal would still stand but VAR could still award City the penalty. Alisson would have saved it anyway so it wouldn't have mattered.

yea, i’ll definitely give you that, the multiple minutes stoppages are nonsense and they’ve been a problem since day 1 when we played west brom in the cup. it’s probably the no.1 issue fans have with VAR

i can imagine the officials collective heads spinning in your example with them reviewing the penalty and checking the goal was ok

 

[Farkmaster]

Why are we talking about any significant changes, when we've got a pigfuck going on.? This process right now isn't a process, it's just a bunch of improvisation.

Give this lot any system and they'll fuck it up. There is zero professionalism. It's amateur hour.

 

[Hansern]

Weird seeing Anthony Taylor have a good game in the CL. Great communication, telling the players to hurry up, not getting drawn into any players rolling around without any contact and being clear and decisive.

The professional set up and focus in Europe can even make Taylor look good.

 

[MomoWASright]

Had Ramos been sent off in that final Klopp would have two Champions Leagues.

Had Kompany been sent off for being last man preventing a goal scoring opportunity and Kane been sent off to that challenge on Robbo Klopp would have 3 Premier Leagues.

They’re all shit. And have been for ages.

 

[Farkmaster]

This whole how should we reform var thing is like when I read recipe reviews and they say, "I didn't have anchovies, parmesan, or lettuce, so I subbed in tuna fish, cashew cheese, and freshly cut grass... Recipe is shit, tasted horrible, 1 star."

 

[tombrown]

This whole how should we reform var thing is like when I read recipe reviews and they say, "I didn't have anchovies, parmesan, or lettuce, so I subbed in tuna fish, cashew cheese, and freshly cut grass... Recipe is shit, tasted horrible, 1 star."

That's me, except I don't leave the review

 

[Hansern]

Lolz

Mark Clattenburg has RESIGNED from his role as a consultant to the Nottingham Forest board. He started the role in February but now believes he is more of an hindrance than a help.

 

[mark1975]

Lolz

Mark Clattenburg has RESIGNED from his role as a consultant to the Nottingham Forest board. He started the role in February but now believes he is more of an hindrance than a help.

Sacked by Carra, great stuff.

 

[mark1975]

Weird seeing Anthony Taylor have a good game in the CL. Great communication, telling the players to hurry up, not getting drawn into any players rolling around without any contact and being clear and decisive.

The professional set up and focus in Europe can even make Taylor look good.

Any ref can and will make mistakes, it's the circus around them that's exasperated the issue. Ok, some of the mistakes of late have been really out there, but it's not aided by confusion, undermining and complete chaos from the muppets who are sat there with the luxury of watching incidents from every angle. A ref can easily miss something, VAR have no fucking excuse. If refs were left to run games like that, with able support for the things they can't see or can easily miss in the intense atmosphere of a game, then we'd all be happy. They can't all be terrible refs, can they? The truth has to be somewhere around the fact the support is shite and they're then pressured and make forced mistakes.