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Dalglish Opposes Hodgson as Liverpool Manager

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[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124740#msg1124740 date=1277207391]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=40695.msg1124722#msg1124722 date=1277205224]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124716#msg1124716 date=1277204760]
[quote author=LadyRed link=topic=40695.msg1124711#msg1124711 date=1277204622]
I tend to agree with Squiggles on a lot of things, but I don't get this Hodgson fan calu bit. Is he related to you?

I get that he's managed some top clubs, but he's ended up at *Fulham*, hardly managing at the top level now, is he?
[/quote]

So what, Anita? Harry Redknapp was at *Portsmouth* when Spurs hired him. Spurs were in the relegation zone at the time; now they're in the Champions League. Given that the new manager's main aim is to stabilise us and get us back in the top 4, I don't see how being manager of overachieving Fulham is necessarily a disqualification for the job.


[/quote]

It isn't necessarily. But let's be clear, he's managing a mid table side with pretty low targets, so it's not too difficult to overachieve. I want a manager that's able to compete at the top level. People make the argument that Kenny hasn't managed at the top level for a long time, I think the same would have to be made for Hogson.

I really have my doubts about him being a manager that could convince our stars to stay and furthermore someone who can attract others to the club. And if we've got significant personnel threatening to walk out on the club if he's appointed, it already tells me it's the wrong appointment.


[/quote]

Which 'significant personnel' have threatened to leave if he's appointed?

EDIT: Oh, you mean Kenny?
[/quote]

You dnt need a grade in psycolgy to undertand that our best players will leave (including but not limited to Stevie G, Fernando and Mascher) if we can offer them 0 CL footie and Roy Parking-the-bus-Hodgson.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

I never said that bunnyman, what i did say is that it is likely that we will be losing our best players whilst trying to pay of rapidly increasing debt. The only genuine interest they have in the Dollar, at the minute they are not selling a competitive club in terms of players gathering cups in may but they are trying to trade on the enormous history and fan base which will stay regardless of whether the players do or not.

Put bluntly I am not expecting a net zero spend and overall weakening like last summer again, I expect something much much worse.

I do not consider it inconceiveable that we will sell soem or all of the big players and I do suspect we will also be unable to replace them adequately financially or from the point of view of being able to attract them in the first place.

I suspect that Dalglish holds a little bit too much power in the hearts of the fans for the boards(read owners) comfort especially if he were to try and oppose their actions, which however blinkered you might be can hardly be judged to be in anybodys interests but their own.

That's not anything like a conspiracy, nor ignorance thats just the way it is when you are losing millions and millions and millions every year due to loans.

As for Hodgson, i've always quite liked him tbh, he seems dignified and after such a long time in the game looks to know what he is doing, I really liked Pellegrini at Villareal and think he would be a good appointment either way we will see soon. I hope its a good one, we will need him to be so.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=40695.msg1124750#msg1124750 date=1277208672]
"Flavour of the month"

2 seasons of strong over performance, in our league.

"Shit away record"

Countered by a superb, record breaking home record

"Everyone will leave!!!!"

I've been more impressed by Hodgson's recent achievements than anything Dalglish has done in the last ten years. It's not hard to put that point across to the players. As far as I know, no player has come out and said he'd welcome a Dalglish appointment. This is hear say which has turned into SCM fact. We know fuck all about anything.
[/quote]

"Overperformance" by what measure? What have they won with that "Superb, record-breaking home record? What record anyway - Fulham's? In a season in which even the champions lost a record number of games? What "recent achievements"?

No-one's denying that player reaction is ultimately a matter for speculation at this stage. Unfortunately for your particular brand of it, Stevie's regard for Kenny is a matter of record, as is Torres' friendship with Stevie, so there's a sight more reason to anticipate Kenny being able to hold on to them than ever there is about Hodgson. Nor is any of them going to come out and say the kind of thing you're suggesting while there's still a chance Hodgson might get the job.
 
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40695.msg1124775#msg1124775 date=1277209926]
"Overperformance" by what measure? What have they won with that "Superb, record-breaking home record? What record anyway - Fulham's? In a season in which even the champions lost a record number of games? What "recent achievements"?[/quote]

Whatever way you want to look at it, he has done a fantastic job at Fulham. To my mind, at worst, he will offer a steady hand and will stabilise the team/dressing room. I think he will be able to rebuild confidence and will be able to get far more from this group of players than Rafa managed to do last season. Bringing Fulham to a European final is a superb achievement JJ.

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40695.msg1124775#msg1124775 date=1277209926]
No-one's denying that player reaction is ultimately a matter for speculation at this stage. Unfortunately for your particular brand of it, Stevie's regard for Kenny is a matter of record, as is Torres' friendship with Stevie, so there's a sight more reason to anticipate Kenny being able to hold on to them than ever there is about Hodgson. Nor is any of them going to come out and say the kind of thing you're suggesting while there's still a chance Hodgson might get the job.
[/quote]

Stevie's regard for Kenny is all well and good but is the report such that it would make Gerrard turn down a move to Real? I seriously doubt that. People make a lot of players being friends, but when it comes to your career you don't stay in a job because you work with mates, you make the decisions that benefit you. If Gerrard feels a move to Real would be beneficial then he will be off.

But as you say it is speculation, no one on here knows the depths of relationships between employees of LFC.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

I don't buy into that theory particularly but the fact that Hodgson is still the favourite for the job perhaps indicates that we intend to spend very little on transfers, and want someone who has recent experience of working under tight budget restraints, and getting the most out of the players he has.

I don't know whether the owners are prepared to (or plan to) sell our best assets, (who knows they may have little choice,) but if they are, the appointment of Woy would indicate that we're unlikely to see a great deal of it reinvested. I'm not as against it as some, but I don't think it would represent a particularly progressive appointment.
 
[quote author=Stulikesdrums link=topic=40695.msg1124777#msg1124777 date=1277210464]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40695.msg1124775#msg1124775 date=1277209926]
"Overperformance" by what measure? What have they won with that "Superb, record-breaking home record? What record anyway - Fulham's? In a season in which even the champions lost a record number of games? What "recent achievements"?[/quote]

Whatever way you want to look at it, he has done a fantastic job at Fulham. To my mind, at worst, he will offer a steady hand and will stabilise the team/dressing room. I think he will be able to rebuild confidence and will be able to get far more from this group of players than Rafa managed to do last season. Bringing Fulham to a European final is a superb achievement JJ.

[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=40695.msg1124775#msg1124775 date=1277209926]
No-one's denying that player reaction is ultimately a matter for speculation at this stage. Unfortunately for your particular brand of it, Stevie's regard for Kenny is a matter of record, as is Torres' friendship with Stevie, so there's a sight more reason to anticipate Kenny being able to hold on to them than ever there is about Hodgson. Nor is any of them going to come out and say the kind of thing you're suggesting while there's still a chance Hodgson might get the job.
[/quote]

Stevie's regard for Kenny is all well and good but is the report such that it would make Gerrard turn down a move to Real? I seriously doubt that. People make a lot of players being friends, but when it comes to your career you don't stay in a job because you work with mates, you make the decisions that benefit you. If Gerrard feels a move to Real would be beneficial then he will be off.

But as you say it is speculation, no one on here knows the depths of relationships between employees of LFC.
[/quote]

Stu, since we're all speculating, I don't think players at a club like LFC will look at Hodgson's record and call it "superb". They'll respect it, but my guess is they'll still ultimately ask "What's he won?". I might add that that's a question Kenny will find it much easier to answer.

Nobody's saying Kenny's appointment would defo persuade Stevie to stay. What many of us are saying, and what I stand by, is that Kenny's appointment would represent BY FAR our best chance of persuading Stevie not to leave, hence also Torres.
 
I didn't say his record was superb mate, 3 away wins tells it's own story there. I was commenting on making the Europa final, that was superb. Especially considering who they beat and some of their home performances. He hasn't won much recently, admittedly, but who has in all the names being mentioned? Very few. Kenny's successes are quite distant now, are they still relevant?

I'm of the view that if Gerrard has made up his mind to leave, then he will leave regardless of who we appoint. Ok, Kenny might have a better chance of keeping him than Roy but that is something we will just have to disagree on. I think Roy could sit down with Gerrard and make a case for him to stay. He's an experienced man who knows how to talk to footballers, he would know just what to say & do to make Stevie stay, whether he does or not would be up to him. Ditto Torres.
 
Squiggs used "superb" about Hodgson's home record and you used it about the UEFA Final. I don't buy that, I'm afraid. Well worthy of respect, for sure, but "superb" is a pretty strong word and my own view is that it's not applicable to any part of Hodgson's record. I'm sure he'd have a decent dart at persuading Stevie and Torres to stick around, but I'm equally sure Kenny's chances of success would be higher.

There's admittedly a debate to be had about the age of Kenny's far more impressive record but, despite the question having being put numerous times, nobody who thinks it DOES matter has managed to specify why. I'd be prepared to bet that a fair few players would simply look at what Kenny's won and worry no more about it. Those who did wonder about the fact that it was some time ago will know (a) the man himself, given his increased profile around the club in the last year, and (b) the considerable help he'd have around him if appointed.
 
Oh, I can't be bothered arguing Hodgson's case anymore, especially if he'd rather manage England. I'm just going to wait and see who's appointed - and support them, whoever they are.

Well, within reason.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

So wait, you mean [size=14pt]IF[/size] G&H can sell torres for 100M tomorrow and the club's valuation would only drop by 50M, then they would refuse to sell torres because they care about the strength of the team?
 
[quote author=justdoit link=topic=40695.msg1124805#msg1124805 date=1277212283]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

So wait, you mean [size=14pt]IF[/size] G&H can sell torres for 100M tomorrow and the club's valuation would only drop by 50M, then they would refuse to sell torres because they care about the strength of the team?
[/quote]



The main difference between our 2nd place and 7th place was arguably Alonso.

I doubt the Yanks are comforted by the 30 million received mainly because A) we paid 20 million for Crockuilani, and B) we've definitely lost a lot more by finishing out of the CL places.

They dont give a shit about us, but what you're implying will hurt their pockets, and that they do care about.
 
Might I just point out that Hodgson's achievements at Fulham pale into insignificance in comparison to Kenny's titles and Pellegrini's job at Villareal (taking a newly promoted side - similar to Fulham - into a champions league spot one year, 2nd in La Liga another, and the Champions league semi-finals another).
 
[quote author=Buddha link=topic=40695.msg1124833#msg1124833 date=1277216120]
Might I just point out that Hodgson's achievements at Fulham pale into insignificance in comparison to Kenny's titles and Pellegrini's job at Villareal (taking a newly promoted side - similar to Fulham - into a champions league spot one year, 2nd in La Liga another, and the Champions league semi-finals another).
[/quote]

Pellegrinni's certainly achieved more, but it a completely different league, using players from South America which wouldn't get permits here. That's the trade off. One big adaptation process.

Dalglish I can't be fucked to get into.
 
[quote author=Buddha link=topic=40695.msg1124833#msg1124833 date=1277216120]
Might I just point out that Hodgson's achievements at Fulham pale into insignificance in comparison to Kenny's titles and Pellegrini's job at Villareal (taking a newly promoted side - similar to Fulham - into a champions league spot one year, 2nd in La Liga another, and the Champions league semi-finals another).
[/quote]

Do you think Pellegrini could achieve that level of success here?
 
[quote author=Stulikesdrums link=topic=40695.msg1124836#msg1124836 date=1277216596]
[quote author=Buddha link=topic=40695.msg1124833#msg1124833 date=1277216120]
Might I just point out that Hodgson's achievements at Fulham pale into insignificance in comparison to Kenny's titles and Pellegrini's job at Villareal (taking a newly promoted side - similar to Fulham - into a champions league spot one year, 2nd in La Liga another, and the Champions league semi-finals another).
[/quote]

Do you think Pellegrini could achieve that level of success here?
[/quote]

it was not quite that spectacular, Pellegrini did really well but he was well bankrolled also, comparatively. I don't think he's a miracle worker however and put simply no I don't think he will be a success, I doubt anybody can as it is at the club. On the bright side he did have Villareal playing some really lovely stuff which at least will be nice to watch while we wait for rescue. If it has to be Kenny to keep the squad together then so be it but for an outside appointment I like Pellegrini (tbh I don't mind hodgson either)
 
[quote author=Stulikesdrums link=topic=40695.msg1124836#msg1124836 date=1277216596]
[quote author=Buddha link=topic=40695.msg1124833#msg1124833 date=1277216120]
Might I just point out that Hodgson's achievements at Fulham pale into insignificance in comparison to Kenny's titles and Pellegrini's job at Villareal (taking a newly promoted side - similar to Fulham - into a champions league spot one year, 2nd in La Liga another, and the Champions league semi-finals another).
[/quote]

Do you think Pellegrini could achieve that level of success here?
[/quote]

Potentially. Certainly every bit as much as I'd hope Woy would and more.

He'd also have us playing the "right way" unlike Hodgson's Rafa-esque compact side.
 
I can't face more depressing percentage football. Honestly, I'll just stop watching.

It hurts what I can best approximate as "my soul".
 
Kenny Dalglish should be crowned King of the Kop once more

By David Maddock




Kenny Dalglish has made it clear – through friends and family – that he wants the Liverpool job.

Speaking to those people close to him, all have a very similar message… quite simply, no matter how long he has been out of the game, he still retains the hunger to succeed as a top-flight manager.

As a journalist, I have covered three different teams managed by Kenny, and at each club, he has exuded a real sense that he is true football man, who cares passionately about the game, and has a deep understanding of its nuances.

Which is exactly what is needed at Anfield right now. The club is in a mess. They have owners who still won’t sell - despite some perfectly reasonable offers on the table – because of a ridiculously myopic view of what the business is worth.

They seem to lack leadership at the top, too, where the amateur bumblings into the world of football by two Yanks who know diddly squat about the sport has left an embarrassing vacuum which has not come close to being filled.

Which means that the decision to sack Rafa Benitez took a preposterously long time, and was handled in a terrible way. And now the decision to appoint a successor has been conducted in the same agonising manner.

What is needed at Liverpool right now is decisive action. It doesn’t need a couple of Americans saying they have heard some random, unsuitable coach is the right man for the job, and so let’s go get him.

What it needs is real football knowledge. Apparently, Dalglish was employed to provide that in the selection process, and after careful deliberation he came to the conclusion that he is the right man for the job.

What he can do is bring rival, warring factions together, and appease those who are still clinging onto an understandable grievance about the nature of Benitez’s departure.

His qualities are what is required at Liverpool right now. He is a football man, who cares about the club, and has a sense of calm authority that has been missing for too long at Anfield.

Roy Hodgson also possesses these qualities, and for all the unfair criticism aimed at him by some Liverpool fans, he too would be a fine choice to bring some dignity to a club that has shown precious little in recent years.

But if Kenny wants the job, if he does come out and suggest he is ready to take it, then he clearly would be an outstanding choice, no matter how long he has been out of the game, and especially if he has a talented young coach alongside him.

http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/opinion/columnists/david-maddock/Why-Kenny-Dalglish-should-be-crowned-King-of-the-Kop-once-more-and-handed-the-Anfield-manager-s-job-David-Maddock-column-article485419.html
 
[quote author=robinhood link=topic=40695.msg1124756#msg1124756 date=1277208860]
I agree with you, Terrier, so why is it the Broughton is so desperate to get Hodgson in?
[/quote]

I didn't know you'd had an audience with Broughton Robin. I'm impressed.
 
[quote author=justdoit link=topic=40695.msg1124805#msg1124805 date=1277212283]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

So wait, you mean [size=14pt]IF[/size] G&H can sell torres for 100M tomorrow and the club's valuation would only drop by 50M, then they would refuse to sell torres because they care about the strength of the team?
[/quote]

Er, no, that's not what I mean - nor what I said - at all.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1125031#msg1125031 date=1277242167]
[quote author=justdoit link=topic=40695.msg1124805#msg1124805 date=1277212283]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=40695.msg1124741#msg1124741 date=1277207500]
Are there really lots of people on this forum who believe the owners are deliberately targeting a pliant manager so they can asset-strip the club?

It's like the Flat Earth Society.

[/quote]

So wait, you mean [size=14pt]IF[/size] G&H can sell torres for 100M tomorrow and the club's valuation would only drop by 50M, then they would refuse to sell torres because they care about the strength of the team?
[/quote]

*Feeds Bunny some words*
Er, no, that's not what I mean - nor what I said - at all.
[/quote]
 
Hodgson Anfield appointment imminent, Liverpool approve transfer kitty


Fulham boss Roy Hodgson could be announced as the new Liverpool manager within the next 48 hours.

Hodgson is thought to be top of the list of candidates to succeed Rafa Benitez, drawn up by Liverpool managing director Christian Purslow and Kenny Dalglish. The 62-year-old apparently fulfils all six criteria set out by Purslow and Dalglish for Benitez's successor and the Anfield board has reportedly approved Hodgson's appointment.

Hodgson has maintained a dignified silence over the speculation that he will join Liverpool, although it is thought he would like to manage another big club before he retires. He will return from South Africa today, where he has been working as a BBC pundit at the World Cup and the Daily Mirror speculates that Hodgson will now finalise contract details with Liverpool.

Apparently, the Anfield board have sanctioned a £15million transfer fund for Hodgson's use. In addition, with Yossi Benayoun set to complete a £5million move to Chelsea and Inter Milan and Barcelona rumoured to be interested in fellow midfielder Javier Mascherano for £30million, the Daily Mirror speculates that Hodgson could have around £50million to spend.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40695.msg1125564#msg1125564 date=1277362835]
Hodgson Anfield appointment imminent, Liverpool approve transfer kitty


Fulham boss Roy Hodgson could be announced as the new Liverpool manager within the next 48 hours.

Hodgson is thought to be top of the list of candidates to succeed Rafa Benitez, drawn up by Liverpool managing director Christian Purslow and Kenny Dalglish. The 62-year-old apparently fulfils all six criteria set out by Purslow and Dalglish for Benitez's successor and the Anfield board has reportedly approved Hodgson's appointment.

Hodgson has maintained a dignified silence over the speculation that he will join Liverpool, although it is thought he would like to manage another big club before he retires. He will return from South Africa today, where he has been working as a BBC pundit at the World Cup and the Daily Mirror speculates that Hodgson will now finalise contract details with Liverpool.

Apparently, the Anfield board have sanctioned a £15million transfer fund for Hodgson's use. In addition, with Yossi Benayoun set to complete a £5million move to Chelsea and Inter Milan and Barcelona rumoured to be interested in fellow midfielder Javier Mascherano for £30million, the Daily Mirror speculates that Hodgson could have around £50million to spend.

[/quote]

£50m wouldn't be bad at all, providing those fuckers don't use it to pay off the debts.
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40695.msg1125567#msg1125567 date=1277363070]
"If" we could spend that amount well, we'd be in quite good shape i think Mark.
[/quote]

Well essentially 5 x £10m players? As long as it's spent well, obv. I still think even if Uncle Roy does take over that Dalglish will have a big role to play in the transfer market.
 
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40695.msg1125569#msg1125569 date=1277363295]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40695.msg1125567#msg1125567 date=1277363070]
"If" we could spend that amount well, we'd be in quite good shape i think Mark.
[/quote]

Well essentially 5 x £10m players? As long as it's spent well, obv. I still think even if Uncle Roy does take over that Dalglish will have a big role to play in the transfer market.
[/quote]

Maybe so.

We could break our transfer record on a defender and sign a left back and still have around £42m to spend on a LW, striker and CM. As always i guess it's all down to what G&H are prepared to do. *fingers crossed*
 
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40695.msg1125570#msg1125570 date=1277364070]
[quote author=mark1975 link=topic=40695.msg1125569#msg1125569 date=1277363295]
[quote author=Rafa4PM link=topic=40695.msg1125567#msg1125567 date=1277363070]
"If" we could spend that amount well, we'd be in quite good shape i think Mark.
[/quote]

Well essentially 5 x £10m players? As long as it's spent well, obv. I still think even if Uncle Roy does take over that Dalglish will have a big role to play in the transfer market.
[/quote]

Maybe so.

We could break our transfer record on a defender and sign a left back and still have around £42m to spend on a LW, striker and CM. As always i guess it's all down to what G&H are prepared to do. *fingers crossed*


[/quote]

Rafael Benitez broke our transfer record on a defender last year.

£17M
 
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