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Big D vs Twitter

[article]
https://www.barrons.com/articles/moderna-stock-why-falling-51628710770

Moderna Stock Crumbled Wednesday. Investors Are Questioning This Year’s Spectacular Surge.

Stock in the Covid-19 vaccine maker Moderna fell 16% Wednesday as investors seemed to struggle to value shares that have nearly tripled in value this year. Moderna (ticker: MRNA) shares had an unbelievable run from the beginning of the year through the middle of last week. The stock was up more than 300% over that period, beating the S&P 500, which climbed 18.%; the iShares Biotechnology ETF (IBB), which was up 14%; and the SPDR S&P Biotech ETF (XBI), which fell 11%. No other stock in the S&P 500, which Moderna joined in late July, has performed nearly as well. The runner-up, Bath & Body Works (BBWI), was up 106%, a respectable gain that isn’t even close to being in Moderna’s league. In April, Barron’s recommended buying Moderna shares, saying that worries at the time that its market value was too high were overblown. When the article went to press, the company’s market value was $67 billion. On Aug. 4, the day before the company reported its latest earnings, its market value was $168.9 billion, according to FactSet. That means that investors thought the company was worth more than the big pharma giant Bristol Myers Squibb (BMY), which has a market value of $149.7 billion. The value was nearly twice that of the biotech stalwart Gilead Sciences (GILD), at $86.8 billion. But as Moderna unveiled its quarterly earnings on Thursday, analysts and investors seemed to look around and develop a case of vertigo. Two longtime Moderna bulls, Oppenheimer analyst Hartaj Singh and Piper Sandler analyst Edward Tenthoff, cut their ratings on the stock. Singh dropped his rating to Perform from Outperform, while Tenthoff cut his to Neutral from Overweight. “With a ~$170B market-cap (largest biotech now) and up 300% YTD …MRNA shares are fairly pricing a tremendous amount of future recurring revenues and pipeline progress,” Singh wrote. In the days since, the market has been struggling to find a stable price for Moderna shares. The stock jumped 17% on Monday, fell 5.7% on Tuesday, and fell again on Wednesday. Bank of America analyst Geoff Meachem wrote in a note published Tuesday that the valuation remains “unreasonable.” In order to justify the market capitalization, an investor would need to assume that the company would sell up to 1. 5 billion doses of its Covid-19 vaccine each year, and “a 100% probability of success for the entire pipeline with aggregate peak sales of $30 billion,” he said. Covid-19 vaccine news has, nevertheless, been positive for Moderna in recent days. Doctors at the Mayo Clinic on Sunday posted a preprint of a study that found that, in a real-world study conducted in Minnesota, the efficacy of the Moderna vaccine was superior to the one from Pfizer (PFE) while the Delta variant was dominant. Meanwhile, authorization of booster doses for at least some subset of the population seems increasingly likely, though Pfizer’s will be first in line. Still, shares are dropping. In a note out Wednesday, BayCrest Partners managing director Jonathan Krinsky noted that trading volume has been high on Moderna shares in recent days. “If it looks like a blowoff, and feels like a blowoff, it’s probably a blowoff,” he wrote. “There is likely further downside in the weeks ahead here.”
[/article]
 
So the stock is down 6% on the week but 300% up on the year.

Dantes, when in doubt zoom out.

And yet, you know the company is not worth 300% more. So something is up. You have morons like Sanchez who think the company is worth that much, because they know nothing about valuation. You have morons like the analysts at barrons who think investors are changing their valuations form one month to the next like a mad woman's piss, because they know nothing about portfolio management.

It's up because traders bought call options. The banks which sold those options for the commission then have to buy the stock to hedge out the risk. The options become more risky due to the options pricing maths. The banks need to buy more stock to rehedge. When you have small illiquid companies that large institutions don't really own because they're not Google, then there is not a lot of people for the bank to buy from, so they have to pay more to get what they need. The risk goes up. They pay even more next time around. And like gamestop the other month, it drives up the price. Then one day, the options expire, the traders cash them in, walk off with the profits. The banks sell the stock to pay off the traders. The idiots who believed Moderna were the next big thing and bought the stock themselves half way through the ride get burned alive.
 
Its normal for a company to fall slightly after an earnings report.

It's a mystery to me why the market acts the way it does.

On track - goes up
Bad news - goes down
Over performance - goes down usually.

That's why I dont dabble in stocks. Too much of a head fuck.
 
It's because earnings reports attract more people to the market, due to people thinking it's a big exciting day, and it being in the financial news, so it increases the liquidity. That's a perfect time to off load your stock onto the public, stock you bought months ago when you predicted what the earnings would be. Had they sold off the stock the day before, there would be no liquidity and the price would have really tanked, by the end of your transaction you'd be getting 20p on the pound. So you don't do that. You wait for the public to step onto the pitch to make up the numbers, then you sell it off for a much smaller hit, hit as in you get to keep more of your profit, not that you're suffering a loss. The public are there to suffer the loss instead.

The 15% drop in Moderna on an earnings report was the smaller fall. On any other normal day, if the same transactions occurred we'd be sending poor the sanchez our thoughts and prayers.
 
............The idiots who believed Moderna were the next big thing and bought the stock themselves half way through the ride get burned alive.
But but but ... if they bought halfway through they'll still be up massively right? And isn't that the exact opposite of getting 'burned alive'?
 
Nobody's 300% up. They'll be up closer to half that if they're lucky, on a small amount of capital which would make it hardly worth it. Or if it was a big amount of capital, aside from their stupidity, when they sell the broker will take a cut, the taxman will take an even more obscene cut, and what's left may just about keep you a little bit ahead of inflation for the year.
 
I see - So, an investment being somewhere between (only) 150% up and 300% up is actually a bad thing...

Wow. I HAVE been doing it all wrong this whole time.
 
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I see - So, an investment being somewhere between (only) 150% up and 300% up is actually a bad thing...

Wow. I HAVE been doing it all wrong this whole time.

An investor will allocate a small amount of capital to moderna (since the volatility is high) and a larger amount or capital to say pfizer (since volatility is lower). So it's a small amount that's gone up. Secondly, once Moderna goes up, the investor will sell it and buy more Pfizer to rebalance their portfolio.

That's why nobody has made 300% aside from people messing around with a few grand.
 
He said, ages ago, that he gets paid a proportion of his remuneration in shares. He hasn't invested anything other than his time and expertise, and now he's made fuckloads.
 
An investor will allocate a small amount of capital to moderna (since the volatility is high) and a larger amount or capital to say pfizer (since volatility is lower). So it's a small amount that's gone up. Secondly, once Moderna goes up, the investor will sell it and buy more Pfizer to rebalance their portfolio.

That's why nobody has made 300% aside from people messing around with a few grand.

So... Yes or no? An investment showing a return of 150% - 300% is now a bad thing?
 
He said, ages ago, that he gets paid a proportion of his remuneration in shares. He hasn't invested anything other than his time and expertise, and now he's made fuckloads.

That could come with strings locking him in on a rolling basis. So if he can't sell this year's allocation until around 3 years down the line, then he may not love to see it.
 

Thank you.

So, having (finally) admitted that, you STILL continue to blather on endlessly about ifs and buts and possible scenarios, all to try and look less (incredibly) wrong, instead of just saying 'Ok, fair play, you win this one', despite the fact that the entire forum can see how wrong you are and the utter nonsense of your stance.

Why are you like this?

It much be exhausting for you... It certainly is for the rest of us here.
 
I can’t even begin to imagine how unfathomably rich Dantes must be, given his genius and insight.

He must make Bezos look like a pauper.
 
I think the bigger question is.. is Dantes an incel?

Somewhere out there, there’s a Colombian post graduate student that can answer that question...

... if she’s not been locked up in the basement of Mumma-Dantes house, that is.
 
Oh look, the sheep were wrong again :

The FBI hasn't found any evidence that the January 6 assault on the US Capitol was part of an organized plot to overturn the election results, Reuters reported, citing law-enforcement officials.

The officials also said that the FBI has "so far found no evidence" that former President Donald Trump or "people directly around him were involved in organizing the violence," Reuters reported.

"Ninety to ninety-five percent of these are one-off cases," a former law-enforcement official familiar with the investigation told Reuters. "There was no grand scheme with Roger Stone and Alex Jones and all of these people to storm the Capitol and take hostages."

More than 570 participants have been arrested by federal officials. Investigators have found that groups such as the Oath Keepers and Proud Boys did plan ahead of time to break into the Capitol, but they didn't engage in much planning beyond that step. Reuters reported that 40 of the defendants are being prosecuted on conspiracy charges, implying a certain amount of planning and coordination.


But prosecutors have generally shied away from alleging a broader plot. Senior Department of Justice officials do not intend to bring forward seditious-conspiracy charges or even racketeering charges, which are commonly used against organized criminal gangs.

A Democratic congressional source told Reuters that senior lawmakers who have been briefed on the FBI's investigation find the results credible.

Though the FBI has not found an organized plot or direct involvement by Trump, that doesn't mean that Trump didn't play an important role in instigating the violence. Earlier this year, the House of Representatives impeached Trump on the charge of "incitement of insurrection" after he spent weeks promoting conspiracy theories about the results of the 2020 election. On January 6, Trump gave a speech on The Ellipse where he urged supporters to march on the Capitol.
 
No, my problem is with neo-nazis, those who apologize for them, and people who pretend that both sides have legitimate concerns.

In most things I encounter, I think myself open-minded and able to listen, learn and be wrong. In this particular matter, I have no desire to listen to somebody whose first reaction to a BLM protest is to scream 'All Lives Matter', as if white people are somehow treated the same way as minorities are, and thus any attempt to improve the way minorities are treated would mean their being elevated above white people... It's just wrong.

I don't care about why they're yelling it. Their ignorance, their racism, their fragility is not something I will ever take a second to understand or empathize with. And anybody who pretends that my intolerance of their intolerance is the same thing, and an equal part of the problem that we're now faced with, can also fuck right off. Fuck me, there are people here who, had they and the internet been around in 1944, would have defended the fucking Nazis and claimed that the allies pushing back as was as much the problem as the Nazis' initial aggression was.

There is no 'fake news', as that cunt and his followers proclaim there to be... There is right wing media and there is left wing media, and they slant their reporting of what's happening to their own ends, yes. But only one side pretends that this cunt isn't a KKK leader in all but attire, inspiring hatred and violence everywhere he goes. Only one side pretends that he wasn't 100% responsible for what happened last week, and has been happening over here for the past four fucking years. THAT'S the fake news, mate. That people push back against that is understandable and laudable, not equally wrong, FFS.

You say the word 'either cause' in your last line to me... Those who hang on his every word, who manufacture this violence and chaos in an attempt to undermine the natural and legal transfer of power, who claim the election was stolen, who refuse to accept the rules simply because they no longer like like them, who stormed the Capitol intent on overthrowing the government by violent means, taking hostages, setting off bombs, those pricks don't have a cause... They have a manifesto. Just like their Austrian mate did in the 1930s and 40s.

This isn't right V left, mate. It's right V wrong. And if you argue that point, you're on the wrong side.

So you fell for media bullshit again
 
Oh look, the sheep were wrong again :

I’m not even sure it’s worth pointing out, but I don’t think anyone other than you or Dantes believes Trump was capable of ORGANISING anything, including putting his trousers on the right way round, let alone a full scale coup.

INCITING people to attempt what they thought was a coup... oh... he’s well capable of that.

I’m presuming you know the difference between ORGANISING and INCITING - you’re supposed to be “smart”.
 
I’m not even sure it’s worth pointing out, but I don’t think anyone other than you or Dantes believes Trump was capable of ORGANISING anything, including putting his trousers on the right way round, let alone a full scale coup.

INCITING people to attempt what they thought was a coup... oh... he’s well capable of that.

I’m presuming you know the difference between ORGANISING and INCITING - you’re supposed to be “smart”.

No evidence.
 
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