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UEFA bending over for Liverpool again

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Woland

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http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/apr/15/birmingham-city-europe-fa-premier-league

Birmingham City's place in Europe threatened by financial concerns
• Carling Cup winners must satisfy FA and Premier League
• Rules were introduced after Portsmouth's administration

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Stuart James
The Guardian, Friday 15 April 2011
Article history

Carson Yeung has been prepared to mortgage his personal properties to raise money for Birmingham City. Photograph: Vincent Yu/AP
Birmingham City face the threat of being denied their licence to play in Europe next season if they cannot convince the Premier League and the Football Association that their finances are not a major cause for concern.

The Premier League is set to hold discussions with the Birmingham board this month before deciding in conjunction with the FA whether they should be granted a Uefa licence and allowed to play in the Europa League, for which they qualified after winning the Carling Cup.

It is understood that a final decision on Birmingham's participation is not expected to be made until the middle of next month, when representatives from the governing bodies meet to determine which clubs meet the criteria for a licence. Uefa delegates its licensing scheme to national associations, meaning that Birmingham will need to satisfy the FA and the Premier League that they can meet their financial liabilities for the year ahead.

This time last year Portsmouth, FA Cup finalists, were told that they would not be allowed to compete in the Europa League after the FA and the Premier League decided against endorsing their application for a Uefa licence. Portsmouth, however, had failed to submit their application on time and were in administration with debts of £119m. Birmingham's situation is far different, although there are genuine concerns at the Premier League, who have additional reasons for wishing to ask questions of the St Andrew's board.

Under the disclosure rules brought in after the collapse of Portsmouth last year, clubs must submit "independently audited accounts to the Premier League by 1 March each year with requirements to note any material qualifications or issues raised by auditors". Clubs are also required to submit "future financial information" to the Premier League by 31 March each year that "will act as an improved early warning system should any club take undue financial risks which may have consequences for future financial stability".

As the accounts for Birmingham City football club and their parent company, Birmingham International Holdings, included qualifications in their audit reports about both companies' ability to continue as a "going concern", the Premier League wish to learn more information about Birmingham's financial position, the ownership structure at the club and recent share activity.

A spokesman for the Premier League said: "Under our financial criteria all the clubs have to submit future financial information. There are a number of triggers that would result in us taking a closer look at a club's financial circumstances, such as an 'emphasis of matter' [eg a doubt on the club's ability to continue as a going concern] on the accounts. This could result in measures being placed upon a club to ensure its sustainability going forward."

Under the new rules, which were approved in 2009, the Premier League has a range of sanctions available to it for clubs that fall into financial difficulties, including a transfer embargo, a ban on player contracts being extended or improved, or the enforced sale of players. Carson Yeung, who on Thursday bought 8.6% of the club to increase his stake in Birmingham International Holdings to 24.9%, provided written assurances to the Premier League last year in relation to the club's finances.

Birmingham's fiscal position has come under scrutiny at various points in the past 12 months, including soon after their Carling Cup final victory, when Birmingham International Holdings announced that Yeung was preparing to mortgage his private properties in a cash-raising exercise. The statement to the Hong Kong stock exchange added that without fresh funds the business may suffer "significant curtailment of its operation".

It is understood that the Premier League is also interested in whether Birmingham will be able to raise the £24.65m that was outlined in the club's most recent accounts, which were signed off in October. Although it was announced last month that the placing for shares for £7.15m has been completed, it has since been confirmed that the "best efforts" part of the capital-raising exercise, which it was hoped would raise £17.5m, has been delayed for a further two months.

Peter Pannu, Birmingham's acting chairman, maintains that the club remain on a sound financial footing. "The finances of the club in terms of profit and loss are fine and with the continued support of Carson Yeung we do not envisage any foreseeable problems," he said. "It is routine procedure for the Premier League and Uefa to look at the club's books, especially as we are now eligible for European competition."
 
You know things are shit when your fans are "praying" to be in the Europa Cup.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=44971.msg1315976#msg1315976 date=1302869078]
You know things are shit when your fans are "praying" to be in the Europa Cup.
[/quote]

haha touche.

Anythings better than nothing tho eh
 
True enough. It would be nice to play the youngsters in something other than the Carling Cup.
 
Prob in the minority but I think I may prefer us not to be in it. I'm torn, but TBH a season focusing on the league, maybe a cup run, 7 a damn good chance at REAL European footy the next season would be a massive boost IMO.

Add in the change to more Saturday kick offs & I think not being in the bloody Europa league is preferable.
 
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=44971.msg1315981#msg1315981 date=1302869610]
Prob in the minority but I think I may prefer us not to be in it. I'm torn, but TBH a season focusing on the league, maybe a cup run, 7 a damn good chance at REAL European footy the next season would be a massive boost IMO.

Add in the change to more Saturday kick offs & I think not being in the bloody Europa league is preferable.
[/quote]

How about the financials?

Not the first time I've heard that idea but somehow it feels like wishful thinking that we'll do better in the league because of it.
 
We would certainly take a short-term financial hit. I guess the question is whether taking that on the chin would be a worthwhile "investment" in order to give us the best possible chance of getting ourselves back into the really big time. It's a risk either way, because neither option guarantees success. Personally I'd sooner take the risk of being involved in Europe, and try to get success to breed more success.
 
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=44971.msg1315988#msg1315988 date=1302872338]
We would certainly take a short-term financial hit. I guess the question is whether taking that on the chin would be a worthwhile "investment" in order to give us the best possible chance of getting ourselves back into the really big time. It's a risk either way, because neither option guarantees success. Personally I'd sooner take the risk of being involved in Europe, and try to get success to breed more success.
[/quote]

It also mean you get more chances to watch Liverpool play. I hate this waiting till the next weekend for another game.
 
[quote author=Squiggles link=topic=44971.msg1315979#msg1315979 date=1302869386]
True enough. It would be nice to play the youngsters in something other than the Carling Cup.
[/quote]


nah play good team in all competitions. Do you not remember the treble season, the league and uefa cup were amazing victories.

Any trophy is superb
 
[quote author=Red Mullet link=topic=44971.msg1315992#msg1315992 date=1302872684]
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=44971.msg1315988#msg1315988 date=1302872338]
We would certainly take a short-term financial hit. I guess the question is whether taking that on the chin would be a worthwhile "investment" in order to give us the best possible chance of getting ourselves back into the really big time. It's a risk either way, because neither option guarantees success. Personally I'd sooner take the risk of being involved in Europe, and try to get success to breed more success.
[/quote]

It also mean you get more chances to watch Liverpool play. I hate this waiting till the next weekend for another game.
[/quote]

Totally agree with those two points.

I am all for the youngsters or fringe players getting some game time in the beginning - we need to prioritise the league so may not be able to afford to give players like morgan or sterling PL starts.
 
Am i the only one who thinks it woould be a little bit rough on Birmingham?

They won it they should play IMO.
 
[quote author=Molbystwin link=topic=44971.msg1316005#msg1316005 date=1302874463]
Am i the only one who thinks it woould be a little bit rough on Birmingham?

They won it they should play IMO.
[/quote]

It is, but I don't support them.
 
I would rather be in it than out of it.
Some sort of European football is at least an excuse for better players to come, minor trophy or not it does carry some credibilty.
We could do actually do really well in it next year too. I think if you asked the likes of Andy Carroll, he would want a shot at it.
I think Krumps point may have something to it , I too feel a bit sorry for Brum, if it is a factor - to get us in to keep the profile up at the cost of their place.
Plus it damages Birmingham's financial position even further.
Looking at it from their position and as a neutral that's the way it will be seen if it comes to fruition.


regards
 
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=44971.msg1316012#msg1316012 date=1302876010]
Ditto, plus I think they'd get embarrassed by anyone decent.
[/quote]

So in realty we'll be helping them! 🙂
 
[quote author=Jack D Rips link=topic=44971.msg1316015#msg1316015 date=1302876174]
We didnt exactly cover ourselves in glory in it either JJ
[/quote]

Er, we weren't that bad.... er...
 
[quote author=Vlads Quiff link=topic=44971.msg1316017#msg1316017 date=1302877109]
I would rather be in it than out of it.
Some sort of European football is at least an excuse for better players to come, minor trophy or not it does carry some credibilty.
We could do actually do really well in it next year too. I think if you asked the likes of Andy Carroll, he would want a shot at it.
I think Krumps point may have something to it , I too feel a bit sorry for Brum, if it is a factor - to get us in to keep the profile up at the cost of their place.
Plus it damages Birmingham's financial position even further.
Looking at it from their position and as a neutral that's the way it will be seen if it comes to fruition.

regards
[/quote]

And would be great for minutes for the likes of Flanagan, Robinson, etc. Kelly definitely benefited from the extensive minutes Hodgson gave him during the Europa League games, while Kenny benefited from seeing Cole's shitness in the competition. It'll serve its purpose. Hopefully we won't be using it to find out more about which players to give away.
 
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44971.msg1315985#msg1315985 date=1302871069]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=44971.msg1315981#msg1315981 date=1302869610]
Prob in the minority but I think I may prefer us not to be in it. I'm torn, but TBH a season focusing on the league, maybe a cup run, 7 a damn good chance at REAL European footy the next season would be a massive boost IMO.

Add in the change to more Saturday kick offs & I think not being in the bloody Europa league is preferable.
[/quote]

How about the financials?

Not the first time I've heard that idea but somehow it feels like wishful thinking that we'll do better in the league because of it.
[/quote]

What do you mean by financials? If you mean money earned in the EL then I think it's not even profitable until you are well advanced in to the seemingly unending stages of the damn thing.
 
[quote author=bkwitche link=topic=44971.msg1316027#msg1316027 date=1302878075]
[quote author=Modo link=topic=44971.msg1315985#msg1315985 date=1302871069]
[quote author=FoxForceFive link=topic=44971.msg1315981#msg1315981 date=1302869610]
Prob in the minority but I think I may prefer us not to be in it. I'm torn, but TBH a season focusing on the league, maybe a cup run, 7 a damn good chance at REAL European footy the next season would be a massive boost IMO.

Add in the change to more Saturday kick offs & I think not being in the bloody Europa league is preferable.
[/quote]

How about the financials?

Not the first time I've heard that idea but somehow it feels like wishful thinking that we'll do better in the league because of it.
[/quote]

What do you mean by financials? If you mean money earned in the EL then I think it's not even profitable until you are well advanced in to the seemingly unending stages of the damn thing.
[/quote]
I think it's good for the trademark to be out playing in Europe. With the team we'll have next seasdon we might just win it.
 
You make more money getting to the group stage of the CL & losing every game (therefore getting no win/draw bonuses) than you do winning the EL.

That's not including gate receipts, which will be higher in the CL by a long way.

Financially it would make more sense to miss a year of the EL to stand a better chance at getting into the CL the following year.
 
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=44971.msg1316086#msg1316086 date=1302888291]
Would that place necessarily go to Liverpool?
[/quote] Considering that we only got in this year becuase Pompey who also failed the EUFA financial rules were refused enty to the competition I would say yes.
 
If we dont finish in the places to win a cup then we dont deserve to be there. I know all this financial governance stuff is a step in the right direction for football but a fair percentage of our fans couldnt be arsed with the Europa and we never put out a full side, so its clearly not high on our list of priorities. For Birmingham it would be one of the highpoints of their recent history. They earned the place they should get it, if we want in then we have to overhaul Spurs
 
Strongly disagree. For European competitions to mean anything, qualification should be based on league position alone.
 
[quote author=Judge Jules link=topic=44971.msg1316231#msg1316231 date=1302942664]
Strongly disagree. For European competitions to mean anything, qualification should be based on league position alone.
[/quote]

It's just a throw back to when there were 3 competitions; European Cup for the Champions; Cup winner's Cup for the FA Cup winners and the UEFA Cup for the runners up in the league
 
Fair point, and I recognise there can be more than one view on this, but mine is that doing it on league position is what best safeguards the quality of the current competitions. Birmingham would almost certainly find themselves majorly embarrassed if they did get anywhere near the latter stages anyway.
 
UEFA aren't doing us any favours. They simply wanna apply the rules. That we may stand to benefit is coincidental.
 
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