The PL is dead
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No. It's been a topic for years. It's Liverpool, not London. It's been a serious topic here and Manchester for ages.
Right, and I've just read someone pointing out the average age of season ticket holders is 20 years younger in Dortmund, or Germany or whatever.
Even when I had a season ticket - admittedly only for a few years - there was tonnes of old blokes who had been going for decades who naturally aren't going to be singing along pissed up, but instead just loudly grumbled at their least favourite players. Mind you, this was the Anfield Road end. Furthest away from the away bit.
Most pleasant, it was.
Even when I had a season ticket - admittedly only for a few years - there was tonnes of old blokes who had been going for decades who naturally aren't going to be singing along pissed up, but instead just loudly grumbled at their least favourite players. Mind you, this was the Anfield Road end. Furthest away from the away bit.
Most pleasant, it was.
There's a bar in Belfast that does a deal for the Ulster rugby matches, a few quid gets you a pint before the game, the bus over and the bus takes you back for a pint after the match.
Something like that is needed, but for 30,000 people. Perhaps give them four pints before the match.
Something like that is needed, but for 30,000 people. Perhaps give them four pints before the match.
The atmosphere now compared to the first few times I went is way noticeably shitter. My first game was in 1998, I don't remember much about the atmosphere because we lost 3-1 to Leeds and I was depressed. Next game was home to Leeds again (my dad is a Leeds fan) in March 2003 and I was in the Kop. We were shite that season, but I remember thinking the atmosphere was amazing. Singing barely stopped for 20 seconds at a time and I'd say I spent about 4 minutes of the game sitting. I can only imagine how guys who went to game in the 80s and 90s (even before) feel about the comparison in atmosphere. I really don't see why one premier league team don't go dropping ticket prices for the ordinary punter and stop pricing people out of going at lease semi-regularly. The publicity and goodwill it would create would surely generate some money and then tell the CEO or marketing dude to go get a new official beverage dispenser or some shit like that to make up the shortfall. It can't be that hard.
I know the Europa league isnt a great example to use here for a number of reasons, but its not like the reduced ticket prices leads to a marked improvement in atmosphere at those games...which being on a Thursday night and cheaper, youd imagine have a higher % of locals versus OOT.
I do understand the desire here to get back to a community club, but its hard (read; nigh on impossible) to carve out a little niche of non-capitalism in a sea of rabid consumerism.....albeit a lot easier when you have a ground capacity of 82k and can play with the mix in ticket pricing and zoning.
I remember a few years back when Utd tried to get a boycott going (immediately post-Glazer?) and all that happened was the masses that couldnt get tickets normally jumped in a filled the gap left by those making a stand. Whilst youve got that level of demand its difficult for clubs to ignore the "free money" in charging relatively high ticket prices even though this creates disgruntled locals.
As someone said, the only way you stand a chance of influencing the situation is with a mass coordinated effort across the rank and file of football fans; but i simply don't see that happening.
I do understand the desire here to get back to a community club, but its hard (read; nigh on impossible) to carve out a little niche of non-capitalism in a sea of rabid consumerism.....albeit a lot easier when you have a ground capacity of 82k and can play with the mix in ticket pricing and zoning.
I remember a few years back when Utd tried to get a boycott going (immediately post-Glazer?) and all that happened was the masses that couldnt get tickets normally jumped in a filled the gap left by those making a stand. Whilst youve got that level of demand its difficult for clubs to ignore the "free money" in charging relatively high ticket prices even though this creates disgruntled locals.
As someone said, the only way you stand a chance of influencing the situation is with a mass coordinated effort across the rank and file of football fans; but i simply don't see that happening.
The best atmosphere I can remembered in my limited experience was during the Hicks and Gillete out period.
All fans were raving about the atmosphere inside and outside the ground during the closing stages of the 13/14 season.
It seems that he fans need something to rally around before they get really vocal.
I don't know if it is because there is an unjustified expectation of success because of our successful history or if it has always been like this.
All fans were raving about the atmosphere inside and outside the ground during the closing stages of the 13/14 season.
It seems that he fans need something to rally around before they get really vocal.
I don't know if it is because there is an unjustified expectation of success because of our successful history or if it has always been like this.
Ah, there's probably LOADS of reasons, but I suspect that one is pretty obvious: there's a lot of fans who are 45-55 and have been going for decades, and don't want to get smashed and sing their heads off while sitting down. Away support is always noisier.
It's not going to change. Even with increased capacity you know it's just a means to open up a whole new revenue to the club, which might give us flexibility with cup games (no more so than now though really), but ultimately will just lead to a bigger drone of an atmosphere.
It's not numbers, it's a combination of all seated games, a waning status, a new generation of fan who haven't seen us win much and a microwave culture that thinks it's their right to stand in the crowd and translate their forum/social networking rants to the terraces. Usually in the form of sitting there grumbling and not having one fucking iota of an idea about what it means to get behind your team.
That's not just us, that's most of the upper tier teams these days. For a reminder of the golden days of support, you only had to look at the Palace away support last week, or the 200 reds who traveled to FC Ruban. Hardcore is the minority, the rest are either privileged consumers or the halfhearted types just coasting along through hollow devotion to a cause they've forgot the ethics of.
It's not numbers, it's a combination of all seated games, a waning status, a new generation of fan who haven't seen us win much and a microwave culture that thinks it's their right to stand in the crowd and translate their forum/social networking rants to the terraces. Usually in the form of sitting there grumbling and not having one fucking iota of an idea about what it means to get behind your team.
That's not just us, that's most of the upper tier teams these days. For a reminder of the golden days of support, you only had to look at the Palace away support last week, or the 200 reds who traveled to FC Ruban. Hardcore is the minority, the rest are either privileged consumers or the halfhearted types just coasting along through hollow devotion to a cause they've forgot the ethics of.
Oh come on. Blaming "new", self-entitled fans? How many of them are there at Anfield? It's the same load of moaning miserable twats that have been going for years.
There may be some element of "nouveau" fans attracted to shiny new stadiums and successful clubs at City, Chelsea or Arsenal, but those last two grounds have always been quiet anyway - Highbury library.
I accept it's my fault. I used to go nuts on the kop, now I sit there thinking about tax returns.
But, if I gave my the offer of fifty quid or a ticket to my kids what do you think they're gonna do? It was a couple of quid and I could stand next to my mates when I was their age. With their fifty quid now they'd go the pub to watch it and get a weed and a just eat later on. It's quite short termist because an entire generation would much rather do that than go the game.
But, if I gave my the offer of fifty quid or a ticket to my kids what do you think they're gonna do? It was a couple of quid and I could stand next to my mates when I was their age. With their fifty quid now they'd go the pub to watch it and get a weed and a just eat later on. It's quite short termist because an entire generation would much rather do that than go the game.
The atmosphere was getting pretty poor when we were still winning the league. People had taken winning stuff for granted. But, as the season before last showed, it wouldn't take much to ignite the crowd again a bit. But on a regular basis, I think the Kop needs being made the local heart of the community again, with lots of discounted access and special initiatives. I doubt anything will wake up the Main Stand, it's practically been a picnic area in the past few years (why do so many people seem to need to EAT at games these days???).
There's a couple (friends, not husband and wife) that sit right next to my mate in the Main Stand who genuinely spend 3/4 of the match talking about cooking recipes (particularly soup), tv (particularly Gogglebox) and who's shagging who at their respective places of work (particularly effeminate dudes female best mate). And I mean talking as in INCESSANT, barely draw breath, often both speaking at the same time, machine gun fire words, style talking.
It blows my flipping mind that they dont just go to the pub and use the money to fund a white wine sprtitzer and gossip frenzy every other Saturday/Sunday. Sometimes the diatribe doesnt even stop for a goal! Mental.
I tried to think when, if ever, I’d considered who owned Liverpool when I’d been fanatical about them as a little kid but I never did, no one ever did. That part of the game wasn't a significant part of the debate. Now fans worry as much about the bank balances of their clubs as their league position, and this new dimension of the game is a reflection of everything that is shit about modernity.
What's more boring or weird than a citeh fan bragging about some oil baron fascist's expansionist goals for a corner of Manchester? Or Arsenal fans being happy with 4th because it keeps the coffers swelling? Or Liverpool fans moaning they can't compete financially when they've got the seventh most expensively assembled squad in the history of the sport? I'd much prefer to watch a game having a few pints with good friends. The prob is most of my friends are sat in the pub watching it, and most of the ones in the ground are miles away from me.
What's more boring or weird than a citeh fan bragging about some oil baron fascist's expansionist goals for a corner of Manchester? Or Arsenal fans being happy with 4th because it keeps the coffers swelling? Or Liverpool fans moaning they can't compete financially when they've got the seventh most expensively assembled squad in the history of the sport? I'd much prefer to watch a game having a few pints with good friends. The prob is most of my friends are sat in the pub watching it, and most of the ones in the ground are miles away from me.
Yeah, me & the lads were talking about this the other day. Saying that although the cost is a huge reason why we don't go, if we could all stand/sit together & enjoy a drink then we'd find the money more often as it's another form of socialising, and the money we use to fund socialising together could be used for that instead.
Going the match now is actually very isolating & insular, the complete antithesis of how I enjoyed the match when I was younger & a large part of the reason I fell in love with the game the club. I got offered a ticket a few weeks back, cup game, as did my mate, (single tickets) we both jjbbed the tickets in favour of watching the match together with a bevvy.
A lot is made of the way away teams & smaller clubs have better atmosphere, part of the reason is that in both cases seat numbers aren't enforced & mates can sit together in large groups. It's social & helps people make a lot more noise basically enjoy the experience.
Indeed. The govt decided to bring the game to the middle classes. It's not a conspiracy theory or anything, they did a paper on it called something as blatant as 'bringing football to the middle classes'... and the clubs jumped on board and formed the premier league when the P&L projections were waved at them. Now we've got this... and the issue is, football did used to be a community thing. Not by design of the clubs, but by design of the fans, dads and lads and friends and cousins all going the game together every week, but for the reasons discussed above that is no longer possible.
I honestly don't think anything will ever be done about it. The only alternative is to turn your back on the prem and get involved in lower league football. The reason I don't is that I'm not that arsed... I don't need a secular church at this stage in my life... so I don't need to go all FCUM, and I'd be happy to watch the game in the pub if I lost my season ticket. So yeah, it's all my fault.
I honestly don't think anything will ever be done about it. The only alternative is to turn your back on the prem and get involved in lower league football. The reason I don't is that I'm not that arsed... I don't need a secular church at this stage in my life... so I don't need to go all FCUM, and I'd be happy to watch the game in the pub if I lost my season ticket. So yeah, it's all my fault.
Do you remember about 15 years ago there was a coke add featuring a blind west ham fan that went to the match and his two mates would explain what was happening to him?
Well, they should remake that ad but his mates will be on the phone instead of being beside him. One is at home as he can't afford the season ticket and the other is in another stand.
Perhaps Vodafone can remake it.
Well, they should remake that ad but his mates will be on the phone instead of being beside him. One is at home as he can't afford the season ticket and the other is in another stand.
Perhaps Vodafone can remake it.
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