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Sevilla post-mortem

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I don't know what was worst - losing key players to injury earlier in the run or them coming back, not really match fit, to be in contention for the final. I wonder if we would have been better off blocking them out of mind and concentrating on the players we still had who were 100%.

The thing that disappoints me is the way certain hacks suddenly, belatedly and cynically seized on the 'Klopp's an unlucky finalist' slogan. The man saw Dortmund lose twice to Bayern - hardly a surprise - and once to Werder Bremen - at the time, again, hardly a freakish failure - and once to City - ditto. But you know now it's going to be brought up every damn time we get close to any cup. And that depresses me because the players already seem incredibly prone to choking in big games, and Klopp's worked so hard to correct that mental problem, but now there'll be two dimensions to the negative hype around us. We so desperately needed that win, and it feels like such a struggle ahead because we didn't get it.
 
We've known to worry for a long time as to which Liverpool team will turn up but what really irks me about this particular defeat is the sheer waste of all that effort and verve that went into beating United, Dortmund and Villareal. It shouldn't detract from those Herculaean efforts but it does. I bet Klopp can't wait to get some reliable performers in, he must worry all the time about the frailty the players he inherited sometimes show.
 
By Paul Tomkins.

Big games, and one-off occasions, alter perceptions more than anything. They can swing on small details, including luck, and the break of the ball. So all the clear improvements made under Jürgen Klopp should not be written off if the final doesn’t go the Reds’ way.

This much is true: Liverpool are good enough to win the Europa League. But they might not. The most important thing is the level the team has reached in recent months – but on the night, the luck might not be on their side. (Remember, the best team doesn’t always win the match.)

I feel that Klopp has taken Liverpool to the level of a Champions League side, but inheriting a team that was in 10th place, and with various injuries, he didn’t exactly have an easy ride to reach that level.

You cannot play 25 cup games in a season, including two finals, and then say Liverpool are the 8th-best team in England. (I’ve seen people say this, as as if the league table exists in a vacuum.) You also cannot discount the challenges of a manger taking over in October and adding no one on a permanent deal in the transfer window, because he wants to wait to do it better in the summer (so, no quick fixes that might bump up a place in the table but longer term have less impact). He hasn’t had a preseason, nor money to spend; therefore, you cannot ignore these limitations. He took over with 10th, and but for fielding a shadow XI in several games, could easily have finished in the top six.

But look at it like this. How would other teams fare if, on top of 38 testing games, they had to play: Southampton away; Stoke away (and home); Manchester City at Wembley; plus another League Cup game against a Premier League side? And that was just the first competition. And then, in the FA Cup, West Ham could be added, home and away.

In essence, just by looking at those fixtures, the Reds played seven extra Premier League games this season (six of them against top-half teams), with four of them away from Anfield; plus the winnable ties – but where some commitment was still required – against Exeter and Carlisle. But these were just the domestic cups.

So, on top of what was already essentially 45 Premier League games (albeit with more away from home, and some lasting 120 minutes), the Reds had the six Europa League group games: two against a decent French side, two against a far-flung Russian side, and two against an unremarkable Swiss side. Not the toughest set of fixtures, you’ll agree, but still games that need playing, and time spent away from preparing for the Premier League. At the very least, it’s six more games against teams at least at the level of Bournemouth or Norwich; winnable, but not exactly jaunty strolls in the park. It would be disrespectful to the French and Russian leagues to say that decent sides from those countries are not the equivalent to a 17th-placed English team.

Aside from the three games against lower division sides (Exeter twice, and Carlisle), Liverpool, with the Europa League group games and the domestic cup competitions, could be said to have played thirteen additional games against Premier League quality sides.

But then came Augsburg, who finished 5th in Germany last season, and were 12th this season. So that’s two more games against a side that, at the very least, are on a par with Premier League Bournemouth.

But then it got crazy. Two games against the 5th-best team in England on league form, who also had played fair few cup games that may have held them back; and, to boot, these are games against ‘deadly’ rivals, in the form of Manchester United. These two games in themselves were almost like two exhausting cup finals, such was the tension and emotion. These were not normal cup ties.

But it didn’t end there: up next, the 2nd-best team in Germany. Irrespective of however many cup games they, Bayern or anyone else played, it’s indisputable that Bayern are the best team in Germany and Borussia Dortmund are not too far behind. Two more legs, another win; another night of high energy and tense emotion.

Then the semi-finals: the 4th-best team in Spain, who, by that stage, had already played a ton of European games. And finally, Sevilla, tonight – a team who would almost certainly finish in the top half of the Premier League (they’re surely better than West Ham, but have played a lot of cup games, like Liverpool).

So, that’s 25 cup games; but crucially, 22 of them against Premier League-standard opposition. Some of them could be seen as ‘easier’ Premier League games, but of the 22, an astonishing fifteen of them were against top-half teams in England – or overseas teams surely capable of such a finishing position in the Premier League.

So in terms of the workload, the Reds essentially played 60 Premier League games in 2015/16, with a greater number of league games against top-half teams than the usual 50-50 split between top and bottom half (minus one team: Liverpool, in 8th, who cannot play themselves). So instead of 18 games against those in positions 1-10 (minus 8th), the Reds essentially played 33.

That’s thirty-three games against the top 10 of the Premier League or their overseas equivalents; almost an entire league season of games against tougher opposition. Then, the 20 actual Premier League games against the bottom 10, and six more (all the ties in the Europa Group stage), plus a cup game against Bournemouth.

Perhaps what’s most telling is that almost all of the tough (“top half of Premier League”) cup games came in the seven months Klopp has been in charge. Brendan Rodgers’ three cup games were against Carlisle United, Sion and Bordeaux: one lower division side, and two sides who would surely be lower table if in the Premier League.

The achievement here – For Klopp and his team, on May 18th – is to simply be standing. That’s one hell of an effort right there.

Progress in cups can be misleading, because you can get easy draws and fluke results. But that hasn’t happened here; add a Champions League-standard last 16 for the Reds, and an injury crisis, and you can say that these were no easy strolls to the finals.

Klopp has taken the team to a European final and a domestic final, with someone else’s players. He has improved the squad, but only in terms of confidence, interplay and fitness; not in terms of spending.

Years ago, when assessing Rafa Benítez’s Liverpool tenure, I noted the way that every single season was taken into May (with the exception of 2008, which was taken to within an hour of May: the Champions League game against Chelsea ending close to midnight).

I thought it was a “type” of success, along with other ways of measuring what was good. If your season is over by January or February, then there’s less to be proud about; it’s hard to claim any kind of success. Are Arsenal now a better side than Spurs because they overtook them on the last day, despite never being credible runners in the title race? (Equally, Arsenal played a lot of good teams in the Champions League and couldn’t afford to send out the reserves, like Spurs did against Dortmund.)

So it was interesting to see Klopp himself using the same yardstick:

“If you look at my career as a manager until now you can say that each season was very exciting until the last match. Staying in the league in the first year [with Mainz] – last day. Not getting promoted in the second year – last day. Not getting promoted next year – last day. Getting promoted – last matchday. Not getting in the Europa League with Dortmund – last matchday. Qualifying for the Europa League – last matchday. We became Bundesliga champions three games before the end but we had finals in the last four years always until the end.

“I stayed in the race until the end. Sometimes I thought: ‘My God, everyone else is already on holiday, they have had four weeks and I’m still going nuts.’ But that is the truth. I try to get everything. When I sleep, I sleep. When I’m not I’m really awake. I try to push everything I can to get everything I can get. That is why we had finals in the last few years.”

So whatever happens tonight in Basel, I will see this season as a success. If the Reds lose, then it’s not an outright, unqualified success, but in the context of the challenges Klopp has faced, it’s still a success of sorts, and bodes well for 2016/17.

Note: If Liverpool win tonight I expect a heady mix of adrenaline and euphoria to propel me to write an article on the occasion. However, if it ends in defeat, this article stands as a good measure of the season, and how it’s been as if Liverpool have been running two marathons this season, whilst everyone else in England ran only one.

https://tomkinstimes.com/2016/05/the-final-reckoning-klopps-reds-after-glory/?
 
I don't know what was worst - losing key players to injury earlier in the run or them coming back, not really match fit, to be in contention for the final. I wonder if we would have been better off blocking them out of mind and concentrating on the players we still had who were 100%.

The thing that disappoints me is the way certain hacks suddenly, belatedly and cynically seized on the 'Klopp's an unlucky finalist' slogan. The man saw Dortmund lose twice to Bayern - hardly a surprise - and once to Werder Bremen - at the time, again, hardly a freakish failure - and once to City - ditto. But you know now it's going to be brought up every damn time we get close to any cup. And that depresses me because the players already seem incredibly prone to choking in big games, and Klopp's worked so hard to correct that mental problem, but now there'll be two dimensions to the negative hype around us. We so desperately needed that win, and it feels like such a struggle ahead because we didn't get it.

I wouldn't place too much emphasis on the opinions of the Press, they change as the latest result dictates.

Neither would I be too concerned with the immediate future, there's a lot to do, and we must not forget Klopp has been here a very short time. It just seems his stay has been longer because of the number of games he's managed - more than 50 in 7 months!

Next season we also have the benefit of fewer games and a preseason with some replacement players and a chance for the coach to plan rather than spend all his time reacting to events.

A bit of calm and perspective is justified, I think.
 
I don't know what was worst - losing key players to injury earlier in the run or them coming back, not really match fit, to be in contention for the final. I wonder if we would have been better off blocking them out of mind and concentrating on the players we still had who were 100%.

The thing that disappoints me is the way certain hacks suddenly, belatedly and cynically seized on the 'Klopp's an unlucky finalist' slogan. The man saw Dortmund lose twice to Bayern - hardly a surprise - and once to Werder Bremen - at the time, again, hardly a freakish failure - and once to City - ditto. But you know now it's going to be brought up every damn time we get close to any cup. And that depresses me because the players already seem incredibly prone to choking in big games, and Klopp's worked so hard to correct that mental problem, but now there'll be two dimensions to the negative hype around us. We so desperately needed that win, and it feels like such a struggle ahead because we didn't get it.

I thought similar about the players coming back. Deffo felt like a distraction and in a strange way we might have been better if they had stayed at home. Too late now of course, but what a chance for this shower to turn all the apathy and irritation around and carve their names into LFC history.
A damn shame.
 
I wouldn't place too much emphasis on the opinions of the Press, they change as the latest result dictates.

Neither would I be too concerned with the immediate future, there's a lot to do, and we must not forget Klopp has been here a very short time. It just seems his stay has been longer because of the number of games he's managed - more than 50 in 7 months!

Next season we also have the benefit of fewer games and a preseason with some replacement players and a chance for the coach to plan rather than spend all his time reacting to events.

A bit of calm and perspective is justified, I think.

A good post. But what a statement it would have been to win the trophy and get back into the CL and then also have all that you describe.
 
I wouldn't place too much emphasis on the opinions of the Press, they change as the latest result dictates.

Actually, they tend to repeat the same thing if they think they've got a stick with which to beat you (it's only this season that Ranieri finally shut up the 'Mr Runner Up' chatter). And it is something to bother about if it seems like you have players who internalise the problem when they keep being asked the same questions. We've got too many players who know that they're regarded as being suspect when under pressure, from Rodgers' title chasing team onwards, and that's a psychological burden that WILL have to be lost at some point. Every time these players get a trophy within their grasp they fall apart. It looked so much like Klopp had liberated them from that feeling, but here it is, still there. That isn't something to just dismiss, and when outsiders pick up on it the thing gets worse. Look at Spurs - they've had that for decades. You could say Arsenal have had it, too - even their fans expect them to fall away come April, no matter how cocky they've been before that. The tension sets in on an annual basis. Maybe a bold new player can change it, maybe two, but it's a hard wall to smash through.
 
Actually, they tend to repeat the same thing if they think they've got a stick with which to beat you (it's only this season that Ranieri finally shut up the 'Mr Runner Up' chatter). And it is something to bother about if it seems like you have players who internalise the problem when they keep being asked the same questions. We've got too many players who know that they're regarded as being suspect when under pressure, from Rodgers' title chasing team onwards, and that's a psychological burden that WILL have to be lost at some point. Every time these players get a trophy within their grasp they fall apart. It looked so much like Klopp had liberated them from that feeling, but here it is, still there. That isn't something to just dismiss, and when outsiders pick up on it the thing gets worse. Look at Spurs - they've had that for decades. You could say Arsenal have had it, too - even their fans expect them to fall away come April, no matter how cocky they've been before that. The tension sets in on an annual basis. Maybe a bold new player can change it, maybe two, but it's a hard wall to smash through.

Great post. Macca just to add to your point, it is not just when trophy is within grasp. In the last year, in the premier league, whenever we reach a point where we are within 4-6 points of fourth, and if we win the gap narrows to a tiny margin, we are bound to loose that weekend's game.

The wall you talked about is the reason why I think Cantona is still revered in mancland. Hate him but I think he played an important role in setting up the winning mentality they had for a 2 decades.
 
Maybe Sturridge should not have moved towards Lovren's header, but it was a soft 'goal'. I can't believe the keeper would have let it in without the distracting movement.
 
You can criticise him for being offside, but once he is offside it seems harsh to criticise him for going for the ball.

It's the instinct of any striker worth their salt.
 
Sturridge's movement is completely irrelevant as it would have been a piece of piss save if he wasn't there.
 
Actually, they tend to repeat the same thing if they think they've got a stick with which to beat you (it's only this season that Ranieri finally shut up the 'Mr Runner Up' chatter). And it is something to bother about if it seems like you have players who internalise the problem when they keep being asked the same questions. We've got too many players who know that they're regarded as being suspect when under pressure, from Rodgers' title chasing team onwards, and that's a psychological burden that WILL have to be lost at some point. Every time these players get a trophy within their grasp they fall apart. It looked so much like Klopp had liberated them from that feeling, but here it is, still there. That isn't something to just dismiss, and when outsiders pick up on it the thing gets worse. Look at Spurs - they've had that for decades. You could say Arsenal have had it, too - even their fans expect them to fall away come April, no matter how cocky they've been before that. The tension sets in on an annual basis. Maybe a bold new player can change it, maybe two, but it's a hard wall to smash through.

Spot on Macca...
 
Footy365.com:

[article]
* If any one player did not deserve to depart St Jakobs-Park with a runners-up medal on Wednesday night, it was Kolo Toure. With his contract expiring in the summer, the Ivorian could have done no more to persuade Jurgen Klopp and Liverpool that he can be of great worth for at least another season.

Ten years ago, Toure started in his first European final. His Arsenal side took the lead against La Liga opposition in the first half of the Champions League final in 2006, before they eventually caved in to sustained pressure. A decade later, the collapse was rather more pronounced and dramatic, but equally heartbreaking.

If Toure has played his final game in Liverpool red, he provided one final reminder that age is just a number. The 35-year-old was imperious in Basel, blocking more shots than any of his teammates (one), making more interceptions than all but Alberto Moreno (three), and making 17 clearances – seven more than any other player, and five more than Sevilla made altogether. His perfectly timed last-ditch tackle on Kevin Gameiro with the scores level at 1-1 epitomised a brilliant lion-hearted performance. It is a huge shame it was not matched by the trophy he craved. Whichever side he joins in the summer, they will be gaining the services of a wonderful professional who can still offer a great deal.

* Liverpool are purveyors of fast-paced, ‘heavy metal’ football under Klopp, yet they turned up late for their most important gig yet. Two-time reigning champions Sevilla are far more accustomed to this stage, and started the faster of the two sides by far. They boasted 57% of the possession after 15 minutes, with the excellent Ever Banega orchestrating proceedings. Liverpool were not shell-shocked, nor were they outclassed by their opponents, but it was quickly evident how relatively inexperienced this squad is on the big stage. Such naivety would be decisive later on; there will be plenty more on that later.

* One? Maybe. Two? Arguably. Three? Perhaps not. But regardless of the number, the common consensus is that Liverpool were unfortunate not to be awarded at least one penalty in the first half.

After 13 minutes came the first call. An excellent ball through from James Milner was controlled instantly by Roberto Firmino, who looked to break into the Sevilla area. He was met by Daniel Carrico – curiously once of Reading – and the Brazilian attempted to flick the ball beyond the defender. All eyes were on referee Jonas Eriksson as Firmino tumbled to the ground.

Be it for tripping the forward or for handling the ball in the same action, Carrico had undeniably committed a foul. Somehow, a penalty was not awarded.
On the half-hour mark, it was Adil Rami’s turn, with the Frenchman palming the ball out of play under pressure from Moreno. The decision from the officials? A goal-kick.

As the first half drew to a close, the hat-trick was complete. It would have been a harsh decision to adjudge Grzegorz Krychowiak guilty of handling the ball as he stooped to block an effort, but justice would have been served in a fashion. The following collapse was all their own doing, but Liverpool can feel aggrieved over such crucial decisions.

* On 34 minutes, BT Sport co-commentator Owen Hargreaves implored Liverpool to ensure Philippe Coutinho and Daniel Sturridge saw more of the ball. The club’s two brightest attacking talents had shared 22 touches between them by that stage, with just one shot on target. The Reds were in the ascendancy, but the Sevilla defence was largely untroubled.

On 35 minutes, the duo responded. From the right-hand side, the ball found Coutinho through great work from Roberto Firmino and James Milner. The Brazilian shuffled possession onto Sturridge, who stood around 16 yards out, surrounded by two defenders and with seemingly no route to goal. Within an instant, the ball had nestled in the corner of the goal, and Sturridge had already wheeled away in celebration

The pure brilliance of the finish cannot be understated. With the outside of his left boot, Sturridge applied requisite power and delicious curl to beat Sevilla keeper Soria, while leaving two defenders stranded. The England international had no backlift, and in everyone else’s view had no option but to turn back and release the ball. No-one expected the end result; no-one but Sturridge, of course.

* More has been written about the 26-year-old than any other player since Klopp was appointed in October. His injury record has been dissected, his relationship with the manager has been discussed, his suitability in this side has been debated and his work-rate and dedication has been doubted. Time and time again, Sturridge responds the only way he can.

Does Sturridge suit this Liverpool side perfectly? Not in the traditional sense. If you want a striker to tirelessly pressurise a defence, there are far more more suited to the role. But if you want a striker to score goals and raise the attacking performances of his teammates, few are better than the England international.

The oft-spoken criticism of Sturridge is that he is too greedy. When you produce as often as he does, greed is not an issue. Despite featuring in just 25 games in all competitions this season, he ends the campaign as his club’s top goalscorer with 12. Optimise his fitness, and he is among the top three strikers in the Premier League. Of course, that is far easier said than done.

* For the remainder of the first half, Liverpool were dominant. Sevilla started the quicker, but the Reds finished the opening period having almost lapped their opponent. Almost. Liverpool had eight shots to Sevilla’s one. Sevilla players were dispossessed ten times. The Spaniards completed just 63% of their first-half passes. Liverpool players were energetic, hell-bent on pressing the opposition into oblivion. They completed as many tackles as they committed fouls (11 each), and had opportunities to head into half-time with a three-goal lead or more.

The misconception is that Klopp sends his players out to simply run mindlessly, chasing the ball regardless of where it is and who has it. It is a gross misunderstanding. Sevilla were overrun by their opponents, and yet completed more kilometres in the first half (54.65 to 53.68). It is not necessarily about running the furthest or the longest at all times, but about picking the ideal moments.

In the first half, Liverpool perfected that tactic. As it happened, half-time came at the wrong time.

* Within 20 seconds of the restart, Sevilla provided the most emphatic of responses. For Liverpool, the main culprit in the concession of the equaliser was a predictable figure. Moreno’s poor header was bad enough; his absolute non-defending when faced with the on-rushing Mariano was unforgivable. Sevilla’s right-back sauntered past the Spaniard and squared for Kevin Gameiro, who applied a simple finish. Moreno forgot to lock the front door with the initial header, then turned back not to correct his mistake, but to open it himself for the trespasser.

Not content with playing the main antagonist for Gameiro once, Moreno stood stranded, marking thin air when the Frenchman found himself free in the penalty area on the hour mark. A point-blank save from Mignolet spared his blushes.

In the 23-year-old’s case, these were not his first mistakes. They certainly should be his last for Liverpool. Klopp has raised the performance levels of almost every member of this squad. Even Simon Mignolet has improved to an extent. Yet even the most talented of coaches would struggle to implement concentration, attentiveness and the basics of defending in Moreno’s game. Klopp’s summer planning has undoubtedly already begun, and there must be a red mark against the name of his left-back.

* Credit must be handed to Sevilla manager Unai Emery. At half-time, the Spaniards looked to be on the brink of being blown away by a free-flowing and confident Liverpool side. They created no chances in the first half, and conceded eight. Half-time came at the most inopportune time for the Reds, but provided much-needed respite for Emery’s side.

What a team talk. Within a minute of the restart they were on level terms; within 20 minutes they were ahead; within a further five they held a two-goal lead over their former tormentors. As lackadaisical and lacklustre as Liverpool were in the second half, Sevilla were electric. Emery deserves the utmost praise for lifting his fighters off the canvas at the nine-count.

* Central to the Spaniard’s success was one Ever Banega. The midfielder has been linked with the Premier League for a number of seasons now. On Wednesday evening, he provided evidence as to why.

While Sevilla struggled in the first half, one player notably kept their cool and continued unabated. In the second period, Banega then came into his own. The midfielder ended the game with the most touches (62), the joint-most completed dribbles (three), and more key passes than any player except for Nathaniel Clyne (two), as well as two tackles, seven crosses and the respective numbers of Emre Can and James Milner in his pocket. The Argentinean had 23 more touches than any Sevilla player, and is the most deserving recipient of a third consecutive Europa League winner’s medal. His talents would be well served in England.

* “They scored a goal that would win a million games – it was that good. Kevin Gameiro has scored lots of goals – he couldn’t have scored a goal like that,” Mark Lawrenson told BBC Sport. Perhaps not, but it was Gameiro who had the last laugh. After his acrobatic effort which narrowly evaded Mignolet’s goal represented Sevilla’s only first-half attempt, the Frenchman scored with a rather more simple second shot.

Before the game, BT Sport pundits Michael Owen and Steve McManaman analysed Gameiro’s previous seven goals in the tournament. Each were similar in their application: a clever run followed by a simple finish. This was no different. Coke will rightfully take the plaudits for his two goals, but Gameiro was excellent in the second half and provided the platform for his side’s comeback. He may not score goals the standard of Sturridge’s, but he does score them. With 25 in 45 games in all competitions, he can feel aggrieved at his absence from France’s Euro 2016 squad, particularly when Olivier Giroud (24 in 53) is present.

* As positive as Liverpool’s first few months under Klopp have been, there remains one glaring negative: the club cannot defend a lead.
Liverpool led a relegation-embattled Newcastle side 2-0 after 30 minutes at Anfield in the Premier League in April. They drew 2-2. Liverpool led Southampton 2-0 in the 63rd minute in March. They lost 3-2. Liverpool led a doomed Sunderland 2-0 at home after 81 minutes in February. They drew 2-2.

Here, they blew Sevilla away with an irresistible first-half attacking performance, but had just one goal to show for it. That does not excuse the collapse witnessed after Gameiro’s equaliser. With the game still in the balance and the scores level with over 40 minutes to play, the players seemed to simply give up. Their belief had been sapped, and the trophy that was within touching distance had slipped through their grasp. In the post-match words of the manager: “We saw it in the game after they scored the first goal. It changed.” Quite.

* Was the lack of leadership integral to Liverpool’s downfall? As much as Steven Gerrard’s departure in the summer was necessary, it has left the squad at Anfield without an on-field inspiration, a lifter of spirits, one who can lead by example. Toure tried to fulfil such a role, but was also tasked with attempting to keep the opposition at bay. Without a leader, Liverpool crumbled.

James Milner was captain for the evening. An experienced head, and a winner of trophies, but a leader? Milner was a follower at Manchester City; it is where he excels. He has been in unbelievable form in recent weeks, but is not a man you can look towards for motivation. Instead, he is just as susceptible to losing his temper as the rest of the players around him. Would Jordan Henderson have fared any better had injury not befallen him? It is doubtful. Klopp must seek to rectify the matter and sign a proven leader this summer.

* Start well. Hassle opponents. Gain possession. Create chances. Work tirelessly. Fade in second half. Be removed. Rinse. Repeat. That, ladies and gentleman, is what we call an ‘Adam Lallana’.

Just how infuriating is the Englishman? He encapsulated Liverpool’s first-half performance, putting in two crunching tackles and looking bright after a relatively slow start. His reverse pass to set up Sturridge’s first shot on target was sumptuous. Some compared his showing to that of former Klopp favourite Shinji Kagawa, and the similarities were certainly evident.

Lallana also encapsulated Liverpool’s second-half performance. The verve and vigour of the opening 45 minutes disappeared down the tunnel, and a nervous, tired shell emerged for the next 45. His 73rd-minute removal for Joe Allen was a mercy substitution, and it means he has now completed 90 minutes in just 28 of his 49 starts this season. Lallana is a willing disciple of Klopp’s testing tactics, but, to use the medical description, he suffers from ‘f***ing knackered-itis’ rather often.

* Another whose application cannot be doubted is Coutinho. And yet it still has not quite clicked for the Brazilian. His highlight reel is memorable and plentiful, and he is a fine talent when at the peak of his game, but few can be more conspicuous by their lack of influence on the field. In 90 minutes, Coutinho completed 28 passes, had one off-target shot and struggled to make an impact. The 23-year-old endures such games all too often, but is regularly rescued by one moment of long-range magic or a skilful run. In the biggest game of his club career, neither were forthcoming; he did not even complete a single dribble.

For a player nominated for the PFA Player of the Year and Young Player of the Year award in consecutive seasons, as well as one who won four end-of-season Liverpool awards earlier this month, Klopp is justified to expect much more of Coutinho. He is the supposed jewel in this Liverpool crown, but his anonymous performances are becoming a familiar frustration.

* UEFA can hardly have been surprised at the scenes ahead of the match. Having allocated just over 10,000 tickets to Liverpool fans for the final – the club’s first on the European stage in nine years – the predictable, and sad, conclusion was that a number of supporters found themselves in Sevilla’s section of the stadium. And yet it was the complete lack of segregation that led to the unfortunate sight of both sets of fans fighting before kick-off. Riot police were called in to calm matters, and UEFA’s frankly stupid decision to hold the final at a venue incapable of meeting the overwhelming demands of the fans of the participating clubs must be called into question.

* And so Liverpool’s first season under Jurgen Klopp draws to a close. It is a campaign which ends on a sour note, but promised so, so much. Defeats in two cup finals are bitter pills to swallow, and make the eighth-placed Premier League finish more difficult to defend. What is clear however is that, under Klopp, Liverpool can become great again.

“He’s infectious, he makes you smile with his behaviour on the sideline and he is a manager you would want to play for,” Steven Gerrard told BT Sport before the game.

“I think the fantastic thing is that he shares everything with everybody,” added Kenny Dalglish. “He shares the joy, the excitement, the passion with the players, and that’s transmitted to the fans. Everybody can relate to him. He’s fantastic at his job, but he doesn’t need to boast. He just does it. Everybody has totally responded to what he’s done. He’s been like a breath of fresh air to this club and that’s resulted in getting to this final.
“Everybody at Liverpool is really positive heading into next season with Jurgen in charge.”

It is the last line which provides the silver lining on the greyest of clouds for Liverpool fans. Klopp has been in charge just seven months, and yet it feels as though he has been at Anfield for a lifetime. Fifty-two games of fast, frenetic football, soundbites and hugs end with nothing tangible to show for it. Nothing but immense promise.

As most of the Premier League’s established elite head into next season amid managerial upheaval – Chelsea and Manchester City will appoint new bosses, Manchester United and Arsenal fans will hope to do the same – Liverpool are in an advantageous position. While the Klopp honeymoon is over, every sign points to a happy marriage.
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If you could have a do-over, what would you have done differently?
You can't control what is being said to the players, you can just change the players in the line up.

It's pretty obvious what I would have done. I would have dropped Firmy and played either Lucas or Allen in midfield with Milner and Can.
 
I would have dropped Lallana after the first half and replaced him with Lucas. I would also have dropped Moreno and replaced him with Origi and at the same time moved Milner to the left back position. He played as a left or right fullback a lot of times so it shouldn't been a problem.
 
We all know that Moreno can't defend and putting Coutinho on the same side hardly helps defensively. Our tactics seemed ok when we had the ball but as soon as we lost it the same old defensive frailties reared their ugly head.
There were times last night when Sevilla counter attacked against us and had 4 or 5 players in attacking positions but when we won the ball back and tried to counter them they also seemed to outnumber us up front. The midfield were chasing shadows all night.
 
Actually, they tend to repeat the same thing if they think they've got a stick with which to beat you (it's only this season that Ranieri finally shut up the 'Mr Runner Up' chatter). And it is something to bother about if it seems like you have players who internalise the problem when they keep being asked the same questions. We've got too many players who know that they're regarded as being suspect when under pressure, from Rodgers' title chasing team onwards, and that's a psychological burden that WILL have to be lost at some point. Every time these players get a trophy within their grasp they fall apart. It looked so much like Klopp had liberated them from that feeling, but here it is, still there. That isn't something to just dismiss, and when outsiders pick up on it the thing gets worse. Look at Spurs - they've had that for decades. You could say Arsenal have had it, too - even their fans expect them to fall away come April, no matter how cocky they've been before that. The tension sets in on an annual basis. Maybe a bold new player can change it, maybe two, but it's a hard wall to smash through.

Yep I covered the mentality issue earlier in the thread.
 
If you could have a do-over, what would you have done differently?
You can't control what is being said to the players, you can just change the players in the line up.

It's pretty obvious what I would have done. I would have dropped Firmy and played either Lucas or Allen in midfield with Milner and Can.

We did nothing wrong in the first half - we should have been up 2/3/4-0.

Second half, I am really not sure if any substitution made would have managed to turn the team around - they were so rattled by the goal. I cannot think of anyone on the bench who would have been able to just demand the team fight regardless ... I would have taken Coutinho off for Allen or Lucas to TRY and control the middle but I'm not sure that would have helped really.
 
Interesting point by Jonathan Wilson:

What happened in the second half of the Europa League final followed a pattern. Perhaps if Kévin Gameiro hadn’t scored quite so quickly after the restart, the impact of his equaliser wouldn’t have been so profound, but for the 25 minutes that followed, Liverpool were rudderless. They lost shape and cohesion, utterly unable to stem the Sevilla flow. The change from a first half that Liverpool had come to dominate was almost inconceivable.
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There were individual reasons for the turnaround, of course. Alberto Moreno will have better nights, twice at fault in the buildup to the equaliser as part of a display in which his defensive shortcomings were repeatedly exposed. Simon Mignolet, although he made two fine saves, inspired a sense of anxiety. Daniel Sturridge and Philippe Coutinho went missing in the second half. Roberto Firmino looked exhausted. But perhaps most significant was the collective failing – one that has flared up a few times this season. As against Southampton, Sunderland andNewcastle United, when two-goal leads were squandered, Liverpool lost control of a game they had seemed to be dominating.
At least in part, the issue is probably mental. But it is also structural. Roy Hodgson was widely derided in 2013 when he spoke glowingly of the way Jürgen Klopp’s Borussia Dortmund, when under pressure, formed themselves into two banks of four, denying the opposition space. It wasn’t the story people wanted to hear; that side of their game didn’t thrill the way their pressing did. Their default was to press but they were also capable of dropping off and absorbing pressure.
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The freedom allowed to Sevilla’s Mariano Ferreira helped floor Liverpool and Emre Can. Photograph: Peter Klaunzer/EPA


Klopp, rather more quickly than many anticipated, has begun to instil his pressing game at Anfield. Probably since the 2014 World Cup there has been a reversion in football’s attitude to physicality, a sense that perhaps the movement against aggression had gone too far. The game is still less percussive that it was even 20 years ago but referees seem more inclined to allow a nudge or a shoulder-to-shoulder challenge than they were when tiki-taka was at its peak, as though there was a recognition that players had to be allowed to try to win the ball back.
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Liverpool have been at the forefront of exploiting that new liberalism. The Villarreal manager, Marcelino, felt they’d gone too far, but to those who remember English football’s dominance of Europe in the early 80s, Liverpool’s 3-0 win at Anfield was a reminder of the days when foreign teams would arrive at English stadiums, find themselves chased and harried into submission, and slink away moaning about the robust style of the English game. Klopp has always been open about his admiration for that era of English football and that game in particular seemed an indication that the approach still has an application today.
It’s not just about conditioning. Players have to be extremely fit, of course – and the assumption is that Liverpool will be even fitter next season after a full summer of Klopp’s preparation – but it’s also about organisation. Undirected charging achieves little but wearing players out; that Liverpool have in certain games been so effective in their pressing suggests the level to which Klopp’s structure has been assimilated. But the chaos that can overwhelm them suggests that the more staid, reactive side of his game has yet to be taken on board.
Before the game in Basel, a senior Sevilla official had said he thought there were two Liverpools, the one that wrought chaos and a more controlled version. He hoped it was the chaotic version that turned up because, while that could blow a side away, it also offered opportunity. Sevilla were rather more resilient than Villarreal had proved but they were rocking towards the end of the first half. Liverpool could – perhaps should – have doubled their lead in that 10 minutes before half-time.
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The break, though, gave Sevilla the chance to reset and the early goal gave them impetus. Liverpool’s defending was shambolic. Rather than two banks of four there appeared at times to be almost a bus queue down the middle of the pitch. The amount of space Sevilla had was astonishing and the overlaps of the right-back Mariano Ferreira made sure they exploited it. Moreno, not unreasonably, will take the blame, but there was a general lack of control and it seems likely that, as well as a left-back, signing a controlling central midfielder will also be a priority.
Chaos can be effective. It was chaos that brought the comeback against Dortmund, breaking the shape of the game. Even Rafa Benítez, that most Apollonian of managers, ended up unleashing chaos for his greatest moments as Liverpool manager, against Olympiakos, Milan and West Ham. But chaos is, by its nature, unreliable. It may be thrilling but what is needed now is a greater sense of control.
 
Before the match, it was mentioned that no Liverpool manager has ever come in mid-season to win a cup. Really disappointed Klopp couldn't chalk that out but even in Istanbul, Rafa had the privilege of fielding some of his signings in Alonso, Garcia. Klopp still is using a 100% Rodgers team and the only hope I could bring myself to clutching, is that we'll be signing a string of German superhumans to bring us back up on our feet.

*It later dawned on me that even during his previous stints, Klopp never really got Mainz or Dortmund to really get off to impressive things until his third season. Klopp mentioned in the long interview that in his first 2 seasons at Mainz, they kept missing out on promotion to the Bundesliga by mere point(s). He may not be given as much time here with the poisonous media now using the choker tag on him, but I sincerely hope that the 2 finals we've played this season were in spite of using a Rodgers team rather than another 2 finals to add to his 3 last 'choke ups'. By hook or by crook, Klopp will drag this team up.
 
Before the match, it was mentioned that no Liverpool manager has ever come in mid-season to win a cup. Really disappointed Klopp couldn't chalk that out but even in Istanbul, Rafa had the privilege of fielding some of his signings in Alonso, Garcia. Klopp still is using a 100% Rodgers team and the only hope I could bring myself to clutching, is that we'll be signing a string of German superhumans to bring us back up on our feet.

*It later dawned on me that even during his previous stints, Klopp never really got Mainz or Dortmund to really get off to impressive things until his third season. Klopp mentioned in the long interview that in his first 2 seasons at Mainz, they kept missing out on promotion to the Bundesliga by mere point(s). He may not be given as much time here with the poisonous media now using the choker tag on him, but I sincerely hope that the 2 finals we've played this season were in spite of using a Rodgers team rather than another 2 finals to add to his 3 last 'choke ups'. By hook or by crook, Klopp will drag this team up.

Yeah, it's lazy journalism that's being jumped on. They are always looking for some stigma to attach to a manager. This is the same press who were lauding our progress after the United, Dortmund & Villareal games. The same ones who will sucking off LVG tomorrow if he wins the FA Cup, after slating him all season.
 
Yeah, it's lazy journalism that's being jumped on. They are always looking for some stigma to attach to a manager. This is the same press who were lauding our progress after the United, Dortmund & Villareal games. The same ones who will sucking off LVG tomorrow if he wins the FA Cup, after slating him all season.

Agreed the press are bandwagon merchants. The follow trends, they don't speak truth
 
I would have dropped Lallana after the first half and replaced him with Lucas. I would also have dropped Moreno and replaced him with Origi and at the same time moved Milner to the left back position. He played as a left or right fullback a lot of times so it shouldn't been a problem.

After a pretty good first half you would have subbed one of our better players from that half? Interesting.
 
I've stayed clear of this place since the game. Too raw. And no doubt all of the major issues and moans and excuses have all been made, and debated and argued to the point of boredom/ insanity.

In summary, though, nothing happened against Sevilla that told us anything new. We still need a new GK (happening), we need a top quality DM player, we need a new CB partnership, we need a new LB (happening), we need at least one new, quick attacking player (Gotze, maybe?), and we need another striker.

Only Toure, Milner, Clyne and Sturridge can say they had a good game and showed up.

And of the other players that we have, let's be honest: there is no such thing as a brilliant, inconsistent player. It's an oxymoron. And Firmino, Lallana - and to an extent Coutinho and Can - are not reliable enough. So they're not brilliant. So we need better. Or to at least supplement them with better players, if not outright replace.

You can perhaps have one or two in the side, but all three is taking a gigantic risk, because quite often you'll get a great game one week, and a mediocre one the next. And if all three disappear, you are totally fucked. I made this point about Firmino in that thread about Monchi, and it was sad to see it come so horribly true. And what a game for our player of the year to go missing, too. Seeing Lallana disappear was less surprising.

As for strikers, well, Sturridge has to stay as he seems to be the only genuinely great finisher we have, given Benteke's form and lack of favour. Origi looked fucking dreadful and isn't ever going to score 20 goals in a season. Not ever.

Whoever comes in, they need to be able to lead this team, and give it a personality that allows Klopp to extend his influence onto the pitch. I don't agree that the result was entirely due to us bottling it - the fact that our players aren't good enough was the other main factor - but we need to show far more resilience, because Heavy Metal football is all well and good, but if you play Heavy Metal half the time and then go quiet and start crooning break-up songs on a banjo, you're getting bottles of piss thrown at you.

And bottles of piss is what that team deserved on Wednesday.
 
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