I'm not sure exactly how much a top quality European scouting network costs, and don't call me surly.
Scouse Scouts.
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I'm not sure exactly how much a top quality European scouting network costs, and don't call me surly.
You're not Modo. Are you? surely well maybe.
It's getting better. The new reserve league is the right way to go. But scouting? That's all up to who we hire.
Disregarding TAA and Woodburn, our best talents were bought. You know like Suso, Ibe and Sterling.
What the fuck are you on about? We're ALLLLLLLLL Modo
That's true
I think we need twenty or thirty of their level or above to get one or two worldies out.
It's like talking to myself, Modo.
Because I am talking to myself! Ahahahahaha!
Nice one, Modo.
Cheers.
God that's a horrible thought.
Don't let Modo hear you saying that. I'll go mental.
I find that very hard to believe. Courtois aside, have any of the dozens of players they've hoarded in recent years made the first team?
The other day there was something in papers saying Chelsea have made near enough 500M selling players in the last 3 years.
It seems far more likely that a big part of their "self-sustainability" model is to buy players, loan them out to their network of clubs and sell.
Take Marko Marin for example - he was almost viewed as an investment opportunity rather than a player.
As for the the reserve league, it's a joke. That's why - by all accounts - City have bought (shares in, ha!) Girona and are loaning reserve players there, so that they can play competitive football at a decent standard.
It seems, on the face of it, quite rare in this country for teams near the top to pick up proper bargains and even when they don't seem like it at the time (see the fees for Walcott and Bale for example, which looked pretty steep at the time).
I'd be more interested in the current state of scouting/signing of local Scouse players, Everton seem to be doing better than us in that regard. I don't know if we are failing in this aspect, or whether Everton are better at picking them up, or even whether the talent pool is just pretty small right now - maybe these kids are picking other sports. We have Trent on the way through now, could we have had more or is it just comparisons to the past that make it look that way?
I'd be more interested in the current state of scouting/signing of local Scouse players, Everton seem to be doing better than us in that regard. I don't know if we are failing in this aspect, or whether Everton are better at picking them up, or even whether the talent pool is just pretty small right now - maybe these kids are picking other sports. We have Trent on the way through now, could we have had more or is it just comparisons to the past that make it look that way?
Thats a fair assesment... but still we use plenty young inexperience players that didn't cost us much, which was the original question. Can we give them more time? Not sure as they cost us points.... but I would love if they deserved time and grew to be reliable contributers.
I'd love to know what dickhead thought it would be a good idea to spend 35 million on a shite arsenal player with one year left on his contract. I'm afraid the answer is probably Klopp though.
Everton certainly beat us in terms of intensive scouting in the region - they've got over 200 scouts for the centre of the north-west alone. But I don't think you need anywhere near that number to be very effective. Talent isn't hard to find - in fact you'd have to make quite an effort not to be aware of where the best prospects are. So there's no great problem in finding talented kids. The challenge is in convincing them and their parents that your club represents the best deal on the table. Everton have probably edged that in recent years in terms of showing that there's a good education at the academy and there's a decent chance of developing and getting a chance at the higher levels. But I don't think we're behind Everton now, and since Klopp came in it's much easier to sell the club in terms of its eagerness to bring good young players on. The success of kids like TAA and Woodburn makes such a positive impact on that it's hard to exaggerate.
Everton send letters home to every kid in my kids school every year inviting them all to an Everton football fun day, where their academy trainers train all the kids & arrange matches. The best of them then get invited to their academy for a trial.
The lfc academy does a similar thing, but you have to pay to go to their football fun day.
Have a guess which one gets more kids attending?
It may sound a small thing, but who the fuck knows how many promising young players end up with them as a result of tag stupidly short term thinking. Looking at the younger scouse players coming through their ranks I'd say a fair fucking few.
The lfc academy does a similar thing, but you have to pay to go to their football fun day.
Have a guess which one gets more kids attending?
It may sound a small thing, but who the fuck knows how many promising young players end up with them as a result of tag stupidly short term thinking. Looking at the younger scouse players coming through their ranks I'd say a fair fucking few.
Maybe we can just send scouts to Everton's football fun day.
That is some out-of-the-box thinking right there..
My main issue with how we have addressed the market for quite some time is not that we haven't dug a gem out of a school yard somewhere, but more so our blatant lack of spotting talent even if it's kicking us right in the eye.
I have no idea how Dele Ali looked for Dons but surely he couldn't haven been half bad I guess, and as we know we scouted him it's baffling why we didn't make a thorough move.
Also, maybe sometimes we've actually made the moves, but haven't really been able to convince anyone. @gkmacca touched upon it in the above, that there's a long way from actually spotting the talent to closing the deal and I do sometimes feel there've been a touch of arrogance on how we've been acting on the market/towards players. Almost like if some of our staff/board members have been stuck in the 70s/80s where we actually were shit hot on the market and could more or less pick and chose.
I have no idea how Dele Ali looked for Dons but surely he couldn't haven been half bad I guess, and as we know we scouted him it's baffling why we didn't make a thorough move.
Also, maybe sometimes we've actually made the moves, but haven't really been able to convince anyone. @gkmacca touched upon it in the above, that there's a long way from actually spotting the talent to closing the deal and I do sometimes feel there've been a touch of arrogance on how we've been acting on the market/towards players. Almost like if some of our staff/board members have been stuck in the 70s/80s where we actually were shit hot on the market and could more or less pick and chose.
I think some parents actually might chose Everton because their kids have a bigger chance to make it. We haven't developed anywhere near as many Scouse players Everton has in the past 15 or so years.
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From the point of view of a total out-of-the-know and judging by press reports/opinion at the time, it seems like the big misses have been a combination of both not being able to convince the player and also low-balling their market value. Whether the latter is a question of penny-pinching or lack of knowledge in the decision making process, I don't know.
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Yep, that's true, but their academy is much better in terms of attitude towards the kids from day one, I know a fair few reds who have moved their kids to Everton from Liverpool stating a number of different reasons for it.
It's understandable how pissed off we all get with our scouting / transfer policy given that it's pretty much the no.1 reason why we've not won the league for over 20 years.
I was reading through the last few posts and to my great surprise I found myself defending the club - weird.
When we sold Sterling, I thought that was the last of our major assets gone. Who would fund our expensive mistakes in the market now?
Since then Coutinho has gone on to further establish himself as a top tier talent and Mane is apparently being tracked by Real Madrid.
That's not bad when you consider that one was a 20 year old reserve at Inter and the other a "decent" Premiership player at Southampton.
We struggle badly to buy stars but we seem to have a (lucky?) knack of making them.
I was reading through the last few posts and to my great surprise I found myself defending the club - weird.
When we sold Sterling, I thought that was the last of our major assets gone. Who would fund our expensive mistakes in the market now?
Since then Coutinho has gone on to further establish himself as a top tier talent and Mane is apparently being tracked by Real Madrid.
That's not bad when you consider that one was a 20 year old reserve at Inter and the other a "decent" Premiership player at Southampton.
We struggle badly to buy stars but we seem to have a (lucky?) knack of making them.
Mane cost £35m. That's not exactly small change, and many here were disgusted we paid that much for him. Even I thought it was quite a lot of money, and I was delighted we signed him.
I suppose with regards to "making" players, we offer a far bigger platform, but there's far more examples of players we've paid 10m, 20m,30m or more that don't exactly have all the big clubs queuing up to buy.
Suarez, Sterling and now Coutinho and Mane. But that's about it really, apart from maybe the Juve interest in Can. The rest are nowhere near.
As i suspected our attitude stinks KHL has pointed out two excellent potential buys abroad I bet we didn't even look at them. Those buys your talking of Mane Coutinho etc are gone they are from now on going to be VVD 70 million. Arrogance and a complete lack of foresight are going to kill us. We always seem to be six steps behind the competition, Its sickening, It really is.
I think we do need to have some awareness of the fact that there is far more to a transfer than the 'good player and cheap' rationale we use as fans. There'll no doubt be a lot of players scouted by the clubs or even breakdowns in talks that we as fans don't even know about. Granted, there'll still be some good players that slip through the net because we don't make a move also, but it's not always that cut and dried I'm sure.
I'm not sure watching a player from a Premier League opponent destroy our shit defence (Mane), or buying a player who has been well-known on the European scene since he was playing at Basel and had a season at Chavski (Salah) really counts as scouting.
Nah. Not scouting as identifying new talents. But both for well in an compliment out team, so there must be some kind of type assesment. As an example I would have a hard time watching Nani play for our team even if he possess some of the same qualities as those two.
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