Real Madrid's money

[Rosco]

[quote author=juniormember link=topic=34104.msg886087#msg886087 date=1244703966]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886085#msg886085 date=1244703297]
[quote author=drizzt link=topic=34104.msg886080#msg886080 date=1244696796]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886041#msg886041 date=1244670757]
[quote author=Dee link=topic=34104.msg886040#msg886040 date=1244670615]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=34104.msg885928#msg885928 date=1244663790]
Where the fuck has it all come from? I know they're a big, rich club, but £56m on Kaka, and they're still planning to buy Ronaldo, Silva, Xabi and others. They haven't spent anything like this in recent seasons, so what is the source of this sudden vast wealth in the middle of a global financial crisis? Anyone know?
[/quote]

• 
  [li]They flogged off their training facilities in prime Madrid surburbs for top dollar[/li]
  [li]they negotiate their TV contracts seperately[/li]
  [li]They have always been better at marketing than all bar our friends part-way down the M62. [/li]

Compared that to us - Selling Mellwood wouldn't even pay the interest on our debt, We are tied into the group bargaining structure within th EPL for TV rights and we've been fucking embarrasingly bad at marketing for as long as I can remember.


[/quote]

I'm actually tired of hearing this "we're shit at marketing" thing.

Go and look at the figures, they don't really support the argument.
[/quote]

Manure still pull in 15m a year more than we do and that's after Ayre grew the revenue by 20% each of the last two years. So we WERE shit at marketing, we are now better but still nowhere close to being a "few million" behind manure.
[/quote]

We were ?

So we aren't now ? (Which is what I've said)

And making 50m a year from marketing isn't being shit at it, the fact of the matter is that for a long time Man United have had a better product to market. Of course they'll make more. How are you supposed to get people interested in a fourth placed team that play overly cautious football ?

There's no marketing genius out there who could have possibly helped us overhaul United in that regard. The return we could get from improving this end is much smaller than the return from improving our stadium.
[/quote]

You may know a thing or two about law and accounts, but marketing/advertising has very little to do with the logic you stated (although it helps, of course). There is so much more Liverpool could have done, and still could do, to generate a far greater amount from worldwide marketing.
[/quote]

So it's easier to sell a less attractive product than a more attractive one, is that what you're telling me ?

 

[Jack D Rips]

[quote author=juniormember link=topic=34104.msg886087#msg886087 date=1244703966]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886085#msg886085 date=1244703297]
[quote author=drizzt link=topic=34104.msg886080#msg886080 date=1244696796]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886041#msg886041 date=1244670757]
[quote author=Dee link=topic=34104.msg886040#msg886040 date=1244670615]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=34104.msg885928#msg885928 date=1244663790]
Where the fuck has it all come from? I know they're a big, rich club, but £56m on Kaka, and they're still planning to buy Ronaldo, Silva, Xabi and others. They haven't spent anything like this in recent seasons, so what is the source of this sudden vast wealth in the middle of a global financial crisis? Anyone know?
[/quote]

• 
  [li]They flogged off their training facilities in prime Madrid surburbs for top dollar[/li]
  [li]they negotiate their TV contracts seperately[/li]
  [li]They have always been better at marketing than all bar our friends part-way down the M62. [/li]

Compared that to us - Selling Mellwood wouldn't even pay the interest on our debt, We are tied into the group bargaining structure within th EPL for TV rights and we've been fucking embarrasingly bad at marketing for as long as I can remember.


[/quote]

I'm actually tired of hearing this "we're shit at marketing" thing.

Go and look at the figures, they don't really support the argument.
[/quote]

Manure still pull in 15m a year more than we do and that's after Ayre grew the revenue by 20% each of the last two years. So we WERE shit at marketing, we are now better but still nowhere close to being a "few million" behind manure.
[/quote]

We were ?

So we aren't now ? (Which is what I've said)

And making 50m a year from marketing isn't being shit at it, the fact of the matter is that for a long time Man United have had a better product to market. Of course they'll make more. How are you supposed to get people interested in a fourth placed team that play overly cautious football ?

There's no marketing genius out there who could have possibly helped us overhaul United in that regard. The return we could get from improving this end is much smaller than the return from improving our stadium.
[/quote]

You may know a thing or two about law and accounts, but marketing/advertising has very little to do with the logic you stated (although it helps, of course). There is so much more Liverpool could have done, and still could do, to generate a far greater amount from worldwide marketing.
[/quote]

Winning the Premiership once or twice would probably help.

And its not rocket science to work out that where we lag behind is in the bums on seats business. The mancs take approx £1M more than us every home game.

 

[Oncy]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886085#msg886085 date=1244703297]
How are you supposed to get people interested in a fourth placed team that play overly cautious football ?
[/quote]Cor fucking hell. Didnt need that right at the start of me day!

 

[drizzt]

[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886085#msg886085 date=1244703297]
[quote author=drizzt link=topic=34104.msg886080#msg886080 date=1244696796]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886041#msg886041 date=1244670757]
[quote author=Dee link=topic=34104.msg886040#msg886040 date=1244670615]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=34104.msg885928#msg885928 date=1244663790]
Where the fuck has it all come from? I know they're a big, rich club, but £56m on Kaka, and they're still planning to buy Ronaldo, Silva, Xabi and others. They haven't spent anything like this in recent seasons, so what is the source of this sudden vast wealth in the middle of a global financial crisis? Anyone know?
[/quote]

• 
  [li]They flogged off their training facilities in prime Madrid surburbs for top dollar[/li]
  [li]they negotiate their TV contracts seperately[/li]
  [li]They have always been better at marketing than all bar our friends part-way down the M62. [/li]

Compared that to us - Selling Mellwood wouldn't even pay the interest on our debt, We are tied into the group bargaining structure within th EPL for TV rights and we've been fucking embarrasingly bad at marketing for as long as I can remember.


[/quote]

I'm actually tired of hearing this "we're shit at marketing" thing.

Go and look at the figures, they don't really support the argument.
[/quote]

Manure still pull in 15m a year more than we do and that's after Ayre grew the revenue by 20% each of the last two years. So we WERE shit at marketing, we are now better but still nowhere close to being a "few million" behind manure.
[/quote]

We were ?

So we aren't now ? (Which is what I've said)

And making 50m a year from marketing isn't being shit at it, the fact of the matter is that for a long time Man United have had a better product to market. Of course they'll make more. How are you supposed to get people interested in a fourth placed team that play overly cautious football ?

There's no marketing genius out there who could have possibly helped us overhaul United in that regard. The return we could get from improving this end is much smaller than the return from improving our stadium.
[/quote]

I was just pointing out that you said we were "a few million" behind. Which was and is patently not true. Ayre has grown our commercial revenues 20% year on year and that wouldn't be possible if we weren't so far behind manure to start with. Wait until you see the next shirt sponsorship and then tell me we've been doing OK.

 

[TheBunnyman]

From the BBC website:

From Puskas and Di Stefano to Zidane and Beckham, Spanish football giant Real Madrid have aspired to acquire some of the most talented and glamorous names in world football.

Now, in the latest chapter they have swooped in a matter of days for two of the biggest names in world football, Kaka and Ronaldo.

The signing strategy is being led by the returning president of the club, construction magnate Florentino Perez, who previously led the Spanish team from 2000 to 2006 - during its famous "galacticos" era.

It was under Mr Perez's first reign that the club initially aimed at becoming the world's richest and best known football brand.


REAL MADRID REVENUES 2007/08
Increased by 4% to £290m
Driven by increased commercial revenues
Commercial revenues accounted for 35% of income
Broadcasting income accounted for 37%
Matchday accounted for 28%
Source: Deloitte

But how can they afford to pay the reported £56m for Kaka and offer a world-record £80m for Cristiano Ronaldo - existing as they do without the deep pockets of a billionaire benefactor?

Growing match-day revenues, increasingly shrewd and global marketing, healthy commercial income, and a ground-breaking domestic TV deal, have all catapulted the club to the peak of the Deloitte's Football Money League this year.

They have topped it for the past four straight years, despite being overshadowed in the Champions League by their bitter rivals Barcelona.

'Remarkable growth'

According to those most recent figures, for 2007/08, the club saw its revenue hit £290m during that season.

Whilst Real Madrid's 4% revenue growth in 2007/08 was more modest than in preceding years, it meant that across a six year period the club had doubled its annual revenues since 2002.
Cristiano Ronaldo in action for Manchester United
Real Madrid has a history of buying the world's best players

Perhaps crucially, it also gave the club a revenue lead of 41m euros (£32.5m) over Manchester United, in second place.

"The engine driving Real's remarkable revenue growth, and its ascent to the top of the money league, has been the club's ability to increase commercial revenue," said Dan Jones, author of the Deloitte report, when it was issued in February.

Matchday revenue has also increased significantly in the past couple of years thanks to the reconfiguring of areas of the club's stadium to increase corporate hospitality capacity and hence revenues.

Average attendances at their home ground - the 80,354-capacity Santiago Bernabéu football stadium - are the third-highest in Europe.

Emerging markets

After the purchase of David Beckham from Manchester United in 2003, Real Madrid cleverly projected their brand into East Asia, on the back of the England star's appeal.

"That was all about the race by the big European clubs to crack the East Asian, Indian and other emerging markets first, and the race is still going on," says Nigel Currie, of marketing and sponsorship giants Brand Rapport.


There will be massive TV deals coming up for them [Real Madrid] overseas in the next few years
Nigel Currie, Brand Rapport

"However good the Premier League and Spain's La Liga are, there is an elite breaking away, led by the likes of Real Madrid."

He added: "What they are doing is partly a response to Barcelona's success, but these signings are them putting down a marker to be the top club and football brand in the world."

Mr Currie said Real were targeting the world's best players - who were also the world's most marketable players.

'Fickle allegiance'

That, Mr Currie added, meant that in emerging markets fans may swap allegiance, from - for example - Manchester United to Real Madrid, simply because they preferred to support star players rather than clubs.

"They are far more fickle in terms of allegiance," he said. "But it is not about Real looking to sell more merchandising in places like China, in fact they would not make a great deal from doing that.
Kaka is noted for his spectacular goals for club and country
Real Madrid will look to attract Kaka fans to their brand

"They are looking to make money from these signings by maximising their future overseas TV rights," says Mr Currie.

"There will be massive TV deals coming up for them overseas in the next few years, that is the big carrot.

"With the developments this week Real Madrid will already have restored their profile and status to number one in these emerging markets.

"And the team that has the most marketable players, and the most supporters, will get the best TV deals."

'Important role'

The television money, both overseas and at home, is crucial to Real's surge in income in recent years.

Since 1997 Spanish clubs have sold their own rights individually.

Real Madrid signed its latest deal in 2006 - for a reported record 1.1bn euros - with Spanish film and TV company Mediapro for seven seasons of broadcast rights.

That works out at a huge 150m euros a year.

"Spanish television rights have increased significantly in the past three years, and would no doubt play an important role in these large Real Madrid transfers," says James Pickles, editor of industry journal TV Sports Markets.

Big name sponsors

But overseas merchandising, domestic and TV rights, and matchday earnings are not Real's only income streams.

It also has a number of high profile sponsorship partners - Bwin.com, Adidas, Coca-Cola, Audi, and Spanish beer brand Mahou.

An image rights deal with Adidas alone in early 2007 garnered them 762m euros.
Perez (left) is taking his second stint at the club helm
Real Madrid president Florentino Perez (l) with former glamour player Alfredo Di Stefano

Another benefit, one that helps attract top name players, is the fact that tax legislation allows their foreign players to pay tax at about 23% for the first five years that they are in the country.

It also helps that Real - from before the 1950s heyday of Di Stefano - is considered the "establishment team" and can call on close links with the government or city authorities when cash is tight.

Last but by no means least is the fact that Real, like Barcelona, are exempt from demands imposed on the majority of Spanish football clubs to become publicly listed companies.

Unlike the majority of European football clubs, Real Madrid are owned by its thousands of members, known as "socios", who elect the president.

That leaves it free of all the ramifications for takeovers and potential debt issues that being a listed company could involve.

In its report Deloitte said it would be difficult to see anyone topping Real Madrid at the top of the money league next year, but added "it will be interesting to see how the club copes with the loss of the Brand Beckham effect."

It appears Real are now answering that question by plugging that gap with the purchase of Kaka, and proposed purchase of Ronaldo.

 

[Avmenon]

I think Ross is right, to an extent.

The main issue is ticket sales, and the stadium attendance (or lack thereof)

I do think he's underestimating the impact of brand marketing that the Scum have brought to bear tho.

Whilst it may not immediately affect those sales, the effect of beaming Scum into millions upon millions of homes is going to create millions upon millions of fans who'll one day want to sit on those seats.

And buy airline tickets, and buy insurance policies, and get credit cards.

It will add up,eventually.

I've mourned about this issue many a time, and I won't do it again.

Where Ross is right on the money is that no marketing genius could have sold the 4th place Liverpool teams of old who's greatest attainable achievement was beating the Scum by an odd penalty now and again.But that's not who we are now, and we musn't drop the ball gain.

 

[mark1975]

Lines like this one just sum them up to a tee, and the way football's gone in general:

It was under Mr Perez's first reign that the club initially aimed at becoming the world's richest and best known football brand.

>🙁

 

[Hansern]

Well, Perez certainly kept his promise about signing a couple of galacticos.
I wonder if they've kept a few mill aside for the defence, or do they intend to win every game 6-4..

 

[David Byrne]

[quote author=drizzt link=topic=34104.msg886080#msg886080 date=1244696796]
[quote author=Rosco link=topic=34104.msg886041#msg886041 date=1244670757]
[quote author=Dee link=topic=34104.msg886040#msg886040 date=1244670615]
[quote author=TheBunnyman link=topic=34104.msg885928#msg885928 date=1244663790]
Where the fuck has it all come from? I know they're a big, rich club, but £56m on Kaka, and they're still planning to buy Ronaldo, Silva, Xabi and others. They haven't spent anything like this in recent seasons, so what is the source of this sudden vast wealth in the middle of a global financial crisis? Anyone know?
[/quote]

• 
  [li]They flogged off their training facilities in prime Madrid surburbs for top dollar[/li]
  [li]they negotiate their TV contracts seperately[/li]
  [li]They have always been better at marketing than all bar our friends part-way down the M62. [/li]

Compared that to us - Selling Mellwood wouldn't even pay the interest on our debt, We are tied into the group bargaining structure within th EPL for TV rights and we've been fucking embarrasingly bad at marketing for as long as I can remember.


[/quote]

I'm actually tired of hearing this "we're shit at marketing" thing.

Go and look at the figures, they don't really support the argument.
[/quote]

Manure still pull in 15m a year more than we do and that's after Ayre grew the revenue by 20% each of the last two years. So we WERE shit at marketing, we are now better but still nowhere close to being a "few million" behind manure.
[/quote]

This marketing spiel bores the pants off me.

Did you ever consider that Man Utd were dominating football at a time when money and sponsors started pouring into the game at unprecedented levels?

How many more shirts and mugs can you sell in Aisa based on past success?

We did aswell as we could without selling out our traditions completely, which, although I doubt many will admit it, was a huge issue for the majority of our then fanbase.

It all comes back to the stadium. The chuckle brothers sat on their hands, wasting a good ten years of pissing around, and it's caught up with us.

 

[Avmenon]

No one is denying the importance of the stadium,which removed the need for your hasty edit.

Since you were part of the majority of the then fanbase, what traditions would have been sold out had the club been better marketed IYO?

 

[David Byrne]

[quote author=Avmenon link=topic=34104.msg886496#msg886496 date=1244744197]
No one is denying the importance of the stadium,which removed the need for your hasty edit.

Since you were part of the majority of the then fanbase, what traditions would have been sold out had the club been better marketed IYO?
[/quote]

Our traditions as a humble, non corporate sucking whore? Those traditions.

I remember there was uproar when they installed the new clock.

Define 'better marketed' anyway?

Off field success is fueled by by what goes on on the pitch, always has been, hence (shock horror) the mancs being 'better marketed'.

People just use it as an excuse for the underachievement of the past 20 years, which is down to more than just a lack of shirt sales in outer mongolia.

 

[Avmenon]

Again with the shirts.

Better marketed just means taking a greater interest in securing more fans,wherever they may be; even Outer Mongolia.

Traditions are important,but so's winning.

I do agree with you tho that they've had little effect on the quality of our play and the fact that we weren't winning thngs.

 

[Tinto]

I remember boasting how we were a family club and that United were just a soulless corporation, and laughing at the Mancs when they removed the 'FC' from their badge before putting it back again.

The truth was that the joke was on us and we should have faced up to the reality that football is a business now and should have embraced it far earlier. Parry did have a difficult line to tread in trying to maintain our tradition as a family club whilst making us get to grips with the post Sky world. The fact we didn't win a trophy and didn't have the coat tails of the Champions League to hold on to throughout the 90s made the task even harder.

 

[David Byrne]

[quote author=Tinto link=topic=34104.msg886510#msg886510 date=1244745983]
I remember boasting how we were a family club and that United were just a soulless corporation, and laughing at the Mancs when they removed the 'FC' from their badge before putting it back again.

The truth was that the joke was on us and we should have faced up to the reality that football is a business now and should have embraced it far earlier.
[/quote]

I think we did, albeit in our own unique way. But like you said yourself, it comes down to success. How can you market a team in perma transition for 15 years on par with one who is dominating at a time when the exposure on football was at its peak?

We started looking into building a new stadium around the same time as Arsenal, some 10/11 years ago, maybe more, so even back then we knew the importance of it, and look how that turned out...

 

[rebel23]

Calderon claims credit for Ronaldo signing

Former Real Madrid president Ramon Calderon says Cristiano Ronaldo's transfer from Manchester United was agreed last summer.

Ronaldo is finally set to join the Spanish side for £80million after United accepted a bid for the Portugal winger today following protracted speculation since last summer.

Calderon, who stepped down at the Bernabeu midway through last season, stopped short of confirming a pre-contract agreement was in place since last summer but confirmed the deal was always in the pipeline.

"I think it's going to be big event for Real Madrid, he is one of the best players in the world. He is going to help my former club get titles next season," Calderon told Five Live.

"Last season United decided not to do it because they thought it was too early and everyone agreed to do it this season.

"And I think it's okay for the player - he wanted to come, he said that many times - it's okay for Real Madrid and also for Manchester United, who will get a lot of money for the transfer."

It is believed an agreement was in place since last summer for the transfer despite new president Florentino Perez now taking the credit for the coup but Calderon refused to confirm there was anything official.

"Let's say that everyone involved in the operation agreed to do it this season," he said. "That is what I can say. It has happened now, it was a bit early last season."


According to the former president the 94 million euros paid by Florentino Perez were not a problem for Real Madrid "I left Real Madrid in an excellent financial position. Mr. Perez received 91 million in cash when I started [as president] with just 4 million. Real Madrid has solvency, liquidity and credit."

 

[David Byrne]

Any word from Platters yet?

 

[Ryan]

There'll be another Galactico too before this summer's out, no doubt about that.

Be it Villa, Ribery, whomfuckingever, I'm certain they'll go for one more.

 

[LFC_DO]

Including transfer fees and wages Ronaldo is costing Real Madrid £180m over his 6 year contract!

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=LFC_DO link=topic=34104.msg886706#msg886706 date=1244767135]
Including transfer fees and wages Ronaldo is costing Real Madrid £180m over his 6 year contract!

[/quote]

Meanwhile, we're stepping up our interest in Tuncay, who's available on a Bosman.

 

[madmax]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=34104.msg886709#msg886709 date=1244767306]
[quote author=LFC_DO link=topic=34104.msg886706#msg886706 date=1244767135]
Including transfer fees and wages Ronaldo is costing Real Madrid £180m over his 6 year contract!

[/quote]

Meanwhile, we're stepping up our interest in Tuncay, who's available on a Bosman.
[/quote]


Not a bad move, i must say. I like Tuncay more than Yossi.

 

[Ryan]

[quote author=madmax link=topic=34104.msg886710#msg886710 date=1244768114]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=34104.msg886709#msg886709 date=1244767306]
[quote author=LFC_DO link=topic=34104.msg886706#msg886706 date=1244767135]
Including transfer fees and wages Ronaldo is costing Real Madrid £180m over his 6 year contract!

[/quote]

Meanwhile, we're stepping up our interest in Tuncay, who's available on a Bosman.
[/quote]


Not a bad move, i must say. I like Tuncay more than Yossi.
[/quote]

I made it up mate.

 

[TheBunnyman]

[quote author=Ryan link=topic=34104.msg886715#msg886715 date=1244769291]
[quote author=madmax link=topic=34104.msg886710#msg886710 date=1244768114]
[quote author=Ryan link=topic=34104.msg886709#msg886709 date=1244767306]
[quote author=LFC_DO link=topic=34104.msg886706#msg886706 date=1244767135]
Including transfer fees and wages Ronaldo is costing Real Madrid £180m over his 6 year contract!

[/quote]

Meanwhile, we're stepping up our interest in Tuncay, who's available on a Bosman.
[/quote]


Not a bad move, i must say. I like Tuncay more than Yossi.
[/quote]

I made it up mate.
[/quote]

You didn't. We have been linked to Tuncay, but he's not available on a Bosman.